Getting my son his first gun.

[Chief Joseph]

His birthday is coming up and think I'm going to get him his first gun that will actually be his gun. As much as I hated my s&w sigma, I've read too many good reviews of their .22lr tactical rifle, the m&p 15-22. Of course, I'll have to shoot it a lot too, but that's another matter. He already shoots my Walther P22, but I would like a rifle for him too. If anyone has what they feel is a better choice, I'm not buying for another 2-3 weeks.

[jocko]

pretty damn hard to knock the Ruger 10/22 out of those possabilities. Just sayin. There ew take dwon looks reall awesome.

[ripley16]

Ruger 10/22 is always a good choice.

For a definite "cool" factor, there's the HK MP5 22. I can forsee lots of fun with one.
http://www.hk22rimfire.com/index.php?page=mp5-a5

An alternative in the AR realm is the HK 416-22, (see above link). I almost bought one myself at the last gunshow.

I've always thought the Browning Buckmark carbine had a lot of potential to put smiles on faces.
http://www.browning.com/products/catalog/firearms/finder.asp?f1=004B&bg=x

[LorenzoB]

Consider the 10/22 like Jocko and Ripley said. It is a "classic".

[DeaconKC]

If you go the 1022 route, you will have a couple hundred extra to buy him ammo with!

[Chief Joseph]

I have a friend who has a 10/22, I like it, but am looking more towards the tactical look and feel of the gun also. The reviews I've read says the m&p 15 22 mimics the m&p 15. Beyond shooting, it would introduce him to the weapon and one day hoping he could move right into an AR and be comfortable from the start. I myself am salivating for the Ruger Mini 14 tactical... Xmas is coming.

[Planedude]

I'll throw in with the 10/22 crowd as I have taught alot of new young shooters with my 10/22. Youngster love that old gun.
Nothing wrong with the S&W AR copy 22, super cool to show his buddies.

I have an old Marlin 39A lever gun that the young shooters love as much as the Ruger. I had a 4th grader (10-ish??) at the range with his father and uncle. The two of them were trying to shoot a snubby .357 and were ignoring the young boy. My Son-in-law and I were sighting in the 22's and I offered the boy the Marlin (17 rounds) he had a blast. After I had the 10/22 scope zeroed, I loaded the Ruger extended mag and let the boy shoot that. The grin was impressive and when done the boy was heard to exclaim, "Dad, did you see me shoot the machine gun"?

Good times. Enjoy these times with your son.

[LorenzoB]

There is nothing wrong with a tacticool rifle! I wouldn't mind having that M&P 22 now! But it wouldn't be a "classic" gun he would "need to keep" like a 10/22 that he might keep and possibly pass to his son or grandson. So my advice is that the first gun a father gifts a child be a "classic keeper".

[steveschu]

So my advice is that the first gun a father gifts a child be a "classic keeper".

I agree. I had the slide engraved on the pink P380 of my daughter's 21st birthday gift. I think she will keep it a very long time.

[forestranger]

Us "old cowboys" would'a rather had a Marlin or Henry lever action when we was young-uns but I reckon times has changed?

[LorenzoB]

I agree. I had the slide engraved on the pink P380 of my daughter's 21st birthday gift. I think she will keep it a very long time.

Yea! Engrave it. Very cool idea.

[7shot]

Tactical is cool...I like your way of thinking about getting him introduced to the AR system. That's the same reasoning behind me getting my son a Walter P22 instead of the Ruger Mark III. All choices are great I just thought the Walter was more true to form in the pistol platform than the Ruger.

[les strat]

Us "old cowboys" would'a rather had a Marlin or Henry lever action when we was young-uns but I reckon times has changed?

Yep. Marlin's Model 60 accuracy out of the box is amazing.

Although I think the 15-22 is a cool rifle and wouldn't mind owning one, a classic style rifle is more of a lifetime keeper, but I'm old school.

[jocko]

yup. back in our gun business dayh the Modle 60 was our best seller with the 10/22 right on its ass in sales. I personally like the 10/22 better but the model 60 was a gun we knew we could sell and never have to see it ever come back...

[ltxi]

What jocko just said or...gasp...a single shot .22 rifle. As my elder generation taught me...first, learn to shoot.

[AJBert]

I've already bought my youngest grandson his first rifle and he has yet to turn 2. No, I haven't given it to him yet! It is a refurbished Savage/Stevens 1915 Favorite single shot .22lr, the same gun I first learned to shoot with. Original action, replaced octagonal barrel, and some of the most beautiful wood furniture I've ever seen on a little ol' .22.

Here's hoping he will treasure it as much as I do the memories of learning to shoot with the same firearm at a very early age.

[ltxi]

Outstanding present!!

[TheTman]

I guess I'm in the 10 22 camp. There are a lot of tacticool accessories you can buy for it, to turn it into an AR looking rifle, and all types of cool stuff you can buy to make it about anything you want. I imagine this rifle has more accessories available for it than any other .22, plus you're not stuck with one platform. Want a traditional hunting rifle, then put the original stock and mag in it. Want something more assault rifle looking, you can buy a tactical pistol grip stock, and extended mags and have an AR/AK looking rifle. I love the versatility the 10 22 gives you.

[robdnor]

Consider the 10/22 like Jocko and Ripley said. It is a "classic".
I am obviously with the other 10/22 guys
And parts will be readily obtainable, and they have a very proven track record


If you go the 1022 route, you will have a couple hundred extra to buy him ammo with!
This is a great consideration because the more time he shoots the more he will enjoy it


I guess I'm in the 10 22 camp. There are a lot of tacticool accessories you can buy for it, to turn it into an AR looking rifle, and all types of cool stuff you can buy to make it about anything you want. I imagine this rifle has more accessories available for it than any other .22, plus you're not stuck with one platform. Want a traditional hunting rifle, then put the original stock and mag in it. Want something more assault rifle looking, you can buy a tactical pistol grip stock, and extended mags and have an AR/AK looking rifle. I love the versatility the 10 22 gives you.

This is very true, but don't forget the possibility of a father son project part where you work together to build up something, be it tatical or building an ultimate if you son enjoys the long range stuff

I also would agree that the single shot would be a good learning gun, though you wanna be able to play with it too and seeing he has already shot semis the concept wont be new to him

[jocko]

no doubt if u buy him a tactical type rifle, he is gonna love it. How could any youngster not. Hell it was basicaly made for us adults to buy so ur gonna do well buying that. Ur enthusiasm is gonna be higher to, as from reading your posts, u seem fairly directed to the tactical rifle. We just chimmed in with our suggestions and for me I don't get around much to look at alot of guns, so I have certainly missed looking at some of the really nice tactical looking 22s rifles. I might change my mind to, who knows. One thing nice about the 10/22 and marelin model 60 was that those damn guns just went bang every time, maintence damn near almost free, super accurate, "affordable"

You know just because u buy ONE 22 for your son does not mean that you cannot buy another one down the road for lets say "ol dad". If u give him a 22 rifle what ever it is, IT IS HIS. Post us a photo when u buy. Ur son will love it for numerous reasons but #1 willbe becausxe it came from MY DAD..

[TheTman]

My .22's my dad gave me were stolen in a burglary, I sure wish I had them back, one was a Marlin semi, that kind of looked like an M1 carbine without the magazine, and the other was a single action 6 shooter that I had a lot of fun with. I did acquire his Browning Auto 5 goose gun after his death and treasure it highly. The barel is a 30" full choke affair that has some rust pitting on it. and would like to buy a newer 26-28" barel with interchangeable chokes, to make it more versatile. It is fun to take pheasant hunting and when a bird gets up, let everyone else have a shot at it, then if they all miss take it out way out of most people's range. Or if one gets up way out there and most people won't take a shot, I can still drop it. It would probably make a good trap gun if I would have the stock fitted to me.

[Chief Joseph]

I really wish Ruger would do a mini 14 tactical in .22. I really want one of their .223 tacticals.

[mr surveyor]

Personally, I'm not into tactical....more into practical.

I'd go for the Model 60, 10/22, or a good quality .22 cal lever gun. Either would be a great first step to the high caliber practical rifles - either 30/30, 35 rem, 45/70 in a lever gun, or .243, .308, 30/06, etc, in a good bolt gun.

But if all his future shooting is limited to the range, I suppose Tacticool is fine though.

just my old fart opinion


surv

[Scoundrel]

I have a friend who has a 10/22, I like it, but am looking more towards the tactical look and feel of the gun also. The reviews I've read says the m&p 15 22 mimics the m&p 15. Beyond shooting, it would introduce him to the weapon and one day hoping he could move right into an AR and be comfortable from the start. I myself am salivating for the Ruger Mini 14 tactical... Xmas is coming.

I have the M&P 15/22 and the M&P 15 Sport, and I like them both a lot.
I also have a Ruger Charger, which is basically a pistol version of the 10/22, so I have experience with both.

I'm surprised nobody here has mentioned the Ruger SR-22 rifle.
In one neat package, you get the cool profile of an AR-15 platform, but the proven reliability of the 10/22 action. But it does not function like an AR-15, so not really good training for the step up.
http://www.ruger.com/products/sr22Rifle/models.html

I have handled the SR-22 rifle (did not shoot it), and it is significantly heavier than my 15/22, and you can't break it in half for easy transport.

My M&P 15/22 is my favorite gun, hands down.
It is fun to shoot, and the action is fairly quiet. Suppressed, using subsonic ammo, I can hardly hear it running if I don't have my cheekbone pressed against it.

It is easy to cycle the action with either hand (I find the 10/22 charging handle annoying, personally, and I'm not even a lefty). The magazines are easier to insert and remove than the 10/22.

It's very easy to take apart for cleaning - MUCH easier than the 10/22 action, and when you're shooting .22lr, that's important. I always struggle with getting the dang bolt out of the 10/22, and getting it back IN with that spring-loaded charging handle needing to be pulled back, and not staying square while you try to snap the bolt down onto it is just a nightmare - and I have good hand strength and coordination. Maybe I'm doing it wrong.

It is very reliable (they had some issues in the early versions but that's all sorted out now). The magazines are cheap. It eats the cheap bulk pack ammo just fine. It likes Federal better than Winchester due to the shape of the nose of the bullet, but even then it only had about 5 feed jams in 1000 rounds with the Winchester. I can shoot anything from CCI all day without a single issue.

I can load ten 25-round 15/22 magazines in one sitting and I don't have sore thumbs/fingers when I am done. I get hand cramps loading the 10/22 rotary magazines after only about 5 of them. Don't know about the 25-round banana shaped ones. I understand that there are some hand-crank-operated speed loaders for those, but the one I looked at only worked on the non-rotary magazines with the steel lips, and I had already purchased a bunch of the rotary magazines.

It's true that you can't customize the 15/22 as much as the classic 10/22. For example, you can't make one of these out of it:
http://ab9d.com/webpage/gunstuf/drums4.jpg
But I looked at a lot of those aftermarket mods for the 10/22, and by the time you buy all of the tacticool accessories for a classic 10/22, you've exceeded the cost of buying another gun. Might as well buy another one that is configured the way you want it for the most part. You can still load up the 15/22 with lots of accessories though. It has rails all over the place and comes in many versions to suit your desires.

So, no offense to the old-school folks who have nostalgic feelings about the 10/22 because they got one as a kid, but whenever I explore a nostalgic feeling, I always find myself disappointed in the reality of it. I always forget the drawbacks and the reasons why it was good WAY BACK THEN, but not necessarily now. The more modern 15/22 is a dream to carry, load, shoot, and clean.


You might also want to know about this very affordable UTG gun case. The 15/22 fits in there very well when broken down, and there is room in the main pocket for a scope, foregrip and bipod as well. The front pocket will hold as many magazines as you want to stuff in there - even a couple of the Black Dog 50-round drums on top of 5 or six flat 25-rounders. I also fold up a few targets and stuff those in there as well.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001BR2Z8G/ref=wms_ohs_product
You can't fit a Ruger SR-22 in there, but you might be able to fit the 10/22 takedown.
The bag that came with the Charger was trash. So I bought another UTG case for that as well. It's awesome to be able to carry your rifle, some accessories, a bunch of magazines, some targets, earplugs, etc. in your gun case and still have it take up so little room, with a carry handle and a shoulder strap. Can't say enough good things about this gun case.

You've already read a bunch of reviews on the 15/22, but if you want to see my range report with some cool pictures and a lot of different ammo tested, check it out here:
http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=8437

[Chief Joseph]

Scoundrel, thank you very much. And thanks to all the others who've posted. I am leaning more and more to the 15 22. Been watching tons of vids on youtube about it. I really like how easy it breaks down and how the bolt comes out.

[muggsy]

I'm old school. My dad started me with a bolt action single shot .22 rifle. I quickly became a rifleman instead of a lead slinger. Any boy worthy of the title will love his first gun no matter what it is.

[Tinman507]

I'm old school as well. First (and still have) rifle is a Glenfield Model 25 bolt action .22lr.

We teach Scouts to shoot with bolt actions, single shot. Teaches discipline, safety and control. Once they learn to shoot, they can get fancy with semi's and the tacticool stuff. Teach the fundamentals and the rest follows along.

[Scoundrel]

I suppose there is some merit to this, but I don't see why you couldn't teach that stuff with a tactical rifle that has only one round in the magazine.

Don't get me wrong, I do see the value in a single shot rifle. I have one, in fact, and it's a Rossi Youth combo (22/410) model. I sent the barrel off to get threaded, even. :)

If I had a son, and was giving him his first long gun, it would probably be that one.
The first rifle I ever shot was a bolt-action with a ten-round magazine. No idea what brand it was, and my dad lost it somewhere in his attic years ago. When he dies, I may go up there and look for it. I still have nostalgic feelings about it. However, see my above notes about nostalgia.

But, since the OP seems to have a preference in the direction of the M&P 15/22, I was weighing in on its merits vs. the 10/22.

What will your son's first SmartPhone be? Would you get him a rotary phone with a steel bell and clapper on a land line first, to teach him discipline and control before he starts using a cool computer phone? It's a changing world...

[mr surveyor]

.......What will your son's first SmartPhone be? Would you get him a rotary phone with a steel bell and clapper on a land line first, to teach him discipline and control before he starts using a cool computer phone? It's a changing world...

yes:D

[Scoundrel]

yes:D

WJ_yQ02xwsM

[les strat]

what will your son's first smartphone be? Would you get him a rotary phone with a steel bell and clapper on a land line first, to teach him discipline and control before he starts using a cool computer phone? It's a changing world...
lmao :19:

[mr surveyor]

this here is my office phone for the employees...if'n he wants to talk, this is it


http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b345/cowpi/StumpwaterExchange.jpg


:)

[Cokeman]

I got my boy this one. Best for gun ever!

http://www.impactguns.com/data/default/images/catalog/535/henry_lever_youth.jpg

[jlottmc]

I can say with out a doubt that for the smaller kids a Crickett rifle is the way to go. http://www.crickett.com/ If the yoot is a little bigger or older, then a 10/22 is a great way to go. Given your affliction for older guns a Henry rimfire is another great option.

[Chief Joseph]

How much are you guys paying for the 10/22, was looking at getting one and putting a tapco stock on, but at over 300 for the gun and 75 for the stock, it's about the same price as the 15 22.

[rvanpelt]

I can say with out a doubt that for the smaller kids a Crickett rifle is the way to go. http://www.crickett.com/ If the yoot is a little bigger or older, then a 10/22 is a great way to go. Given your affliction for older guns a Henry rimfire is another great option.
Another vote for a Cricket as his first gun, then move up to a Henry lever, as Cokeman stated. I love my adult model with octagon barrel! :) After the boy learns disciplined shooting, move up to the Ruger 10/22. I don't think an auto is a good starter gun for a kid, just saying. IMHO
Rod van Pelt

[Cokeman]

Yeah. If they are small enough, even the Henry can be heavy to hold while aiming.

[jlottmc]

A wood stock and blue finish should run right at 250-300 all day long at Wally world. An LGS should be able to that or better as well. The Tapco stock is what it is, just order that from a distributor instead of the factory.

Ok now to take a small detour. My daughter is almost big enough to handle her purple stocked Crickett. I need to make a sling for it, and then find somewhere I can teach her, my way. I'm so excited.

[les strat]

Crickets are great little rifles that teach discipline and making every shot count. Good length of pull for short little arms. Some come with a pretty decent scope you can put on after teaching them to shoot with iron sights.

[jimbar]

Chief,
Like a lot of others, I'll go with Ruger 10/22. Here's what I did wiith mine.
$232 for rifle, $100 for kit, $40 for red dot

[jocko]

damn thats col. Obamma will come an take that though, or he will send Pelosi and in that case then just bend her over a table and give her your gun. Just sayin

[jimbar]

damn thats col. Obamma will come an take that though, or he will send Pelosi and in that case then just bend her over a table and give her your gun. Just sayin

it would have to be the gun,....or a 10 ft pole,....I guarantee nothin' else would touch her..:D

[jlottmc]

I say go right ahead you DOM (that would be jocko). You mess with that, don't film or take pictures please.

[ripley16]

Still think one of these,

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r64/derekmgrant/HkMp5.jpg

or one of these is a good choice.

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd197/dr_lutovsky/Tanks_Guns/HK_416.jpg

But I'm a HK fanboy, so...

Rugers good too. Saw a beautiful full Monte Carlo stock 10/22 at the gun show last week for $350. Almost bought a used one, standard birch stock, for $175.

[Bawanna]

I have two of those HK's (suppressed Navy) in the armory. Very fun. My son has the GSG 22 look alike and it's a lot of fun to play with too.
A few of the parts can be swapped with real ones to make a more solid little gun. The buttstock and such.
Around here everyone is getting away from the sub guns and sticking with short barreled AR's. We still have ours but never use them anymore. They refuse to give them to me for proper love and affection. Story of my life.

[les strat]

Yesterday, I bought my 6 yr old a Marlin 15Y single shot bolt action .22 made in 1986. It's going to be his Christmas present. I was going to buy another Cricket like I bought my daughter, but found this in great shape with beautiful wood for $75, and it is a higher quality rifle than the Cricket. Still had the insepctor sticker on the stock! I spit-shined it last night and it looks great. Perfect LOP for little arms.

[Chief Joseph]

Made the decision, bought him the S&W M&P 15 22. Will give it to him in 2 weeks. Maybe a little earlier if the wife allows. Would like to get out and shoot it while the weather is good. I'm going to get myself a 10/22 sometime in the next year and put a tapco stock on it. Maybe fathers day.

[Scoundrel]

Made the decision, bought him the S&W M&P 15 22. Will give it to him in 2 weeks. Maybe a little earlier if the wife allows. Would like to get out and shoot it while the weather is good. I'm going to get myself a 10/22 sometime in the next year and put a tapco stock on it. Maybe fathers day.

Post up a picture or two of him using it, if you want!

[Bawanna]

I think he'll be one very happy camper when he pulls that out of the box.

I'm sure he'll put Jfootins wide mouth smiley face totally to shame.

One lucky boy.

[Chief Joseph]

I think he'll be one very happy camper when he pulls that out of the box.

I'm sure he'll put Jfootins wide mouth smiley face totally to shame.

One lucky boy.

I bought a couple of attachments and a case for it. I've put the rifle in the case and will give him the attachments first, then the case and will let him believe they are for his airsoft rifle. Then when he opens the case he'll get the surprise of a real rifle. Can't wait, it's almost a present for me too.

[Chief Joseph]

Post up a picture or two of him using it, if you want!

Will do, will take a while though.

[Chief Joseph]

Gave Jr the gun last night, and pulled him out of school 2 hrs early today to go shoot it. Would have waited until the weekend, but weather is looking wet and rainy with today being the last dry warm day. Love the rifle, put about 700 rounds of golden bullets through it. Put about 200 through my Ruger SR22 pistol too. Other than Jr burning out after 45 minutes all was fun. Of course I made him stay another hour for me to burn out as well. That rifle goes through ammo a lot faster than the pistols, that's for sure. I made a video, but no pix yet. Will post when I have some.

[Scoundrel]

Glad you like it. How does he like it?

Funny, I would have been ecstatic to go shooting all day with my dad, but these days I hear about kids being kind of "meh" about shooting (I don't have kids), and I think "those kids should be jumping at the chance to do this", and then I realize how much of an old codger I'd sound like if I said it.

The same thing happened with ATVs and someone else's kid.

[Chief Joseph]

Glad you like it. How does he like it?

Funny, I would have been ecstatic to go shooting all day with my dad, but these days I hear about kids being kind of "meh" about shooting (I don't have kids), and I think "those kids should be jumping at the chance to do this", and then I realize how much of an old codger I'd sound like if I said it.

The same thing happened with ATVs and someone else's kid.

Well, it is Thursday and were up early for school, been in school all week, plus he hasn't slept well all week being excited for his birthday. I could tell he was tired on the drive up. He slept on the way home. Kids just don't have the attention span yet. In time I hope. Worked out well for me, I got to shoot more. HEHE.

[les strat]

Glad you like it. How does he like it?

Funny, I would have been ecstatic to go shooting all day with my dad, but these days I hear about kids being kind of "meh" about shooting (I don't have kids), and I think "those kids should be jumping at the chance to do this", and then I realize how much of an old codger I'd sound like if I said it.

The same thing happened with ATVs and someone else's kid.

I think the way scoiety has downplayed hunting and guns in general, it is not as "cool" as it was. IDK. Maybe they get their shooting fix with video games. :rolleyes:

I do know my kids do not take to the outdoors like when I was a kid. From the time I got up on weekends/summers, I ate breakfast and hit the door and didn't come in until it was lunch, then back outside. Too much to explore. I have to make my kids go outside. They aren't crazy about fishing, but they do like to go to the range and shoot with me.

[Cokeman]

Might be because they are afraid of predators.