PM9 Crimson Trace Laser or Nightsights

[Pyranha]

Hello, I'm about to pick up my first Kahr pistol. I've been an avid Glock fan for some time, but am just wanting something a bit more practical for every day conceal carry.

After trying out a handful of the pocket pistols, I've pretty much settled on a PM9. My only decision left is which model.

PM9039 Standard PM9, Black/SS

Or for $90 more:
PM9093L CT Laser or a PM9039N Night sights

Is there any difference between these models besides the crimson trace laser on the L and the factory night sights on the N?

How do people like the factory night sights?

I've never had a laser on any of my carry pistols, but I'm really starting to think it might just be a worthwhile edge to have. If I decide I don't like it, is it completely removable so that it'd be like a standard PM9039?

Thanks for any help you can provide, cheers!

[Pyranha]

For what it's worth, I'm sure I'll upgrade the factory sights on the laser version if I do order it instead of the factory night sight option, or standard option if there are better night sights out there than the factory ones.

[ndoren]

Hello, I'm about to pick up my first Kahr pistol.
How do people like the factory night sights?

My new PM9 has the factory night sight option. They're Meprolight Tru Dot sights. White circles in daylight, green glow in the dark. Very visible and clear for daytime shooting. Better than stock in normal lighting conditions. However, in my humble opinion, I wished they were a bit brighter in the dark. So, somewhat mixed feelings. They're zeroed very well from the factory. Spot-on the bullseye. Neall

[JLeephoto]

Some people prefer different night sights. I'm having some XS Big Dots added to my PM9 and the slide Cerakoted. I just prefer all black pistols, and IMHO that's the main reason to get a PM series over the CM. If I were just going stainless and wanted to add night sights I'd go with the the CM9 and easily swap the front sight out.
It's really personal preference but I understand the PM dovetailed sights are a PITA to replace on our own as they are a very tight fit. My local armorer wouldn't do it and suggested I send my slide in.

[janderson021]

I put the Crimson Trace laser grips on my CM9 a couple of months ago. Sighted it in at 7 yards, then played around with how it pointed at shorter and longer distances. I really like it, and it is easily removable if needed.
Then, 2 weeks ago I bought a 'new' (year 2012) Trijicon front sight directly from the Kahr website. Put it on with no problem, put 200 rounds thru the pipe so far just to see how things align (and they do at 7 yards). The Trijicon sight works just like the stock sight. I do like having the extra advantage in low light conditions of seeing that 'glow in the dark' sight with the red dot pointing the way.

[Just One Shot]

Both!

[drewski115]

Both!

What he said.......oh and PM9 DLC.

[AC7880]

CM9 approx $400. CT Laser approx $170. $570 and "almost" the same as a PM9.

[olympicmotorcars]

Sorry, I have to be the negative voice. I had a crimson trace on my PM last year for several months and it worked great, until I noticed one day while practicing dry firing, the laser had become significantly off zero compared with my sights. ( I mean you would miss by several feet if targeting something 7 yards away.) I promptly removed it and bought some Meprolights and have never looked back.
If yours becomes off zero and have to use your weapon, which will you trust in a split second decesion, the laser or your sights? Especially if you are used to relying on the laser.

[Pyranha]

I understand the match grade barrel and few other differences between the CM and PM are, apparently, mostly irrelevant for typical cc usage.

But I'm in industrial maintenance... and the machining work on the PM is a thing of beauty compared to the CM. It likely doesn't make it better, but it's something I appreciate! So I spoke with my dealer today and asked him to order one, ended up going with the PM9093L Crimson Trace Laser version. If I decide I don't like the Crimson Laser, it'll be up for sale here.

I'll certainly be sending the slide to Kahr after the holidays for some proper night sights to be installed and ordering a nice IWB holster this week, after checking out my options.

Thanks for the input, I can't wait for Thursday, cheers!

[Pyranha]

Sorry, I have to be the negative voice. I had a crimson trace on my PM last year for several months and it worked great, until I noticed one day while practicing dry firing, the laser had become significantly off zero compared with my sights. ( I mean you would miss by several feet if targeting something 7 yards away.) I promptly removed it and bought some Meprolights and have never looked back.
If yours becomes off zero and have to use your weapon, which will you trust in a split second decesion, the laser or your sights? Especially if you are used to relying on the laser.

You posted while I was in the midst of posting, and had walked away for a minute. Regardless, I already placed my order earlier today.

I really appreciate you bringing that concern up though. It's certainly something I'll have to watch for. Was yours an EDC piece? What sort of holster were you using? IWB or Pocket?

[APSKahr]

Sorry, I have to be the negative voice. I had a crimson trace on my PM last year for several months and it worked great, until I noticed one day while practicing dry firing, the laser had become significantly off zero compared with my sights. ( I mean you would miss by several feet if targeting something 7 yards away.) I promptly removed it and bought some Meprolights and have never looked back.
If yours becomes off zero and have to use your weapon, which will you trust in a split second decesion, the laser or your sights? Especially if you are used to relying on the laser.

This is the reason, and I've read it more than a few times in regards to the PM/CM series, that I have not bought a CT for my CM9. Since it's not a grip panel replacement like other pistols, and there is no accessory mounting rail for the laser to firmly lock onto, I can see how the attachment method would be prone to movement. I currently have a Dawson tritium front on mine.

[JFootin]

This is the reason, and I've read it more than a few times in regards to the PM/CM series, that I have not bought a CT for my CM9. Since it's not a grip panel replacement like other pistols, and there is no accessory mounting rail for the laser to firmly lock onto, I can see how the attachment method would be prone to movement. I currently have a Dawson tritium front on mine.

The answer is to get a Walther PPS (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=13152&storeId=10002&productId=60492&parent_category_rn=44304&isFirearm=Y) which has a rail for a laser. Slightly larger, but a well liked CC pistol with some great features.

[APSKahr]

Yes, the Walther PPS is a very nice pistol I've shot one before. For me, the things going against it are primarily, that I already have a CM9 and not a PPS, lol. But I think it's slightly too large for pocket carry and I don't like the magazine release. Plus it's more expensive, and mags are more expensive.

[JFootin]

Well, just wanted to throw that option out there for using a laser. I am not interested in a laser for my CM9 or any of my carry pistols. Not needed at SD distance, IMO. I have read a lot of negative reports about the fit of the CT laser on Kahrs, so they are no go for me. Now, I have the Laserlyte LT-Pro training laser and the reactive Laser Target that I can use for practice with all of my pistols, and they help me to learn better trigger control and to develop point shooting skill right here in my man cave. Nice thing is that ammo cost is zero! :D

[olympicmotorcars]

I also have a PPS. Great pistol. I carry it a lot.

Pyranha: yes the PM 40 is one of my EDC pistols, along with my Glock 27 and Walther PPS.
I have high noon IWB tuckable holsters for all of them. ( Split Decision , I think is the name of them ). You might want to check out highnoonholsters.com

[dirtkicker]

I have a CT laser on my CM9 and it is dead on accurate. It was very easy to adjust and hasn't moved in 300 rounds. I like it and practice with it. In low light or in an awkward position sight acquisition is not always an option. I like to keep my options open.

[JLeephoto]

I have a CT on my PM9 and it does slip very slightly on occasion but not enough to alter the point of aim more than an inch at self defense distance of 5-7 yards. I keep an allen wrench handy and make a quick adjustment each time I dry fire practice. Takes about 10 secs. So, not much of an issue for me, and the laser is great for dry fire practice.
That said, I'm installing Big Dot sights and may consider losing the laser. It does take up a slight amount of purchase space under the trigger guard on an already very short grip. I also practice with my other guns with sights so it seems like a strange transition. Finally, in reality, I'm not convinced that I'd be using any sights or even that they are needed in an , Oh $%^^, get off me situation. But, having good sights or a laser sure make practice more fun.
Just think we need to be realistic in our reasoning. If we need one of these little guns in a self defense situation it's likely to be very up close and personal under more stress than most folks can imagine. That's not to say we shouldn't train, I just think we sometimes get too hung up on the gear.

[Nimrod]

I bought my PM9 with night sights. I added the Crimson Trace laser sights as soon as they were available. I have never had it need readjusting after being set. That could be because I remove it when cleaning and reinstall it and adjust as necessary, due to the reinstallation. I practice with both the laser and without. I wouldn't recommend totally relying on the laser. Although unlikely, it could fail when you need it most.
To each his own, but I have night sights and Crimson Trace laser sights on all four of my carry guns. The fact is that most defensive shootings occur in low light conditions.