Perp' in heavy clothes thwarts Cop's Taser

[wyntrout]

Another bright BG with a construction tool and heavy clothes foils Cop's Taser, but not police firearm... WARNING RAW language by guys in car while videoing the incident:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bY5ioBvrYIg

Excessive shooting... naw, Cop surely had a few rounds left.

Wynn:)

[Longitude Zero]

You ALWAYS have lethal cover available when deploying a TASER in case it is not effective. The perp got just what he deserved.

[kb2wji]

LEO did what he had to do. I wonder why Fido wasnt released? It's felony assault...let the pooch taste the guy. And I agree with Zero. My Taser has failed me as many times as it's helped. It's a cool tool, but dont bet anything important on it.

[wyntrout]

From the comments, I think the cop feared that the perp' would harm the dog with that big tool. I didn't bother to follow up or even watch the entire video, but I can't imagine that the perp' survived. He was out of sight on the second 5 shots, so I don't know what he did to "merit" the follow up, but I'm guessing he hadn't ceased and desisted enough.

Wynn:)

[apheod]

cop holding the gun gangster style needs training.

[kb2wji]

^ Still worked LOL Plus, we all know that sideways is for the kill shot

[muggsy]

What part of, "Get on the ground." didn't the perp understand?

[evnash]

cop holding the gun gangster style needs training.

hes not holding gansta style. his firearm is canted in, like you are supposed to do when shooting one handed.

[MLESa7990]

hes not holding gansta style. his firearm is canted in, like you are supposed to do when shooting one handed.


Agreed. Every time we qualify at the range and need to shoot with our off hand, our instructors suggest shooting the pistol canted in to help with quicker follow up shots. So he was doing exactly as trained. ;)

[OldLincoln]

I wonder what rounds the police were shooting and how it performed going through all that clothing. Obviously there was penetration but the perp seemed to veer away with 5 rounds in him. If he was shooting a .40 I wonder if a 9mm would have done as well. Suddenly my 7rd PM9 feels inadequate for the street, even with HST +P.

As for the number of shots, my training say shoot until he is down - period. He wasn't down with 5, but turned to walk away, still holding his weapon. Police had responsibility to get him on the ground and without a weapon to protect all the idiots filming the scene and he may have even had a bomb in his back pack.

Overall I say good job police.

[OldLincoln]

Agreed. Every time we qualify at the range and need to shoot with our off hand, our instructors suggest shooting the pistol canted in to help with quicker follow up shots. So he was doing exactly as trained. ;)

Yes, the cant aligns the wrist with the forearm passing the recoil to the elbow and shoulder. Stick your arm out with closed fist vertical, thumb aligned with target, and then canted and it's obvious.

[Thunder71]

Curious, but why hang onto the dog? I suppose the dog could have been injured (or killed), and those dogs are a partner, life long buddy too.

They 'are' service dogs and the moment the guy went for the other officer he could have let him go - not like the other officer couldn't have moved a little, although he did hobble toward the criminal while apparently trying to un-holster his gun. I really don't think that guy would have stood a chance and the dog would have had him down in no time, that's what they are trained for and he was certainly ready and willing to do his part.

Not necessarily saying one way is right and the other way is wrong, but I do think there were options here.

I'm not a cop and don't play one on TV, so for all I know this situation was handled textbook perfect.

[Longitude Zero]

hes not holding gansta style. his firearm is canted in, like you are supposed to do when shooting one handed.

Precisely. He was using a tried and true shooting technique.

[Longitude Zero]

Curious, but why hang onto the dog? I suppose the dog could have been injured (or killed), and those dogs are a partner, life long buddy too.

They 'are' service dogs and the moment the guy went for the other officer he could have let him go - not like the other officer couldn't have moved a little, although he did hobble toward the criminal while apparently trying to un-holster his gun. I really don't think that guy would have stood a chance and the dog would have had him down in no time, that's what they are trained for and he was certainly ready and willing to do his part.

Not necessarily saying one way is right and the other way is wrong, but I do think there were options here.

I'm not a cop and don't play one on TV, so for all I know this situation was handled textbook perfect.

In the tape the handler did not want the dog engage with a perp when a TASER is deployed. Also once the TASER proved ineffective the handler does not want the dog out in front and be mistakenly shot.

Also my departments policy is very clear. If the perp has a short ranged weapon and the TASET is not effective Deadly Force is expressly recommened and all but mandated.

[muggsy]

In the tape the handler did not want the dog engage with a perp when a TASER is deployed. Also once the TASER proved ineffective the handler does not want the dog out in front and be mistakenly shot.

Also my departments policy is very clear. If the perp has a short ranged weapon and the TASET is not effective Deadly Force is expressly recommened and all but mandated.

It all goes back to what P.T. Barnum once said. "Never give a sucker an even break."

[Longitude Zero]

It all goes back to what P.T. Barnum once said. "Never give a sucker an even break."

Yes sir. I always like the one that went, "If you ain't cheatin you ain't doing it right."

[kb2wji]

Or... If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck

Sent using Tapatalk

[OldLincoln]

Curious, but why hang onto the dog? I suppose the dog could have been injured (or killed), and those dogs are a partner, life long buddy too.

They 'are' service dogs and the moment the guy went for the other officer he could have let him go - not like the other officer couldn't have moved a little, although he did hobble toward the criminal while apparently trying to un-holster his gun. I really don't think that guy would have stood a chance and the dog would have had him down in no time, that's what they are trained for and he was certainly ready and willing to do his part.

Not necessarily saying one way is right and the other way is wrong, but I do think there were options here.

I'm not a cop and don't play one on TV, so for all I know this situation was handled textbook perfect.

I've seen dogs used mainly to chase down a runner. The guy was dressed with heavy clothing like the handlers that practice the dogs and they don't get hurt. So the risk was too high for the dog to get hurt and the perp to remain active. Well handled in my opinion and I wonder if it wasn't a planned death by cop suicide. He didn't leave them many options.

[Bawanna]

In some situations as Old Lincoln stated it's hard or confusing for the dog to understand who the bad guy is too. I've watched some K9 training and demonstrations and was involved when we first got our K9's and they sometimes do attack another officer if there's a lot going on.

Most are trained not to hold a grudge so they'll bite and chew a guy up and when the handler says they are ok, the bad guy can pet and play with the dog like a pet. No hard feelings. They of course don't do that normally but during some of our demonstrations they will do the attack thing and then walk the dog through the crowd and let little kids pet it up close.

Amazing animals police dogs.

[les strat]

Also, even with a highly-trained police dog, one good hit from a taser can ruin a good police dog. Kind of like a good hunting dog that has been shot and becomes gun-shy. It's hard to overcome the association.

[les strat]

In some situations as Old Lincoln stated it's hard or confusing for the dog to understand who the bad guy is too. I've watched some K9 training and demonstrations and was involved when we first got our K9's and they sometimes do attack another officer if there's a lot going on.

Most are trained not to hold a grudge so they'll bite and chew a guy up and when the handler says they are ok, the bad guy can pet and play with the dog like a pet. No hard feelings. They of course don't do that normally but during some of our demonstrations they will do the attack thing and then walk the dog through the crowd and let little kids pet it up close.

Amazing animals police dogs.

I used to work for a lady that trained dogs and attended many training sessions for police dogs. In one incident, a highly-trained and respected German Shephard police dog attacked a gentleman that was saying hello to his trainer and slapped the trainer on the back when greeting him. He was never used again in the police field. They have that kind of demands on them.

[wyntrout]

I think that most people are ignorant of proper conduct around working dogs... police or even seeing-eye dogs. You don't make threatening motions or just walk up and try to pet them. These animals are working dogs... not pets... and trained to protect their handlers. Children are not wary or trained to stay away from work animals unless SPECIFICALLY allowed by the handler/trainer. Adults should know better, but obviously some are pretty ignorant or thoughtless... slapping a handler on the back is an apparent attack... DOH!

Wynn:)

[LaP]

I think that most people are ignorant of proper conduct around working dogs... police or even seeing-eye dogs. You don't make threatening motions or just walk up and try to pet them. These animals are working dogs... not pets... and trained to protect their handlers. Children are not wary or trained to stay away from work animals unless SPECIFICALLY allowed by the handler/trainer. Adults should know better, but obviously some are pretty ignorant or thoughtless... slapping a handler on the back is an apparent attack... DOH!

Wynn:)

It's just a flat out good idea to ask if you can "pet the dog". It applies to police puppies and civilian fur-balls. That cute little show dog can still draw blood just like the well trained dog in uniform.:cool:

[les strat]

I think that most people are ignorant of proper conduct around working dogs... police or even seeing-eye dogs. You don't make threatening motions or just walk up and try to pet them. These animals are working dogs... not pets... and trained to protect their handlers. Children are not wary or trained to stay away from work animals unless SPECIFICALLY allowed by the handler/trainer. Adults should know better, but obviously some are pretty ignorant or thoughtless... slapping a handler on the back is an apparent attack... DOH!

Wynn:)

According to the trainer, he was not supposed to attack for any reason except upon command. They are not supposed to make the call, the trainer is. That is why the dog with 10's of thousands of dollars was permanently shelved. He was untrustable for work at that point.

It was still stupid to greet the trainer that way though!

[OldLincoln]

I grew up with Rusty, an old Irish Setter. I spose he wasn't always old, but seemed older than me as a growing kid. He didn't bark much, but whenever somebody he didn't know stopped by he would position himself just in front of us and push us back if the person started approaching. Once we told him it was okay and properly introduced Rusty to the person (sniff the hand and a quick lick of greeting, Rusty was fine. It was always a comfort just knowing Rusty would put his life on the line for us. He lived a good life and finally gave it up a very old and mostly healthy dog.