PM9 1000 Round Update

[ParabellumJ]

Went to the range yesterday to put the first rounds down range in my new Colt M4. All went well but this is not a range report on the Colt. I also took along my CZ 75B and my PM9. After running through most of the .223 I had brought I decided it was time for the pistols.

I shot the PM9 first, putting 100 rounds of 115 grain wwb, 50 rounds of 115 grain Blazer Brass and 25 rounds of Speer 124 GDHP through it. Somewhere in those 175 rounds I crossed the 1000 round mark for the gun and the results were typical of me shooting the Kahr...not good, at least accuracy wise. All my shots were low, and not just a little low, I mean at 20 feet they were in the bottom of the 7 ring. My buddy shot it as well, and had the same results. We then moved on to the CZ. Given the CZ 75 is DA/SA, I was curious how I could shoot it in DA compared to the PM9. Let me say the DA pull on the CZ is no where near as smooth as the Kahr. But the results were much different, I hit spot on. Same with my buddy, dead nuts. So it got me thinking, why after shooting this gun for 1000 rounds can i not hit close to the bull at self defense ranges?

I shoot my G19 dead nuts, same with my CZ and with the wifes XDm. I am not recoil sensitive and feel I have decent trigger control. So what is it? Google revealed many complaints of people shooting the PM9 (and other Kahrs) consistently low and theories of shooter error to manufacturing error. I have confidence in the gun going bang every time. I should, I carry it most days. So I started at the beginning, the sights. My PM9 came from the factory with 3 dot Meprolite night sights. I thought about the standard bar-dot sights on a kahr, with the "dot the i" sight picture. Of course with 3 dots the front dot should be level with the rears. So I held the gun and aligned my normal three dot sight picture. And guess what? The muzzle is pointed down about 10 degrees. I asked the wife to align the sights "properly" and saw the same results for her, front sight about 10 degrees downward. I then tried the "dot the i" sight picture and...bingo. Slide perfectly level.

I am a little embarrassed to admit that it took me 1000 rounds to discover I was holding with the wrong sight picture. Apparently Kahr applies the same sight picture to the factory night sights, at least that is my theory. Next range trip will either validate my findings or leave me scratching my head again. In considering solutions to the problem the words Glock 26 actually came out of my mouth. I love Glocks, but I also love my PM9 and would hate to part ways with it because I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn.

Anyone have any experience with the factory night sights that could confirm or deny the proper sight picture?

[muggsy]

I don't think that I'd have had the nerve to tell that story. Your one hell of a man. That was a real revelation. I don't know that Dear Abby could have handled that one. You hitting the bull now so that's all that matters. I hope you don't mind a little ribbing. :)

[micotu]

So wait. Do you have the same type sights as mine? this is how I aim with my sights and I don't seem to shoot high or low regularly.

http://i.imgur.com/6wycIfzl.jpg

[ParabellumJ]

So wait. Do you have the same type sights as mine? this is how I aim with my sights and I don't seem to shoot high or low regularly.

I have the exact same sights and aim with the exact same sight picture. Continuously shoot way low. At 20 ft I would have to aim at the top of the 7 ring to hit the bull. Like I said, I thought it was me not knowing the trigger, but after 1000 rounds I know it. I like it. I aint jerking it. I am not hitting low and left, it low and dead center. You can definitely see the slide tilted down when aiming properly.

[wyntrout]

If you could get hold of a LASER boresighter, you can compare sight lineup with that.

There's no "i" to dot with three-dot sights!

Wynn:D

[RRP]

PBJ,

I'm not sure how you can know the barrel is aligned 10 degrees off the point of aim, just by looking at the gun.

If you haven't already done this, shoot the pistol from a sturdy bench rest. Then try shooting it with your left hand, from the bench rest. Is it still impacting low left?

You should do this before you start moving sights.

[ParabellumJ]

I will try shooting it this weekend but the hits are just low, not low left. There is also a very experienced shooter at my range I will have shoot it to compare. I realize I am grasping at straws here but after this many rounds frustration is starting to set it.

[DKD]

Well if all else seems to fail, you can always just replace the front site with a slightly lower one or replace the rear site with a slightly high one.
That will move the point of impact up for your sight alignment / site picture.

[jocko]

or change ur sight picture, like seeing more of the front sight. We have read on this forum of practicly all shooters who have shooting issues as that of shootin low, never high.

An experienedshooter IMO had better be well acquainted with kahrs trigger system to. as most al lutter guns as most know dont't that loooooong travel in them...

[ParabellumJ]

Ok, so I went to the range today, just me and my PM9. I had to know, was it me or the gun. I shot 100 rounds of 115 grain Federal Range & Target. I paid very close attention to my sights and used a proper 3 dot sight picture. However, rather than use a 6 o'clock hold like normal, I used a center sight alignment covering the bull with my front sight post. I also made sure to use good trigger control on each and every shot. Here are my last 15 rounds shot off hand standing at 7 yards.
8298

Conclusion: it was me. The gun does NOT shoot low. Not the best group I have ever put up but it is certainly not way low as before. Only the one flier, and that was high. I guess I was shooting her carelessly before and not concentrating on a good trigger pull. That combined with a 6 o'clock hold led to low hits. My bad. Please forgive me for I have sinned. I shall never doubt my sidekick again.

[RRP]

Nice shootin', today.

[jimsea]

Alright......good to see.