Zimmerman update

[knkali]

http://gma.yahoo.com/warning-graphic-photo-possible-evidence-shows-george-zimmermans-050145810--abc-news-topstories.html

[AJBert]

Amazing how "new" evidence keeps coming out on the side of Zimmerman, isn't it?

[aKahrt_and_p2KT]

Amazing how "new" evidence keeps coming out on the side of Zimmerman, isn't it?

I think the story has been told on one side so far.

[Barth]

http://gma.yahoo.com/warning-graphic-photo-possible-evidence-shows-george-zimmermans-050145810--abc-news-topstories.html

It's unfortunate that Zimmerman pursued when he was requested not to.
Also, arming yourself for a lethal force encounter while performing neighborhood Watch duties,
and I emphasis watch, showed poor judgment that doesn't bode well for him.

It's good that he at least has some injuries or his goose would be cooked for sure.

My biggest concern is that poor judgment by a single individual
may have a deep negative impact on the gun rights of literally millions.
I'm sure there are many times more instances of
foiled rape, robbery, murder and other forced felonies,
by private citizens with permits, that we will never hear about.

So much good that the liberal news agencies seem all to willing to ignore.

[AIRret]

From the information available I agree with Barth. Poor judgment by Zimmerman may have a BIG impact on gun rights. We all know how anti-gun activist will jump on ANY incident to limit our rights. It's a-shame that pro gun people don't get equal air time. We RARELY hear about how violent crime goes down when CPL's go up.
'

[jocko]

and to add to this crapola. I read today where Ted Nugent was fined 10K plus other mandates for poaching a bear in alaska. he is banned from there unjting for a certaiain amount of time and to add to that he is also baned in komiforia for baitng deer . IMO he is a real thorn in the NRA's side with his over the wall vocalizing and now to add this to his resume, IMO is sure not the person I want standing on any podium and trying to defend anything. Very dissapointed in him to say the least. He will be looked at with a different eye IMO. from me anyhow.

[knkali]

and to add to this crapola. I read today where Ted Nugent was fined 10K plus other mandates for poaching a bear in alaska. he is banned from there unjting for a certaiain amount of time and to add to that he is also baned in komiforia for baitng deer . IMO he is a real thorn in the NRA's side with his over the wall vocalizing and now to add this to his resume, IMO is sure not the person I want standing on any podium and trying to defend anything. Very dissapointed in him to say the least. He will be looked at with a different eye IMO. from me anyhow.

I agree. He gives anything remotely conservative a bad name. His over simplistic, over the top, know it all attitude wears thin quickly.

[CJB]

It's unfortunate that

That sir, is a blatant falsehood and one that has become a mythical fable

Zimmerman said something like - should I follow him

Dispatch said - we dont need you to do that

Zimmerman turned back toward his parked vehicle

~~

Your premise is wrong on several grave counts.

First, and foremost, following Martin was a legal activity.

Secondly, there was no order, no instruction, no mandate, for Zimmerman to stop. We dont need you to do that is not an order to stop, especially considering the circumstances. Dispatch are always instructed to advise citizens to withdraw. You could report seeing a rape of a six year old girl in progress, describing hairy testicles and erect ***** (peeness) thrusting into the victims bloodied vagina, and they'd tell you to not get involved. Its what they do, its what they are trained to do. They are trained to do so for the following reason: For the callers safety. Thats it. They are concerned that the alleged perp would turn on the caller.

Third, based on where Martin would have to have been to disappear, and the place Martin was shot, Zimmerman was in fact on his way back to his vehicle, having given up following at the suggestion (at best) of the dispatcher.

Take a look at the aerial images of the complex. Take a look at the time line. LISTEN to the police tape, and

....Zimmerman pursued when he was requested not to....

flies out the window, based on facts - vehicle location, building layout, placement of body. Those cannot be misrepresented, as the media claim of "failure to follow orders to stop pursuing" are.


EDIT - peeness is edited out? and vagina is not... h'mmm sexist I'd say!

[Barth]

The law permits you to carry a concealed weapon for self-defense.
Carrying a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman or a "good samaritan."

In my eyes;
A private citizen arming themselves,
and then following a suspicious individual,
is a clear example of poor judgment with potential consequences.

Sing and dance all you want.
This guy is in deep doo doo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX009sWzRQg

[Mike_B]

I agree. He gives anything remotely conservative a bad name. His over simplistic, over the top, know it all attitude wears thin quickly.

I'd pay to see Nuge perform his music. I would not bother to go see him speak about politics, even if free. Great guitar player and performer, politician- no....

Come on now, do you really care about someone's political viewpoint when they sing songs like "Wang Dang, Sweet Poontang"?

[CJB]

I see it as good citizenship personified.

The fact that he was armed.... many people, me included, carry every day. We dont "arm ourselves", which has implication of intended purpose. We carry. We want options should the need arise. Following someone - especially when you're on the phone with the cops - seems like a good thing to do. There were a lot of problems in that neighborhood (townhouse community).

Its not song and dance. Its all a matter of facts and law, versus opinion and emotion.

FACT: Zimmerman has the legal recourse of defending himself, even with deadly force, if he believes he was going to be seriously hurt, or killed. That is non-contestable. Its the law.

The one thing, and only one thing, that really matters is this: Did Zimmerman believe he was about to be seriously harmed, or even killed.

Race, color, size, weight, following... is all pie in the sky, diversion. It comes down to explaining how Martin "disappeared" in one location, then was killed in a location not far from Zimmermans vehicle. Thats the crux of it. There are two explainations - either Zimmerman "captured" Martin, and Martin made a break for it, attacking Zimmerman. Or Martin circled around, and attacked Zimmerman. Thats it. And that is what will be presented in the trial - IF - and thats a big IF - if it goes to trial.

There are good chances it will still be tossed by the trial judge.

Zimmerman's doo-doo is deep, but less legal than social I'm afraid.

[Barth]

I'd pay to see Nuge perform his music. I would not bother to go see him speak about politics, even if free. Great guitar player and performer, politician- no....

Come on now, do you really care about someone's political viewpoint when they sing songs like "Wang Dang, Sweet Poontang"?

It amazes me how some people seem particularly interested in performers political views.
We all have valid opinions.
But someone staring in a TV sitcom hardly makes them an expert in political matters.

Then again I post here.
And all I did was stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night - LOL!
http://www.sitemason.com/files/eGRVYs/holidayinn.jpg/main.jpg

[Longitude Zero]

My biggest concern is that poor judgment by a single individual
may have a deep negative impact on the gun rights of literally millions.
I'm sure there are many times more instances of
foiled rape, robbery, murder and other forced felonies,
by private citizens with permits, that we will never hear about.

So much good that the liberal news agencies seem all to willing to ignore.


And that is the way it is in our country. My suggestion is to become politically active at all levels in your area where you live. If your reps do not know you by name when you call them you are not doing enough!!!

[kramm]

Seems to me that there was(is) some kind of tension that was ready to pop, the M&Z incident was the spark that set it off. Wonder what it could be?

[jocko]

I don't see any judge tossing the case out. not that maybe it should not be but he just ain't gonna do it. he will let the law play out and the jury can toss the case out by a not guilty

[jocko]

I'd pay to see Nuge perform his music. I would not bother to go see him speak about politics, even if free. Great guitar player and performer, politician- no....

Come on now, do you really care about someone's political viewpoint when they sing songs like "Wang Dang, Sweet Poontang"?

he is a real performer but I think he a real me COMPLEX TO. I seen his show at Mountain fest last year in W.VA and it was awesome, if he wouldjust sing but he has to ad dhis political b.s. to about every thing he does. like as if people are realy listening to him. These past two incidents concernng hunti9ng just turned me totally off on him. I have no douvbt he has been donfg this **** for years to. I am not sure he has the real hunter skills to get the respect of those who do hunt. He is a thorn in the NRAQ and they pulled his comment this past week off of their webb site. I don't care what he says but IMO he should not use the NRA platform as his launching pad. He is not qualified for that. A Chares Heston, he is not.

[muggsy]

That sir, is a blatant falsehood and one that has become a mythical fable

Zimmerman said something like - should I follow him

Dispatch said - we dont need you to do that

Zimmerman turned back toward his parked vehicle

~~

Your premise is wrong on several grave counts.

First, and foremost, following Martin was a legal activity.

Secondly, there was no order, no instruction, no mandate, for Zimmerman to stop. We dont need you to do that is not an order to stop, especially considering the circumstances. Dispatch are always instructed to advise citizens to withdraw. You could report seeing a rape of a six year old girl in progress, describing hairy testicles and erect ***** (peeness) thrusting into the victims bloodied vagina, and they'd tell you to not get involved. Its what they do, its what they are trained to do. They are trained to do so for the following reason: For the callers safety. Thats it. They are concerned that the alleged perp would turn on the caller.

Third, based on where Martin would have to have been to disappear, and the place Martin was shot, Zimmerman was in fact on his way back to his vehicle, having given up following at the suggestion (at best) of the dispatcher.

Take a look at the aerial images of the complex. Take a look at the time line. LISTEN to the police tape, and

....Zimmerman pursued when he was requested not to....

flies out the window, based on facts - vehicle location, building layout, placement of body. Those cannot be misrepresented, as the media claim of "failure to follow orders to stop pursuing" are.


EDIT - peeness is edited out? and vagina is not... h'mmm sexist I'd say!

+1. Thank you for your comment and it bears repeating. Zimmerman was never told not to follow Trayvon. He was only told that he didn't have to follow Trayvon. According to Zimmerman he was attacked by Trayvon after he stopped following him and while he was attempting to return to his truck.

[muggsy]

The law permits you to carry a concealed weapon for self-defense.
Carrying a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman or a "good samaritan."

In my eyes;
A private citizen arming themselves,
and then following a suspicious individual,
is a clear example of poor judgment with potential consequences.

Sing and dance all you want.
This guy is in deep doo doo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX009sWzRQg

Apparently, Barth, you've never heard of a neighborhood watch or auxilliary police. I guess your not your brother's keeper.

[jocko]

and as u well know : dead men have no comments!!

I don't carry because I am scared, I carry because I am not scared!1

[Bawanna]

This one is once again aching to be closed as it's accomplishing nothing. I will leave it for now but know that it's in my thoughts.

It's like summer here sudden like, so I'm gonna go work on my tan.

[Barth]

This one is once again aching to be closed as it's accomplishing nothing. I will leave it for now but know that it's in my thoughts.

It's like summer here sudden like, so I'm gonna go work on my tan.

Sorry Bawanna.

Seemed like things started off constructive.
But this is a hot topic.
Thought I was being politically correct, mostly,
well until I started channeling Johnny Cash anyway...

You have a hard job my friend.

[Tilos]

As I watched the bond hearing and the prosecutor pound away about Zimmerman's statements to the police, I remembered all the instructors who told me if you are involved in a shooting, DO NOT make any statements to the police before talking to an attorney!

That prosecutor kept phrasing his questions starting with "before you committed this crime"... and/or "why did you...after committing this crime".
If that doesn't imply a crime was committed I don't know what would.
The defense never challenged the phrasing of these questions, but I'm not sure if they could.
Zimmerman made 5 statements to police...written and signed!
scary stuff,

[jocko]

yes but also if u noticed i tha thearing the lead detective ha snow chaged his story to, . I think zimmerman handled it well, I think it was a wise, surpise move by his attorney to maybe set the ground work for viewers tosee he is a normal looking , well mannered person so. The persecutor has his work cut out for him in trying to prove 2nd degree murder. I just don'tthink he can get the job done either, and then I will just sit back on the porch with a six pack in in ice and watch the hyspanics and black anniliate each other, and o yes I willnot be calling 911 either . Just sayin. If we let he system work I think he will walk, if we let public pressure dictate, he is a hung man..

and no doubt the total bottom line is that we really know nadda about anything in this case from either side of the aisle either. It is nice to speculate and I think if we keep it clean on this forum and relate to the case and not hammer each other for difference of opinions that maybe the great one will allow this to continue, for IMO it is going to be a game changer down the road for all of us... keep it civil between members.

[Barth]

As I watched the bond hearing and the prosecutor pound away about Zimmerman's statements to the police, I remembered all the instructors who told me if you are involved in a shooting, DO NOT make any statements to the police before talking to an attorney!

That prosecutor kept phrasing his questions starting with "before you committed this crime"... and/or "why did you...after committing this crime".
If that doesn't imply a crime was committed I don't know what would.
The defense never challenged the phrasing of these questions, but I'm not sure if they could.
Zimmerman made 5 statements to police...written and signed!
scary stuff,

I think it's human nature to want to explain every thing in detail to LE
following an event.

I was told to say -
"I was in fear for my life and could not escape"
I would like to have an attorney present before answering any more questions"

The phrase;
"anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law"
has very real and lasting implications.

If your going to carry, it's a real good idea to
already have a defense attorney picked out in advance.

[jocko]

in the eyes of the prosecutor he did commit a crime vbut the jury willbe smarter than that to take "phrases" and let them override the facts of the case. I think te prosecutor did allhe could do as I thin thge defense attorney surprised everyone buy letter zimmerman speak and I thnk zimmerman was well tutored to. I think he lead investogor who wrote the probably cause is the one who fokked up.

best way to get this trial going and over is to put the "nugh" as the judge.

[JFootin]

This was a bond hearing, not the trial. I'm not sure that was the prosecutor saying those things. I think it was Travon's family's lawyer. It was totally uncalled for at a bond hearing, IMO.

[TheTman]

I got this link in my email today, "Does the Media Want a Race War?". Food for thought. http://personalliberty.com/2012/04/06/do-the-media-want-a-race-war/
It seemed we had come a long way, especially with the election of a black president, but the President and his appointees seem to be trying to divide us instead of unite us as a people. I just don't get what is going on here, The media have tensions running so high that if Zimmerman walks, I'm afraid inner cities are going to burn from coast to coast, and if he doesn't then what powers have forced him to be put on trial when the local police found no reason to hold him. It's all politics and throw a bone to the dog that barks the loudest. The way the media withholds evidence, and twist what the release to sound bigoted and racist really makes me wonder what they are up too.

[Tilos]

JF:
I think you are mistaken about who was asking Zman those questions as the state has charged him, not the family.

I think this will drag on past the election for obvious reasons.

[knkali]

I got this link in my email today, "Does the Media Want a Race War?". Food for thought. http://personalliberty.com/2012/04/06/do-the-media-want-a-race-war/
It seemed we had come a long way, especially with the election of a black president, but the President and his appointees seem to be trying to divide us instead of unite us as a people. I just don't get what is going on here, The media have tensions running so high that if Zimmerman walks, I'm afraid inner cities are going to burn from coast to coast, and if he doesn't then what powers have forced him to be put on trial when the local police found no reason to hold him. It's all politics and throw a bone to the dog that barks the loudest. The way the media withholds evidence, and twist what the release to sound bigoted and racist really makes me wonder what they are up too.

They are up to selling print or space on the net. In short, make money any way they can. The media has an agenda. Who they help or hurt is not of importance to them. The media played the case one way and worked it for all its worth now they will go in a different direction to get more out of the story. Bewtween the criminal case and the civil it will be a tough road for Zimmerman for sure right or wrong.

[CJB]

It seemed we had come a long way, especially with the election of a black president

Nah, at best half way there, since the that bastard the President is only half black!

[tv_racin_fan]

The law permits you to carry a concealed weapon for self-defense.
Carrying a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman or a "good samaritan."

In my eyes;
A private citizen arming themselves,
and then following a suspicious individual,
is a clear example of poor judgment with potential consequences.

Sing and dance all you want.
This guy is in deep doo doo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX009sWzRQg

Poor judgement is not agaubst the law else I know a heck of a lot of people who would be in jail.

[Barth]

Poor judgement is not agaubst the law else I know a heck of a lot of people who would be in jail.

When poor judgment results in death,
accidental or otherwise,
people go to jail all the time.

Watch and learn.

[tv_racin_fan]

When poor judgment results in death,
accidental or otherwise,
people go to jail all the time.

Watch and learn.

Some do, some don't.

In any event what has been told by the media is suspect in this case. Surely everyone can see that now that one media outlet admitted it editted the 911 tape in such a way as to leave off the question asked as to race and left the answer to seem to portray a race issue.