p380, do or don't?

[BOBBO268]

I see a lot of negs for this gun, should i get one or not, reliability wise? I like the slim body, but if its a problematic gun, i'd rather stay away....

[cesande]

See this post for MY opinion.
http://kahrtalk.com/showpost.php?p=126329&postcount=3

Or this one

http://kahrtalk.com/showpost.php?p=126330&postcount=2

Again my opinions.....

and I will work to make it a range toy as much as I can but realize that it is really a 1 or 2 mag sword when needed (fully cleaned and lubed and ready for service)....

[BOBBO268]

Very good read, thanks for the help. It makes sense, only the first mag or two count when it matters. Interested to hear if anyone has problems with those first 2 mags....

Also, does anyone who owns a p380 also have a taurus 380 lcp? I've also been looking at these, and for under $200, i can add a crimson trace laser for $180 and still be way under the price of the kahr. Any opinions/experiences?

[kerby9mm]

Around here the p380 is close in price to the Sig p238 which now is known to be reliable and fun to shoot for way more that 2 mags worth. It is too bad the p380 has so many issues. The Ruger Lcp is small enough for pocket carry,cheap and has a better track record than the p380. There is also the Keltec so you have other choices.

[Ninjatarian]

Save yourself the hassle... and money. I own a P380. I now also own the S&W bodygaurd. The P380 had a few major failures. The Bodyguard had a couple minor failures that wouldn't keep it from still functioning (slide didn't lock back on empty mag, for example). The Bodyguard was half the price and comes with a built in laser. It also has real adjustable iron sites unlike the Taurus. I also like the Taurus, but the lack of real sites kills it for me.


If someone already owns a problem child P380, then 50/50 on keeping it. If you don't and know they are a problem ahead of time... you would be silly.

As far as that 1-2 mag sword comment, I partially agree. What you say is true only needing 1-2 reliable mags. But also, how long does your gun stay squeaky clean and oiled when you carry it every day in your lint filled pocket, gumming up the works and soaking up the oil? Second, carrying is a major peace of mind thing. I'm not sure I would have peace of mind knowing the gun I chose to take with me is only good for 1-4 mags... on a good day.

[rogerthedodger]

Save yourself the hassle and money. Buy a CM9, or if in Commiefornia, get a PM9. Best of the best, my opinion. I have CW9, PM9, P380, LC9, LCP, LCR, and many others.
PS And if you really gotta have a P380, I'll make u a deal on mine. LOL:)

[BOBBO268]

I have a bodyguard, and i've only shot it once, I hate the trigger, i mean HATE!!!, it is horribly long and between 8 and 10 lbs, thats crazy. The laser's are prone to failure and once again, should have done a lot more research, like i'm doing this time. From what i've read the cm9s are very reliable, however, thicker than the p380 and probably a lot harder to carry inside a waistband or inside a pocket, right?

[JFootin]

I have a bodyguard, and i've only shot it once, I hate the trigger, i mean HATE!!!, it is horribly long and between 8 and 10 lbs, thats crazy. The laser's are prone to failure and once again, should have done a lot more research, like i'm doing this time. From what i've read the cm9s are very reliable, however, thicker than the p380 and probably a lot harder to carry inside a waistband or inside a pocket, right?

My CM9 disappears IWB. In an El Paso Pocket Max horsehide holster, there was no printing when standing, but a large and noticeable (to me at any rate) lump on top of my leg when sitting. Too big to be mistaken for a wallet. Some people can get away with it, but I can't with my thin legs. Try it for yourself. The gun is light enough that it rides very comfortably in the pocket. Jocko carries his PM9 in his left front pocket all the time.

For IWB carry so comfortable that you literally cannot feet the gun and holster there at all, get a PJ IWB Holster (http://pjholster.com/?page_id=37) with over the belt clip. Just $40 shipped and the best holster you can get for the CM9. Paul will work with you on cant, ride height, clip style, whatever it takes to satisfy you.

[jjmc2001]

I bought a P380 in slightly used condition a few weeks ago. It is an RAXXX serial number and looked to be lightly used. I already own a Kahr CW9 and love it. I figured even if the 380 had issues Kahr would make it right. I have a little over 300 rounds through it as of yesterday with only one stovepipe which was casued by me limp-wristing with my off-hand (first shot). The P380 is a true pocket pistol. The CM9 is not. I aslo have an LCP and the P380 is a huge step up in terms of trigger, sights, and overall finish. The Sig238 is a fine weapon and it appears the kinks are now worked out of it. I just thought it was too heavy and I never warmed up to the single action/safety issue for a pocket gun. If you always intend to carry IWB go with a CM9 but for pocket carry the P380 is excellent. The problem with reading about problems is the satisfied owners rarely comment. So far I am satisfied and if it has issues I will send it back to Kahr.
My first 300 rounds were with the crappiest ammo I had including Fiocchi, Privi Partizan, Winchester white box, and UMC. I did clean it after 200 and then went back to the range a few days later with some higher quality ammo. Same excellent results. I am sure there are problem P380s out there I guess I just got lucky.

[Tank]

I have a P380 that I guess I must have gotten lucky with, it's even in the "bad S/Ns" at S/N RB69XX. I had some issue in probably the first 100 or 125 break in rounds but by 200 it was working fine and I'm around 400-450 now with no issues.

One of my issues was my gun doesn't like flat nose wwb ammo. Don't limp wrist it, and I make sure I always close the slide using the slide lock and allowing the spring to close the action and load the 1st round. Kahr recomeneds this method but I caught myself closing the action slowly to watch the 1st round load. I fixed these minor issues and have had good luck. Maybe I'll develope prolems later but so far so good.

I do find that I have been only shooting this gun about 30 rounds at the end of the session about the last 3 or 4 times out, just to stay up on it. Next time I'll try a hundred or so to see if there are any problems.

This .380 fits my hand better than any I looked at. I get 2 full finger on the gun without using a mag extention that moves around on my second finger. I'm still in awe over the accuracy with a 2.5" barrel the P380 is cappable of.

The gun world is full of almosts. There are .380s almost as small as .32s, 9mms almost as small as .380s, .40s almost as small as 9mms.......

It's a personal choice on the size of frame you are looking for for what you are going to do with the gun. Some cases a half inch longer and 4 ounces heavier aren't a concern and you can move up a caliber. Others this is a deal breaker.

Let us know what you go with and how it turns out for you.

[kpm9]

Mine was a problem from day 1 and I sold it and bought a LCP.
The LCP has been 100%, not as accurate but reliable. And that is what I need for a close up backup gun.

[Longitude Zero]

I am no fan of the 380 in ANY weapon. I would never trust my life to anything less than a 9mm or bigger.

[Disapointed]

D-O-N-T

Trust me on this one.
SG

[Disapointed]

I am no fan of the 380 in ANY weapon. I would never trust my life to anything less than a 9mm or bigger.

I know everyone has heard this before, but it is true. I'd much rather have a .380 that is always on my person, than my .40 or 9mm that is with me a few times a year.

[kpm9]

I'd much rather have a .380 that is always on my person, than my .40 or 9mm that is with me a few times a year.

True, just not the P380. With the PM9 and CM9 around, you can do much better.

[Squib]

To paraphrase Dirty Harry: "Are you feeling lucky...bunky?" Checkout the CM9.

[onegun]

If it was twice as good as the one I had it would still be unreliable. Look at the PM9/CM9.

[raptorider]

def get a cm9,,can't go wrong for the price.

[dirtkicker]

I am no fan of the 380 in ANY weapon. I would never trust my life to anything less than a 9mm or bigger.

It sure seems all the 380's out there have issues of some kind. I had the LCP - long trigger, couldn't hit crapola with it. DB380 - utter fail. CM9 for my ccw.

[Jeremiah/Az]

I have a P380 that has been flawless from day one. Never had one malf. I don't count rounds, but I'm sure it's over 200.

[jjmc2001]

Can some of the P380 owners on here explain the problems they had and why they could not be fixed by Kahr. As I said earlier I guess I got lucky but I wondered why Kahr could not fix the problems.

[JFootin]

Man, you're opening a can of worms, here! Just do some searches. It has been discussed ad nauseum, and there are no real clear answers about what was wrong, and Kahr people are mum about it. It seems that there were some issues with the frames flexing. Maybe heat changes or heating up from repeated firing. Some people had multiple frame replacements while Kahr was still restling with the issues. It seems like they have found the solution, but time will tell. It will take time for older NIB guns to clear suppliers' shelves, too, but the new guns coming off the line now should be better. I certainly wouldn't want to buy a used one.

[jjmc2001]

I am not trying to open a can of worms and I am a long-time Kahr owner (and happy recent P380 owner). I have read every thread I could find on this site and others about the P380 and have yet to hear a clear definition of the problem and the solution. I am just curious as I am keeping my P380 and if it has issues I trust Kahr to fix it. I would like to hear more from Happy P380 owners.

[tomwalshco]

I've had mine for 2 years. Goes through spells where it shoots great for a hundred or 2, then starts to act up. Probably have 1,000 through it.

Have never shot more than 100 rounds at a session and it's always squeaky clean and well lubed when I start. Have tried all different combinations of oil/grease/lubrication. FMJ - HPs - light bullets - heavy bullets - all different brands - can't find any trend with any.

This last spell was brought on by flat nose FMJs. Latest offering of WWB at Wallys. My ramp is mirror shiny and chamber is slick as snot.

Put a whole new set of springs in. Still acting up. My issues have been 90% - getting round into the chamber (and locked up) and 10% - losing the empty casing on the way out.

Have noticed one of my mag followers has a small crack in it, so it may be just this one mag - didn't really document performance of both. Will pay closer attention next trip.

My "go-to" pocket rocket is a Kel-Tec 380 I've had for a while. Not as good a range shooter, sights are non-existent for all practical purposes, and snappier - but it shoots anything, everytime. Smaller and lighter, too.

But I haven't given up on the Kahr. Will keep fussing with it. A trip back to Kahr is just too expensive and painful for me. Besides I'll feel much more empowered and smart if I can figure it out.

Also have a PM9 and CW9 that have been perfect and I love them.

[tomwalshco]

I am not trying to open a can of worms and I am a long-time Kahr owner (and happy recent P380 owner). I have read every thread I could find on this site and others about the P380 and have yet to hear a clear definition of the problem and the solution. I am just curious as I am keeping my P380 and if it has issues I trust Kahr to fix it. I would like to hear more from Happy P380 owners.
You're not. My take is that well over 50% of the issues with these little guys is technique - code for limp-wristing. That goes for all of them - P380, P3AT, LCP, Bodyguard, DB380, P238, TCP, etc. Some more sensitive than others and some get better with age. A few completely poo-poo the limp-wrist argument, but it makes perfect sense to me (physics) and I've done it plenty.

And the smaller the gun, the less room for error. The timing is all sped up so that minute tolerance and clearance issues that never manifest in a 30 oz gun, become major traffic jams in the 10 ouncers. Lot less room for variances in spring tensions, too.

Maybe someone will design a little dude that will be 100% out of the box for 100% of the owners. But not yet, amigos. Probably a good reason Glock hasn't taken a shot at it because the "Perfection" moniker might take a big hit.

And it seems as though the people that expect every gun to run 100% out of the box everytime are the ones that squawk the most - making it seem like all these units are all POS.

Kahr also has an offset feed ramp which may present issues that the others don't experience. Don't know, just sayin'.

[kerby9mm]

All you have to do is tell your attacker to wait a while so you can make sure that you have the proper grip on your p380 and even then hope it shoots

[Disapointed]

You're not. My take is that well over 50% of the issues with these little guys is technique - code for limp-wristing. That goes for all of them - P380, P3AT, LCP, Bodyguard, DB380, P238, TCP, etc. Some more sensitive than others and some get better with age. A few completely poo-poo the limp-wrist argument, but it makes perfect sense to me (physics) and I've done it plenty.

And the smaller the gun, the less room for error. The timing is all sped up so that minute tolerance and clearance issues that never manifest in a 30 oz gun, become major traffic jams in the 10 ouncers. Lot less room for variances in spring tensions, too.

Maybe someone will design a little dude that will be 100% out of the box for 100% of the owners. But not yet, amigos. Probably a good reason Glock hasn't taken a shot at it because the "Perfection" moniker might take a big hit.

And it seems as though the people that expect every gun to run 100% out of the box everytime are the ones that squawk the most - making it seem like all these units are all POS.

Kahr also has an offset feed ramp which may present issues that the others don't experience. Don't know, just sayin'.


Can't believe you would even consider lettign Kahr escape their shor tfall by bringing out the ol' lim p wrist again. My pile of crap that was purchased brand new never shot out of the box. It was cleaned, racked, lubed, etc. 5 different shooter using 4 different brands of ammo. Oh yeah, cleaning in between using it as as single shot. I've only "limp Wristed" on egun in my life. A Taurus, beretta style 20 yrs ago. figured it out and have never had that issue again with any auto. The P380 is no good, plain and simple. Trigger better than LCP, YES. More accurate YES. Shot both. Looks better YES. Feels better in hand, YES. Less percieved recoil, YES. ZERO reliability for te Kahr, CHECK.

[LMT42]

^^^ Your gun is an RB series which is known to have frame issues. Limp-wristing is a problem even with the ones that have good frames. He was merely stating that of all the issues, he suspects limp-wristing is at the top of the list. I agree.