Victim Arrested

[Tinman507]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/21/new-hampshire-man-faces-felony-charge-after-firing-gun-into-ground-near-burglar/

[knkali]

yep pretty messed up world aint it. We can only hope that the grandfather gets a talk'n too and that's all. It would help restore faith in the system and everyone watching each others backs.

[TheTman]

How is firing a shot into the ground reckless conduct when you're trying to scare a theif? Bozo Cops and D.A's. Sure glad I live in flyover country.

[hsart]

Just curious... can you get arrested for an accidental discharge (into the ground)? I'm sure it varies state by state or even by city depending on general attitude toward guns, but does anyone have any experience or knowledge about this. If he was not on his property then castle doctrine won't apply (I think)......

[hsart]

I guess they can arrest you and put you in the guilty until proven innocent place...

[Longitude Zero]

Messed up situation. However unless you are justified in discharging the weapon lawfully, doing just to "scare" is exceedingly unwise. In my jurisdiction it would only be discharging a weapon in the city limits, a misdemeanor with a $760 dollar fine.

[hsart]

Agreed... a messed up situation. The good guy's life did not seem to be in danger unless the bad guy was going for him. All the BG needed to do was to run away... as unwise as a discharge into the ground would be, shooting someone in the back is definitely not legal.

[jocko]

they will ultimately drop the charges agaisnt him, as public outrage will take over. Probably te prosecvutor didn't even know bout the arrest untilthe paper work crossed his desk. Common sense and this guys past record should prevail...

[Scoundrel]

Why did the police take ALL of his guns, and not just the one used in the incident? That's some serious bullsh!t there.

but, that is a minor detail compared to the felony charge. You guys have already covered that part though.

[ltxi]

What I find disturbing is that this happened in rural NH, although Farmington is a college town.

He will be cut loose.

[CJB]

He should have said he was aiming right for the thiefs butt, but missed.... he doesn't know a butt from a hole in the ground....

(edited to make it past the censor bot)

[tmf21]

Cops simply enforce the laws. They don't make them and even if they don't like whats on the books they have to enforce the laws and lets others decide.

That being said and done, this guy will/should be set free and all charges dropped. Otherwise the public outcry will be huge.

If the DA had any brains he would drop all charges.

[Scoundrel]

If the DA had any brains he would drop all charges.

DAs aren't interested in what's right or fair or popular. They are interested in getting convictions any which way they can, if there are legal grounds for it. The worse they can make it for the defendant, the better it is for them.

[tmf21]

DAs aren't interested in what's right or fair or popular. They are interested in getting convictions any which way they can, if there are legal grounds for it. The worse they can make it for the defendant, the better it is for them.

Unfortunately you're correct. I once asked a cop about use of deadly force in self defense and the response was "don't quote me but it all depends on the DA".

[ltxi]

Cops simply enforce the laws. They don't make them and even if they don't like whats on the books they have to enforce the laws and lets others decide.............




And you really believe that? No discretion?

Huh...

[tmf21]

And you really believe that? No discretion?

Huh...

Fair enough. Unfortunately in publicized case discretion may no be possible, also cops are human and you get some that "live by the book" and others that exercise discretion.

[wyntrout]

"Warning shots" are ILLEGAL here. If I were confronted by a large predator, I would think about firing one into the ground and maybe scaring him off, before using a small handgun on a puma or bear... unless he was charging me!:eek:


Wynn:)

[Longitude Zero]

DAs aren't interested in what's right or fair or popular. They are interested in getting convictions any which way they can, if there are legal grounds for it. The worse they can make it for the defendant, the better it is for them.

Not exactly true. What they are MOST interested in is being RE-ELECTED. They will file or not file cases in order to to continue on in public office.

[Bill K]

There is the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. This fellow should - as I understand the story - and probably will get off with not even a slap on the wrist.

[Scoundrel]

Not exactly true. What they are MOST interested in is being RE-ELECTED. They will file or not file cases in order to to continue on in public office.

I suppose you're right, popularity does factor in there. In most cases, getting the largest number of convictions for the worst charges they can think of makes them popular, but when the majority public opinion is against them, I can see them relaxing their hands on the throttle of their personal freight train a little.

[AIRret]

I wonder if this poor guy will be sued by the bad guy(s) in a civil court?

[LaP]

I wonder if this poor guy will be sued by the bad guy(s) in a civil court?

Well, I would certainly expect it. Apparently the "Law" is on the burglar’s side. Roll the dice.... the homeowner could cough up much more than anything the burglars could have run off with. It sounds like a WIN/WIN situation for them.
(another example of common sense being put to death in this country)

[Popeye]

It's a shame but you have to know your state laws when it comes to discharging your weapon. I would think he'll get off with a slap on the wrist,a fine and loss of carry licence. I don't think he''ll do any hard time. What good would come from locking him up. I'm sure the state has bigger fish to fry.

[JimC]

Charges dropped...

http://www.wmur.com/news/30524687/detail.html

[wyntrout]

Well, that's nice. I wonder how much time he spent in jail, how much money this cost him, and did he get all of his guns back??

Makes you really want to get involved, huh?

Wynn:rolleyes:

[TominCA]

Nice Brochure that lays things out nice and understandably - but the model, while attractive, is missing some special quality that the Korean Beauty Queen had. (you probably can't get that type of look at a model agency) and I will miss the last model.

[MLESa7990]

Wow. Would not think something like this would happen in NH.

[Scoundrel]

Wow. Would not think something like this would happen in NH.

Well, they don't charge sales tax so they gotta get their revenue somewhere. :)

[RodeoX]

I think he is getting a raw deal. Having said that, I also think "warning shots" and even warnings are bad form. I may say something like "If you come any closer I will assume you are trying to kill me." Just to establish grounds for deadly force. But I would not say anything about a gun. My approach is that guns are not for scaring or warning people, they are for killing. I would ONLY draw to kill. If some thug sees my pistol, it will only be for a moment.

[JFootin]

What this hero did was a citizen's arrest. Before this country lost its friggin mind, a citizen humanely and responsibly shooting a warning shot into the ground to convince a robber that he was under arrest until the police could arrive was doing the right thing. He was enforcing the law and apprehending a criminal serial house robber. The law is for the people and against criminals. But things have gotten so screwed up that everything is turned upside down! :31:

I'm glad the prosecutor showed he has some sense by dropping the charges.

[ptoemmes]

Now, if this was Texas: http://www.khou.com/video/yahoo-video/Bellaire-man-chases-down-suspect-after-neighbor-robbed-at-gunpoint-139325908.html

BTW - that was not JUST any gun.

[TriggerMan]

In Michigan, a warning shot is an announcement that you want to spend time in jail.

We can't chase burglars through the neignborhood. We can't defend property. Our own or our neighbors. Your life or an others need to be at risk of death or grevious harm. You pull your gun and shoot at the threat to stop it. It's not a laser pointer.

[Popeye]

I'm so happy that Penna. finally has a Castle Doctrine Law that makes sense.

[TominCA]

Next time he shoud say, "I was so scared and fired the gun by mistake, But luckily I was safely pointing it at the ground."

[Tinman507]

I'm so happy that Penna. finally has a Castle Doctrine Law that makes sense.

I'm with you brutha!

[TominCA]

Sometimes it could be handy to have a realistic looking airsoft gun lying areound at the crime scene

[Ken_K]

I'm happy that I DO live in Texas! Houston isn't that far from me and stuff like that happens more than you think. Another nice thing about Tx is that if your pistol somehow becomes exposed (think t-shirt hanging up on the grip) while in a holster designed to conceal it, your not breaking the law. Now, if your packing a 7.5" barrel ruger redhawk on your hip it's pretty obvious your not trying to conceal it and that will cause you some issues.

[wyntrout]

The guy wasn't a "victim" until he got involved... then he fired his gun into the ground. If he was that scared or in danger, one would think that his shot should be AT the CRIMINAL! Obviously he wasn't feeling that endangered since he could fire a "warning" shot... into the GROUND... at someone who wasn't threatening HIM!

I would seriously think about a different strategy... "Halt or I'll shoot"... BANG, BANG BANG... center of mass... more shots as necessary. I would charitably give him at least a few milliseconds to raise his arms or drop the gun... longer can be detrimental to YOUR health!

Shoot, all of the movies and TV shows that I've seen the FBI say HALT! FBI!, the next thing that always happens is that the perp' turns and opens fire on the FBI and they duck while he escapes... IF, they... the FBI... are lucky!

Wynn:)

[HDoc]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/21/new-hampshire-man-faces-felony-charge-after-firing-gun-into-ground-near-burglar/

Hmmm, New Hampshire. Isn't the state motto: Live Free or Die ?

[Tinman507]

No I think they changed it to
"We're pissed Massacheusetts Came First"

[Scoundrel]

Hmmm, New Hampshire. Isn't the state motto: Live Free or Die ?

It's all a matter of interpretation. If you're a politician, you work as little as possible, and all of your living expense and leisure/recreation is covered by taxpayers. That's as close to living "free" as one gets. And, if they can't do this right, they'll die because they certainly won't actually WORK for a living.

You're thinking of people who fight for their freedom and freedom for everyone else, and will give up their lives doing so. Quite a different animal.

[Scoundrel]

By the way, this thread has prompted me to SERIOUSLY consider a gun safe.
One that is bolted to the floor.

I wonder how long it will take for the guy in NH to get his guns back. They searched his house and took ALL of his guns, before he was even charged with anything.

They could eventually force me to give up the combination to the safe via court order, or force the door, but they'd have to REALLY want to, and be able to justify it, rather than it being the whim of some gung-ho cop on the spot where it's easier for them to just do it and justify later.

[ltxi]

No I think they changed it to
"We're pissed Massacheusetts Came First"

bad joke. notice they immediately dropped the charges.

Live Free Or Die vet

[ltxi]

By the way, this thread has prompted me to SERIOUSLY consider a gun safe.
One that is bolted to the floor.

I wonder how long it will take for the guy in NH to get his guns back. They searched his house and took ALL of his guns, before he was even charged with anything.

They could eventually force me to give up the combination to the safe via court order, or force the door, but they'd have to REALLY want to, and be able to justify it, rather than it being the whim of some gung-ho cop on the spot where it's easier for them to just do it and justify later.


My safes are ram set anchored to concrete, both the floor and the wall, and I'll be damned if I could remember what the combinations are if I didn't feel like it. Honest....I haven't opened them in over ten years....lost the paper I done wrote the combinations down on....not even sure I remember what's in there....now that I think of it, they were maybe just there when I bought the house.

It was a long time ago, but after an incident in big city for New Hampshire, Nashua, I was handed my gun back a day and a half later.

[ltxi]

It's all a matter of interpretation. If you're a politician, you work as little as possible, and all of your living expense and leisure/recreation is covered by taxpayers. That's as close to living "free" as one gets. And, if they can't do this right, they'll die because they certainly won't actually WORK for a living.

You're thinking of people who fight for their freedom and freedom for everyone else, and will give up their lives doing so. Quite a different animal.

NH has an unpaid legislature.

[Scoundrel]

My safes are ram set anchored to concrete, both the floor and the wall, and I'll be damned if I could remember what the combinations are if I didn't feel like it. Honest....I haven't opened them in over ten years....lost the paper I done wrote the combinations down on....not even sure I remember what's in there....now that I think of it, they were maybe just there when I bought the house.

It was a long time ago, but after an incident in big city for New Hampshire, Nashua, I was handed my gun back a day and a half later.

It's difficult for some people to know when keeping their mouths shut will work and when it will get them in more trouble.

I read somewhere not long ago about someone who was ordered by the court to give up the password to an encrypted hard disk on a computer. Big trouble if they didn't cooperate.

I suppose if there is no pending criminal investigation, since they dropped charges, they might give the guns back fast. If there is no civil suit pending.

[Scoundrel]

NH has an unpaid legislature.

Point taken. I'm just being cynical and pessimistic. Don't know anything about how most states work. I just hear about public-paid junkets and booze parties that MY state's elected officials get up to, and assume everyone's state is doing it.