New P380, rough first day!

[boones]

New user with a new P380. So far, pretty disappointed. It started when I took the gun home and took it apart to clean and lube it. The QA on the gun seemed poor. There were metal shavings from manufacturing all inside the gun. Also, it was very difficult to take down, with the slide pin being a pain to remove and the slide not wanting to slide forward and off with the pin removed the trigger pulled. A sharp yank got if off. I watched the takedown video on Khar's site to make sure I was doing it correctly. I also found rough plastic mold flashing around the inside of the gun. Once fully cleaned and lubed, it seemed to operate normally if somewhat more stiffly than I expected.

Today I took it to the range:

Put 200 rounds through it and had about 20 malfunctions. I used 2 types of ammo, 100 each, both new. One was bitterroot valley (?) 75grain reduced ricochet rounds. The second was PMC bronze 90g FMJ. I had far fewer malfunctions with the PMC, but still had troubling problems with the PMC. I had a bunch of FTF with the BRV ammo, but none with the PMC. Maybe just the ammo there. I had stovepipe problem with both types, but less with the PMC. I had failure to reach battery with both. Maybe that was me limp wristing it? Most troubling was that the gun would occasionally lock the slide, even with rounds left in the mag. I checked the slide pin and it was properly inserted with the arm of the spring on top of the little tab that holds it down.

After the range, I took it down to clean it.

The gun looked like it was chewing up the plastic rails pretty fierce. I suspect it rides on the metal rails, but it was chewing up the plastic parts. I didn't expect so much visible wear after so little use. Is that normal? My springfield 45 XDM looks like new inside after 1000 rounds plus. I also noticed there might be a burr of additional metal on the slide near the notch that is used to lock the slide back. Possibly this is causing the gun to lock back while rounds are still in the mag? I took a few pictures, thoroughly cleaned and lubed the gun. I'm not sure where to go from here, except to solicit advice here and call Khar on Monday. I'm pretty bummed at the moment and don't look forward to sending my gun back to Khar for warranty work. I've done a decent amount of shooting in my life, but this is only the second pistol that I have owned personally, so it's entirely possible I'm making a novice mistake. Any advice is appreciated.

http://www.freedmantire.com/matt/khar/4.jpg

http://www.freedmantire.com/matt/khar/3.jpg

http://www.freedmantire.com/matt/khar/2.jpg

http://www.freedmantire.com/matt/khar/1.jpg

[Bmxovich]

Wow, brand spanking new pistol? Curious what letters the serial number starts with? I've wanted one for a couple of years and just picked one up with a known issue. Failure to return to full battery. I believe a new set of springs will fix it up. I'm sure you'll get some great advice from the fellows on here regarding your 380. I'm just starting to live with mine. But I do know these little things need to be cleaned and lubed often. After 50 rounds it gets pretty filthy in there. So if your gun was brand new and you ran 200 down the pipe without stopping to clean it, I'd expect you to have some issues. It does look chewed up in the pics though, hope not. Anyway, don't get too discouraged, lets see what what the experts have to say.

[wyntrout]

The slide lock spring's screw and washer appear to be really loose and about to fall out! The left side of the spring looks like it took a hit on installing the slide lock pin.

Use a Torx# 5 screwdriver or a flat-bladed jeweler's screwdriver that is small enough to fit the screw and snug it down, but DON'T over tighten it as you could strip the plastic threads in the frame.

http://www.kahrtalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7773&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1361815810

The plastic shavings can be trimmed away. The plastic rails are just guides for installing the slide. It looks like some battering on the left side of the feed ramp, too. The bottom of the slide where the brass cases have left smears could be cleaned and polished a bit. Use a little oil there, too, but none in the striker/spring area... attracts crud and could it could build up and cause light or no primer strikes.

By the way, welcome to the forum and I'll throw in the links and info I try to give new members. Obviously you've seen some of it already, but maybe there's some you might want to see.

Right now, I think the biggest problem is the slide lock screw and the washer are really loose and causing most of your problems. I hope that the threads in the frame are not stripped.

Welcome to the Kahrtalk forum supported by K a h r Arms.
Here are a few essential links and things to do BEFORE you take your new pistol to the range, and ESPECIALLY BEFORE taking it apart and trying to re-assemble it! The Kahr is a different design… 6-7 unique patents cover the Kahrs. I’m not trying to imply that you don’t know anything about guns, but many don’t know anything about the Kahrs and some of the things you can do to damage or cause malfunctions of your new, or new-to-you Kahr pistol.

First, if you don’t have a manual, yet, or one didn’t come with your pistol, you can view it and/or download the pdf file here:
http://www.kahr.com/PDF/kahrmanual.pdf

Please watch one of these videos FIRST! These videos can point out possible problem areas and emphasize correct procedures!
Take down and re-assembly videos:
T, TP, CW, P, & PM/CM Series:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=G2cZgVg_SwA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=G2cZgVg_SwA)
MK series:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...mSCnIOaUk#t=0s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zXmSCnIOaUk#t=0s)
K series:
http://www.kahr.com/Pistols/Kahr-K9-Elite.asp
There are many links on fixing problems listed in several places… under the New Member or Kahr Tech sub-forums.

A very handy one is the Kahr Lubrication Diagram:
http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=14750
Many of your questions can be answered in these areas and you can learn how your Kahr works and not damage it with improper handling.

Another great resource for information on Kahrs... Archives of Magazine and Internet Reviews for Kahr pistols by industry experts. They test these pistols and report on their views and the ammo they tested in it. This is a good way to find ammo that might fit your needs along with accuracy and feeding in the pistol... usually from a rest with velocity and energy, as well as penetration and expansion sometimes... very informational.

http://www.kahr.com/product-reviews.asp

Frequently asked questions: http://www.kahr.com/faq.asp?

One very important bit of advice: Hold the Kahr pistol firmly when firing OR CHAMBERING a round. These compact pistols need all of the force they can get from the slide to get a round into the chamber successfully. If you don't hold the pistol firmly, part of the needed momentum is transferred to MOVING THE PISTOL and the top round will DIVE and jam into the right side of the feed ramp. The weak hand, over hand rack method gives the best grip and a firm rack will give you the best chance at chambering a round.

Use the weak hand fingers over the slide(clear of the ejection port), thumb along the slide and pointing to the rear. Use the gun hand to simultaneously firmly push the gun as you give a vigorous rack with the weak hand and cleanly release the slide as it reaches the rear limit and is "snatched" from the weak hand. This approximates a real rack from firing and beats the slide release method WHEN executed properly. Much more strength can be exerted when this is done closer to the body.

Here's a video on that. The first part is what I'm talking about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=hjLbFOw8sow (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=hjLbFOw8sow)

There are many helpful members here most of the time who might be able to help you, but as anywhere, there are many opinions and not all are correct. Be mindful of this before doing anything drastic to modify your pistol!


Wynn:)
Aka wyntrout

PS: I keep thinking of stuff to add and help new members... and am trying to cover most of the popular subjects. Yes, it's repetitious to many, but possibly not to all new members. This approach is easier than having to look up every tidbit for each new member or question that arises. :)

[boones]

I appreciate the feedback. The gun is brand new, serial number starts with RD02XX, purchased from budsgunshop.com since my local dealers couldn't give me an ETA on when they could get one. The gun was thoroughly cleaned and lubed prior to taking it to the range the first time. Good thing as there were metal shavings and grime inside the gun from the factory. I fired all 200 rounds without stopping to clean it. I alternated ammo between the 2 types. Indoor, hourly range, no ability to stop and clean. I did stop a lot to sight in the laser and to clear all the malfunctions. I had read the manual and studied the takedown video from kahr while I was waiting for the gun to arrive, so I'm confident I performed the takedowns correctly. I just re-read the manual about cleaning and it just says to clean after each shooting session, without defining what a shooting session is limited to. I would expect that 200 rounds is not too much for a modern semi-auto. My only other points of reference are my springfield XMD 45 and rental guns from the range. I definitely had more problems with the BRV ammo and less with the PMC, but both had stovepipes and most troubling the slide locking back on a non empty mag.

Regarding the slide stop spring, it may look loose in that photo, but it's not loose. I'm including a better picture. If I lightly pull on either side, it can't move or turn. I haven't attempted to adjust it in any way, that's how it came from the factory. To ensure it was engaging the slide stop pin correctly, I inserted the slide stop pin without the slide installed. As viewed from above the gun, the horizontal arm of the spring was sitting in the notch and the slide stop was being properly held down. I do notice that the spring alignment on the left side slightly interferes with the insertion of the pin, enough that it takes a good push to get the pin installed. That probably explains the "hit" on the left side of the spring.

As for all the wear to the plastic rails, normal? After 200 rounds, it's still hard to get the slide off the frame, i.e. there is strong resistance and it takes a good pull. It doesn't slide off smoothly. normal?

I did like shooting this gun. I bought extra mags, laser, IWB holster, etc. I'm disappointed with it right now, its one of the more expensive guns in its class and I expected that to translate to quality and reliability. Right now I couldn't trust it, but I'm hoping to change that.

http://www.freedmantire.com/matt/khar/5.jpg

[Bmxovich]

Putting myself in your shoes I see two options,

1. Clean it up, debur it, etc and do what you can based on the advice you get on this forum. These guys are good. You'll probly get it worked out.

2. Send it to Kahr to go over with a fine tooth comb.

I'd do the latter myself having just shelled out good cash for a new pistol. Is the edge of the feed ramp banged up as Wynn pointed out? That would bother me. I've owned 5 Kahrs, and liked all of them but 1. It was a new CM9 that had so many sharp edges on the slide that I thought it was a joke.

200 rounds seems like a lot to me without cleaning these tiny guns. Mine gets pretty dirty after 50 or so of PMC. It can be done, I just think its one more thing to skew your results. 100 maybe for me tops. My wife has an XDM and it'll shoot all day long and not malfunction, just a big pistol with tons of room for error. Flawless.

If it bothers you, send it in, write down in detail what the issues are and what you expect in return. Let them deal with it.

[Flincher]

Heed all the advice from wyntrout. Kahrs aren't the only "pocket rockets" that need TLC at least through a few hundred rounds of hardball. The same issues can be read on other forums (Sig238, RugerLCP, S&W BG380, etc.). And you'll end up with the best pocket .380 on the market. My P380 sizzles. And BTW I've owned both the LCP and the 238.:)

[Bad Cheese]

No offence to the fellas here, they mean well, but I would send it to headquarters and seek the official diagnoses of the excessive wear, if it is a factory defect, Kahr should be the one to do the warranty work, I wouldn't attempt to "fix it" on my own when it is under warranty. The wear on the plastic is not normal IMO.

You have a sharp burr on the edge of the feed ramp for starters.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l133/1eyecrooked/burr_zpsb66232aa.jpg

[wyntrout]

In your first pictures and in # 2, I can see almost all of the spring and the screw seems to be backed all of the way out. Did you push or screw it back in, because your second picture of the SL is quite different and it's not just the angle?

When inserting the SL pin, it's best to not start from complete alignment with the pin hole, but tilt the SL slightly to the right to get past the spring without damaging it, before holding it vertical and pushing it in with your thumb.

As I said, the Kahrs are compact and tight-toleranced with powerful springs to make up for their small size. The P380 is the smallest and still uses the same design, so you have to hold it correctly... firmly, to prevent the pistol from absorbing some of the momentum needed for chambering and ejecting properly. These pistols need cleaning and lubrication for the same reasons, and the P380 more so. It's not uncommon for the P380 to perform flawlessly for 50-60 rounds then develop "malfunctions". Larger pistols have more room and "slop" to keep working with debris and crud that builds up in firing... the small Kahrs don't.

I have an XD45, a Glock 19 and G23C that have NEVER had any malfunctions, but they are big loose guns compared to the Kahrs... and the P380 IS the smallest.

That 75-gr ammo is oddball and suspect to me. For break in, I would use only factory FMJ of quality... as the PMC is. Wait until you have a trouble-free, reliable gun before "testing" ammo other than good reputable FMJ. You want to eliminate the ammo and test the pistol, not test several things at one time. I know that you have to use what you can find these days, but standard 90 or 95 grain FMJ is best for breaking in your P380.

I've broken in two new ones and I can fix just about any of the problems that they had now without sending it in, using free replacement parts from Kahr. That includes burrs and peening buildup on the barrel surfaces. These things happen and most just file, stone, or sand the build up to stop it from interfering with the pistol's operation.

I can't really tell from the one picture of your slide if it's black... DLC. That does present problems if that's a steel burr in the slide lock notch area, but it could be stoned the get rid of any buildup and make those ares smooth.

Your pistol did seem to have a lot more plastic coming off the rails, but that can be cleaned up with a razor knife and fine sandpaper. The slide rides on sturdy steel rails embedded in the polymer frame fore and aft.

I've taken my P380's to the range with 10-12 mags preloaded and not had one problem, but then had FTF's with the second loadings. The P380 just seems to like a clean feed ramp. It's hard, but I've just cleaned that with a paper towel as best I could and pressed on... maybe even adding a tiny bit of decent oil the the ramp with a patch or piece of paper towel... that area is tiny! It gets dirty fast and FTF's can be the result.

Wynn:)

[ScooterS]

I have the P380 that just arrived from Buds last week. S/N is similar, just a "few hundred off" of yours. I shot mine yesterday for the second time. I'm having some slide problems that I attribute (most likely) to the spring, or possibly the slide lock. The lock actually pushes itself out after a few magazines.

I cleaned it and put about 150 rounds through it last week. I cleaned it again and ran another 100 rounds yesterday. I cleaned it this morning. I'm seeing a fair amount of "black" from firing, but nothing like the damage/scarring on yours. I'd be calling them Monday and send it back for sure.

In my case, I used the most excellent instructions here and aligned/tightened the spring this morning. I'll shoot it next weekend. If that doesn't resolve all problems, mine will be going back for tuning as well.

I'm hopeful that a trip to the shop will result in a fair amount of quality control/ checking/testing, that will give me a well-tuned weapon.

I just hope that I don't run out of ammo before I get things working well!

Keep us posted.

[yqtszhj]

Welcome to the forum. I had a CW9 and have a CM9 and CW45. All run well after breakin.

I would say don't worry about the plastic rails, gently smooth any burrs you might see, clean and lube it good again and shoot some more PMC. That's pretty good ammo. Sounds like you're getting through the breakin and with some full strength .380 ammo next range trip you might find that things work out much better. Watch your thumb on the slide release when shooting which may be causing you an issue.

Keep us informed and again Welcome.

[JohnTz]

I just got a p380 RD serial number and it has done awesome since round one. I had great success breaking it in with AE 380 95. Not a single issue. On the SD ammo, it loves 102 Golden Sabre and Critical defense but could not reliably feed Win Ranger T. Mine shows no wear on the plastic rails at all. I cannot understand why yours are so chewed up. I have 750 rounds on mine now and runs flawlessly. I would try some better stronger ammo than that reduced recoil stuff and really hold on to it very tight.

[jocko]

sendaneail to kahr, attn. Jay show him the photo of the barrel with the burrs on the feed ramp. that is not right PERIOD. The rails wear willwork itself out to but again, I think this gun needs to go back to kahr and let them sort it all out. Some here, myself included would take on theproject in house but I wouldnot recommend dong anything here other than letting kahr have a look at it. I have no idea what is causing the b urrs on the feed ramp area even though on the outter portion of the ramp which wold play no part in functioning, it still should not be like that. My feelins are it came out of the box that way.

Email kahr, sned ur good photos, be nice and polite with ur explanation. ..

[Ikeo74]

This (below) is most of your problems. You are shooting reduced power loads with soft bullets to reduce ricochets. Quit using the bitterroot valley 75 grain junk until the gun is fully broke in. Shoot the PMC or equivilent powered ammo and your problems will soon go away. Also put some auto chasis grease on the recoil spring assembly. fill it in between the coils of both springs liberally. You will se a world of difference in performance.


"Put 200 rounds through it and had about 20 malfunctions. I used 2 types of ammo, 100 each, both new. One was bitterroot valley (?) 75grain reduced ricochet rounds. The second was PMC bronze 90g FMJ. I had far fewer malfunctions with the PMC, but still had troubling problems with the PMC. I had a bunch of FTF with the BRV ammo, but none with the PMC"

[bonjorno2]

I've owned a few p380 and have had my share of growing pains... hang in there it will get in tip top shape and will be one of the best cwp's you will ever own!

[boones]

Thanks so much for all the of the feedback, it's been very valuable to me. The warm welcome is appreciated as well.

I'll try to respond to the feedback:

I was careful to use a tight 2 handed grip at all times. That doesn't mean I didn't limp wrist it, just that I was aware of trying not to limp wrist it.


I'll be calling kahr tomorrow. I don't plan to start working on a brand new gun that should work correctly from the factory. I'm a mechanical engineer by education and not shy on mechanical projects, but I'm also not a gunsmith.

As for the 75 grain FMJ ammo, it's what I could get locally, was recommended by my local dealer and meets all the criteria specified in the manual. Caliber and new. There is no mention in the manual of bullet type or weight that I saw. It was $25 a box for $50, so it wasn't cheapo stuff. The manual also suggests firing 100 rounds minimum for any ammo type to determine reliability. I determined my gun doesn't like it and I won't be buying it again. I don't see how the ammo could cause the slide on the gun to lock with rounds still in the mag, chew up the plastic rails, or distort the feed ramp as pointed out. In my mind, those don't seem to be ammo problems. The FTF and FTE's could be. I supplemented the ammo with the PMC which I was able to get at the range. The gun liked that ammo a lot better, but it still had malfunctions. I don't mean to imply that any of your comments regarding ammo are off-base, just that my break-in attempt was "by-the-book" so to speak. I'll incorporate the feedback here in my usage of the firearm. At the end of the day, I really just want a reliable weapon.

As for the 2 pictures of the springs looking different, must be the angle of the photograph. I haven't touched the screw on the spring or tried to adjust it in any way. The first picture was taken midway through the cleaning of the gun after the first 200 rounds, and the second picture was taken hours later after the cleaning was completed.

Surprised no one has mentioned the dog hair in the photo. That's my Labrador's contribution. He's a good dog, but I expect he would be a terrible shot.

[ScooterS]

Sadly, today, what we can shoot is limited to what we can find!

[Cokeman]

"I don't see how the ammo could cause the slide on the gun to lock with rounds still in the mag"

Lock the slide back and put a full mag in the gun and see how close the top bullet is to the slide stop lever. A round with the bullet sticking out too much can hit the slide stop lever as it rises in the mag. A round that has slid forward can also hit it.

[boones]

Wasn't able to get through to kahr. Waited on hold for 20 minutes, then got Jeff. For some reason the call was disconnected after about 2 minutes. I tried to call back, but just got to the hold line again. Kahr didn't call me back. A few hours later when I had the opportunity to call again, I waited on hold for a few mins and then left a voicemail. Hope for a call back soon.

[wyntrout]

Email with pictures has always worked best for me... to Jay:

jay.dandrea@kahr.com

Wynn:)

[phil413tx]

If you email Jay, he will reply within 30 minutes. Much faster way to communicate with Kahr. jay.dandrea@kahr.com

[boones]

Email sent, thanks for the tip. It's almost 4PM here in Colorado, so it's after business hours in NY. I update the thread once I've communicated with Kahr.

[boones]

Heard back from Jay at kahr. He suggested that the wear on the rails and the burr on the ramp were not problematic. He also suggested that the malfunctions were ammo related due to not meeting recommendations. He believed the BRV ammo were reloads, hence not meeting recommendations. I corrected that point as the ammo was factory new, brass cased, American made. Doesn't mean that the BRV ammo is a good match to the gun, just that it meets all recommendations outlined in the manual. He mentioned the PMC is not American made, hence does not meet recommendations. He offered to take the gun back to the factory for inspection, but with a 2-3 week turnaround. I responded with more specific questions, especially on the slide locking back with a non-empty mag and the difficulty of removing the slide for cleaning, but those questions were not addressed in the reply. Instead I got a pleasant reply that I could ship it to them if I wanted to.

Since I've received no recommendations from kahr on resolving my issues, I will be shipping the gun back to kahr for inspection/service. My experience with kahr is sour so far, but every company makes lemons and it's how they deal with those lemons that determines their commitment to their customer. I'll keep the thread updated as it progresses.

[Bmxovich]

Ya not what I'd wanna hear either, but I agree ship it back. Put a detailed letter of everything you want addressed. That feed ramp would bug me. Why so battered looking? Etc etc

[wyntrout]

I hope they look at the slide lock spring and fix anything they find. Maybe they'll give you an extra mag or something, especially if they do find anything defective. Good luck!

PMC is good ammo and I don't use it because I shopped for price and reputable manufacturers from anywhere... lots of "foreign stuff" is made at the Fiocchi plant in Ozark, MO. Brands like Herters, MFS, and others besides Fiocchi. Sometimes you even get the Fiocchi brass in the other brand's boxes.

Wynn:)

[adamog133]

I had issues with my p380 until I put 400 rounds through it, ftfeed, ft eject, etc, would not fire flat nose,...blah blah blah.

After 400 rounds of 95 grain flat, round, hollow, +P ball, etc, it is working flawlessly. I had shavings in it, plastic wearing on the slide, etc until it was broken in. Now it is perfect. I ran it wet for the 1st 400 , cleaned it after each range session, etc.

I polished the feed ramp, cleaned up the burrs , oiled it, dry fired and racked it it about 1000 times to loosen up the springs a bit, .

It has such tight tolerances so the break in period is crucial.

Hang in there.

[boones]

Fedex shows that my pistol was delivered to Kahr on Monday. Here's to hoping it comes back running well and without malfunctions.

[skyranch]

Boones –

I read your original post but didn't have the opportunity to reply to it in a timely manner. I also have a new P380, in my case was a orange plastic magazine, and also a orange addendum ( supplement ) to the take-down process. Did that come with your P380 ? My serial is RC9xxx. The orange magazine ( actually called a disassembly tool ) is inserted between #3 and #4 on the white instructions in the booklet. ie: once the Slide Stop is removed you install the 'tool' ... "pull the trigger and push the slide ONLY UNTIL the edge of the cocking cam back end is visible". Then you REMOVE the tool ... and push the slide forward off the frame
.
It's a moot point now, as you have sent your Kahr back. Hopefully they will fix whatever problem you have experienced.

It was your comment about having to force the slide off that prompted me to respond. Since the orange supplement was not mentioned in the video. Maybe my California model is different ?

Regards,

[boones]

My P380 showed up back at my house today. Just under 2 weeks round trip for the repairs. The return experience went well. Here is what it says on the "Technical Service Work Sheet".

Slide is OK. Replaced Barrel. Reworked Extractor. Deburred Slide Stop Area. Test Fired without Malfunction.


Here's to hoping it's fixed and reliable now. Will report back here when I've had the chance to put another 100 rounds through it.

[rnbtexas]

that sounds promising.

[dsk]

So, have you had a chance to shoot it again yet? Be sure to use plain-jane FMJ ammo and let us know how it went.

[boones]

So, have you had a chance to shoot it again yet? Be sure to use plain-jane FMJ ammo and let us know how it went.

Haven't had an opportunity yet. I've looked for ammo and not found any that Kahr recommends. I can only find the PMC, which is regular FMJ ammo, brass cased, etc but kahr doesn't recommend because it's not US made. The BRV ammo I used before would fall into the recommended category, but my p380 hated it.

I will be sure to report here once I am able to get ammo for it and try again. If I can't find anything else, I'll go with the PMC based on the reports from other users on this forum.

[dsk]

I picked up some S&B, and I couldn't care less if it's "recommended" or not because it's a typical round-nosed FMJ. If I can only use this-or-that brand of ammo it's going to be a problem, especially with the limited availability of most ammo in general. As I indicated earlier I had to wait a few weeks just to be able to even find any .380 ammo on the shelves.

I was going to go shooting today, but I was too late getting out the door so I couldn't get my gear ready in time. Maybe this weekend.

[b4uqzme]

Interesting thread. Thanks for sharing I learned a lot. Personally, I would have inspected, de-burred, polished the feed ramp, cleaned, lubed then shot some more of that PMC. I've had good luck with any factory brass. Steel or aluminum cases are another matter. I suspect your method will work well for you in the long run and I respect your choice not to fiddle with a brand new gun. Really focus on that grip though. It's not enough to keep it tight. You gotta keep as much "hand" on the weapon as possible. Get the fleshy part of your weak hand on the grip and lock your weak hand wrist. Check out the many youtube videos for "thumbs forward grip". I only stress this because ALL of my initial Kahr problems were grip induced. You might need a little more break in but you will love that gun. Best of luck. And thanks for listening to everyone's 2 cents. Add them up and you could probably take your better half to dinner.

[b4uqzme]

One more quick thought. Stay away from that 75 grain stuff. Too weak a round could certainly cause your failure to cycle problems.

Good shootin'

[b4uqzme]

Dsk. I really like that S&B. I had some 9mm and it ran great. Low recoil. Accurate. And cheap (at least by today's standard).

[b4uqzme]

Sorry boones. Last thought I promise. Although I've shot and liked PMC, it is dirty. 200 rounds might be a lot to shoot without a cleaning. This coming from the guy with 700 rounds thru his K40 without a bath. The gun -- not me.

[boones]

Sorry for the delay. I finally got back to the range and fired my P380. It did much better, but it still has a ways to go before I trust it. The range had independence ammo, standard FMJ made in America brass case stuff. They had 4 boxes and would only let me buy 2. I put all 100 rounds through the gun, slowly over the course of an hour, alternating with my .45 springfield.

The gun fired the first 40 rounds flawlessly. I was quite encouraged. I was mostly firing it slowly, loading 1 or 2 rounds in the mag at a time. On about round 40, it had a failure to eject "stovepipe". Maybe me not holding it tightly enough? I finished the box out slowly.

Should I mentioned I burned through about 200 rounds in my springfield .45 XDM? Random reloads of suspect quality. No malfunctions.

For the second box on the P380, with the range getting close to closing time, I burned through the ammo more quickly, loading 6 rounds at a time and firing until empty. Around number 30 of the second box, the slide locked back mid magazine. Hit the slide release and continued normally through the rest of the box.

At this point I have 300 rounds through the gun. On this last trip I had 2 malfunctions out of 100. If it had just been the FTE, I would consider it was me. With the slide locking back, its not good enough for a carry gun. I think I'll try putting another 100 rounds through it and see if it improves to reliable. On the plus side, the first 40 rounds were flawless and for it's intended purpose, it's really the reliability of the first magazine that matters.

Upon disassembly, I found that the gun was not chewing up the rails anymore (khar had mostly trimmed them off). They had replaced the barrel and the feed ramp looks fine. It cycles by hands easier than when new. The trip back to kahr improved the gun dramatically, but not enough. Hopefully by the next 100 rounds it will be fully reliable.

[jocko]

could have the slide locking back maybe been the ol thumb hitting it and u know knowing it. U fired alot of rounds, things happen with such a small ass gun. I think u should now go with a good defense round and test out at least one box, that is hwat u b ought the gun for, . I like corbon powerball if for one reason it feeds like a fmj round.

[boones]

could have the slide locking back maybe been the ol thumb hitting it and u know knowing it. U fired alot of rounds, things happen with such a small ass gun. I think u should now go with a good defense round and test out at least one box, that is hwat u b ought the gun for, . I like corbon powerball if for one reason it feeds like a fmj round.

Yes, it's possible. Unlikely though. I was being very careful with my hold and I don't have large hands. I will put some defense rounds through it. So far, I haven't found any to buy.

[dsk]

Your latest range trip sounds like it went the same way as mine. The pistol runs perfect until it starts getting fouled, plus that $#@& slide stop is too easy to bump accidentally even when you think you're not doing it. I trust mine for EDC now as long as it is squeaky-clean and lubed, but I'd never trust it dirty like I sometimes do with my larger carry guns.

[JohnTz]

Sounds like it is good to go. I agree with jocko go get a couple boxes of defense ammo. BTW, never carry a dirty gun. Why would you not do everything possible to ensure reliability when your life may depend on it.

I think the P380 is simply an awesome canceled carry gun. I am encouraged that you got yours running. I simply love mine.

[dsk]

I normally carry only a clean gun, but there have been times when I fired my EDC at the range and couldn't get a chance to clean it for a week or more, thus requiring that I carry it dirty for a short while. I won't dare do that with the Kahr. But then again last week I fired a squeaky-clean Kel-Tec that used to be one of my carry pistols and it barfed within a mag or two anyway. Keep 'em clean, but test-fire them often as well.

[boones]

Sounds like it is good to go. I agree with jocko go get a couple boxes of defense ammo. BTW, never carry a dirty gun. Why would you not do everything possible to ensure reliability when your life may depend on it.

I think the P380 is simply an awesome canceled carry gun. I am encouraged that you got yours running. I simply love mine.

I have no intention of carrying a dirty gun. I didn't buy it for a range gun, but I do need to practice with it if I expect to be competent. If it's rock solid reliable from clean through the first magazine, it can do what I want. I can only get to the range maybe once a month, so it will be a long time for it to prove itself. It started terrible, got better after factory service, but isn't trustworthy yet.

[kjkens]

Observations. After many rounds I find my P380 does not like flat nosed bullets. Rounded tip or pointed tip ammo seems to give the least problems. For practice I find the Speer Lawman rounds to work best. Hornaday zombie killers with the somewhat pointed tip and colored plastic dot in the middle of the tip also work well. After trying to break my gun in and experiencing frustration I tried the Speer and was able to put many rounds through the gun to get it broke in. I hope this helps.

[yqtszhj]

The range had independence ammo, standard FMJ made in America brass case stuff.

On about round 40, it had a failure to eject "stovepipe". Maybe me not holding it tightly enough? I finished the box out slowly.

Should I mentioned I burned through about 200 rounds in my springfield .45 XDM? Random reloads of suspect quality. No malfunctions.

At this point I have 300 rounds through the gun. On this last trip I had 2 malfunctions out of 100. If it had just been the FTE, I would consider it was me. With the slide locking back, its not good enough for a carry gun.



I have a LCP that DOES NOT like Independence ammo. Fail to extract, fail to eject, I think the stuff is weak in .380. I have never had a problem w/ PMC period in 9mm, .45, and .223. It's good stuff.

I have an XDs and man that thing is sweet. The trigger and fiber optic sights really work for me.

[yqtszhj]

The range had independence ammo, standard FMJ made in America brass case stuff.

On about round 40, it had a failure to eject "stovepipe". Maybe me not holding it tightly enough? I finished the box out slowly.

Should I mentioned I burned through about 200 rounds in my springfield .45 XDM? Random reloads of suspect quality. No malfunctions.

At this point I have 300 rounds through the gun. On this last trip I had 2 malfunctions out of 100. If it had just been the FTE, I would consider it was me. With the slide locking back, its not good enough for a carry gun.



I have a LCP that DOES NOT like Independence ammo. Fail to extract, fail to eject, I think the stuff is weak in .380. I have never had a problem w/ PMC period in 9mm, .45, and .223. It's good stuff.

I have an XDs and man that thing is sweet. The trigger and fiber optic sights really work for me.

Oh, and go with what jocko said. Hang in there too.