First Kahr (PM40), Bullet Jams when I release slide to load?! Back end catching

[jbrowncreative]

I bought this gun used and was told it was used by a former law enforcement officer (BS) and was taken good care of. It didnt work when I tried to test fire it at the store, and they assured me it was just a broken spring and to purchase it and they would give me the new spring.

The new slide stop spring did make it not jam on eject/stay back prematurely. However I have an entirely new problem now (probably been their whole time)

With a full clip in the receiver, and the slide locked back, when I release it to LOAD MY FIRST BULLET INTO MY GUN, It gets jammed

http://www.jbrowncreative.com/kahr/jam.jpg

Alright I have 4 videos, everyones likes youtube videos!

http://www.youtube.com/user/JamesBrownTown/videos

3 videos of me using the "sling-shot" method to sucessfully load.

and

HERE IS A VIDEO OF THE PROBLEM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CJv1ViJyL4
:80:

[jbrowncreative]

I am using Corbon Hollow-Points. All I have currently for protection. I read on gb6491's post about filing down the plastic in the clip and he mentioned somewhere that loading the first bullet IF IT WAS HOLLOW POINT, woulds till require minor tinkering to load first one?? I have, and continue to sand this reciever trying to see some different results.

My dad's new kahr manual says the first bullet should be loaded by opening the slide, popping a clip in, then releasing the slide feeding in a bullet. The photo i posted above (paste the link) is what happens when I try that. one out of 5 times, usually only on the 1st or 2nd bullet in a full clip only.

[TucsonMTB]

If you are loading by pressing down the slide release with the slide locked back and it is still jambing, you are probably a candidate for some magazine follower sanding and maybe a new bevel on the leading edge of the pickup rail as described in Greg's thread in the Technical section: http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=1612

If you are using a sling shot technique by hand, try using the slide lock. That may eliminate your difficulties. If it does, you will probably eventually be able to do it by hand instead, after a little practice with this gun.

Oh, and be sure to review and apply the lubrication and preparation threads in this same area. Especially if the gun has very few round through it, a little drag goes a long way toward creating issues. Kahr's benefit more from extra lubrication rather than less like Glocks.

In any event, welcome to the forum and keep us advised. We may be able to help. :)

Edited to add: I see you found the threads. Keep the faith. It will become more reliable.

You could also call Kahr. They will often work on guns with recent serial numbers no questions asked.

[jbrowncreative]

Thank you for your welcome, and response. I should have noted the following: I have researched the serial number and it is dated to circa 2004. I am utterly assuming that it is passed the break in period due to the shear fact it was certainly in used shape when purchase. My father purchased a Kahr PM9 over Christmas and they do not share these issues.
:edit: oops i just seen I need to SCROLL down that link you sent me.

I tried sanding forever, to the point I dont want to sand too much. In his photos their was a small circle that started to appear in the back end ontop of the plastic. I took this as an indication for how deep I was to go, however I was unable to reach it and unsure to go further. I am able to pretty smoothly "Slingshot" it (which i believe is when you pull back real quick n release to load the bullet. However I am unable to simply press the release and have it catch a bullet n load it. It half loads it, so I just have to tap or push the slide and SLAP it goes right in.

I am going to look into whatever this bevel thing is you mentioned... I'm down to try anything at this point I really can't afford to do much I spent everything I had to get the gun, and my license!

Any thing I can do to help yall help me, let me know!

::edit:: This is simply a loading on the first bullet problem, and perhaps the second. I believe the problem is sourced in from the lower end as if I just put ONE bullet in the clip and rack it then it honestly does not present these problems as much.

Is it possible that since the physical TIPS of my BULLETS are NOT SMOOTH since they are hollow points, that it is causing a hang up? I got this to protect myself as I live by myself and do not want all i've gone to school for my whole life to be for waste if i get shot in the face because my gun couldnt shoot the first bullet.

::edit 2::: Is it better to call or email Kahr. My gun is out of warrant and I have looked at indexes of the serials as well as the official envelope from the gov and it is dated to 2003

[Bawanna]

Lock the slide back and insert a full magazine. See if the pick up rail, stripper rail, interface rail, whatever you want to call it is behind the cartridge or if the cartridge is pushed up under it. If it's under then it's not getting a fair chance to chamber. When you do the sling shot load your actually able to pull the slide just a tad bit further back which might be enough to get behind the case and feel well.
That's where the bevel comes into play. If the case is under the stripper you can file off that front corner "bevel" and the case will slide up in front of the stripper bar and you'll have a much more harmonious outcome.

Give it a whirl and get back to us.

[jbrowncreative]

Is this what your talking about?
http://i49.tinypic.com/55rmkh.jpg

[jbrowncreative]

Honestly it seems like in my gun that it is correct and wouldnt benefit from the file thing? Additionally could all of this be from me doing something wrong while loading it? I notice the bullet gets kinda forward sitting in the chamber. What it seems to happen is when it closes it doesn't have enough space or something, like the slide just jams it and it hangs open and then i have to tap it closed.

::edit:: This slingshot method seems to work pretty damn good, I wonder why closing the slide is weird. Like even when it works it HONESETLY feels like something gets pushed or forced, i feel like the bullet isnt geting horizontal enough and its being forced into the barrel when its not aligned.

[jbrowncreative]

It seems to be hanging on the ejector(?) thing, it gets stuck and i have to pull back like 1/4" on the slide to let the bullet release forward

http://www.jbrowncreative.com/kahr/hangup.jpg

THIS IS AFTER i released the slide with a full clip of 5 out of the smooth clip that i've shaved a lot i guess

[TucsonMTB]

This slingshot method seems to work pretty damn good, I wonder why closing the slide is weird. Like even when it works it HONESETLY feels like something gets pushed or forced, i feel like the bullet isnt geting horizontal enough and its being forced into the barrel when its not aligned.
Stop! You have achieved success! :D

The slingshot method is the better choice anyway because you can do it quickly whenever you need to. The only reason Kahr recommended using the slide stop is that new people were experiencing difficulty getting the slingshot method to work.

Just stick to the slingshot approach and be happy! ;)

[OldLincoln]

I had the round wedging with the nose part way in to chamber while the rim was still down. Sounds like yours. I polished the ramp and the chamber entrance including the roof and all became well.

For kicks you might try rubbing a tad of grease on the ramp and upper chamber entrance and try the slide lock release again. If the round pops into the chamber you have a pretty fair indication that polishing would help. If not better then that's one less possibility.

[yqtszhj]

If it's "well used" I don't see where anyone mentioned the recoil spring yet? A spring was mentioned but I'm not really sure which one that was or if it was the correct one. Is it possible that the spring doesn't have enough in it to slam the slide back home?

Or is it getting hung up on the extractor because there is some dirt built up and it's not moving like it should?

Just some thoughts.

[Bawanna]

jbrowncreative, I can see the post you delete. In the second one the photo on the left clearly shows the case under and not in front of the stripper or interface. The slide is not far enough back at lock to get behind the round. It will ride over and push but jamb every time.
When you sling shot your pulling it back far enough to get behind the case.

Bevel the bottom a bit and you'll be in business. Undelete that photo so everyone can see. Its a great picture.

[TucsonMTB]

If it's "well used" I don't see where anyone mentioned the recoil spring yet? A spring was mentioned but I'm not really sure which one that was or if it was the correct one. Is it possible that the spring doesn't have enough in it to slam the slide back home?

Or is it getting hung up on the extractor because there is some dirt built up and it's not moving like it should?

Just some thoughts.
Excellent observation and should have been our first suggestion. Kudos to you for being on the ball. :)

Shame on me for not thinking of replacing the possibly tired recoil assembly (or at least the larger outer spring which usually gets tired after a couple thousand rounds)! :o

Even if you find you don't need it now, you will in the future, so a new recoil assembly is worth purchasing and trying now.

That really should be first on the list for any used semi-automatic pistol with an unknown and possibly high round count.

And, since this is an older style, blunt nosed slide, you can get an inexpensive replacement spring set from Wolff gunsprings (http://www.gunsprings.com/index.cfm?page=items&cID=1&mID=29#185), slip the old outer spring off the existing recoil assembly, slip on the new one from the set, and be good to go very quickly for not much money. :D

[yqtszhj]

Excellent observation and should have been our first suggestion. Kudos to you for being on the ball.



Whoa, careful when saying that was an excellent observation and saying I may be on the ball. Next thing there will be some expectations from me. I'm not too bright and I have to start with the simple stuff first. You guys start talking all of that gun theory and I just get confused.:confused::confused::confused:

[jbrowncreative]

::edit:: I just saw the other posts, let me read them first then re-edit this.

[jbrowncreative]

http://jbrowncreative.com/kahr/jam.jpg

[jbrowncreative]

Tuscon Wow, thank you for the link! That's taking your help and extra step, I appreciate that.

My question is this, how could the "recoil" spring be a part of the issue if I am MANUALLY locking the slide back, and then releasing it? It seems like (from the name recoil) that the spring would have something to do with pushing the rail to the back position which I have manually done. The weird thing is, and this is supplemental information. THE PROBLEM DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH THE EXTENDED CLIP.

My father purchased this for me as a gift and has offered to have it sent to Kahr, however I want to know more about the issue first. Before I go grinding on a factor part, I'd like to see if its just a cleaning problem or some old weary springs. I expect this gun has gone through much more than a couple thousands, idk why I just feel that way.

Someone mentioned something about the "ejector". Can you enlighten me more on the purpose and more the functioning movement of this peice? I felt yesterday when looking at it that maybe that could be causing it too and it was rather gunged up. I didnt know it moved or came out?


::edit:: I am going to go ahead and order some new recoil springs, since someone here said they recommend them to be replaced, and it's good to have as backup anyway. Can you tell me if i should get the "factory" or the "enhanced power" (i assume factory, just wanted to check) going to order this now and get it in the mail asap. If it can help at all its worth a shot. however i'd like an answer about why the spring could be it if Im the one pulling the slide back to its locking position on the rail

[Bawanna]

Is this what your talking about?
http://i49.tinypic.com/55rmkh.jpg

If you look at your picture here on the left you can see the cartridge nearly under the pick up rail. The picture on the right is as it should be.
It's possible that who ever originally owned it, I think I remember it was a cop used the slingshot mode and would probably not have had an issue.

A little bevel on the front of the pick up rail allows the case to slip past and move up into it's proper position to be pushed off and chambered.

It's possible the 7 round mag is orienting the round just enough farther forward for it to get past. There's a good thread about this someplace, I'll see if I can find it.

I don't think you need to send it back at his point.

[jbrowncreative]

^ Keep in mind that is not my photo above, that is a photo from the thread-how-to on beveling the peice. My gun is the one that is BLACK in this thread..

Someone said "Move on and be happy with the slingshot method and don't do anything" essentially, but my question is this. My dads brand new PM9 from Kahr recommends in the instructions that when loading the first round the slide be in the back locked position, clip in, then release. I will not be fully happy until my weapon seamlessly does that... So which to try first, FILE... or RECOIL SPRING?

[jbrowncreative]

As you can see in my pictures, my first bullet while in the clip still is in the right place it looks like?? Can you look at my photos I posted again and see if you still think I should "stone the bevel"

::EDIT:: THAT IS NOT MY SILVER GUN IN THE TWO-UP PICTURE THAT IS FROM THE THREAD. I USED IT ONLY AS A REFERENCE, I DONT THINK MY GUN IS DOING THAT, MY PROBLEM IS WHEN IT CLOSES IT BECOMES STUCK, REFER TO ABOVE PHOTO

sry i confused everyone =(

::Edit:: maybe this helps, its like the bullets are getting scratched a lot on top and stuff, but then again i have played with the same 6 rounds for days trying to find whats causing this

[Bawanna]

Ok, as I was searching I realized that you used Gregs pictures. Here's another example from Tucson who had issues with certain ammo for a long time. He just accepted that fact and stuck with what worked. A slight bevel and his gun eats everything he feeds it now.

http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=10229&highlight=bevel

He beveled slightly more aggressively that Greg did but the theory is still the same.

As I mentioned if the cop used only the sling shot method he may not have ever experienced this issue at all. Or he may have just accepted it, manipulated a round into the chamber and found it shot ok so didn't give it another thought. In all likely hood he tossed the instruction manual the minute the box was opened and was just lucky enough that it worked via sling shot. I know this since most of my officers open any new guns they get at my desk. I have numerous owners manuals I retrieve out of the trash can and save for future reference.

While a recoil spring never hurts a thing in my infinitely small mind I don't think it will help your issue for the reasons you mentioned yourself. Your manually locking the slide back, if the round is in front where it belongs it'll feed.

[jbrowncreative]

Thank you for looking into this more for me. In my photos though the round is clearing the part with the bevel though?? Did you see the large photo on page 2 (the kinda upside down one).

Some one said they were able to aleviate this problem by polishing like the roof of the chamber and something like that? Any in site into that at all?

I'm hesitant to grind on the gun when the clips are acting so different. The 5 clip slingshots, but doesnt rail. The 6 clip rails, but is clunky on the sling. Thanks for your opinion on the recoil spring. All of this helps me, and future people, to isolate this problem!

[Bawanna]

Thank you for looking into this more for me. In my photos though the round is clearing the part with the bevel though?? Did you see the large photo on page 2 (the kinda upside down one).

Some one said they were able to aleviate this problem by polishing like the roof of the chamber and something like that? Any in site into that at all?

I'm hesitant to grind on the gun when the clips are acting so different. The 5 clip slingshots, but doesnt rail. The 6 clip rails, but is clunky on the sling. Thanks for your opinion on the recoil spring. All of this helps me, and future people, to isolate this problem!

Yeah, I saw that picture and it's kind of hard to tell but it looks to me like it's just barely clearing. I'm a little lost in what your are referring to as "rails". Not sure what you mean.

That was our own Old Lincoln talking about the polishing and you can take anything he says to the bank and draw interest on it. It also won't hurt a thing to polish the points he mentions. Some fine sandpaper 600 or finer and a dremel with a polishing wheel, the bullet shaped ones work good will make things shiny and slick.
And zero risk of harm to your gun. Remember sparks equal grinding (not good). If the feed ramp or other areas are rough the sandpaper on a dowel or pencil will help clean things up. Then a little polishing and your good.
If you don't have a dremel finer sandpaper or a cloth with some flitz or other polish will get the job done in fine fashion as well.

[jbrowncreative]

Thanks Bawanna, I'm not sure what he's saying to polish thats what I meant. Can you tell me what exactly to polish and where it is (and what it looks like) I don't know what everything is called yet! I do have a instruction manual I can cross reference what you tell me though. I do not have a dremel or fine sandpaper (maybe some 2000 wet sand but yah..)

::edit:: just found some 600

I strip/clean my gun with HOPPES#9, and then I oil it with "SAFARILAND BREAK FREE LP"

http://www.jbrowncreative.com/kahr/upside.jpg
http://www.jbrowncreative.com/kahr/jam2.jpg
http://www.jbrowncreative.com/kahr/jam3.jpg

[jbrowncreative]

CAn someone Clarify what Old Lincoln meant by RAMP, and CHAMBER ENTRANCE? I'm going to try and wet sand (2000 grit) them with hoppes solvent I guess! If that doesnt work then I might need to try and file aparently? This last picture above shows the severity of the angle of the bullet in this issue, this is why it concerns me.

::edit:: Is he refering to the polished (reflective) entrance and back part of the BARREL?

[Bawanna]

CAn someone Clarify what Old Lincoln meant by RAMP, and CHAMBER ENTRANCE? I'm going to try and wet sand (2000 grit) them with hoppes solvent I guess! If that doesnt work then I might need to try and file aparently? This last picture above shows the severity of the angle of the bullet in this issue, this is why it concerns me.

::edit:: Is he refering to the polished (reflective) entrance and back part of the BARREL?

Yes, the ramp is usually reflective, the little slop leading up to the chamber. Also the chamber itself along the top and the edges to the rear of the chamber. The points where your bullet is touching in your last photo of the jam.
You can also polish the front edge of the pick up rail that we've been talking about so the case can slide up the breech face easier if you don't feel it needs to be beveled.
Kind of hard to see clearly but I don't see much bevel on yours. You can see where it is riding over the rounds with that little strip of brass or wear. That is the pick up rail, or interface rail we're talking about. You can polish that too. It normally will slide over the rounds in the magazine as it feeds the top round into the chamber, so that wear mark is semi normal but will work slicker if it's smooth.
A little more bevel on the front bottom edge there with a file I really think will help along with the polishing in that same area.

[Bawanna]

Some of the smart fellas will be along shortly I'm sure but looking again, there isn't hardly any bevel at all on the stripper. It's near square. Taper that a bit, and polish it and the bottom of the stripper bar as well as the chamber area and that feed angle will improve immensely.

If you lock the slide back and insert a magazine and then slowly pull the slide back a bit more you should see that case slide up in the back under the extractor, the little hook on the right side, that allows the rear of the cartridge to be much higher and help the feed angle.

Where do you live. I'm coming over to help. Have file will travel. Well I don't fly but I'm not opposed to long drives.

Come on guys, help here. Maybe I'm wrong and all wet on this one. I need back up.

[jbrowncreative]

i got a pencil with some wetsand 600 dipped in Hopppes wrapped around it and went around the inside of the "chamber" on the barrel piece, careful not to get to the actually barrel threading, and did some wet sanding with the stuff on the outside where you said. Didnt seem dirty enough to be causing this problem..

[JFootin]

Bawanna meant the slope, not the slop, on the back of the barrel that feeds bullets into the chamber. On Kahrs, it is usually well polished, but some more wouldn't hurt.

[jbrowncreative]

Alrite yah that didnt work, so I guess my only option now is to try and grind this... I see where and what i'm suppose to bevel. Can you tell me what and where the stripper rail is... Ugh... im really lost here, I don't see anything different when i lock it back then slowly pull back the rest of the way. itll feed if i do it slowly, its almost like its TOO FAST to close or something.

Tried polishing. When the bullet jams, i have to pull the slide a couple millimeters back, then the BACK END OF THE BULLET goes horizontal allowing it to fit through that little grooved hook. I think maybe I do need to file this.. I have no tools however.

:editt: maybe this could help?? How come with a round in the chamber, im able to pull my slide back like .25" and it actually STAYS THERE out of place, with the little circle rod in the front pokin out, like you know what I mean? I can pull the slide a little back and it stays when a bullet is in the chamber, like it gets kinda hung up or something?

[jbrowncreative]

UPDATE:: Well I tried the unmodified plastic peice from my extended clip in my small clip (i shaved the plastic yesterday for the slingshot trick) so for the first time i notice the HUGE difference this mod makes, you really cant slingshot on that stock one!! So I popped it back in and it slingshots FINE... I really wonder if the gun itself functions ok, maybe if I take it to the range and encounter some kind of reload or ejection problem that can help us route this problem some more?

[Bawanna]

In your post 24 you can see the copper colored streak on the bottom of your slide, narrow at the back and gets wider to the front.
That is the stripper or interface rail. The front end of that where the copper color is widest is the point that needs beveled and all along that rail should be smooth. You can use the 600 on a flat stick along there and clean that all up. The little hook you talk about is the extractor which pulls the case back out of the chamber which in turn bumps it up against that fixed hook which kicks it out towards the ejection port.

[OldLincoln]

http://jbrowncreative.com/kahr/jam.jpg

http://www.jbrowncreative.com/kahr/jam2.jpg

I'm missing something here. Both pics looks like a perfect pickup to me. The rim is under the extractor and in place on the breach lip. This is why I'm not understanding the issue with the mechanics.

It looks like the nose is hanging up on the upper lip of the chamber as I experienced. Polishing that made all the difference.

To describe, holding the barrel looking at the ramp, take a round and put it at the angle in the pic, with the nose just inside the chamber angled up. That's a high friction spot and why I polish it to a mirror shine as I do the ramp. Further, you might want to clean up the breach face. Might not get it to shine so much but make it smoother as the rim makes the turn there also. It's amazing what a difference a little polishing makes for defense ammo such as HST that's a little oversized.

[jbrowncreative]

I polished to a mirror shine the chamber entrance (ramp thing) like you said. The issue is (to clarify) in the last picture u posted, above this post: That is how the gun rests when i release the slide so its not "operating correctly". This doesnt happen with 3 or 4 bullets in the small clip, and doesnt do it at all on the big clip. Or near as often "not at all" is a little much.

[jbrowncreative]

I do not think its the front getting hung up, I think its the back. The slide is pushing forward too quick for the bullet to get into the horizontal position? Sorry for my rookie'ness, I'm trying to learn. If it works with a different (not full) clip setup does that mean something?

::edit:: just testing again, yah its ONLY happening with the small clip with 5 (full) loaded in it. I modded the plastic "sling shot mod?" and that seems to work fine with that clip if I rack it that way. But why with 4 in the 5 clip, and any mount in the large clip does the (photograph documented) problem not seem to exist?

[OldLincoln]

The chamber is the hole above the ramp that the bullet slides into. Did you polish that also? You may also want to polish as you can the breach face - the round spot with the striker pin hole. It has machine marks so won't shine so much but you can make it smother. Finally, if all this is smooth and shiny, perhaps you do need a new recoil spring.

I have read the posts about filing the mag follower but since my stock mags feed so well I haven't wanted to try it. I'm thinking I will on one anyway to prove to myself it works. I don't doubt what others say, but I have a bunch of pills and juices that others have sworn makes you healthier and all they did for me is make my wallet lighter.

[jbrowncreative]

Lincoln, let me ask you this. If I am the one bringing the slide to the locking position, and manually unlocking it myself doesnt this rule out the recoil spring? From the sounds of its name (i am oblivious to full function) it sounds like the spring is oonly responsible for pushing the slide back, which I had already done by setting it to the locking position myself.

This isnt something that happens after every shot, or on the eject. This is only when I have the gun sitting down with the slide locked back, I pick it up and a full clip (5) pop it in, and SNAP close the slide, it crinkers my bullets as shown

::edit:: i've tried polishing and cleaning and oiling several times these parts I feel like (well by hand + 600 grit wet sand + solvent) no avail... Like I said in a previous post this only happens when i open the rail n try to close it on the first bullet n a full flush-fit clip. not the 2nd 3rd 4th or 5th.. so is it really smart to start changing mechanical things with my gun if it does infact function fine minus this

[jbrowncreative]

Alright I have 4 videos, everyones likes youtube videos!

http://www.youtube.com/user/JamesBrownTown/videos

3 videos of me using the "sling-shot" method to sucessfully load.

and

HERE IS A VIDEO OF THE PROBLEM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CJv1ViJyL4
:80:

Argh, i might just have to send it to kahr

[OldLincoln]

Lincoln, let me ask you this. If I am the one bringing the slide to the locking position, and manually unlocking it myself doesnt this rule out the recoil spring? From the sounds of its name (i am oblivious to full function) it sounds like the spring is oonly responsible for pushing the slide back, which I had already done by setting it to the locking position myself.

This isnt something that happens after every shot, or on the eject. This is only when I have the gun sitting down with the slide locked back, I pick it up and a full clip (5) pop it in, and SNAP close the slide, it crinkers my bullets as shown

::edit:: i've tried polishing and cleaning and oiling several times these parts I feel like (well by hand + 600 grit wet sand + solvent) no avail... Like I said in a previous post this only happens when i open the rail n try to close it on the first bullet n a full flush-fit clip. not the 2nd 3rd 4th or 5th.. so is it really smart to start changing mechanical things with my gun if it does infact function fine minus this

When you rack the slide back, it is the recoil spring you push against, and it is what pushes the slide closed when you disengage the slide lock. It takes a lot of pressure to drive the round out of the mag, off the ramp, nose into the chamber roof, slide the rim up the breach face to allow the round to align with the chamber and slide home. It's like one of those long ladder fire trucks that steer on the back end of the trailer. That part is akin to the rim sliding up the breach face while one edge is under the extractor.

The need for pressure is because of the friction involved. That's why I push for reducing the friction as my first advice. It doesn't hurt and often helps. The second approach is to replace a weak spring for a stronger one to increase the force applied.

[jbrowncreative]

Thanks for your insight on this. I'll look into how I can go about getting some tools to do this, or having some one do it. Anything I can do by myself with my current tools I think has been done as of now

[JFootin]

I would like to see if it happens with other brands of ammo. Some guns, not just Kahrs, will not like a particular ammo, but work perfectly with another and problem solved.

[jbrowncreative]

Interesting.. This is expensive high rated defence ammo. I have read their have been some issues closing the slide on large hollow points. So do you think i should stop by walmart on way home and buy a box o whatever their selling and try it??

[jbrowncreative]

ATTENTION: than you all for your relentless help with my gun. Everyone who has responded has been loads of help and very supportive to my cause!! Ill try with some practice rounds today and see if this still happens. IF IT DOES WORK with practice ammo then i'll simply be satisfied with slingshotting the first round. Maybe look into a new recoil spring an MAYBE some beveling

::edit:: So i got preped to go to the gun range and drove all through town looking for pracitce ammo to no avail. So I tried the only other kind of round I could find at my house to test this problem again. And It seems THAT IS WAS THE CORBON AMMO causing this entire issue