1. Two guns are always better than one

[Deano]

This is a little follow up poll to my 1911 shopping thread. I'm now torn between two options. In addition to a hankering for a 1911, I've been eyeing a P380 for summer pocket carry. I have the CM9 which will work, but it's kinda big for pocket carry. Also, P380 reliability reports have me on the fence about getting one. So my two options are this:
Option 1: Get a less expensive 1911 like this one:http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/178/products_id/78865/Handguns/Bersa+Handguns/AMC%20AC45G2DT%20AMCLS%20GOVT%2045%201911%208RD%20 DT/
or this one: http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/178/products_id/49736/Handguns/Bersa+Handguns/Bersa%208%20+%201%20Round%2045ACP%20Single%20Actio n%20American%20Classic%20w/Blu/
or this one:http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/876/products_id/411539079/Handguns/Rock+Island+Armory/Rock%20Island%20Armory%20GI%20M1911A1%20Mil%20Spec %20.45/
then use the left over cash to buy a P380.

Option 2: Spend some serious cash on a nice 1911 like this one: http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/71998
and forget the P380 and just cram the CM9 in the pocket for now.

Will my new affair with the 1911 platform be just as blissful with a less expensive one, or should I go for the gusto. Is it better to try a less expensive one first, just to make sure I'm gonna love it? Advise me, oh erudite ones.

[jlottmc]

Well, how bad do you want both? Thing is with a milspec 1911, you can get a less costly one, and do to it a part or two at a time. Personally, I have no use for a .380 (or 9mm for that matter) but that's just me. Ask yourself which option fits your plans and battery better. That is all I can suggest.

[Deano]

Thanks jlottmc. What you have said is what I'm stirring around in my mind. I'm actually leaning away from the P380, but I know there are going to be times in the summer when I probably won't carry a weapon because it's just too hot to don more clothing so I can cover up something bigger. Is a P380 in the pocket better than a CW45 at home? Anyone with a P380 and a CM9 that can comment on pocket carry of the two?

[Bawanna]

Of your 3 cheap choices I'd go the Rock mostly cause I never heard of the first two and the Rock has an excellent track record.

GB has a similar Smith and reports he is quite enamored with it. He's also familiar first hand with the Rocks, he'll be along shortly I hope.

You just need to determine what the purpose of the 1911 is gonna be and place it on the priority list.

Like Jlott, I wouldn't waste lunch money on a 380 but in your life if you need a genuine pocketable gun, then that's a good choice for you.

I carry my Commander 1911 on my belt every day so it's high on my priority list.

You may not be fond of the platform as a carry gun, I wasn't for awhile either.
If that's the case the Rock would make a fine range gun or a starter if you will.
If your struck by the wisdom of John Moses invention then you go for that Smith or any of the higher on the food chain versions although the Rock would still work just fine.

The CM9 should fill the compact gun need. Lots of ways to conceal that little bugger with minimal attire.
Does it really ever get that hot in Orygun? You on the east side maybe?

[OldLincoln]

I have a very nice 1911 with sentimental value, but I'll not carry it because should I use it I'll loose it to the police "holding" it. I have made up my mind that I'll only carry what I can be okay with loosing. Yeah I know, sad but true, but still something to consider.

[Dmitri]

Also, P380 reliability reports have me on the fence about getting one.
They seem to have resolved most, if not all, of the issues, as it would appear from the more recent reports. Mine has 500+ rounds with various ammo -- and not a single problem. As for the old "9 vs 380" argument -- I think the latest P+ defensive .380 rounds, like the Buffalo Bore or Golden Saber, will do the job just fine (see also Ljutic's latest excellent report (http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=12595) on 380 vs 9 ammo comparison) ;) But that's just me; others' mileage will vary and that's fine.

Anyway, mainly just wanted to point out that it looks like Kahr had ironed out a lot of the kinks in these little pistols and they are quite reliable now.

Good luck in any case!

[Deano]

Of your 3 cheap choices I'd go the Rock mostly cause I never heard of the first two and the Rock has an excellent track record.

GB has a similar Smith and reports he is quite enamored with it. He's also familiar first hand with the Rocks, he'll be along shortly I hope.

You just need to determine what the purpose of the 1911 is gonna be and place it on the priority list.

Like Jlott, I wouldn't waste lunch money on a 380 but in your life if you need a genuine pocketable gun, then that's a good choice for you.

I carry my Commander 1911 on my belt every day so it's high on my priority list.

You may not be fond of the platform as a carry gun, I wasn't for awhile either.
If that's the case the Rock would make a fine range gun or a starter if you will.
If your struck by the wisdom of John Moses invention then you go for that Smith or any of the higher on the food chain versions although the Rock would still work just fine.

The CM9 should fill the compact gun need. Lots of ways to conceal that little bugger with minimal attire.
Does it really ever get that hot in Orygun? You on the east side maybe?The Rock is a known quantity. The other two as far as my research tells me are both essentially the same gun - American Classic II - made in the Phillipines by Metro arms. Bersa has nothing to do with the production of that model. They just import it and brand it. Both have very good reputations as far as I can tell from the 1911 forum, and seem to rise to the top when talking about budget 1911 pistols.


Conventional wisdom is that buying a milspec gun and upgrading one part at a time is the most costly route and usually results in a gun that you cannot sell for anything like what you put into it.

The two, less expensive, fully featured guns you picked out should both be just as satisfying to own and shoot as the Scandium S&W. But, if you have any issues with them, getting warranty service will probably be more of a challenge. Historically S&W takes really good care of their customers and ships very few lemons.

That is NOT to suggest that any of the three from AMC, Bersa, or Rock Island are not of good quality or necessarily more likely to be problematic. They should be just fine. But, if they are not and you are a 1911 newbie . . . the S&W is a "safer" choice.

Oh, and be prepared that this will probably NOT be your only 1911, once you catch the fever. So, starting at a modest price point so you can install your first idiot scratch with less embarrassment is probably a good idea. ;)Idiot scratch? What's that?


I have a very nice 1911 with sentimental value, but I'll not carry it because should I use it I'll loose it to the police "holding" it. I have made up my mind that I'll only carry what I can be okay with loosing. Yeah I know, sad but true, but still something to consider.
I don't plan to carry this gun, but it may serve SD duties at home. I share your reluctance to carry an expensive weapon.

The poll is tied one to one, but from your responses, I can't tell who voted which way. Maybe I should just get a less expensive 1911 and spend the rest on ammo and targets. :D Option 3?

[Deano]

They seem to have resolved most, if not all, of the issues, as it would appear from the more recent reports. Mine has 500+ rounds with various ammo -- and not a single problem. As for the old "9 vs 380" argument -- I think the latest P+ defensive .380 rounds, like the Buffalo Bore or Golden Saber, will do the job just fine (see also Ljutic's latest excellent report (http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=12595) on 380 vs 9 ammo comparison) ;) But that's just me; others' mileage will vary and that's fine.

Anyway, mainly just wanted to point out that it looks like Kahr had ironed out a lot of the kinks in these little pistols and they are quite reliable now.

Good luck in any case!Just when I start leaning away from the P380, you gotta come along and stir the poop. I'm off to look at Ljutic's thread now.

[Dmitri]

Sorry man, nobody said life was supposed to be easy. :D

Also, just in case you haven't seen the "P380 success stories" thread... here it is: http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=8059
:p

[DKD]

I tend to agree with BAWANNA here, the S&W is always a safe bet for sure. The Rock Island is as he stated a good basic weapon. I would also take a look at the new Remington R-1's as a cost effective 1911 pistol. The slides are all machined, all steel same as the originals and they are glass smooth. They come with a standard stainless steel match barrel, and match bushings. They are very close to the orginals they made back in 1917, except they have front & rear dove tailed sites, lowered and flaired ejection ports and high polished traditional walnut grips.

[DKD]

I didn't want to cofuse the two responses so here it is....the PM9 or for that matter CM9 are infact a stouter caliber. I agree that the manufactures much impoved upon the 380 ACP but it will never match the 9mm, plain and simple. Know as for the carryabilty I have used both and yes the P380 is a good bit smaller in ones pocket, however I really think you have to take into consideration on how you typically dress in the summer months. If I had my drothers I prefere the 9mm due to the fire power...now for that matter if I can get away with it I would go to my 45 ACP.
Have I confused you enough yet? Hope thois helps you out.

[TucsonMTB]

Idiot scratch? What's that?
From the 1911 enthusiasts . . . http://forum.m1911.org/showthread.php?t=99944

[BEARDOG]

Here's my 3cents worth(inflation),

I love my 9mm Kahrs and would recommend them to friends, but can't say that about the P380, for exactly the reason you stated.
So if you want to have a smaller, flatter, lighter summer carry then a CM9, why not get a proven reliable and cheaper .380.... AKA the Ruger LCP ?

Then take the $ saved and buy whatever 1911 meets your wants, needs, and bankroll. The Rock's sure do seem to get good press, and you can get them in the "tacticool" version for a little more $ as well.... There are other more middle range 1911's to consider, like from Sig and SA, and Ruger (of coarse they are hard to get now, but that will pass in time.)
So that even with the .380 LCP it would put you around the price on the S&W alone.

Later, if you find that you just got to have a more expensive 1911, go for it!...What do you want the 1911 for??? That E series S&W is Scandium, with a bobtail and Night sights it is comander sized and is designed for carry. IMHO you have at least 3 better guns for CARRY already with your Glock 19 and Kahrs.
I use to carry a 1911 style gun, and still would if I had to, but every gun I have bought in the last few years for carry/defense has been... DAO ,- They Have no manual safety,- and are made with lightweight (poly) frames.
Some 1911's are beautiful, and the single action trigger makes them very nice shooters BUT, To me they are more for range fun, and just to "have" kinda guns now.

[muggsy]

The only way I can pocket carry my CM9 is in a coat pocket. It does very well IWB. The P380 is a peach to pocket carry, but the .380 Auto a little light for a true defensive round. I use it primarily as a back up gun, or when I can't carry anything else. My all time favorite gun to shoot is my 70 series Colt Gold Cup. If I had your choice to make I'd go with the best 1911 that I could afford and put the P380 on hold for awhile. You could look for a good used 1911. There are plenty of them out there.

[Yogi 117]

Being an LCP .380 24/7 carrier, you know my feelings. While the LCP just slips into a front pocket & you never realize it's there, if I had to do it all over again with what I know today, I would carry the Kahr CM9, and the reasons are many: better stopping power, cheaper ammo than .380, easier to shoot with better accuracy & on target follow up shots, concealibility (not much bigger than the LCP), buying same ammo for practice & SD as my G26 & your G19. The LCP has one & only one advantage, about 5-6 ounces lighter than the CM9. Now, I can't speak to the Kahr P380, but I agree with a couple of statements that the .380 ammo has come a long way, and a .380 is better than nothing. I also have a N82 (squared) IWB Professional holster ordered for my G26, and if works as nice at keeping the total weapon away from my skin as I think it will, you might consider getting one for your CM9 for summer carry. It's a tuckable holster, or you can just wear a Hawaiian shirt or polo shirt un-tucked, a normal summer sighting!

With that said, I did NOT vote because I'm not familiar with the 1911 platform, but there are so many .45's to choose from it would be like a kid in the candy store. Choices & Options are always a good thing, so I can feel your dilemma. Good luck on your search, sounds like you have some tough decisions ahead. U.S. Marshall Raylan Givens carries the G21 in .45 acp, and it looks nasty! I believe they can be had with a narrower grip for the smaller hand. Like I said, lots of options & maybe you're dead set on the 1911 platform. If so, go for the gusto & get a Colt or STI. Just my $0.02 worth. ;)

Edit: I guess with inflation, that should read my $0.03 worth? Oh boy! :eek:

[gb6491]

Of your 3 cheap choices I'd go the Rock mostly cause I never heard of the first two and the Rock has an excellent track record.

GB has a similar Smith and reports he is quite enamored with it. He's also familiar first hand with the Rocks, he'll be along shortly I hope.

You just need to determine what the purpose of the 1911 is gonna be and place it on the priority list.

Like Jlott, I wouldn't waste lunch money on a 380 but in your life if you need a genuine pocketable gun, then that's a good choice for you.

I carry my Commander 1911 on my belt every day so it's high on my priority list.

You may not be fond of the platform as a carry gun, I wasn't for awhile either.
If that's the case the Rock would make a fine range gun or a starter if you will.
If your struck by the wisdom of John Moses invention then you go for that Smith or any of the higher on the food chain versions although the Rock would still work just fine.

The CM9 should fill the compact gun need. Lots of ways to conceal that little bugger with minimal attire.
Does it really ever get that hot in Orygun? You on the east side maybe?
I do indeed have an "E" series Smith and a Rock Island (albeit in 9mm).
I like them both a lot. You get much better fit and finish with the Smith, but the Rock Island is presentable. I've dealt with both companies' Customer Service and found both to be top notch in taking care of my pistols (a S&W M63 and a RIA mid size 1911). Both guns are reliable. The Smith might be more accurate from a machine rest, but both will probably shoot better than a lot of folks can hold them. I'd be a lot less concerned if I ding the RIA than I would be with the Smith:eek: I think the RIA is a good value, especially for some one getting into 1911s. I think the Smith a good value considering the price, features, fit, and finish.
I've looked the American Classic over and think them as about the same quality as the RIA offering (comparing each's Tactical models). I've no clue about their customer service.
Here are my Smith and RIA:
http://i41.tinypic.com/rrjms3.jpg
http://i49.tinypic.com/30d87qa.jpg
BTW, I often carry two guns with the pocket carry most likely being a .32 or .380 auto. They fit my need, I practice quite a bit with them, and feel confidant with either, but in the end they are just my personal preference (won't be swayed otherwise or attempt to sway anyone likewise).
Regards,
Greg).

[Deano]

Wow, I'm overwhelmed by the response. I feel fortunate to be a part of such a great forum. I never expected this many responses in just a couple of hours. Doesn't anyone around here work? :eek: I'm processing the responses now, and my hard drive is a little slow (needs an upgrade). Must be time to go golfing.

That Remington R-1 looks pretty nice. Is the enhanced version the same, except for the front serrations on the slide?

[Bawanna]

Those Smith grips are drop dead gorgeous. Wish I could come close to that. I bet I could get 12 or 15 bucks a copy for something like that. Personalize the initial for folks that don't got E in their name.

Love Eloishous Edzachery.

[QuercusMax]

In answer to the original question, I strongly recommend:

Get one nice gun now. Don't get 2.

I say this based on something I learned long ago: Back when I was away at college, I came home several times a year on breaks, and every time I would buy one LP record for my stereo (now you know how long ago). Each time I got a new one, I would listen to it over and over, and thus got a lot of enjoyment from every record.

Then one time I had a little extra money, so I splurged and bought TWO records at once. But since I only had so much listening time, I didn't get any more pleasure out of 2 records than I did with one - but I spent more. One of many life lessons. (I also observe that buying multiple toys for my grandson does not provide him with any more pleasure than one - it just divides his attention and he does not enjoy any one thing very much.)

Your question is slightly different, in that you are thinking about buying 2 cheaper items instead of 1 more expensive one. Another of my life lessons is that every time I have bought a cheap item, I have regretted it. In my case, more cheap stuff usually has given less pleasure than having nice things that work well and that I can cherish.

My advice: Buy one really nice gun now, and put all of your effort into enjoying it now. And you will still be able to dream about getting that 2nd item some day - unless you change your mind and want something different.

[jocko]

I have to admit those smith grips are totally awesome. I have no doubt though Bawanna u could duplicate that and being there is only one letter engraved in the grips. I can't for the life of me see how u could mispell that even. Other than that I think ur good to go my friend: Just sayin.

[JFootin]

My last name begins with 'E' and I love that bobtail Smith! :D

[dkmatthews]

I like QuercusMax's advice and I agree with him but for the opposite reason.

If you go into the purchase feeling like you're making a compromise, then you're ALREADY unhappy and you've got buyers remorse before you ever put down the cash.

Guns are SO PERSONAL that it's hard NOT to end up with an emotional attachment to them. Based on that belief, I can't ever recommend someone buy something when they feel like they are starting out with a compromise.

BOTTOM LINE: Stick with your 9mm and buy yourself the gun you really want.

[OldLincoln]

You were thinking about 380 so that you can pocket carry comfortably. If your smallest gun remains the 9mm, will you carry it as faithfully as a 380? It will definitely show in dress pants while the 380 not nearly as much.

So, if not going the 380 route means not carrying at times I suggest getting a 380. If you are concerned about the Kahr then get something with a better reputation. Nobody here will think less of you for it.

[ParabellumJ]

If you go into the purchase feeling like you're making a compromise, then you're ALREADY unhappy and you've got buyers remorse before you ever put down the cash.

Guns are SO PERSONAL that it's hard NOT to end up with an emotional attachment to them. Based on that belief, I can't ever recommend someone buy something when they feel like they are starting out with a compromise.

BOTTOM LINE: Stick with your 9mm and buy yourself the gun you really want.

I couldn't have said it better myself. Never compromise or settle for less than what you truly want in a gun (or woman for that matter). Personally, it sounds like the 1911 wont be a carry gun since you are looking for a 380 to pocket over your CM9. So if its going to be a safe and range queen/BBQ gun, then I would definitely get the nicest, most kick-ass 1911 I could afford and buy some cargo shorts and pocket that CM9.

[Deano]

I'm back from golfing and had a chance to mull over the sage advice offered here. I think I'm gonna skip the 380 for now and focus on a nice 1911 that I'll enjoy, hopefully the rest of my life, and who knows, maybe pass it on to my kids. I'll find a way to hide the CM9 in summer clothing.

You guys are all right. The grips on that S&W are the prettiest grips I've seen. I don't want to buy a gun just for the grips, but man, they are gorgeous.
I also really like the looks and reputation of the two tone sig 1911. No one here ever talks about the sig. Why is that?
That Remington enhanced looks like a very nice gun, super reviews, but I'd change the grips immediately.
I'm thinking the S&W is the best bet of the three, but also the most expensive.

One thing for sure, there's no shortage of folks who love to talk about 1911s. I think I'm going to find out why pretty soon.

[Yogi 117]

Deano's on a roll! :53: And, I think it's all my fault! :eek: 1911, here we come! :o

[ParabellumJ]

You guys are all right. The grips on that S&W are the prettiest grips I've seen. I don't want to buy a gun just for the grips, but man, they are gorgeous.
I also really like the looks and reputation of the two tone sig 1911. No one here ever talks about the sig. Why is that?
That Remington enhanced looks like a very nice gun, super reviews, but I'd change the grips immediately.
I'm thinking the S&W is the best bet of the three, but also the most expensive.

One thing for sure, there's no shortage of folks who love to talk about 1911s. I think I'm going to find out why pretty soon.
I don't know why there isn't much love for the Sig 1911. I do know the slide is cut a bit different and there are some other differences as well. Out of those three I would agree the Smith is the pick of that bunch. Personally I am partial to Colt when it comes to 1911's. Had one and I loved it, but like a dummy I sold it. I've had my eye on the Colt Special Combat Government model as a replacement, but it will have to wait until next years tax returns at least.

[TheTman]

I'm going 180 degrees from some of the others, I think 2 guns are better than one, as someone suggested you might swap the P380 for an LCP or something less expensive. If I were to pay over $500 for a pistol it is for darn sure is NOT going to be a .380. I doubt if the .380 is going to be your main range/practice gun, so I wouldn't worry about trigger pull or cosmetics or such, reliability would be my main concern, as long as it was accurate for 7 yard and shorter distance shooting. Then take the money that was saved on the .380 and get a nicer 1911. Also, I'm still not convinced in the reliability of the P380, although we are see MUCH less complaints about them. One can get a very reliable .380 for not much more than half the price of a P380.
I always take more than one gun to the range, I like to shoot the more punishing calibers for awhile, then switch to something lighter, and go back and forth. I've also had instances where the cheapest things I could get has out lasted and out performed something costing hundreds of dollars more (audio equipment, cars, etc). If you switched your .380 to something less expensive, you could get a nice 1911 in the $600-$800 range, and have something pretty decent. I friend just got an STI Spartan V 1911, which seems to be a really solid .45 for just over $600. Waiting time on them is about 6 weeks though. Might look thru Armslist.com for your state see if anyone has something for sale you are interested in. I would also be tempted to skip the .380 altogether, and go with a CM9, but that's up to you and your needs. I figure the .380 is a fine summer gun where it doesn't have to penetrate much clothing, while I'd want something a little more substantial in jacket weather. JMHO

[emopunker2004]

The first 2 are great budget 1911's FYI. I owned the 2nd at one point and it was flawless.

[Deano]

I'm going 180 degrees from some of the others, I think 2 guns are better than one, as someone suggested you might swap the P380 for an LCP or something less expensive. If I were to pay over $500 for a pistol it is for darn sure is NOT going to be a .380. I doubt if the .380 is going to be your main range/practice gun, so I wouldn't worry about trigger pull or cosmetics or such, reliability would be my main concern, as long as it was accurate for 7 yard and shorter distance shooting. Then take the money that was saved on the .380 and get a nicer 1911. Also, I'm still not convinced in the reliability of the P380, although we are see MUCH less complaints about them. One can get a very reliable .380 for not much more than half the price of a P380.
I always take more than one gun to the range, I like to shoot the more punishing calibers for awhile, then switch to something lighter, and go back and forth. I've also had instances where the cheapest things I could get has out lasted and out performed something costing hundreds of dollars more (audio equipment, cars, etc). If you switched your .380 to something less expensive, you could get a nice 1911 in the $600-$800 range, and have something pretty decent. I friend just got an STI Spartan V 1911, which seems to be a really solid .45 for just over $600. Waiting time on them is about 6 weeks though. Might look thru Armslist.com for your state see if anyone has something for sale you are interested in. I would also be tempted to skip the .380 altogether, and go with a CM9, but that's up to you and your needs. I figure the .380 is a fine summer gun where it doesn't have to penetrate much clothing, while I'd want something a little more substantial in jacket weather. JMHO
Your points echo my thoughts that prompted me to start this thread in the first place. It's not as though I don't have a good conceal weapon. The CM9 is pretty darned good. I'm gonna try getting through the summer hiding that sucker and then if I'm not happy, I might consider something smaller for next summer. It hides very well IWB, and I can just leave the shirt un-tucked and probably be fine. Just have to be careful about bending over or reaching up.

In .380 I'm not overly thrilled with the choices. Some of them are no smaller than the CM9. For reliability, and concealability in my mind, the LCP is at the top. It's just not a fun gun to shoot, and I don't think I'd want to practice much with it at the range. A couple of magazines from that gun and my hand is zinging between the thumb and forefinger. I guess for a pocket/backup gun, that's OK. It's basically a close range point and shooter. The P380 still lacks reliability in my mind. I know some people have had great luck with them, but the price to pay for a bad one is pretty steep.

[muggsy]

Wow, I'm overwhelmed by the response. I feel fortunate to be a part of such a great forum. I never expected this many responses in just a couple of hours. Doesn't anyone around here work? :eek: I'm processing the responses now, and my hard drive is a little slow (needs an upgrade). Must be time to go golfing.

That Remington R-1 looks pretty nice. Is the enhanced version the same, except for the front serrations on the slide?

Work? What's that? I'm retired. Life is good. :)

[jlottmc]

My 1911 Commander is an all stainless Metro Arms from ATI. It shoots amazingly well, was priced right, and is MILSPEC. Search for it in the archives with Bawanna's grips on it.

[HenryinFlorida]

I have an American Classic II 1911, but in blue steel. I got it from Buds for $442 delivered and insured In January. I love it. The quality is really good, at least in mine it is. Like anything, some are good others have problems, but I have fired 200+ rounds without a single problem. For your backup I would go with the Ruger LCP over the P380. I carry mine in my front pocket. It has also been a very dependible pistol. I was carrying an LC9 in and IWB holster, but the CW45 I just bought has replaced that. My 1911 I keep in my nightstand.

[Deano]

My 1911 Commander is an all stainless Metro Arms from ATI. It shoots amazingly well, was priced right, and is MILSPEC. Search for it in the archives with Bawanna's grips on it.


I have an American Classic II 1911, but in blue steel. I got it from Buds for $442 delivered and insured In January. I love it. The quality is really good, at least in mine it is. Like anything, some are good others have problems, but I have fired 200+ rounds without a single problem. For your backup I would go with the Ruger LCP over the P380. I carry mine in my front pocket. It has also been a very dependible pistol. I was carrying an LC9 in and IWB holster, but the CW45 I just bought has replaced that. My 1911 I keep in my nightstand.

Thanks both of you for the feedback. I've been impressed with the universally positive vibe regarding the metro arms american classics. I'm still considering them as a possible first 1911.

[DKD]

DEANO the Remington "Enhanced" version, has a dished out slot on the left side of the grip for your thumb, a special rather sturdy Hi Visability front site and the noted front serrations on the slide, other than taht they are very comparable. I do like that front site on the "Enhanced" but can live without the front serrations on the slide. I tend tp prefer the looks of the standard 1911 format.

[Bill K]

Deano,

If you feel there is a single day or even part of a single day that you won't be armed because you didn't get that pocket .380... THEN YOU MUST GET IT! My Kel-Tec .380 kept me from getting stabbed by a guy 6'3" and I'm guessing now ~260-280 pounds. Because it happened to me on a work day I would not have been carrying my Glock. I now mostly pocket my PM9.

[DKD]

DEANO, the reason so many folks love the 1911 so much is fairly simple. It is a piece of history, a remarkable piece of the gun arts, design following function. A descent 1911 has a slide that when cycled, feels like glass on roller bearings. Thats why its been around for over 100 years and still going strong as ever.
In a nut shell the 1911 45 ACP is like have a Pit Bull on steroids, with a bad attitude, in your hand.

[TucsonMTB]

My Kel-Tec .380 kept me from getting stabbed by a guy 6'3" and I'm guessing now ~260-280 pounds. Because it happened to me on a work day I would not have been carrying my Glock. I now mostly pocket my PM9.
Wow! That will make a believe out of anyone. My PM40 (pretty much the same size as a PM9 or CM9) is in my pocket during waking hours. Tucson, Arizona, occasionally gets a little warm . . . so, I usually wear lightweight chino shorts. With a DeSantis Nemesis or Super Fly holster, it has never been a problem to conceal, get to quickly, nor prevented any activity, like running. http://home.mindspring.com/%7Ejustsomeguy/icon_lol.gif

[Deano]

DEANO the Remington "Enhanced" version, has a dished out slot on the left side of the grip for your thumb, a special rather sturdy Hi Visability front site and the noted front serrations on the slide, other than taht they are very comparable. I do like that front site on the "Enhanced" but can live without the front serrations on the slide. I tend tp prefer the looks of the standard 1911 format.OK, thanks for that info. I think I'd want night sights on mine anyway, so I'd probably change 'em out.


Deano,

If you feel there is a single day or even part of a single day that you won't be armed because you didn't get that pocket .380... THEN YOU MUST GET IT! My Kel-Tec .380 kept me from getting stabbed by a guy 6'3" and I'm guessing now ~260-280 pounds. Because it happened to me on a work day I would not have been carrying my Glock. I now mostly pocket my PM9.Good reminder that bad guys pick the time and place, not us. Thanks.


DEANO, the reason so many folks love the 1911 so much is fairly simple. It is a piece of history, a remarkable piece of the gun arts, design following function. A descent 1911 has a slide that when cycled, feels like glass on roller bearings. Thats why its been around for over 100 years and still going strong as ever.
In a nut shell the 1911 45 ACP is like have a Pit Bull on steroids, with a bad attitude, in your hand.OK now that sounds like fun.


Wow! That will make a believe out of anyone. My PM40 (pretty much the same size as a PM9 or CM9) is in my pocket during waking hours. Tucson, Arizona, occasionally gets a little warm . . . so, I usually wear lightweight chino shorts. With a DeSantis Nemesis or Super Fly holster, it has never been a problem to conceal, get to quickly, nor prevented any activity, like running. http://home.mindspring.com/%7Ejustsomeguy/icon_lol.gif
All right, you just about have me convinced that I can pocket carry the cm9 anywhere.

[Yogi 117]

There ya go Deano. Just takes a bit of time to get used to. And pretty soon, you'll feel funny without it! Enjoy that 1911, whichever one you decide on. ;)

BTW, I just cast my VOTE for getting the 1911 only. :third:

[Kahrdriver64]

There's something to be said for "shoot what you carry and carry what you shoot", and I think that is especially true for Kahrs, Glocks, Rugers, and 1911's. Each have distinctly different trigger feels. I bought the Kahr 380 as a backup over the Ruger for the simple reason the trigger feel is much closer to my normal K40 carry. Not that the LCP is not a decent little pocket pistol, it is indeed. But the trigger is different, and mixing them in carry applications just doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

[Deano]

There ya go Deano. Just takes a bit of time to get used to. And pretty soon, you'll feel funny without it! Enjoy that 1911, whichever one you decide on. ;)

BTW, I just cast my VOTE for getting the 1911 only. :third:I know your motivation all too well.


There's something to be said for "shoot what you carry and carry what you shoot", and I think that is especially true for Kahrs, Glocks, Rugers, and 1911's. Each have distinctly different trigger feels. I bought the Kahr 380 as a backup over the Ruger for the simple reason the trigger feel is much closer to my normal K40 carry. Not that the LCP is not a decent little pocket pistol, it is indeed. But the trigger is different, and mixing them in carry applications just doesn't seem like a good idea to me.Good point about the trigger. The LCP trigger is long and not what I would call smooth.

So far it's 14-8 in favor of 1911 only. I'm still processing data, and there have been some extremely thoughtful responses on both sides of this fence I'm sitting on.

Something about the American classic II that speaks to me. MILSPEC, all chrome available, dovetailed sights, very good reviews, and great entry price that leaves cash for other things. Might be a good way to test out the 1911 waters without spending an arm and a leg. I'm close to hitting the "buy now" button.

[downtownv]

I had to decide 938 sig or Kimber 1911
Kimber won.

[Yogi 117]

I know your motivation all too well.
Motivation? I just love helping you spend YOUR $$$$$! :madgrin: