P380 striker prevents chambering...

[pm9094n]

First post here... Also on the road so I can't do a thorough search. I have a PM9 and p380. The p380 is brand new. Cleaned, lubed, etc per this site. I put approx 150 rounds through the p380 today. Lots of FTF due to what looked like to me the striker protruding from the channel about 1 mm. This was catching the base of the round and jamming the gun. After freeing the round by dropping the mag, I could push the striker back in with my finger. Then it would recur a few rounds later. This happened when chambering a round 'Kahr Style' or attempting to rack the slide. So, I thought cleanliness was the problem, field stripped it, full clean and lube, then tried to cycle some round through. Same intermittent problem. Seeing the stricker sticking out like that scares me a bit. Also had the gun begin to not return to full battery during shooting. I think the gun was getting dirty. FMJ rem ammo. BTW, the PM9 has never had a hiccup through 250 rds.
Thanks for you help!

[kerby9mm]

Assuming mk.k9 & mk40 striker assembly is the same as yours it goes back & forward with no resistance (free floating). When I dryfire & rack the slide back to lock the firing pin can be forward or back. During firing I would think the inertia from recoil would make the pin slide back. I tried with the firing pin forward slowly racking a round into the chamber & the pin did not hinder it. One would think if the pin did catch on a round that it might break or bend the pin.

[Ikeo74]

I don't have my manual handy but I think there is a page devoted to this exact problem. The gun needs to be disassembled and checked. Check Owners manual for instructions.

[pm9094n]

It may be something to do with size of the gun ( micro). My 9 doesn't do this. I sprayed a whole can if brake clean in and around the channel. I may detail strip and see... I have noticed the machining of my p380 is not as refined... Don't know why

[Ikeo74]

Word for word from the manual. "Checking Safety Devices"

The following safety check is to be carried out at regular intervals and before the pistol is used.
With the slide removed and the barrel dismantled, the stricker is drawn back manually about 1/4 inch and then eased forward again. The tip of the Striker must not project beyond the breech face of the slide.

Note: When easing the Striker forward, be careful not to depress the striker block which sits next to the striker. If it is depressed during the safety check, it will allow the Striker to project beyon the breach face.

My take on this is it could cause a negligent discharge when chambering a round, or if the gun is dropped, however the info does not say that. The striker safety block is an important passive safety to prevent the striker from hitting the primer.

[CJB]

The firing mechanism is the same across the entire line of models.

The striker is more or less free floating, and additionally it uses inertia to fire the cartridges.

Explained: The striker contains the striker spacer, which serves as the forward retainer for the striker spring. The striker also incorporates an engagement surface which interacts with the cocking cam.

As the slide moves forward, propelled by the recoil spring, at a certain point in the slides forward travel, the striker remains stationary due to the engagement of the mating surfaces on the striker and the cocking cam. The slide will continue to move forward into battery, and the striker spring is partially tensioned.

When the trigger is pulled, the cocking cam rotates, the striker is drawn rearward by the engaging surface on the cocking cam, and additional spring tension is placed upon the striker because of its rearward movement. As the cocking cam rotates further, its engaging surface begins to separate from the corresponding surface on the striker and with further cocking cam rotation, the striker is released to propel forward under spring tension.

When the striker is nearly fully forward, the striker spacer, which is being pushed by the striker spring, is halted in its forward movement by a constriction in the striker channel. The striker itself is then free to move forward via inertia, and its nose is able to strike the primer, firing the cartridge.

The striker is free floating for a small amount of travel during recoil, and rearward motion of the slide, until the mating surfaces on the striker and cocking cam re-engage. Re-engagement is possible because the trigger bar has disconnected from the cocking cam, and allowed it to rotate back to its original position.

~~~

I'd like to see a picture, but it sounds like you have a cocking cam issue.

Remove the slide from the frame. Make sure the cocking cam's action is snappy when you pull the trigger and manually "disconnect" the trigger bar. There may be some flashing and/or gunk that is preventing snappy operation, which would prevent it from recapturing the striker.

[Ikeo74]

Assuming mk.k9 & mk40 striker assembly is the same as yours it goes back & forward with no resistance (free floating). When I dryfire & rack the slide back to lock the firing pin can be forward or back. During firing I would think the inertia from recoil would make the pin slide back. I tried with the firing pin forward slowly racking a round into the chamber & the pin did not hinder it. One would think if the pin did catch on a round that it might break or bend the pin.

Kerby, you need to do this safety check on your gun too!

[ScottieG59]

Just be careful which type on break cleaner you use. One that should be okay is NAPA #m (black can) high pressure non cholorinated brake spray cleaner.

I have seen damage done to finishes and some plastic parts with the wrong stuff.

I have a Kahr P380 and a PM9 too. I had to break in the P380 and it works well as long as the ammo is well made. Some of the cheap stuff is weak and inconsistent.

The most common reasons I see when the slide fails to go fully into battery is a weak grasp, thumb rubbing on the slide, maybe a bad magazine, slightly larger cases, dirty gun or a weak recoil spring. Others may know other causes. I think the Kahr chambers are more on the tight side.

The smaller the guns get, the less forgiving they are.

[pm9094n]

Thanks for the replies!!! I read and re- read the manual on the safety check and referred to it at the range. The manual doesn't say how to proceed. I just pushed the stricker back with my finger but I was wary. I'll get a picture tonight and post it.
I did th

[pm9094n]

Maybe it was the brass? I will re-redo the safety check and pay particular attention to the stricker block. Brakeclean non-Cl used.
Thanks again

[Ikeo74]

Thanks for the replies!!! I read and re- read the manual on the safety check and referred to it at the range. The manual doesn't say how to proceed. I just pushed the stricker back with my finger but I was wary. I'll get a picture tonight and post it.
I did th

I think all you have to do is reset it back behind the striker block by doing the 1/4 inch withdrawal with your finger after removing the slide and barrel from the gun. Move it back and if it catches so it no longer extends beyound the breech face you should be good to go. If it happens again a good cleaning is in order. There is a picture in the manual of this condition.
I think this only happens when the gun is disassembled for cleaning and the striker release is accidently pressed when putting the gun back togather. It would be be good to check it everytime you clean the gun.

[kerby9mm]

Kerby, you need to do this safety check on your gun too!
Slide off striker back as long as the striker cannot be pushed forward without depressing the striker block the safety check is completed. Both my mk9 & mk40 work the same exact way. With the pin forward then pulled back the striker blocks pop up.

[pm9094n]

Kerby, I want to restate what you posted to make sure I'm doing this right. Please correct me if I'm wrong:
-Take slide off
-Pull striker back then slowly release it forward, making certain the striker block stops forward motion of the striker
-Confirm by depressing the striker block then repeat to reset without depressing block?

Thinking about it more, it could be the striker block is still dirty and not returning to position fully? Also, unfortunately I only had one brand of ammo today. When I got home I ran through all the recommended cleaning steps again, polished well the throat, ramp and chamber (even slightly rounded ramp edge), mirror polished and smoothed the mag lips, racked the slide wet over and over. I don't like doing this at home but I fed live FMJ ammo through, both Kahr style and hand racking. I did have the problem every few rounds hand racking (I have watched the video and have seen the posts on the correct method) and one time Kahr style.
Plan now is to shoot a couple hundred more rounds and then detail strip/action polish.
What I think is happening is the striker is not 'beating' the round back into the channel before the base of the cartride comes sliding up and gets caught on the protruding striker pin. I am concerned it may bend or break the pin (may already be damaged???)
I don't know. But I'll keep you guys updated.
One more thought. I never have the problem if I rack the slide to tension the striker with the gun empty, then insert a loaded magazine, lock the slide back and release the slide stop Kahr style. Also, does anyone do this routinely. I would think no but I don't know.

[pm9094n]

Ok I had to look at again before bed( you know what I mean).
After 5 FTFs by Kahr method, I pulled back the slide and noticed the rear end of the striker was forward of the striker block. I pulled it back slightly and 'click' the block engaged. But, Icycled the action empty, pulled the trigger, loaded a new mag, and not tinkling of flipping the gun over to check the engagement of the block, had the same problem again! I cleared the firearm, pulled back the slide and reset the block ('click'). Yes, I dropped a small drop of remoil on the striker block and worked it up and down with a small wooden dowel. After that, no problems feeding. But, I did head off another jam by looking under the slide and resetting the striker behind the block. I can chamber a round with slide locked back or by racking. What's going on here??? The slide block is not reliably holding the striker aft and I have to look under the slide to manually check/ reset the block. Is this part of your routine safety check?

[Ikeo74]

I have never had the problem myself but are you doing the reset with the slide remover from the gun and the barrel removed from the slide? Reset the striker then and then reassemble the gun without pushing down of the striker retainer??? From your description I am thinking you are resetting with the gun fully assembled. Did I miss something when reading your post?

[CJB]

Everything should self reset when the slide is pulled fully to the rear.

[pm9094n]

Yes I reset it slide off then realized once assembled I could look under slide to check it.
I'll try to work through it, do a detail strip/polish, shoot some more and send in if persistent. For now every time slide is locked back I'll look underneath. Not ready for carry at this time.

[pm9094n]

BTW, excellent forum guys. Thank you for your help, I really appreciate it.
Both guns (pm9 and p380) are amazing firearms. I bought them both because I like the precision and inherent accuracy, not to mention pride of owning an exacting, well made firearm.

[Flincher]

I own a P380, and have, fortunately had no problems. This is a good, informative, thread however. Prior to firing the first round ( i now have over 350 rounds), I strictly followed the owners manual, recommendations on the forum, and the "lube diagram".

[kerby9mm]

I just (on my mk9) pushed the pin forward by depressing the s block then super slowly chambered a round & as the base of the round slid up the breechface the firing pin retracted into the channel smoothly with no hangups. By the way the round fully chambered and was caught by the extractor then ejected. My mk9 chambers so smoothly you can't even tell a round is going in the pipe.

[Ikeo74]

I just (on my mk9) pushed the pin forward by depressing the s block then super slowly chambered a round & as the base of the round slid up the breechface the firing pin retracted into the channel smoothly with no hangups. By the way the round fully chambered and was caught by the extractor then ejected. My mk9 chambers so smoothly you can't even tell a round is going in the pipe.
They are smooth. I can hand rack and load mine without any problems. I only have about 300 rounds through it so far. How many rounds fired in Yours? I put the wood grips on mine and it is a beauty.

[pm9094n]

Something is definitely wrong. Finally got to play with the gun today and pulling the slide back definitely does not reset everything. The striker remains forward of the stricker block. I need some help. I'm afraid of acc discharge.

[kerby9mm]

When I dry fire then lock back the slide back sometimes the pin is out & sometimes it is bsck because the pin itself has no return spring. I still think when firing the sudden back then forward motion of the slide makes the pin retract. Without reading all this over on my phone is your pin jamming things when firing.

[pm9094n]

Yes intermittently.
I'm calling Kahr tomorrow.

[pm9094n]

Also my pm9 doesn't have this problem

[gb6491]

Something is definitely wrong. Finally got to play with the gun today and pulling the slide back definitely does not reset everything. The striker remains forward of the stricker block. I need some help. I'm afraid of acc discharge.
Just pulling the slide back does not reset everything. The striker may not "reset/retract" until the slide moves forward enough for the cocking cam to engage it. Once engaged by the cocking cam, the striker will remain stationary (relative to the cocking cam) as the slide continues forward. As the slide moves forward the striker block will pass a point on the striker where it can reset.

I didn't read where you have done a complete strip of the slide. If you haven't I suggest you do so and give all the parts a good cleaning (to include the tunnel in the slide). Inspect them for damage as well. Then reassemble the clean parts (no lube) and retest.

Another thought would be that your striker is too long or not profiled correctly. Would it be possible for you to post photos of how far the striker extends from the breech face and of it's tip?
Regards,
Greg

[pm9094n]

Thanks Greg, I took pix last night but had trouble downloading

[pm9094n]

Greg, I understand about reset and retracting the slide. But I can't load a round sometimes as recommended by Kahr without the striker pin preventing chambering. So I have to drop the mag, clear the jammed cartridge, pull back and lock the slide, reach under the slide and manually slide the pin back while making sure the block engages and prevents forward motion, then load another mag, seeing the firing pin is not protruding into the breach face, release the slide and then fire .

[pm9094n]

Can I email pix from my iPhone to a member for posting?

[gb6491]

Greg, I understand about reset and retracting the slide. But I can't load a round sometimes as recommended by Kahr without the striker pin preventing chambering. So I have to drop the mag, clear the jammed cartridge, pull back and lock the slide, reach under the slide and manually slide the pin back while making sure the block engages and prevents forward motion, then load another mag, seeing the firing pin is not protruding into the breach face, release the slide and then fire .
I thought you might, but just wanted to reiterate that. I've sent you PM in regards to the photo(s).
Regards,
Greg

[gb6491]

pm9094n's photos (my apologies, but I did crop and re-size them a bit):
http://i49.tinypic.com/33y12bp.jpg
http://i50.tinypic.com/n2lnhe.jpg
http://i50.tinypic.com/bi2b0j.jpg
Regards,
Greg

[Ikeo74]

There is definately a problem with the striker position here. It should not protrude any at all to interfere with the cartridge loading. The fix is simple (if nothing is broken), but you have to disassemble the gun down to the barrel removed from the slide. Once reset it should be ok unless there is a mechanical problem. Watch this video provided by wintrout and take the gun down to the final disassembly position. Then reset the striker as posted in the manual by retracting the striker 1/4 inch and releasing )slowly). The striker should no longer protrude beyond the breech face. If it does you either didn't do the reset right or there is a mechanical problem with your gun and you will have to contact Kahr. Reassemble according to the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=G2cZgVg_SwA

[gb6491]

If it were my gun and a detailed cleaning of the slide didn't reveal any damaged parts or fix the issue, I'd be inclined to reshape the striker tip so that the start of it's radius was closer to the breech face (green arrow) than it is currently (red arrow). That's what I would try, but you might be better advised to send it back to Kahr as anything you do (outside of a complete break down and cleaning of the entire slide, highly recommended) would be at your own risk.
http://i45.tinypic.com/29ghee0.jpg
Regards,
Greg

[Ikeo74]

That would take some gunsmithing and for this user I would not recommend trying.

[pm9094n]

Greg, thanks for posting these pictures. Until I can detail strip the upper, I won't know 'what lies beneath'. Ikeo's probably right, I definitely not on par with a master like Greg

[pm9094n]

What I'm going to do now when loading the p380 is this:
Drop empty mag
Lock slide back
Release slide
Lock slide back again
Insert magazine
Release slide

I think this preloading helps keep the striker under slight tension. If I dry fire after that first rack the striker may or may not return to blocked position

[JFootin]

The gun should not be doing that. That's what a warranty is for. Send an email with a couple of pics to Kahr CS, attention Jay. They will fix it.

[surveyor]

Hey pm9094n,
My p380 does exactly the same thing. About 450 rounds through it so far. Love it but wish it would go bang consistently.
Have you figured yours out yet.
My next move is to break the slide down and clean and polish anything suspicious.
thanks.....

[jocko]

send the phoos to kahr, attn. Jay, I would not advise u fixing it. It isnot right, could be the breech hole is a tad off kilter to and grabbing thaty striker. aybe a good smitty could fix it but again this is a new gun and in an area, that I would not mess with., anythingu do and it doesn't work, kahr can say u fokkedit up and won't fix it for nuttin.

Do what GB stated, strip the slide down totally and give the striker channel a good cleaning and inspection, if that doesn't take care of it thensend an email to kahr andf ask they to pick up thegun on their dime.

The cocking cam is supposed to keep the striker back out of the way .

[yqtszhj]

If cleaning don't fix it, send it back to kahr. It's broke. I'm like Jocko and wonder about the breech hole.

You know if the perfect storm happened, striker stayed out, and the round actually chambered, I'm seeing a possible full auto. Like the old open bolt machine guns. I could just be goofy though. Of course you might get $1000 for it then up for sale.

[wyntrout]

I would wonder if something's wrong with the striker safety block... or the tiny spring underneath it missing? This would allow the striker to go forward any time... not good!

Wynn:)

[pm9094n]

I wanted to post an update on my p380.

First off, as humbling as it is to say, I think it has been my fault.

The posters on the first page described the workings of the striker fired action perfectly and I wasn't listening. I think dry firing was messing me up- said another way, I think I was trying to load rounds with the striker all the way forward instead of first resetting it behind the block. Duh. Now I make sure to lock back the slide, release it, then proceed with inserting the magazine and either locking back the slide or racking a round. Many posts on this forum have stated you must hear it click all the way back or it's not reset. And that is certainly the case. After the last round, the slide locks back and the striker is back in the channel as normal. I have had no problems this way and shot over 150 rounds yesterday.

Early on, the striker block was sticky and that was confusing me too. After shooting the gun some more, working the striker block up and down and everything well, the gun has worked flawlessly and shoots very well. I put two cans of gun scrubber though it but I think the CRC/NAPA stuff works just as well.

I over-greased the slide rails and after firing a lot of rounds, the grease was building up combined with fouling. This was preventing the slide from returning to full battery. I took the adage 'she likes to run wet' a little too far... Again, my fault.

So thanks to all the posters who have helped. After cleaning and shooting the pistol more I understand it, and I think that familiarity has helped me, just has been said on here a thousand times. Just my ignorance.

I will update with changes but again I really love the gun. The 'full auto' post had me laughing tho...

Thanks again guys, we're lucky to have top notch expert posters here.

[cloud]

I wanted to post an update on my p380.

First off, as humbling as it is to say, I think it has been my fault.

The posters on the first page described the workings of the striker fired action perfectly and I wasn't listening. I think dry firing was messing me up- said another way, I think I was trying to load rounds with the striker all the way forward instead of first resetting it behind the block. Duh. Now I make sure to lock back the slide, release it, then proceed with inserting the magazine and either locking back the slide or racking a round. Many posts on this forum have stated you must hear it click all the way back or it's not reset. And that is certainly the case. After the last round, the slide locks back and the striker is back in the channel as normal. I have had no problems this way and shot over 150 rounds yesterday.

Early on, the striker block was sticky and that was confusing me too. After shooting the gun some more, working the striker block up and down and everything well, the gun has worked flawlessly and shoots very well. I put two cans of gun scrubber though it but I think the CRC/NAPA stuff works just as well.

I over-greased the slide rails and after firing a lot of rounds, the grease was building up combined with fouling. This was preventing the slide from returning to full battery. I took the adage 'she likes to run wet' a little too far... Again, my fault.

So thanks to all the posters who have helped. After cleaning and shooting the pistol more I understand it, and I think that familiarity has helped me, just has been said on here a thousand times. Just my ignorance.

I will update with changes but again I really love the gun. The 'full auto' post had me laughing tho...

Thanks again guys, we're lucky to have top notch expert posters here.

glad you figured it out. I really like my p380 . Now waiting on the cw380.lol

[wyntrout]

That is a "C" model that I might have been interested in... but I have TWO P380s. Shooter's had them on sale for $480 and I couldn't believe the price and thought that might work for my wife... as I did the P9 DLC with Novak NS that I bought on this forum a month or so later! She hasn't shot either, but both of those are working fine now, with a little help from Kahr on the P380.

The MSRP is $100 less than the CM series!

Wynn:)