VERY dissapointed with khar

[Dangerhack]

Hey everyone,
I bought a khar cm9 last year went to shoot it for first time about 3 or 4 months later an had a issue.
I was able to only get 2 shots off then bullets kept jamming when i racked it back to load into chamber or it would not feed the bullets at all. I cleaned the gun took it apart an still same issue. I sent it back to khar then sent back the gun an now i went to range to shoot an i shot 200 rounds at the range, BUT everytime i put a new mag in to reload after the slide locks back.. unless i pull the slide back real fast an hard with a super hard snap action it wont close an feed a bullet an usually have to do it twice. the gun slide is much better but still i dont feel this gun is great quality.
I sold my p2000 sk H&k because it was heavy for off duty i wanted a super light an small gun but the p2000 never had an issue was smooth as buitter never jammed even if left dirty an not cleaned. i feel like this khar is not reliable an if im in a situation off duty that if i pull it out i dont know if it will shoot or not wich is scary i actually regret buying this gun. i rather be uncomfortable carryin a gun an know it will shoot then be the other way around.
any advice or feedback would be appreciated.. of course i know you get what you pay for but its still a gun an still should be reliable regardless..:mad:

[MLESa7990]

So the only problems you are having are from hand racking?


"unless i pull the slide back real fast an hard with a super hard snap action"

That's how you are supposed to hand rack. This seems like user error to me.

Why not load it the way Kahr suggests...using the slide catch/release...problem solved?

[JustinN]

New Kahrs are notorious for not wanting to load the round if you hand rack it and ride it forward AT ALL. They will hang up on that, which is why the Kahr manual suggests using the slide release. Now, I know with most of the Kahrs I've handled, once they get broke in, that spring loosens up just a bit and they become easier to load.

Give us more information on what you have done since late October. I reviewed your last posts and the last was in late October, you hadn't shot the gun yet, were just asking about the look of the back of the gun (and I'll admit it looked sloppy). Did you contact Kahr? What did they say? What did they do? The main thing you keep seeing on this forum is if a gun has a problem, and it is a defect in the firearm, Kahr will make it right. You have to contact them for them to know about the problem though.

Did you follow Jocko's break-in and lube guides? I understand not trusting a gun, especially if it's for your off duty carry, but other than trying to slingshot the slide and it not working, are you having FTEs, FTFs, etc?

[Nimrod]

I agree with MLESa7990. With the slide locked back, insert a full mag and use the slide release lever to load a round. See if this solves the problem. If not, don't give up on the CM9 just yet. Give Kahr another call. I would suggest replacing the recoil spring but since the gun was just returned from Kahr, I doubt the a weak spring is the problem.

[Russ]

Hey everyone,
I bought a khar cm9 last year went to shoot it for first time about 3 or 4 months later an had a issue.
I was able to only get 2 shots off then bullets kept jamming when i racked it back to load into chamber or it would not feed the bullets at all. I cleaned the gun took it apart an still same issue. I sent it back to khar then sent back the gun an now i went to range to shoot an i shot 200 rounds at the range, BUT everytime i put a new mag in to reload after the slide locks back.. unless i pull the slide back real fast an hard with a super hard snap action it wont close an feed a bullet an usually have to do it twice. the gun slide is much better but still i dont feel this gun is great quality.
I sold my p2000 sk H&k because it was heavy for off duty i wanted a super light an small gun but the p2000 never had an issue was smooth as buitter never jammed even if left dirty an not cleaned. i feel like this khar is not reliable an if im in a situation off duty that if i pull it out i dont know if it will shoot or not wich is scary i actually regret buying this gun. i rather be uncomfortable carryin a gun an know it will shoot then be the other way around.
any advice or feedback would be appreciated.. of course i know you get what you pay for but its still a gun an still should be reliable regardless..:mad:

Danger hack

I owned a Kahr CM9 and Beretta Nano and I am convinced after purchasing a S&W Shield 9 mm which is slightly larger than both mentioned that there is a direct correlation with size and reliability.

If you want a smaller firearm - tolerances will be tighter making the likely hood of a failure greater than a larger firearm.

Russ

[Dangerhack]

New Kahrs are notorious for not wanting to load the round if you hand rack it and ride it forward AT ALL. They will hang up on that, which is why the Kahr manual suggests using the slide release. Now, I know with most of the Kahrs I've handled, once they get broke in, that spring loosens up just a bit and they become easier to load.

Give us more information on what you have done since late October. I reviewed your last posts and the last was in late October, you hadn't shot the gun yet, were just asking about the look of the back of the gun (and I'll admit it looked sloppy). Did you contact Kahr? What did they say? What did they do? The main thing you keep seeing on this forum is if a gun has a problem, and it is a defect in the firearm, Kahr will make it right. You have to contact them for them to know about the problem though.

Did you follow Jocko's break-in and lube guides? I understand not trusting a gun, especially if it's for your off duty carry, but other than trying to slingshot the slide and it not working, are you having FTEs, FTFs, etc?

my gun deal an khar said its normal an will not affect reliabliltiy of gun ... besides the slide issue as for now that is all im having problems with.. i was just shocked when it kept jamming before i sent it in.. beacuse i was so used to the smooth action of my h&k it shoots well im just being paranoid i guess

[Dangerhack]

I agree with MLESa7990. With the slide locked back, insert a full mag and use the slide release lever to load a round. See if this solves the problem. If not, don't give up on the CM9 just yet. Give Kahr another call. I would suggest replacing the recoil spring but since the gun was just returned from Kahr, I doubt the a weak spring is the problem.

thanks for the tip.. i tried using the slide release instead of pulling it back an it worked no problem~!.. but i was told by my department an firearms instructers that using the slide release button was no good for the gun or it wears away if you use that alot of slide forward??? thats why i always pulled back to slide foward manually didnt wanna damage my gun .. thats what they make us do with our on dutys. any thoughts on this?

[Bawanna]

Firearms instructors are big on not using the slide release. It's a fine motor skill that will disappear in a stress situation. The slide release will not wear the gun.

After the gun is broke in some it should sling shot with ease. Most sling shot right out of the box. You just need to keep in mind it is very unforgiving for sloppiness in the sling shot, pull it all the way back and let her rip, don't ride the slide at all or she might balk.

Again after more rounds it will become a little more forgiving but it will never be a slopomatic full size Glock. Nothing against a glock mind ya, its just a different much larger, more forgiving platform with no asthetic qualities and carries like a block of wood.

[skiflydive]

thanks for the tip.. i tried using the slide release instead of pulling it back an it worked no problem~!.. but i was told by my department an firearms instructers that using the slide release button was no good for the gun or it wears away if you use that alot of slide forward??? thats why i always pulled back to slide foward manually didnt wanna damage my gun .. thats what they make us do with our on dutys. any thoughts on this?

Kahrs are built to extremely close tolerances...exotic sports car tolerances. Especially when new they are tight, tight, tight. That's why the recommended 200 round break-in. During my break-in, the only failures I had were when I tried to hand rack.

If you think about it, if you carry with a round in the chamber there's no need to hand rack. When you fire the last round in the mag the slide will lock back, you'll drop the mag and reload, then go to battery by flicking the slide release. Every time you put a fresh mag in the gun you flick the slide release. IMHO it's faster and much less effort to do that then try to hand rack.

If you choose NOT to carry with a loaded chamber, then hand racking will be necessary and it becomes easier to do after the gun is well broken in.

[JustinN]

Dangerhack,

I second what Bwana said. My instructors in the police academy also told us to hand rack the guns, not to use the slide stop lever, not because of it wearing down, but because of the loss of fine motor control in a stress situation. Glock specifically makes theirs small. It's the same argument against a gun with a manual safety, you won't get your thumb to work while taking fire.

As the gun wears in, I think your sling shot can get a little easier and it will function fine, but brand new, it is very unforgiving. I can't hand cycle my AR15, but it will fire away like no one's business.

(as a side not on the slide stop wearing out if you use it...it does the exact same motion when you pull the slide back to slingshot it, its still moving up and down).

[muggsy]

I have to say bull. It takes no more fine motor skills to hit a slide release than to rack a slide under stress. It all depends on how you train. If what the instructors told you were true then a 1911 couldn't be relied upon for defense because of the manual safety. I don't know how myths like this get started, but before long they are passed on as truths. It ain't necessarily so.

[AC7880]

Make sure your rounds are at the back of the magazine - especially the top round. Pull the slide all the way back then do a clean release and it will slingshot load just fine - same as using the slide release. You are riding the slide forward.

[skiflydive]

I have to say bull. It takes no more fine motor skills to hit a slide release than to rack a slide under stress. It all depends on how you train. If what the instructors told you were true then a 1911 couldn't be relied upon for defense because of the manual safety. I don't know how myths like this get started, but before long they are passed on as truths. It ain't necessarily so.

+1 I agree

[Bawanna]

I feel obligated to explain that this is what I hear consistently from instructors. I neither agree or disagree with it. I go both ways myself. I'll be fumbling trying to hold the gun let alone do tricky stuff like reload or not jerk the trigger.

Many instructors are also 1911 fans with because they are Jeff Cooper spawns like me or because they think they really are the best, also like me.

I agree that whatever way you do it the most in practice is probably the closest way it will happen under stress, but adrenaline is a horrible thing. I've been there and the rule book goes right out the window.
Training as is often stated is the absolute best remedy but until you look the elephant in the eye or cape buffalo or insert killer animal here_______you just won't know what fine motor skills are.

[Dangerhack]

I actually like using the slide release its just that I've been brainwashed by my department been on job for 7 years to never do it! Imma starting using it at least on my gun ! Thanks for all the tips

[Bawanna]

My recommendation is always to learn from the experts, listen to what they say, then apply what works for you in your day to day activities and round file the rest.

Slingshoting with your duty gun may be the best and right way if it works for you and you train that way. Some of the off the wall stuff our instructors here come up with makes me laugh sometimes. It's like a flavor of the month tactic that changes like skivvy shorts.

But most importantly always, always and I mean always question authority.

[Ikeo74]

So, your are complaining about a gun that evidently you never bothered to break in. Now you want to bad mouth the Kahr firearms because you are not following the new gun break in procedures? I don't buy your story. Your "department" needs to give you better information.:rolleyes:

[jocko]

well one fokking thing if u only have one arm, then hand racking sucks. So I go with the slide release if u wanna be totally consistent every time. gert good both ways, 99.995% ur never gonna hav eto make that decision either.so why do we want to make a big deal out of it. If it floats ur boat, then row the fokker

.I never question the COLONEL..NEVER. JUST SAYIN

[Dangerhack]

So, your are complaining about a gun that evidently you never bothered to break in. Now you want to bad mouth the Kahr firearms because you are not following the new gun break in procedures? I don't buy your story. Your "department" needs to give you better information.:rolleyes:

The gun couldn't be "broken" in the first time because it was defective I had to send it back it wouldn't shoot. You can't break in a gun that doesn't shoot... An " my department " I agree that's what they tell everyone so before this job I knew nothing about guns so I figured what they told me was correct.

[jocko]

I have to say bull. It takes no more fine motor skills to hit a slide release than to rack a slide under stress. It all depends on how you train. If what the instructors told you were true then a 1911 couldn't be relied upon for defense because of the manual safety. I don't know how myths like this get started, but before long they are passed on as truths. It ain't necessarily so.

no motor skills really necessary to use the slide release, racking is anutter story. Might take a brain to know if your hitting the slide release over the mag release over the manual safety, but no motor skills..

[Bawanna]

And it may be correct in some instances like with your duty gun under stress. But if it doesn't work for you then they are not correct.

Given time the choice will be yours, the kahr will work either way.

[Ikeo74]

Hey everyone,
I bought a khar cm9 last year went to shoot it for first time about 3 or 4 months later an had a issue.
I was able to only get 2 shots off then bullets kept jamming when i racked it back to load into chamber or it would not feed the bullets at all. I cleaned the gun took it apart an still same issue. I sent it back to khar then sent back the gun an now i went to range to shoot an i shot 200 rounds at the range, BUT everytime i put a new mag in to reload after the slide locks back.. unless i pull the slide back real fast an hard with a super hard snap action it wont close an feed a bullet an usually have to do it twice. the gun slide is much better but still i dont feel this gun is great quality.
I sold my p2000 sk H&k because it was heavy for off duty i wanted a super light an small gun but the p2000 never had an issue was smooth as buitter never jammed even if left dirty an not cleaned. i feel like this khar is not reliable an if im in a situation off duty that if i pull it out i dont know if it will shoot or not wich is scary i actually regret buying this gun. i rather be uncomfortable carryin a gun an know it will shoot then be the other way around.
any advice or feedback would be appreciated.. of course i know you get what you pay for but its still a gun an still should be reliable regardless..:mad:
I think you should sell your "KHAR" "an" get another H&K. That "wich" should solve your problems.

[Dangerhack]

I think you should sell your "KHAR" "an" get another H&K. That "wich" should solve your problems.

That's the second dumb comment you made.. Dude grow up, everyone else is trying to help an give advice.

[Ikeo74]

That's the second dumb comment you made.. Dude grow up, everyone else is trying to help an give advice.
I am beginning to think you are beyond help when I read your posts.
(make that 3 in a row)

[Bawanna]

Now don't make me come down there and separate you two. I thought things were going along well and some good ideas were accepted as such.

Join me now in singing Inagodadivida at 78 speed in G minor.

[MW surveyor]

Thanks, now I've got .........dant dant da da da dant dant ..... and the drum solo running through my head.

[PattayaPistol]

Ikeo74, maybe I didn't read this entire thread properly but he sure seemed to be taking it all in and working with it. As for HK's I like my Kahr, but I (personally) would take any HK over a Kahr - just personal preference, not something right or wrong. The Kahr is a good (great) niche gun, but has some idiosyncrasies that once learned, don't bother you. Dangerhack appears to be trying to learn. I'm not trying to start or join a fight here, just making a few comments.

Cheers
PP