The Bulldawg Kaboomed

[melissa5]

Yes, she is on the injured list at the moment. I am sick about it. Here's the pictures....

This seems to be the only damage on the frame.

http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/498/dscn2435x.jpg

The slide cracked around the front sight

http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/4665/dscn2436t.jpg

The barrel split and is stuck in the slide

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/2267/dscn2437y.jpg

[yqtszhj]

That looks bad. How'ed that happen? Were you doin your speed shooting IDPA practice when it went BOOM!

OH, OH! I want to be the wise guy. Those pictures are FAKE. Glocks never have anything go wrong :p :D

[Ikeo74]

It looks like junk to begin with. What kind of barrel would have a seam in it to split open? Looks like a total loss to me, not just the frame.

[Barth]

Yes, she is on the injured list at the moment. I am sick about it.

OK Melissa, fess up.
What ammo were you using young lady?

[BEARDOG]

Sorry to see this. What happened? Did you have a sqwib get stuck and fire another behind it?

[gb6491]

Yes, she is on the injured list at the moment. I am sick about it....

Melissa,
Are you OK? No injuries I hope.
Regards,
Greg

[CJB]

I'd have to see the inside of the barrel... but... usually an obstruction will "goose-egg" a barrel, even if the obstruction is close to the chamber. Sometimes, a "soft" obstruction, such as a cleaning patch accidentally left in a bore, will cause a split like that with no goose-egg, or even grease in a barrel (usually on rifle barrels).

Most, but not all times, over pressure, overloads, double and/or triple charges will blow the chamber, and maybe the barrel right in front of the chamber, and not split it.

If its "ringed" inside, you can be sure it was an obstruction, and not metal fatigue or over pressure.

Bummer. I wonder what Glockenspiel will say about it.... or do about it, if anything.

Melissa... I'd love to see a shot inside the barrel if you can manage it.

Glad your not hurt either.

[KMA]

I am so sorry this happened to you, at least you are OK. Were you using reloads?

[Bawanna]

^^^ What GB said. I want to see pictures of your hands. Guns are easy to replace. That had to be a scary exciting couple of minutes when it blew.

I had an officer encounter a squib load during a qual this week. Fortunately he's one of the instructors and even though it was a high pressure SWAT qual he just knew something wasn't right and just stopped.
Bullet was just almost flush with the end of the barrel. They drove it out and I think we're ok.

[O'Dell]

Glad you're okay Melissa. As for the Glock, oh, never mind.

[jocko]

she shoulda hve been shooting with a kel tec??????? instead of a block!!!!!

[muggsy]

Ouch, Melissa5, that hurts just to look at. How many times did you count your fingers? When it happened to me I counted them twice. Glad you're alright.

[melissa5]

Fellas, this was caused by my impatience and stupidity! I was indeed shooting some of my reloads. I had loaded 48 rounds and then found 2 rounds kind of off to the side on my reloading bench. One just needed a primer, so I primed it and therein lies the rub. Of course it had very little or no powder in it. So, I had a squib and didn't recognize it as such when I shot it.

When I shot the round after the squib, it was just like shooting any other round. It didn't sting my hands or anything....the slide just wouldn't move. After I started looking at the gun, I noticed the bent serial number plate and then knew that I had experienced a kaboom or some catastrophic event.

I thank the good Lord that I'm OK. As for he Bulldawg, she can be rebuilt just like the bionic woman! LOL

Here's the best barrel shot that I could get.

http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/7204/dscn2440e.jpg

[melissa5]

That looks bad. How'ed that happen? Were you doin your speed shooting IDPA practice when it went BOOM!

OH, OH! I want to be the wise guy. Those pictures are FAKE. Glocks never have anything go wrong :p :D

LOL! I was shooting my steel plates when it happened. AND, Glocks are great if you don't shoot retarded reloads. :(

[melissa5]

It looks like junk to begin with. What kind of barrel would have a seam in it to split open? Looks like a total loss to me, not just the frame.

That was a Lonewolf barrel. Are they supposed to be junk? I'm not all that versed on aftermarket barrels.

[yqtszhj]

Glad you didn't get hurt. I had a squib in an LCP with some import ammo. Fortunately the slide did not operate on the round when I shot it and when I had to manually cycle the slide I knew something was wrong.

It finished that trip and then had to spend time banging that bullet out of the barrel with a wooden rod and a hammer.

Look at it as an experience in reloading and now you have a story that you can use to instruct others. You're ahead of me as I haven't reloaded anything.

[wyntrout]

Melissa, if you don't have an inertial bullet puller, get one... the hammer looking thingy... and use it to disassemble any questionable bullets. The primer should be the first component, not the last added to a round.:eek:

I'm sure glad that you didn't get injured!

Wynn:)

[jocko]

one thing about Melissa, is she tells the truth, putting blame where it belonged and not on the Glock. Maybe an el cheapo gun might not have been as forgiving. I never hear anthing ever negative about lone woloff barrels and that seem split is I am pretty sure not an actual seem in the barrel. I would thing it would be of some high quality forged material and then rifled lone wolffs way. She didn't get hurt, the gun like sheet metal on a motorcycle when it goes down is all fixable, sometimes body parts are not as fixable. Nice post Melissa, u could have just said nothing and no one would have know any different. I always wndered how one can sometimes decipher a squib over maybe a light load (that works) when having on some of these great hearing protectors and some of these rapid fire course, IMO there is no way to catch a squib before it happens either.

Glad ur Ok Melissa,

I know u won't believe this but about 40+ years ago I sold a customer a K22 Masterpeace, he certainy was a nice guy to but did not know guns at all. he and his brother went to a pond to shoot at cans in the water and he shot 6 times at this can and never seen a bullet hit the water , so he broght the gun in with questions and sure enough 6 lead long rifle rounds lodged in the barrel. Local Smitty took um all out and all was well, not a spec of damage to the barrel. I still see this fella today and always ask him if he has been shooting any cans in the pond lately, He smiles, HE KNEW..

[CJB]

1. "one just needed a primer" - NEVER put a primer in an assembled case! You have the condition of ... your experience, or worse, the primer goes off, creating a very bad problem. How many times has that happened? Almost never, but the risk/benefit ratio is too high. Its just not worth the risk.

2. You've learned the lesson of the squib load the hard way. You will (most likely) never do that again. Hopefully you can drum it into others you shoot with.

3. You didn't goose-egg the barrel, because the bullet must have been stuck right in front of the new one. In fact, if it was stuck only partly into the barrel from the chamber, it may have seated the bullet behind it further into its case. Result - high pressure on double weight being pushed... not a good scenario.

Cant say how glad I am that you're typing with uninjured hands.

Will also say that usually - but not always - the person next to the shooter seems to be the injured someone. I have no idea why, but... that seems to be what happens. Scary stuff.

[melissa5]

Melissa, if you don't have an inertial bullet puller, get one... the hammer looking thingy... and use it to disassemble any questionable bullets. The primer should be the first component, not the last added to a round.:eek:

I'm sure glad that you didn't get injured!

Wynn:)

I've got one, Wyn and probably intended to use it on that round at a later date. Then I got in a hurry and wasn't thinking through the whole process. I just saw that it needed a primer and primed it. :eek: In the future, I am going to put questionable rounds in a container with a label on them instead of leaving them loose on my bench.

[jocko]

super vel used to do that and then a frined of mine Indiana State trooper would stop by and pick up their questional brounds and shoot themt o return the brass. He blew a Model 28 cyliner in half. He laughed about it, Smith replaced it as he was on the states shooting team. Ol harry was a real nut case, if it was free,he would shoot it,. Super Vel gave him alot of ammo and to my knowledge that wqas the only round that ever blew his Model 28 to.

[OldLincoln]

Melisa, could happen to anybody, but just like that busted play on TV, instant replay is cruel. The thought I had was how did you get the powder to stay in the case without a primer?

I know it's obvious but just something overlooked. I can't have music or TV or take a call when to the charging stage and beyond (1 squib to date). I also look at each primed round when I move them from the tub to the tray, looking for anything unusual. I don't sweat primer stick-out much but always check it. I don't sweat it because the Hand primer thingy won't let you take the unfinished case out.

[KMA]

You know Melissa, you are extremely lucky! You could have been badly hurt; squibs can have horrible consequences. Be very glad that you are OK.

[Ikeo74]

I am going to guess how this came about. I am thinking you made up the round in question as a dummy round to set the OAL of the bullet and left out powder and primer to keep it safe. Then after a reasonable length of time (?) you found the round, forgetting it was a dummy round and since it had a bullet in it you replaced the primer only and mixed it in with the completed ammo. Think about that sequence of events to see if you can recall doing it that way.

[melissa5]

I am going to guess how this came about. I am thinking you made up the round in question as a dummy round to set the OAL of the bullet and left out powder and primer to keep it safe. Then after a reasonable length of time (?) you found the round, forgetting it was a dummy round and since it had a bullet in it you replaced the primer only and mixed it in with the completed ammo. Think about that sequence of events to see if you can recall doing it that way.

No, I knew there wasn't any powder in there when I initially put the round to the side. My plan was to fix it at a later date, but I never got around to it. I just wasn't thinking when I picked it up and primed it.

[melissa5]

You know Melissa, you are extremely lucky! You could have been badly hurt; squibs can have horrible consequences. Be very glad that you are OK.


The good Lord was looking out for me...not so much the Bulldawg.

[melissa5]

I think I'm going to start weighing my rounds after I load them. That would have caught the round without powder in it.

[BEARDOG]

What type of press do you use to reload? Can you see the powder charge in the case before seating?

I don't know but, I am not sure that with a 9mm only having 4-5gr of powder that weight is the best way to check as the slight differences in brass weight may make it had to tell???

I use a Lyman turret press, and Visually check each charge I throw before seating and crimping. Slow I guess, but works for me.

[melissa5]

What type of press do you use to reload? Can you see the powder charge in the case before seating?

I don't know but, I am not sure that with a 9mm only having 4-5gr of powder that weight is the best way to check as the slight differences in brass weight may make it had to tell???

I use a Lyman turret press, and Visually look at each charge I throw before seating and crimping. Slow I guess, but works for me.

I use a Lee classic turret press and have the same routine as you, but I got ahead of myself with that round and set it aside knowing that there wasn't any power in there. The most aggravating thing about my Lee is the primer feeder. I spend half my time picking it up off the floor.

You make a good point about the differences in brass weight.

[BEARDOG]

Maybe if you sort them by head stamp it would be closer???

As far as Priming, I use a Lee auto prime, hand primer. It is one piece of gear I can highly recommend. I've been using the same one for over 20 yrs of reloading for all my pistol and rifle priming.

[Scoundrel]

Here's the best barrel shot that I could get.


I think if you back the camera off a ways from the barrel instead of trying for a close-up, you might be able to get a sharper one. Maybe put a flashlight on the other end to get some light in there.

Barrel shots are tricky! I just challenged myself to put my camera where my mouth is. I took ten shots, and these are the best of them:

:laser:

[melissa5]

Yeah, I could do that if I could get the barrel out of the slide. :(

[Scoundrel]

Is that another challenge I hear?

[melissa5]

Is that another challenge I hear?

Could be...:p

[Scoundrel]

Hmm... Is your slide mounted on the frame? Locked back?

[wyntrout]

You could try pre-focusing with light pressure on the shutter release... just before "shutter release". I would focus off to the side at about half the length of the barrel and lock the focus... then hold the camera so that halfway down the barrel is about where you locked the focus and take the shot. .. getting enough light is a trick, too. You could use a bore light from the rear... white sheet of paper background... whatever it takes. It usually takes me a lot of shots and I still don't get exactly what I want.... If that helps at all. :rolleyes:

Wynn:)

[Scoundrel]

OK, I went ahead and did it both ways. First is the setup (for the one with the slide locked back). The one with the slide closed is similar, just no flashlight.

Then I couldn't decide which "slide locked back, flashlight in place" one I liked better, so I uploaded both.

[tv_racin_fan]

OK, I went ahead and did it both ways. First is the setup (for the one with the slide locked back). The one with the slide closed is similar, just no flashlight.

Then I couldn't decide which "slide locked back, flashlight in place" one I liked better, so I uploaded both.

But you left out the barrel split and the bullets stuck in the barrel that made it split that wont let it come out of the slide since the barrel is now bulgededed.

[Bawanna]

I think its beyond welding by a far piece too but those are some really nice pictures.

[muggsy]

Reloading like shooting requires your full and undivided attention. When I had kids at home I put a lock on the basement door so that no one disturbed me when reloading. I wouldn't even take a phone call. Familiarity breeds contempt. It's usually the experienced reloaders who get themselves into trouble. Glad you weren't hurt, Melissa.

[Scoundrel]

But you left out the barrel split and the bullets stuck in the barrel that made it split that wont let it come out of the slide since the barrel is now bulgededed.

I was just demonstrating the technique. Now it's Melissa's turn.

Sorry, but my interest in photographing interesting things doesn't extend to intentionally loading up a squib and blowing my Astra to hell so I can get some good exploded gun shots.

But if you want lotsa pics of smashed up guns, do a Google image search for "kaboom guns".

[Tinman507]

The timing of this thread is uncanny.

My son and I were at a range yesterday shooting our carry weapons and his new shotgun for function check.

We're in the groove punching holes in targets when suddenly in the next station there's a commotion.

A father and son in that station had an impressive collection of handguns. Son (Maybe 19 or 20) was on the line shooting a Makarov. He was popping them off pretty well when he had a squib. The kid had enough experience and/or presence of mind to set the weapon down and call his dad. The nose of the round was sticking out the muzzle about 1/4". When the cease fire was called, he had all the RSO's over there checking the gun out. His dad apparently did some reloads of 9x18 and messed one up.

I have very limited experience with handguns, but the lightbulb went on suddenly. The thought flashed into my feeble brain that had he not stopped and squeezed off another, there would have been a pretty good boom. I then mentally reviewed my own shooting and I have to honestly say I am not sure I would have stopped right there. The take away lesson for me was to pay attention to ALL the gun's functions and not just the holes in the paper.

When we got home, I went online to read this forum and saw this thread. Talk about reinforcement of the lesson.

Melissa, I am glad you weren't hurt by this, but know that at least two noobs (son and I) learned a valuable lesson from it.

[melissa5]

Have you guys ever not gotten the mag seated all the way and then pulled the trigger on an empty chamber? That's what it felt like when I fired the squib. There was no pop or small bang.

[melissa5]

I was just demonstrating the technique. Now it's Melissa's turn.



Scoundrel, I could take pretty barrel shots if I could get light from both ends of the barrel too. With this barrel, it is locked in place. I cannot lock back the slide and I don't have a bore light. Truly, that was the best shot I could take under the circumstances and with the equipment on hand.

[Ikeo74]

A lesson to be learned by all readers that are reloaders: Never change the sequence of loading. 1) de-cap and resize. 2) re-prime 3) charge powder 4) insert the bullet 5) completed round. No one ever puts in the primer after the bullet is in the case. For whatever reason this was reloader error, plain and simple. As said above, it you can't provide 100% attention to detail, stop, and wait, and reload when you can.:eek:

[Scoundrel]

Scoundrel, I could take pretty barrel shots if I could get light from both ends of the barrel too. With this barrel, it is locked in place. I cannot lock back the slide and I don't have a bore light. Truly, that was the best shot I could take under the circumstances and with the equipment on hand.

Bummer. Well, it was worth a try. :)

[Scoundrel]

A lesson to be learned by all readers that are reloaders: Never change the sequence of loading. 1) de-cap and resize. 2) re-prime 3) charge powder 4) insert the bullet 5) completed round. No one ever puts in the primer after the bullet is in the case. For whatever reason this was reloader error, plain and simple. As said above, it you can't provide 100% attention to detail, stop, and wait, and reload when you can.:eek:

I have read other threads about saving money with reloads vs. the time/effort involved, and the takeaway was that if you're retired or otherwise have a lot more time than you do money, it might be worth it but otherwise not really.

After reading those threads, I had pondered doing the reloading thing one day, eventually.

But now I am re-thinking that. It seems that everyone who reloads eventually makes at least one squib, by their own admission. If I start reloading at retirement age, I've started doing it at an age where short-term memory, concentration and attention to detail are prone to lapses.

I'm told that you can save roughly 50% of the cost by reloading. 5000 rounds of 9mm costs about $1000. If I save about 50% of that, I've saved $500. If I make one squib in 5000 and fail to notice it when shooting, I've saved nothing, blown up a $500 gun, and risked injuring myself and bystanders.

Hmm...

[Bawanna]

You can get a squib load on factory stuff too. It doesn't happen often and factory stuff is better than it's ever been but it happens.

We had one last week with factory dept ammo in a dept gun in a G21.

Fortunately the officer felt something wrong and didn't shoot the next round.

I do precisely what Ikeo74 said. If I don't really have time or my hearts not into it I don't reload.

[Scoundrel]

You can get a squib load on factory stuff too. It doesn't happen often and factory stuff is better than it's ever been but it happens.

Yeah, I keep this one on my desk to remind me that it's not all golden in factory-ammo-land. The (visible) quality has been much better with S&B than with Federal.

:O

[Scoundrel]

Hey, I was bored and thinking about barrel shots, so I decided to try again. I really am not doing this to show anyone up, if you can believe that. I thought it might produce some interesting photos.

Disclaimer: For the safety-minded, I disassembled the CM9 first, which as you know involves pulling the trigger which fully releases the cocking cam. I inserted the round with the barrel out, then reassembled the CM9, being careful not to reset the cocking cam as I put the slide back on. I pointed it in a safe direction and carefully pulled the trigger to ensure that it was not engaged. I pulled it several times to be sure. Thus convinced that there was no way the sucker was going to fire on its own, I proceeded to set up the photo. I still kept my head and upper body out of a direct line with the barrel, though I confess that I did put my camera hand at risk.

[340pd]

If you are using a single stage press I use a loading block and charge the cases and put them in the block. Most handgun loads the powder charge will fill most of the case. A simple look at the cases in the block should show any discrepancies in the amount of powder in each case. I give the block a visual check and go from there.

[yqtszhj]

Have you guys ever not gotten the mag seated all the way and then pulled the trigger on an empty chamber? That's what it felt like when I fired the squib. There was no pop or small bang.

Yep that was about like mine with some Indonesian Hertzers ammo (from Cabelas) . Fortunately I cought it.

It was about like the old paper cap guns. For those that don't remember what those were they were things that some of us could buy when we were young before the law suits kept us from getting all of those things we could enjoy hurting ourselves with. Like beating a whole roll of caps with a hammer to make our ears ring really well and have the neighbor come out and cuss at us saying quit shooting off those **** firecrackers. and buying fireworks without our parents and emptying all the powder out of the small ones to make a BIG ONE!!! with a really short fuse.

Man.... life was good. And believe it or not I still have all 10 of my fingers too. :D

[Scoundrel]

Yep that was about like mine with some Indonesian Hertzers ammo (from Cabelas) . Fortunately I cought it.

It was about like the old paper cap guns. For those that don't remember what those were they were things that some of us could buy when we were young before the law suits kept us from getting all of those things we could enjoy hurting ourselves with. Like beating a whole roll of caps with a hammer to make our ears ring really well and have the neighbor come out and cuss at us saying quit shooting off those **** firecrackers. and buying fireworks without our parents and emptying all the powder out of the small ones to make a BIG ONE!!! with a really short fuse.

Man.... life was good. And believe it or not I still have all 10 of my fingers too. :D

While we're topic-drifting about fireworks...

My cousins and I used to take about 10 or so Roman Candles, duct tape them together and fuse them up together. The other side had Saturn Missile batteries. We'd play "Romans and Aliens".

Amazingly, nobody lost an eye.

[Bawanna]

Yep that was about like mine with some Indonesian Hertzers ammo (from Cabelas) . Fortunately I cought it.

It was about like the old paper cap guns. For those that don't remember what those were they were things that some of us could buy when we were young before the law suits kept us from getting all of those things we could enjoy hurting ourselves with. Like beating a whole roll of caps with a hammer to make our ears ring really well and have the neighbor come out and cuss at us saying quit shooting off those **** firecrackers. and buying fireworks without our parents and emptying all the powder out of the small ones to make a BIG ONE!!! with a really short fuse.

Man.... life was good. And believe it or not I still have all 10 of my fingers too. :D

Aww man, I have so done that. We use to do 5 or 6 rolls at a time and drop a big flat rock on em. Rung my bell big time. Probably why I have such super sensitive hearing and can hear a plane crash from 5 ft away.

[melissa5]

It was about like the old paper cap guns. For those that don't remember what those were they were things that some of us could buy when we were young before the law suits kept us from getting all of those things we could enjoy hurting ourselves with. Like beating a whole roll of caps with a hammer to make our ears ring really well and have the neighbor come out and cuss at us saying quit shooting off those **** firecrackers. and buying fireworks without our parents and emptying all the powder out of the small ones to make a BIG ONE!!! with a really short fuse.

Man.... life was good. And believe it or not I still have all 10 of my fingers too. :D

You sound like my cousins who thought it was funny to throw firecrackers at each other. LOL

[Scoundrel]

I still throw firecrackers at my friends. But I use the ones with the fat round green fuses. They burn more consistently. The ones with the thin paper fuses were crazy unreliable.

Regarding dropping big rocks on things, I dropped a big rock on a .45 ACP round I came across at some point when I was about 13. Wouldn't do the same now though. Durrr!

[yqtszhj]

While we're topic-drifting about fireworks...

My cousins and I used to take about 10 or so Roman Candles, duct tape them together and fuse them up together. The other side had Saturn Missile batteries. We'd play "Romans and Aliens".

Amazingly, nobody lost an eye.

Well I was trying not to give bad ideas to the "youth" that join in but since you started it once we were all old enough to drive we bought bottle rockets and drove down the road shooting them from the car windows.. and no it wasn't a passenger shooting them either. Worse than texting while driving.

Disclaimer: Don't try this at home. I had many car accidents in my youth (only involving my car) but none were while doing foolish things. All were just daydreaming and not paying attention. Go figure.

[CJB]

The big question is....

Are you going to try and get it fixed, or.... render it a very very expensive desk ornament with a very very good story?

[melissa5]

The big question is....

Are you going to try and get it fixed, or.... render it a very very expensive desk ornament with a very very good story?

For right now, I think I will put a Lonewolf slide on it with the factory barrel and run it without a compensator. It won't be as pretty, but I don't want to sink another big wad of cash into.