Disappointing PM9

[Polygon]

I can't seem to get this thing to be reliable. I'm pretty frustrated right now. I did the prep, I've put 300 rounds though it, I've tried all the fixes but this thing still won't shoot reliably. It's having two different failures to feed. Once where the bullet is tripping the slide release lever and one where the previous round pushes the next so far forward in the magazine when chambered that it gets hung up on the bottom of the feed ramp. It also will randomly fail to lock the slide back on the last round. I was able to fix the first issue, but I can't figure out the other two. So, I bit the bullet and sent it back to Kahr. Kind of upset it cost me over $70 to ship it back. I'm just hoping to get back a reliable gun. This was supposed to be my carry gun.

It wasn't all bad though. This is my target after doing my last round of testing. This was from 21 feet. I ran about 100 rounds through with a lot of failures. However, it's a pretty accurate little gun. There were some times where I was just firing to see if it would cycle. But you can see where I got some pretty good groups while trying to be accurate. Now if only I can get it reliable enough to carry.

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/559558_3524069511885_1576553743_2814850_38601886_n .jpg

[jocko]

if the gun was in warranty or certainy not more than a couple years old, u should have isisted kahr pick up the shipping tab. they normally do that when asked.

[Polygon]

I've been talking with Jay. Perhaps I'll ask him if they will cover it. I'm not sure if it's still under warranty but I bought it in March of last year.

[Bill K]

Okay and understandable to be frustrated but don't quit on your PM9. When you get it up and running 100%, even if that means a trip back to the mother ship, you'll have IMHO a super SD carry pistol.

BTW, I had two issues with my then new PM9 so I can relate.

[Polygon]

Yeah, I haven't given up on it yet. I love the gun otherwise. Of course, I don't know how I'll feel if I get it back with issues.

[Bawanna]

Yeah, I haven't given up on it yet. I love the gun otherwise. Of course, I don't know how I'll feel if I get it back with issues.

You'll feel the same, only even worse but don't despair, if it's not right send it back again until it is right.
I'm confident they will get it tuned on the first trip, if not we'll form a posse and get that puppy working right.

[jocko]

I've been talking with Jay. Perhaps I'll ask him if they will cover it. I'm not sure if it's still under warranty but I bought it in March of last year.

u boughty it new it carrys a 5 year warranty. I would definitel discuss it with Jay about maybe throwingin a cople of mags to compensate forur out of pocket costs,ir if u have not yet set it back then ask the to pick up the gun.

[kerby9mm]

My mk9 went back 3 times and they volunteered to pay to pick it up all 3 times. The 1st time they put a trigger bar in when I told them it was the cocking cam. 2nd time they fixed the cocking cam but broke the trigger pivot pin off below the frame. 3rd time fixed the trigger pin. All is good now and it was free under warranty so yours should be also. That was 7 months ago so I can't see why anything would change unless they have a lot of guns coming back and are trying to cut costs by talking customers into paying shipping costs. Kahr can ship a lot cheaper than you can so if it was me I would discuss it with them. You read this forum and I bet they do also.

[Snidely Whiplash]

Hang in there. Let Kahr make it right.

My repaired CM9 should be back next week and I'm sure it will be in tip top shape and operate perfectly. (Although purchased new, it had a couple of defects when I first received it.)

I had to pay (a lot!) to send mine back to the factory, but I'm sure I'll be reimbursed for it all. Why? I re-read all the email correspondence and one internal Kahr email (cc'd to me) said to pay the shipping costs both ways since the gun shouldn't have gone out like it did in the first place. I didn't think to ask about this before I sent my gun back and the person at Kahr forgot to mention it.

Kahr is a good company that cares about its customers and its products. Everybody makes mistakes from time to time, but they want to make it right and will do so.

[CJB]

If its still unreliable, call Kahr. You probably wont have to insist they pickup shipping, but if they don't, prompt them to, and also prompt them for some bling - maybe a magazine or two, for your previous shipping bill.

FWIW, my PM9j is as accurate as I can hold it, and seems to feed everything but the kitchen sink. The little circular spring under the retainer that makes the slide stop function is a sometimes finicky part, especially if it has been bent inadvertently. There have been reports of the PM9 slide stop "nose" being a wee bit long, being hit by rounds as they rise up from the magazine - causing some false lock-back issues. Can't speculate on the magazine thing - except perhaps the follower's spring is in backwards? Helps to check.

[Polygon]

You guys are right. I'll let them make it right. It's great little gun and it's dead accurate. I also love how easy it is to break down. I sent an e-mail to Jay and we'll see what he says. I love the magazine idea. The less times I have to reload magazines at the range, the better.

I hope they get it the first time. I've been carrying my full on 1911 and man, it's just too big. For those of you that had to send one back, what was the turnaround time.



FWIW, my PM9j is as accurate as I can hold it, and seems to feed everything but the kitchen sink. The little circular spring under the retainer that makes the slide stop function is a sometimes finicky part, especially if it has been bent inadvertently. There have been reports of the PM9 slide stop "nose" being a wee bit long, being hit by rounds as they rise up from the magazine - causing some false lock-back issues. Can't speculate on the magazine thing - except perhaps the follower's spring is in backwards? Helps to check.

Actually, those are the things I've checked. I had Jay send me that spring as well as a new lever. I filed the old one down until clearance wasn't an issue. That solved the first feed issue but the other got got worse. It just seems it's occasionally pushing rounds too far forward when cambering the round before. I put the new lever in and the first feed issue was a problem again. I'll sure be interested to hear what comes of it.

[Polygon]

Well, I just heard back from Jay and he says they don't cover shipping. That really irritates me. I paid a lot for this gun and it hasn't functioned correctly since day one. The least they could do is cover the shipping since it's under warranty. :mad:

[kerby9mm]

I am shocked. You bought the gun new and one of their high end guns to boot and they won't pay shipping on a warranty claim. Makes me think again about buying another Kahr.

[jocko]

Have u possable tried to ex vchancge ad get another magazne to see if that helps any. could be a magazine issue. Maybe they would let u exchcange a mag to try out, .

PM sent to.

[pitandkahr]

I know it's not the same situation. But I tried to exchange out my 7 round mag for 6 round mags and was curtly told 'no'. :-(


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[Polygon]

Actually, I was told that as well.

[jocko]

I know it's not the same situation. But I tried to exchange out my 7 round mag for 6 round mags and was curtly told 'no'. :-(


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thats strange as they normally will work with an owner with that request.

Sometimes it is best to buy locally if possable as a dealer can send back a gun to the maker far far cheaper than we can. they can send regular mail--We cannot; Just sayin

[JimC]

Well, I just heard back from Jay and he says they don't cover shipping. That really irritates me. I paid a lot for this gun and it hasn't functioned correctly since day one. The least they could do is cover the shipping since it's under warranty. :mad:

Someone probably did the math on just how much they were spending on paying for return shipping on all of their problem pistols and put an end to it.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if the free replacement parts stop being free. :(

[jocko]

maybe also kahr is gonna draw the line of how old a gun is even though under warranty. Their warranty does not state that they will pickup postage both ways and quite possably Polygon's kahr being over 15 months old,they are going to deny paying both ways. They will fix their guns for 5 years if needed but I don't see them paying the postage both ways for a gun lets say 4 years old. They will pay return postage. Not trying to argue this point with Polygon either, he has already sent it back and paid his $70 bucks and I would not be hapy about that either, but again not knowing where he bought the gun either, if he could have had an option of taking it back to his selling dealer and saving abundle in postage: Just sayin.

A point here. I a few years back bvought a new Rolex GMT and it gained time badly IMO. I called Rolex and they said the watch was covered for 2 years so if I sent it back they would certainly regulate it fo rme at no charge and return it back to me. I ask , would they pick up my watch on their dimne and the answer was NO. It is ur responsibility to getit t6o us and we will getit back to you prepaid and fixed. It cost me $35 registered mail, as again like guns, Rolex will refuse any watch sent to them that is not sentto them registered, so I had no choice. When I got it back, all was well and snce then it has kept perfec time and I had basically put that sour note behind me...

[JFootin]

This kind of stuff makes me think seriously about purchasing guns through Davidson's at a LGS from now on, eat the higher price and taxes, and have a lifetime fix/replace/refund (my choice) warranty.

[jocko]

and I think that goes for aqll guns that Davidson sells to. not just kahrs,. My qeustion asI have never bought from them as a over the counter buyer, I did many years ago as a dealer and they were super to do business with, but do they pick up ur gon on their dime. Has anyone ever sent back a gun to davidsons to see how their policy really works etc.
If there is no hidden caviets then that Davidson policy is just super.

[TucsonMTB]

DAVIDSON'S GUARANTEEDSM LIFETIME REPLACEMENT
At Davidson's, your satisfaction is our commitment. In fact, our commitment is so strong, that we have put together the only GuaranteeDSM Lifetime Replacement Warranty available in the firearms industry.

It works like this......

If anything ever goes wrong with any gun you buy with the Davidson's GuaranteeDSM Lifetime Replacement Warranty, it will be replaced. If no replacement is available, it will be repaired at no charge to you. Simple, just return it to the GuaranteeDSM retailer where you purchased it, pay for the return shipping and upon receipt Davidson's will ship the returning retailer a brand new gun* for you.

Edited to add: http://www.galleryofguns.com/about/terms.aspx

[jocko]

unbelievable.

thanks

[JimC]

My PM9 only had to go back to Kahr once, thankfully.

I only had it 5 days and two mags split on the very first range session.

Upon returning home from the range, I called Kahr CS immediately and explained what had happened. They required that the pistol be sent in for them to look at.

I didn't even have to ask who was paying for the shipping, the guy on the phone told me that they would e-mail me a call tag.

They paid both ways but then again, the PM9 was only 5 days old, to me anyway.

Let's be honest, in today's economy, the bottom line is what counts and keeps a business in business. Even though they get a discounted rate for FedEx shipping, it all counts. ;)

[jocko]

well said.

[JimC]

well said.

ME?!? :D

Thank you sir.

[Polygon]

Some very good points.

I responded to Jay that I was upset that they wouldn't cover the shipping. I haven't heard back from him yet. I guess we'll see. Thankfully they will cover the return shipping.

I bought the gun from Bud's and I live in Utah, so no option of taking it back to the dealer. Though my uncle is a Gunsmith for Impact Guns here. I could have him ship it back and save a bunch next time, if there is a next time. I would have bought it locally but I got it for a pretty good deal at Bud's. I couldn't find it for less than $700 locally.

Hopefully they will over to cover at least some of the shipping. If not, oh well. However, if it needs to go back again immediately they better cover the shipping both ways or I'll be pretty mad. Then again, I hope it doesn't have to go back at all. Also, they haven't even had a chance to work on it yet. Tells you they have quite a queue over there. :(

[jocko]

ur attitude is positive, so keep it that way, as kahr will getit right for u, and I guess a lesson learned is a lesson earned. Was not trying to single u out either, just that this thread was the logical choice for this discussion.

Sometimes what we think should be, is not but again maybe does not make it right or wrong.. they willindeed cover the return postage...

[pitandkahr]

I don't know if this holds water, but I know for me, my PM9 has only had one FTE in over 600 rounds...Just finished putting 200 rounds through her this evening...I ran her wet and dry and a ton of different ammos...

However, my MK9 did great the first 400 rounds with only 1, maybe 2 FTE...However, the last 150 rounds today I had probably 4 FTE...My thought is I ran her wetter than the last 2 sessions...I'm going to go back to my original prepping and see how that works in a couple of days...

But the point of my rambling is trying all the different options and really evaluating what you're doing in regards to prep and ammo...I know it's frustrating and I'd be lying to say I'm not a little bummed it hasn't run flawless for all 600'ish rounds each, but cest la vie, I still love them!!!

[kerby9mm]

What should be: the pm9 right from the fsctory. What is: the pm9 is not. What is right: Kahr fix pm9 under warranty and pay shipping both ways. How is that wrong?

[jocko]

not wrong at all, just in some circumstances it will not get shipping paid both ways

[jocko]

I don't know if this holds water, but I know for me, my PM9 has only had one FTE in over 600 rounds...Just finished putting 200 rounds through her this evening...I ran her wet and dry and a ton of different ammos...

However, my MK9 did great the first 400 rounds with only 1, maybe 2 FTE...However, the last 150 rounds today I had probably 4 FTE...My thought is I ran her wetter than the last 2 sessions...I'm going to go back to my original prepping and see how that works in a couple of days...

But the point of my rambling is trying all the different options and really evaluating what you're doing in regards to prep and ammo...I know it's frustrating and I'd be lying to say I'm not a little bummed it hasn't run flawless for all 600'ish rounds each, but cest la vie, I still love them!!!

else fails put in a new set of recoil springs they are fairly inexpensive for the Mk series. Might help, might not, but it wouldbe the first thing I would try.

[pitandkahr]

Would you suggest the Wolf or Kahr? Or one of each :D ... LOL


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[pitandkahr]

I know it's not the same situation. But I tried to exchange out my 7 round mag for 6 round mags and was curtly told 'no'. :-(

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I actually had my FFL try and exchange them as a dealer and he was even told 'no' and wasn't happy with the way he was treated... :(

[paul3156]

I'm new to this thread and am / was considering a PM9. I was hoping to join this forum to learn how good the Kahrs really are. Instead I am hearing the exact same thing that's all over the internet. They are great guns - when they work. That may be okay for a range run but if I'm going to bet my life on a gun I need it to be 100% reliable. Please explain why I'm wrong as I really want to like (and buy) a PM9. The size, weight and accuracy is impressive but the G26 is looking better and better. Help.

[Tinman507]

Is this the only thread you read here?
Look around on the forum a bit.
There are hundreds of favorable, even raving posts about the PM9 and CM9.
There are a few problem children as well. This is a Kahr forum. This is where people come when they have issues and want solutions.
Don't make your decision on a few posts. But know that if you decide to purchase a Kahr, there are lost of people here to help you through the break in and with solutions if you have issues.

[gm412]

My PM9 has been flawless. I just got back from the range. An instructor tried my PM9 and shot the tightest pattern I have seen in a long time. For a carry weapon it disappears in an IWB holster. I have over 1100 shots through mine without a problem. Great gun.