CM9-Last round in chamber goes "click"

[94045]

I have a CM9 with about 400 rounds through it. This week every time I cambered the last round it would just go "click."

Any ideas of what is happening?
or how to fix it?

[jocko]

how does the gun know it is the last round??? Some thing else is not right, let another shooter try the gun, just load half the magazine , it should produce the same results if it is always on the last round. If another person can produce the same thing, I would give kahr a call and explain it to them in detail..

very strange IMO> Makes no sense but you might try total take down of the slide and give that strkerchannel a good cleaning which will give u a chancerto make sure allisOK ih the striker channel. Be very sure u are letting the trigger completely reset itself.

[skiflydive]

My sister in law and a friend were shooting her CM9 yesterday and the same thing happened.

[CJB]

Wait... didn't this happen before... I got the deja-vu thing goin on here

[gb6491]

I have a CM9 with about 400 rounds through it. This week every time I cambered the last round it would just go "click."

Any ideas of what is happening?
or how to fix it?
I suspect the last round is not quite going into battery. Try giving the slide a nudge forward before firing the last round. If that clears it up, look at things that might impede how the last round feeds. A good cleaning (to include the top end with emphasis on the breech face and extractor components) and lube might help. New recoil springs will probably be your best bet.
Regards,
Greg

[Ikeo74]

Well I think it is shooter anticipation of shooting the last round and not letting the trigger reset. The reason being the shooter thinks the next to last round was the last round and held the trigger back and not letting it reset. Let someone else shoot the gun and tell them there is 1 more bullet in the gun than there actually is so they won't anticipate it to be empty. Add one to the amount they think is loaded and I think the problem will go away.
It has happened to me when I did not release the trigger to let it reset itself.

[jocko]

very easy to test that theory out. Let some one even load the mag for u and put in anywhere from 3 to 6 rounds even and the results as u stated should prove out. He nevcer statef that the gun was not going into full battery like GB6491 stated could be , for if that was the case it could indeed be recoil sprig relegated but it should possably show up at any round count to, again the recoil spring can't count. Normally a new setof recoil sp;ring solves alot of issue that one would never think was related.

[gb6491]

Jocko,
My thinking is that the last round isn't getting that extra boost up under the extractor like the other rounds do from a following round. The slide's forward momentum is usually enough to lever that last round into position, but grime, a stiff extractor, or being under lubed might rob the slide of enough momentum that it can't quite get everything done. Likewise, weak/worn springs would not be providing enough impetus to begin with.
Regards,
Greg

[Kahrbonized]

I have a CM9 with about 400 rounds through it. This week every time I cambered the last round it would just go "click."


couple of questions...

How can it go 'click' if the trigger hasn't been reset?

Is the OP hand chambering the last round? How exactly are we arriving to the point of no boom? ...or does he mean to say every time the last round is fed into the chamber he has a mis-fire?

Will a CM9 fire out of battery?

[Ikeo74]

couple of questions...

How can it go 'click' if the trigger hasn't been reset?

Is the OP hand chambering the last round? How exactly are we arriving to the point of no boom? ...or does he mean to say every time the last round is fed into the chamber he has a mis-fire?

Will a CM9 fire out of battery?
I have had a (non-reset trigger) and it will have a weak click. The spring is only half cocked and does not have enough power to fire the round. NOTE: When this happens you can release the trigger and preform a double strike to fire the round. If this seems unbeliveable, try it with your own gun.

[jocko]

out of battery no

[Kahrbonized]

I see, now that you mention it...
I am not up on the Kahr fire control design but I do recall reading somewhere that the striker is something like 70% cocked after cycling and there is some safety interlock with the trigger group.

So perhaps that is what is not working properly. I wouldn't assume it is the shooter if they have several hundred rounds fired, I would think the reset issue would be seen early on with a new inexperienced shooter. So what in the trigger group would most likely be failing?

There seems to be a pattern to many of the problems I am reading about in different posts. Either the gun is defective out of the box or else it is developing problems after a few hundred rounds (say 200 to 600). Why do you think that is? One would think that after the "break in" period the "parts fit" and reliability would improve.

[jocko]

not really ur kahr might be 10% pre cocked but certainly not ven close to 70%. If u have a trigger basr out of spec it can cause light strikes, but it should do it alot. The striker block is deactivated when the trigger is pulled, I seriouly doubt f thaty is bad but it cold be gummed up by not a good cleaning when it left the factory. U can go to the kahr tech section ahd hit o the disassembly of the upper slide and learn now to take that slide completely down for cleaning, eventually ur good hav eto do this someday anyhow, so why not do it now and learn from it. give everythin a good spray cleaning and then retest it out. quite possable it is gummed up and u cannot see it. . It is a no brainer to take that slide down..

[yqtszhj]

Jocko,
My thinking is that the last round isn't getting that extra boost up under the extractor like the other rounds do from a following round. The slide's forward momentum is usually enough to lever that last round into position, but grime, a stiff extractor, or being under lubed might rob the slide of enough momentum that it can't quite get everything done. Likewise, weak/worn springs would not be providing enough impetus to begin with.
Regards,
Greg

Darn Greg, that's some high tech talkin there. You have some vision there and honestly I mean that as a complement.

[Kahrbonized]

Since I can't locate my source on the amount of pre-cocking, it probably wasn't Kahr I read that about. That % did seem to stick though. I was trying to bone up on several potential guns before the weekend gun show and decide which models to consider for purchase. I was looking at the Nano, Solo, LC9 and open to what other Mini-9's were available. I already have a Sig P290 but it has been back to the factory 3 times since January (another story altogether) and I was pretty disgusted with their performance. When I saw and handled the CM9 at the show I liked it over the Nano which I was planning on getting. Only after getting the CM9 home did I start reading of some of the problems others are having. I have only put 25 rounds thru it so far, without any issues. My Sig is now back and as soon as the wind dies down a little I will take them to the gravel pit for some break-in testing and chrono comparison against my 5906 or 3913.

[jocko]

worry about ur kahr and not what u read on this or other forums. Remember it is the internet, and one can post anything he wants beit pro or con Doesn';t speak highly of ur sig 290 3X back but I don't see u hammering it. 25 rounds with no issues is better than 25 with 2 issues, accept that and just keep shootin, It will get smoother and u willget better with it. The Nano is not perfect but it has loyal followers but if one wants to find negatvies about theNano all he has to do is stroll within the gun forums. Its the internet.

[Kahrbonized]

Oh I have quite a bit to say about the Sig, but why go into it on this forum.
Had I read about the problems others were having with the 290 before I traded a perfectly good Colt Mustang for one, I would have known to look for the manuf date and not made the deal on that particular gun. As it was, I was offered a deal on a model I was unfamiliar with and ended up with all the same issues others were reporting. Sig fixed that problem on the first return. The problem was they kept screwing up other things and it kept going back for them to make right. Finally they had it so bungled they replaced the entire gun with a new one. It all came down to the same issues we see discussed here about Kahr... quality control and customer service. At least I didn't have to argue with Sig as to who was going to pay the shipping.

"worry about ur kahr and not what u read on this or other forums. Remember it is the internet, and one can post anything he wants be it pro or con "

These brand specific forums are a valuable tool to see what others are experiencing and find out about fixes for minor issues. It's not hard to separate the real problems from the user induced ones... and the heap of BS that seems to get posted in response to many questions.

I try to be an informed consumer but I don't always anticipate what brand/model I may come across that strikes my fancy at the moment. I often rely on past experience and gut instinct. I'm not new to guns, I've had literally hundreds since the 60's so I do know a fair amount about them but I don't profess to know it all. I've got a pretty good understanding of internet BS too, thank you.

After reading several of the issues brought up by a number of different PM/CM owners, I think there are a number of legitimate concerns with the product. Seems to me, there are also a number of diehards here that like to downplay the problems with the guns and make it seem like the user is at fault or that they're too demanding in their expectations. (The same thing happens on the Sig forum and of course Glockaholics are everywhere too.) I differ with that attitude and like to try and solve the problem or at least understand it.

I don't read gun rag reviews raving about this or that gun of the month either. I do stroll thru the gun forums specifically looking for reports on problems and customer service. That helped me decide to avoid the Kimber Solo I had originally planned on buying (notice a reoccurring theme in my posts??? no cheap kel-tecs). I came to the conclusion that all the manufacturers putting out a mini-9 were having problems of one kind or another. I didn't have time to check out Kahr as they were not on my short list until I handled one at the gunshow. I then made the comparison with the Nano standing at the dealer table and made my choice which included consideration of the good things I had heard about Kahr in the past.

Sorry, I'm digressing, we can open a new thread to continue along this line.

If the OP has been shooting fine for several hundred shots and now is getting a click, and it is not due to failure to reset the trigger then I would look for anomalies or signs of wear in the striker reset cam & trigger linkage and associated parts. There aren't very many parts in these guns to cause problems. Surprisingly, some of these appear to be made of plastic (oh sorry... polymer). When you mix metal and plastic moving parts in a tight-tolerance requirement, the slightest thing can cause problems and I wonder if some of these plastic parts are getting out of alignment or wearing prematurely.

[zebraD]

What parts are plastic other than the frame?

[Kahrbonized]

THanks for getting me to look again, I was mistaken, it is metal. Looking closely at the cocking cam, it was really hard to tell if it actually is metal. Mine has the exact same color and shiny smooth surface finish as the inside of the frame. On first glance it looks like a piece of molded plastic. After cleaning the grease and shining a light on it, with magnifying goggles I can see what looks like a small speck of silver on the striker sear contact surface, so the cocking cam looks like plastic but has a small wear mark that shows it is metal.
They went to a lot of trouble making that part as smooth and plastic looking as it is, is it coated with Teflon or something? There aren't any machining or casting marks anywhere I can see, every surface is smooth and shiny like plastic.

[Popeye]

Send it back to Kahr. Let there CS take care of it.

[muggsy]

very easy to test that theory out. Let some one even load the mag for u and put in anywhere from 3 to 6 rounds even and the results as u stated should prove out. He nevcer statef that the gun was not going into full battery like GB6491 stated could be , for if that was the case it could indeed be recoil sprig relegated but it should possably show up at any round count to, again the recoil spring can't count. Normally a new setof recoil sp;ring solves alot of issue that one would never think was related.

Jocko, my old man fixed more pistols with a detailed strip, clean and lube then you could shake a stick at. Occasionally he would have to replace a worn extractor, weak spring or broken firing pin, but rarely did he have to go any further.

[Gliderguy]

Were multiple magazines producing the same problem? I can invision the cartridge stripper on the bottom of the slide hitting the magazine follower and not quite letting the gun get 100% into battery. if the timing and tolerance on the striker block is very tight the striker may be hitting the block.
Any light hits on recovered brass or notably off center hits on the primers?