Suggested load for PM40

[henryiii]

Can anyone recommend a load they have found to work reliably in the PM40. I have tried 8 grains of Unique with a 155 gr Hornaday XTP & 6 grains of Hodgins with the same 155 Hornaday XTP . Both have failed to feed every time. Using brand new unfired brass. RCBS dies. The round never makes it into the chamber and locks up the action with only about an 1/8 inch of the bullet making it into the chamber, the brass at an angle barely out of the magazine. The gun shoots Winchester factory loads, 155 and 180 weight bullets very reliably. Any recs on a load would be greatly appreciated.

[Ikeo74]

If the reload bullets don't chamber you need to find out what you are doing wrong in your loading process. It is not related to the bullet or the powder. It is the size of your finished product.

[mr surveyor]

first, I have to ask where you got your load data calling for 8 gr of Unique with 155 gr bullet, and what sources did you cross reference with. I do not load .40 S&W, but that 8 gr load you mentioned piqued my curiosity. The load data I had immediately available by my computer desk suggests to me that you are dancing with a compressed load. I'd be leery of that...but I'm not a highly experienced reloader.

As for not chambering, sounds like you need to concentrate more attention on resizing as well as more consistant taper crimp. Not to advertise one brand over the other, but I would suggest the Lee Factory Crimp Die for making a near perfect crimp and not inadvertantly crushing the case mouth.

surv

[mr surveyor]

oh... and concerning the resizing, you know that there's a whole lot of range brass you'll find with varying degrees of case bulge from unsupported chambers. If you don't do a good, full length resize you'll have chambering issues no matter how you treat the case mouth/crimp

[Ikeo74]

The first thing to check, measure and post back here is the Overall Length of the bullet. The second thing to check is the measurement of the case diameter at the mouth where the bullet enters the case, measure and post that measurement. After that we can help you.

[Ikeo74]

Can anyone recommend a load they have found to work reliably in the PM40. I have tried 8 grains of Unique with a 155 gr Hornaday XTP & 6 grains of Hodgins with the same 155 Hornaday XTP . Both have failed to feed every time. Using brand new unfired brass. RCBS dies. The round never makes it into the chamber and locks up the action with only about an 1/8 inch of the bullet making it into the chamber, the brass at an angle barely out of the magazine. The gun shoots Winchester factory loads, 155 and 180 weight bullets very reliably. Any recs on a load would be greatly appreciated.
How much reloading experiance do you have? Are you using only Unique powder or are you using a 2nd powder you are calling Hodgins?

[Bongo Boy]

The cartridge isn't even remotely close to chambering, and if that's consistently the failure mode (i.e., only 1/8" getting into the chamber), then I'm thinking there's a problem that has little to do with the load you're using--although we're all curious about the measured overall length of the cartridge, just the same.

The Unique load of 8 gr is indeed an Alliant recommended dose for the 155 gr Gold Dot, and that load should be fine with the XTP. Something is very suspicious--and my first red flag is that you're using brand new brass. So, tell us each step of your process--from pulling the new case from the bag, to going into the press, to finished round.

And the overall length. Even a cell phone photo of a finished cartridge would be instructive.

Has this problem happened with more than one magazine, or are you using just a single magazine in all cases?

[jocko]

are u hand racking thegun or using the slide lock lever to load that first round...

[mr surveyor]

yep, as Bongo Boy said.... Alliant does recommend 8 gr Unique for the 155 grain jacketed bullet. I wasn't suggesting that had anything to do with the chambering issue... just concerned it may be a bit too close to "the edge" with .40 acp under the current circumstances

I'm still betting it's improperly sized brass and/or over flaring and improper crimping.... or not flaired at all and the brass is being crushed/distorted, or...


yep, pictures would do wonders:)



EDIT....... ON SECOND, THIRD AND FOURTH THOUGHT..... It seems that Jocko is the only one that actually figgered out the "issue". We're all looking at this as if it's just a reloading issue, rather than a "how to charge certain Kahr pistols" issue.

EDIT AGAIN.... and BBoy is most likely onto it with the OAL


sure is hard to figure out these things with limited information

[MW surveyor]

Especially since the post was on the 30th and it is now the 2nd of January without a reply from the OP!

[jocko]

well it would at least be one possability that needed to be eliminated.

damn I would think new brass would not need to be resized. Just sayin

[jocko]

Especially since the post was on the 30th and it is now the 2nd of January without a reply from the OP!

good point there to and being his 1st post, very strange:crazy:

[mr surveyor]

I resize ALL new brass.... it ain't all perfect. I've had some that the case mouth was obviously deformed.

[rago]

i was having trouble with some of my brass, i figured out when i was depriming and sizing with lee dies i was not going all the way down with my stroke , there fore not removing all of the bulge. Then i went through and re checked all my cleaned brass, I found about a doz that were still bulged I ran them through the size again completing a full stroke then the were the right size. i used my go no go gauge,

[DeeDubya]

I'm shooting 6 gr of W231 and 155 gr Rainier plated bullets for a practice round. They function perfectly. I would recommend a faster powder. There are about 50 powder choices that are faster than Unique. Bullseye is always a good choice for short barrels.

[henryiii]

Thank you very much for the replies. I went out of town the day after the post. I am back and ready to try again. We are experienced reloaders, well my father is (50 + years at it), who is doing the actual work as I watch and assist. The cartridge jams between the magazine and the chamber, never making it up into the chamber, therefore I do not believe the crimp is the problem, we are not crimping it at all. Perhaps overall length is the problem, we set the seating depth of the bullet based on a factory round that does function properly, as we do not have a micrometer of that length. I will get the bullet measured properly and report back. As for the new brass, I assumed that was best and bought new unfired Winchester brass and are using it straight out of the bag (but we are resizing it in the process). I was wrong about the Hodkins load, we have not used or tried that brand. We have only used Unique 7.2 grains and 8.0 grains, with the 155 grain XTP bullet, as suggested by Alliant. Have not tried any other bullets or powders, that is why I was asking for suggestions. Any chance the load could be "too hot" , not giving the cartridge time to get out of the magazine before slide moves forward over it(that seems a stretch)? Thanks for the suggestions.

[henryiii]

Once again, thanks for all the suggestions. I am going to start with trying out a load or two with Bullseye powder based on the last suggestion stating he had good luck with that brand in the exact same gun. I will post results, as well as bullet length and other technical info once the results are in. Kahrs are unquestionably finicky, so I am hoping this thread will help more than me. Thanks again, Henry

[Bongo Boy]

While I don't think the load is the problem, I suppose there is a possibility related to a hot load: if the recoil spring is too light a spring allowing the slide to slam hard to the rear, that action might possibly pull the top round right out of the magazine before the slide even gets to it. That in turn could mean the cartridge rim is not sliding up under the extractor, and allowing a steep angle between cartridge base and breech face. I don't know--I'm really reaching here.

The XTP bullet itself has got to be one of the most perfect nose shapes for getting up the ramp I can imagine--doesn't mean it is, I'm just saying it sure seems like it would be an easy feeder. So, here's the data from my journal:

To my great surprise, I can find NO load data of mine for 155 gr XTPs. I have 135 gr XTP loads in 40 and 185 gr XTP loads in 45, but no 155 stuff. I do have, to my great joy, 500 each 155 gr XTP bullets sitting right here next to me--but haven't worked up loads yet. I expect most of them will find their way into 10mm Auto cases, but I'll have to save some for the 40 I guess.

Hmmm...one more chore to get done.

[DeeDubya]

Most PM40 owners know this but just as a reminder...

You must have a firm grip on subcompact pistols to prevent "limp wrist" feeding failures. Any load will fail to feed if the gun is allowed to move back in your hand. Straigten the elbow a little more like in a Weaver stance. It works for me. The PM40 has a pretty heavy recoil spring and the slide has to move all the way back to pick up a round from the magazine.

[getsome]

I load for my PM40 using the same Hornady 155 grn jhp bullet over 5.9 grn Universal Clays powder which is in the middle of the range my loading book calls for 5.8 grn starting load to 6.2 grn as max load....I put a pretty good crimp on mine and used a factory Hornady round with the same bullet for seating measurement depth and I can hand rack the first round every time and they feed fine but even with the lighter powder charge weight they still recoil pretty stout...

As for resizing new brass I found out the hard way this needs to be done...I bought some new Remington .40 brass and didn't resize but just primed them...I started setting up the flair die and found that a new bullet would almost fall into the case with no resistance but after removing the spent primer remover tang and full length resizing them everything was normal and with a slight case mouth flair it took the press to push in a bullet so now I always resize new brass before priming...



In henryiii's situation I would take a finished round and try to fit it into the barrel to make sure the crimp is tight enough and that the round slips in and falls out of the barrel without interference with the champer of any kind...

[muggsy]

Alliant loading data gives you max loads. You should reduce that load by 10% for a starting load, Generally a cartridge that is over length won't fit in the magazine, but I'd double check the OAL just to be sure. If you use new brass you should check the length of the brass and trim it to the minimum speck to insure uniformity.

[henryiii]

Bullseye it is! 6.0 grains Bullseye, with the 155 gr Hornady XTP functions flawlessly in my Kahr PM40. Thanks to everyone who made suggestions, we learned something from all of them and I have found my load. Thanks again, Henry

[MW surveyor]

Glad to read that you got your load on :rolleyes: