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Kahrslinger
05-29-2012, 10:36 AM
Just trying to get some info, opinions and feedback on what shooting stance people prefer? Thanks

GTM
05-29-2012, 10:58 AM
Just trying to get some info, opinions and feedback on what shooting stance people prefer? Thanks

My opinion is that grip is much more important than stance. A bad grip and/or bad trigger control are going to affect accuracy much more than stance.

Longitude Zero
05-29-2012, 11:48 AM
My opinion is that grip is much more important than stance. A bad grip and/or bad trigger control are going to affect accuracy much more than stance.

True however all elements must work together and if only one is bad the rest don't really matter either.

Started with isocolese moved to weaver & modified weaver and back to isocelese. Stance must be balanced, flexible and allow the shooter to move physically and to train the wepon in various locations downrange. In a firefight movement to cover takes priority over everything. While moving, busting a round or two in the direction of your adversary would be helpful to force him/her to move to avoid your fire.

jocko
05-29-2012, 12:09 PM
probably ain't gonna really matter in s SHTF scenario. Ur more than likely not gonna remember anythinbg u did: Just sayin

tarheelcm9
05-29-2012, 01:14 PM
probably ain't gonna really matter in s SHTF scenario. Ur more than likely not gonna remember anythinbg u did: Just sayin

very true...I doubt you'll be worried how your feet are set when you're trying to save your life.

jocko
05-29-2012, 01:30 PM
we have a member here who has ha dto shoot a BG in defrnse I won't mention his name but he toldme he does't really remember alot of the stuff we talk about on this forum.

We can't pick the scenarios we want, as u well know. #1 with me would be my damn gun better go bang, all else falls into place after that. I have a feeling the weaver stance and isosceles stance would feel the same when the BG is shoving your malfunctioning gun up ur ass: Just sayin.

Barth
05-29-2012, 02:03 PM
It's quite possible there may be no time or opportunity to use a shooting stance.

Still, I prefer an pseudo fighting stance.
Something like a modified weaver.
I feel grounded and stable.
Better suited to transition into edged weapon, hand to hand combat
and execute weapon retention techniques.

jocko
05-29-2012, 02:27 PM
how much lead time does one have in a car wreck? Just sayin

Barth
05-29-2012, 02:41 PM
how much lead time does one have in a car wreck? Just sayin

If you're not paying attention? Zero.
If you are aware of what's going on around you?
Maybe enough to avert the wreck.
I'm just saying...

jocko
05-29-2012, 03:15 PM
yup ad that could also be said about any defense scenario to. AWARENESS goes a long way, sometimes though makes no damn difference either..

DeaconKC
05-29-2012, 03:17 PM
I learned on Weaver but have had to change to Isoscoles due to bifocals. Practice some one handed emergency drills at close range too.

Longitude Zero
05-29-2012, 03:26 PM
Many gunfights can be avoided if you are paying proper attention. Knowledgeable folks, such as Bill Jordan & Colonel Jeff Cooper refer to it as "Situational Awareness."

Barth
05-29-2012, 03:33 PM
yup ad that could also be said about any defense scenario to. AWARENESS goes a long way, sometimes though makes no damn difference either..

Yup, Yup.
Sometimes you just step in it and have to deal.
The Hollywood scenario of inadvertently walking into a robbery.
Or already being in the convenience store when a robbery unfolds.
These types of things that just happen.
Wrong place, wrong time and no way out but to stand and fight.

Barth
05-29-2012, 03:36 PM
Many gunfights can be avoided if you are paying proper attention. Knowledgeable folks, such as Bill Jordan & Colonel Jeff Cooper refer to it as "Situational Awareness."

I'm a huge advocate of that.
Really shudder as I watch folks walk through a parking lot with a cell phone.
Oblivious to the world around them.

There is something to be said about looking like a victim.
Bad guys generally want, and look for, the advantage of surprise.

jocko
05-29-2012, 03:43 PM
situational awaremenss = BRAINS.

Bill K
05-29-2012, 04:39 PM
I believe prayer should be our first defense. Pray that it doesn't happen in the first place and if it should that the "good" guy prevail.

Many, perhaps even most "career criminals" practice and hone their "skills" to a higher level then we do our SD/HD skills. They'll almost always start the action suddenly and violently and have us behind the curve trying to catch up. Scary stuff enough but imagine not being armed.

jocko
05-29-2012, 05:03 PM
good point Bill K.

Barth
05-29-2012, 05:04 PM
I believe prayer should be our first defense. Pray that it doesn't happen in the first place and if it should that the "good" guy prevail.

Many, perhaps even most "career criminals" practice and hone their "skills" to a higher level then we do our SD/HD skills. They'll almost always start the action suddenly and violently and have us behind the curve trying to catch up. Scary stuff enough but imagine not being armed.

Not to discount prayer,
but being prepared seems like a fine idea.

voodoo54
05-29-2012, 05:43 PM
I have a whole thread on this in another column. And yes, stance is as important as anything else!

Longitude Zero
05-29-2012, 05:45 PM
situational awaremenss = BRAINS.

Sadly many who CCW feel that mere possession is a magical talisman that will protect them. These dolts are nothing but cannon fodder.

Situational Awareness equals brains but just having brains DOES NOT mean you have Situational Awareness. Logic does not flow bothways. It is a one way street on this issue.

Kahrslinger
05-29-2012, 06:24 PM
On another point, what do you do if you walk into a situation like a robbery in progress or if you are in that convenience store when the SHTF? Do you engage if you feel like you can safely or do you hit the ground and hope no one gets hurt?

gm412
05-29-2012, 06:25 PM
Sadly many who CCW feel that mere possession is a magical talisman that will protect them. These dolts are nothing but cannon fodder.

Situational Awareness equals brains but just having brains DOES NOT mean you have Situational Awareness. Logic does not flow bothways. It is a one way street on this issue.

My Father, god rest his sole, always said "If you pull a gun use it or the other guy will take it away and use it" and "never pull a gun unless you are going to use it".

So having a gun if not used right can be more dangerous than not having one.

Barth
05-29-2012, 06:31 PM
On another point, what do you do if you walk into a situation like a robbery in progress or if you are in that convenience store when the SHTF? Do you engage if you feel like you can safely or do you hit the ground and hope no one gets hurt?

Simple question, complicated answer.
Every situation is unique.

You have to make a judgment call, maybe a gut check.

One thing is for sure.
Never let anyone transport you anywhere.
They only have limited time at the site of the incident.
If you are taken then they may have all the time they want
to do anything they want.
You really don't want that.

I was instructed to stand and fight for my life at that point.

Kahrslinger
05-29-2012, 06:34 PM
I read on another forum where a guy was putting groceries into his car when he heard a scream for help.. Going to investigate he found a mother whose child ( didnt say what age) was on the ground being beaten by a large grown man.. So he drew his weapon and instructed the man off the child.. Anyway that's the basic story.
So what about this type of scenario, where you have to draw on someone who may not be a threat to shoot back? Where you have the advantage of training, drawing your weapon, steady stance and breathing.

jocko
05-29-2012, 06:36 PM
u got that right Barth. For me, would I engage??? only if they engaged me directly,being in the store does not mean I am engaged in the stores problems.lots of scernario's and I should know better than to introduce one of my own even.

I have a very old and famous "decoderr ring" given to me by D!ck TRACY that alerts me before I ever go into a convenience store is there is a probem inside. It has never let me down yet.. Just sayin

Kahrslinger
05-29-2012, 06:37 PM
Simple question, complicated answer.
Every situation is unique.

You have to make a judgment call, maybe a gut check.

One thing is for sure.
You never let anyone transport yo anywhere.
The only have limited time at the site of the incident.
If yo are taken the they have all the time and opportunity to do anything to you they want.

I was instructed to stand and fight for my life at that point.

+1

Agreed

Longitude Zero
05-30-2012, 10:34 AM
So having a gun if not used right can be more dangerous than not having one.

Absolute truth!

OldLincoln
05-30-2012, 12:54 PM
SA is king in my book. Problem is the BG's have changed. Old days your spidy sense tingles and you turn to see BG's approaching and they look away and change direction knowing their surprise is gone. Now the get a mean look and keep marching at you.

As for stance, I use the C.A.R. position keeping the gun in tight with weak hand gripping from the front (thumb pointing at you). It's an in tight gun control position in case they try to take it away. Very different from most but pretty solid.

ez9
05-30-2012, 11:19 PM
i perfer my instruction (mostly pistol) from special forces, left hand 60%,right hand40%, (right handed)bent elbows and athletic stance, leaning into shot a lil'. Start at first shot hole and stay rite there. Hand should fit pistol. With kahr380 your attack shot may be one handed. No more stiff arms for me. Shoot the way ya want, ill be rite here getting more tips.

I was shooting 40 cal glock27, i sold it and will buy kahr 9mm saturday. Yea!:):)

Kahrslinger
05-31-2012, 10:22 AM
i perfer my instruction (mostly pistol) from special forces, left hand 60%,right hand40%, (right handed)bent elbows and athletic stance, leaning into shot a lil'. Start at first shot hole and stay rite there. Hand should fit pistol. With kahr380 your attack shot may be one handed. No more stiff arms for me. Shoot the way ya want, ill be rite here getting more tips.

I was shooting 40 cal glock27, i sold it and will buy kahr 9mm saturday. Yea!:):)


Congrats on the Kahr purchase :)

muggsy
05-31-2012, 07:54 PM
My Father, god rest his sole, always said "If you pull a gun use it or the other guy will take it away and use it" and "never pull a gun unless you are going to use it".

So having a gun if not used right can be more dangerous than not having one.

Your father and my father attended the same school. If the gun is pulled it's going to be fired.