Any issue with repeatedly cycling a round?

[East River Guide]

OK, so I'm on board with carrying one in the chamber, but I have kids in the house and even though I keep everything in a safe I still think I should store my guns unloaded. This basically means I have to repeatedly load and unload the top round in the mag. Maybe not a big deal for periods I am going to the range frequently but sometimes it may stretch out longer than I would like between trips. Anyone think the repeated cycling of a round can cause an issue? Anyone have a way of dealing with it if it is?

[Bawanna]

The only potential issue is bullet set back. Some brands and some guns don't have much issue with it, others it doesn't take much to push the bullet back into the case after repeated chamberings. I usually will only rechamber once or twice and if the cartridge still looks good I'll rotate it down in the mag. If it's questionable it gets set aside for the next range day.

The only other concern is when loading and unloading that's the potential time for an accident. I never unload my carry guns, I keep them in my control or out of reach. I have no young children and rarely have any visit so you may require a different approach. I have set places where I always put them, if it's not on me it's in that spot without fail. A high closet shelf if you have young ones is pretty safe. When your not home and they are snooping around, it should be on you. If you leave it at home then you better do the unload thing.

[jocko]

very well stated bawanna, I could not have stated it better--well maybe alittle better but not much!!!!

[CJB]

As Bawanna stated - bullet set back. I cull mine for range use - can get away with that for low pressure rounds like 45's. On 9's and 40's.... maybe not.

[JFootin]

The three of you missed something: he keeps everything in a SAFE. Why would one feel the need to unload a gun that is kept locked in a safe? Are his kids safe crackers?

ERG, what Bawanna said is right. Loading and unloading constantly is increasing the likelihood of an accident. Seeing as how you keep everything in the safe, why not just leave it loaded? In fact, lots of people keep their gun in its carry holster, even when removing it. Do that and store it in the safe, never exposing the trigger or even touching the gun. KISS is the way to go, and unloading a gun you are keeping in a safe isn't.

[TriggerMan]

Loading and unloading enters you in a dangerous guessing game, "Is it loaded?" Better to always be loaded. Period. No wondering, no assuming. No mistakes!

[Thunder71]

Yeah, I have 3 small kids and I make sure the guns aren't a 'big secret', they know what they are and what they can do. With the mystery removed the kids lost interest, not only that but they are all in a safe that only my wife and I know the combination to. My kids sometimes watch me holster my weapon in the morning, they don't think any more of that than me putting on my socks - they could quite frankly care less about the gun because it's normal and they know I have them to protect them and I've taught them not to talk about it to their friends, it's our business - nobody else's.

I also take them out shooting when they want to go (my kids are 4,5 & 9), I have Airsoft and BB guns for them to use under my supervision (one shot at a time).

I understand your concerns, but I would recommend concentrating your efforts on education and safe handling rather than unloading the guns constantly - I think that makes your risk go up more than leaving them loaded in the locked safe.

[Bawanna]

The three of you missed something: he keeps everything in a SAFE. Why would one feel the need to unload a gun that is kept locked in a safe? Are his kids safe crackers?

ERG, what Bawanna said is right. Loading and unloading constantly is increasing the likelihood of an accident. Seeing as how you keep everything in the safe, why not just leave it loaded? In fact, lots of people keep their gun in its carry holster, even when removing it. Do that and store it in the safe, never exposing the trigger or even touching the gun. KISS is the way to go, and unloading a gun you are keeping in a safe isn't.

I'm one of the three stooges that missed everything but ERG, I'm still right?

This is gonna be a good day.

[muggsy]

Yeah, I have 3 small kids and I make sure the guns aren't a 'big secret', they know what they are and what they can do. With the mystery removed the kids lost interest, not only that but they are all in a safe that only my wife and I know the combination to. My kids sometimes watch me holster my weapon in the morning, they don't think any more of that than me putting on my socks - they could quite frankly care less about the gun because it's normal and they know I have them to protect them and I've taught them not to talk about it to their friends, it's our business - nobody else's.

I also take them out shooting when they want to go (my kids are 4,5 & 9), I have Airsoft and BB guns for them to use under my supervision (one shot at a time).

I understand your concerns, but I would recommend concentrating your efforts on education and safe handling rather than unloading the guns constantly - I think that makes your risk go up more than leaving them loaded in the locked safe.

That's how my old man raised me and I turned out alright, didn't I?

[Thunder71]

"birds chirping"

:)

Me too muggsy, only his guns were in plain sight lol.

[East River Guide]

Why would one feel the need to unload a gun that is kept locked in a safe?



As Mrs. ERG will be happy to discuss with you Mr. ERG isn't perfect. I once shut the safe door without turning the handle to lock it. My bad, horrible mistake, but was a good reminder that multiple levels of safety can help save your butt when you make a mistake. On a long enough timeline, everyone makes a mistake.

[jocko]

again every person has their own degree of safety in and around their home. No one but wife and I are in my home so my PM9 is loaded on the living room mantel. My P380 is loaded in a longaberger basket. MY K9 is loaded in my bedroom vanity, My J frame is loaded in my dresser draw. Any time and I mean any time anyone comes to my home my two guns in the living room dissappear. Many would be uncomfortable in what I just stated so again this is ol jocko's method, maybe not a good one for many. No kids ever come and visit, but if they did ALL GUNS WOULD BE UNLOADED and stored away from the ammo.

[jg rider]

With the amount of practice shooting done around here, (3x a week), the procedure is clear weapon of carry mag and chambered round, insert practice ammo mag, practice, clear weapon, wait for it.........................lock slide back, drop same always carry round into chamber, drop slide, insert carry mag.

14 years of doing this without any mishaps, broken parts, or mis shaped bullet nose or bullet set backs

[jg rider]

No one but wife and I are in my home so my PM9 is loaded on the living room mantel. My P380 is loaded in a longaberger basket. MY K9 is loaded in my bedroom vanity, My J frame is loaded in my dresser draw. Any time and I mean any time anyone comes to my home my two guns in the living room dissappear. Many would be uncomfortable in what I just stated so again this is ol jocko's method, maybe not a good one for many. No kids ever come and visit, but if they did ALL GUNS WOULD BE UNLOADED and stored away from the ammo.

My wife has a K9 in a kitchen pantrycupboard, and keeps a night sighted, Streamlight Glock 17 in her bedroom nightstand draw to keep us safe. I have my aluminum baseball bat and my .25 Raven Arms pistol

[Thunder71]

FWIW, repeatedly chambering a round can also knock the primer loose over time. That means no bang, potentially when you need it most.

Sent using Tapatalk on Android

[muggsy]

"birds chirping"

:)

Me too muggsy, only his guns were in plain sight lol.

I raised my boys the same way. The older one is a gun nut like his old man. The younger son doesn't own one and has no interest. Go figure.

[JFootin]

With the amount of practice shooting done around here, (3x a week), the procedure is clear weapon of carry mag and chambered round, insert practice ammo mag, practice, clear weapon, wait for it.........................lock slide back, drop same always carry round into chamber, drop slide, insert carry mag.

14 years of doing this without any mishaps, broken parts, or mis shaped bullet nose or bullet set backs

Do you drop the slide full speed on a round in the chamber? Kahr says that's a no no, the extractor isn't designed for that. A member here polished and smoothed the front side of the extractor on his pistol (PM45 I think), but he lets the slide off gently and eases the extractor into position, doesn't slam it. Have you examined your extractor for damage?

[jg rider]

Do you drop the slide full speed on a round in the chamber? Kahr says that's a no no, the extractor isn't designed for that. A member here polished and smoothed the front side of the extractor on his pistol (PM45 I think), but he lets the slide off gently and eases the extractor into position, doesn't slam it. Have you examined your extractor for damage?

The extractor faces are all polished
We lower the slide until they stop and then tap the rear to fully seat. After a while the rear of the rim starts to round off so the extractor doesn't have to work as hard. But when starting with new rounds we may have to sling shot the slide a few times. We're still using the original extractors.

We do the same with a Glock 17 and.......my 1911carry gun

[OldLincoln]

I do it that way also, jg. The face is highly polished and I usually rub it with a cloth that wiped some grease along the way. Not enough to see but I think some is there. Setting the slide on it and a tiny tap on the back puts it in place.

Also when cleaning, I exercise the extractor with a the eraser end of a pencil to make sure it moves freely. But I also shoot the chamber round now and then.

[U.S. Patriot]

As others have said, bullet set back is a concern. Something you need to keep an eye on. Once I chamber and eject a round, tt goes to the bottom of the mag. After it has been chambered and ejected a second time, it gets fired. I also fire the rounds in both mags every so often, and replace them.

[JFootin]

The extractor faces are all polished
We lower the slide until they stop and then tap the rear to fully seat. After a while the rear of the rim starts to round off so the extractor doesn't have to work as hard. But when starting with new rounds we may have to sling shot the slide a few times. We're still using the original extractors.

We do the same with a Glock 17 and.......my 1911carry gun

OK. That won't hurt the extractor.


I do it that way also, jg. The face is highly polished and I usually rub it with a cloth that wiped some grease along the way. Not enough to see but I think some is there. Setting the slide on it and a tiny tap on the back puts it in place.

Also when cleaning, I exercise the extractor with a the eraser end of a pencil to make sure it moves freely. But I also shoot the chamber round now and then.

I thought so. It was OldLincoln that described how he polished the extractor and uses that same gentle method. A couple of smart guys who think alike! :yo:

[jg rider]

OK. That won't hurt the extractor.



I thought so. It was OldLincoln that described how he polished the extractor and uses that same gentle method. A couple of smart guys who think alike! :yo:

I'm having a problem doing this on the wife's PM9. If you remember a few days ago we had a thread in the PM forum that got out of control, about Kahr's q.c. After 9 pages of some bad mouthing, I think it was you who asked to shut it down.
Well in that thread I mentioned that while having F.O. sights installed, how Kahr had replaced my wife's slide, free of charge, probably because of a scratch I put into the top of the original one.
Well they replaced all the innards also. So this extractor won't go around the rim unless I feed the round out of the mag. I'm not concerned it will wear in and I still need to polish it

Btw, why did you ask to close that thread? We were all getting along so well! :D

I finally was able to take a look at your friend. It's a beauty. Do you check to see if your hair is combed in the reflection?

[William_the_kid]

I've had some problems with repeatedly chambering Speer Gold Dots in my P380. The noses of the bullets would start to get banged up (bent, misshapen) after several trips up the feed ramp. I switched to Hornady Critical Defense, whose more compact nose profile (with a filled central cavity) holds up a lot better when shoved into the feed ramp.

[jocko]

i have corbon powerball in my P380 very similar to the Hornady round, IMO even better.

[cobrasjp]

I've had some problems with repeatedly chambering Speer Gold Dots in my P380. The noses of the bullets would start to get banged up (bent, misshapen) after several trips up the feed ramp. I switched to Hornady Critical Defense, whose more compact nose profile (with a filled central cavity) holds up a lot better when shoved into the feed ramp.

I've had the exact same experience with Speer GDs and my P380. Repeatedly loading the same round deformed the bullet so bad, the hollowpoint was pinched shut. These rounds also had very bad bullet setback. Switched to Hornady Critical Defense for the same reasons as Will_the_kid, plus they have a cannelure on the bullet so you can tell if the bullet has been pushed back in the case. If the edge of the case lines up with the bullet cannelure, there's no setback. No need to measure the overall length to detect setback.

[TominCA]

See the "Is there a new magazine design for the p380" thread in the Kahr-tech section. It is very informative as to what feeds and what doesn't and possibly why. I got a big change in what is relaible by bending mag lips (not recommending it) to time and position the release. I think a lot of these feed problems are at least partially magazine related,

I use corbon 90 hp and don't have much problem with repeated chambering setback.

[chrish]

I've just gotten into the habit of firing off that 1 round every couple months. I don't worry about the repeated unloading and rechambering of that round for the range visits in between.

I hit the range about 2-3 times per month. I just drop the carry mag, insert plinking mag, and go. So every 5th or 6th trip, I loose a $1 round of my PDX1. For me, that's pretty cheap over the long haul. For that purpose alone, one box of 20 rounds will last me years. My practice ammo is the same weight/performance and I've put enough of the PDX1 rounds thru to know it's reliable, so I rarely shoot my carry ammo.

[DKD]

COBRASIP I had the same nose deformation thing going on with my Speer Gold Dots in the P380. The laoding was enhance some with the magazine modification but have since just switched to Critica Defense in that caliber for more reliable feeding...keep in mind the gun is still quite new and may smooth out more with a couple hundred more rounds down range. The Dold Dots are my prefered load in the 9mm and 45 ACP.
Now to respond to the comment made by THUNDER71...I really don;t beleiev that primer set back is possible. The laws of physics would have to be altered to allow that to occure as the slide is slamming forward which would set the primer hard into the primer pocket and not outward against the breach face...Just sayin...

[voodoo54]

I mainly shoot FMJ at the range and save the JHPs for self defense. The way I get around not constantly rechambering the same round is to make sure I rotate the rounds I chamber. I usually only keep a 50 round box of JHPs so after chambering the same rounds a couple times I put that round in the back of the box. After I cycled through all the rounds a couple of times I'll shoot that box at the range a go buy a fresh box. This usually takes several months so I'm not buying JHP all the time.

[jocko]

I think what voodoo is doing is very proper. I tend to about once a month or so to just shoot my defense magazine out and start all anew. I ever unload my guns at home, just the wife and I so I see no need, so set back is not an issue for me but I like to refresh my defense ammo, just BECAUSE.....

I am more of a grease man over a heavy oiler of my guns, as I pocket carry 24/7 and I would think if one is a heavy oiler that indeed he shouyld cycle that defense magazine more often, as oil just has its own ways of getting into things it maybe should not be, like behind the primer cup etc.. Just sayin

[GROTMAN]

As Mrs. ERG will be happy to discuss with you Mr. ERG isn't perfect. I once shut the safe door without turning the handle to lock it. My bad, horrible mistake, but was a good reminder that multiple levels of safety can help save your butt when you make a mistake. On a long enough timeline, everyone makes a mistake.

I thought I made a mistake once..but I found out I was wrong :rolleyes:

[2aforall]

I wondered this myself. I also have a young child at home. Less than a year old. I used to unload when I came home. I read about setback. Noticed it on my glock. I probably chambered that round 50 times. It fired no problem. I now have 2 handguns. A glock 30 and cm9. I leave the glock at home, loaded, in my holster, and in a locked safe for home defense. Wife and I have combo. The cm9 rides with me or in the safe. Never any exceptions (other than cleaning). I found that loading and unloading seemed more dangetous than not. I have a few rules. Two of them are: an unloaded gun is useless. Alsoi dont take my gun out of the holster until im ready to shoot it.

[97harley]

I just finished reading an article in a special handgun edition of guns and ammo on this very subject and they discuss setback. They state about this very subject and suggest every time you cycle a round just throw that round in a box and load a new round and you'll have plenty of range ammo to practice with. ;)