we accepted martial law too easily

[knkali]

I got this from Tinman's post. It is an important read IMHO. We saw how quick the gov can shut us down and strip us of our freedoms in the name of security. It was amazing how quick we were willing to accept it.
http://georgedonnelly.com/libertarian/boston-police-state-failed

[MikeyKahr]

I thought they were going to take away the 2nd Amendment without much of a fight, instead it was the 4th Amendment.

[knkali]

I thought they were going to take away the 2nd Amendment without much of a fight, instead it was the 4th Amendment.

seems that the 4 th was easy the 2nd not so much but still for the taking

[RevRay]

It was a very good read and he said many things I was thinking when I watched the coverage.

[downtownv]

I made a comment on another forum and got slammed for posting "Wasn't it amazing how fast the Government shut down a Major city with no resistance whatsoever" Talk about Sheep....

[getsome]

The video where the Police pounded on the door and marched everyone out of a private residence one by one while screaming at them to keep their hands up was just too much...What if someone said wait a minute I'll be right with you would the Boots have arrested them and if so for what...Looked like a Law Suit in the making to me as Marshall Law had not been declared and the Soldier Cops were way over the top and out of line....

I thought it was hilarious that the guy that actually found perp #2 was a private citizen that was allowed to go out of his home in his backyard for a smoke after the Jack Boots had given the all clear signal....Bet that little bit of intel caused a big OH CHIT moment back at the Storm Trooper command post....:eek:

[knkali]

I made a comment on another forum and got slammed for posting "Wasn't it amazing how fast the Government shut down a Major city with no resistance whatsoever" Talk about Sheep....

what did they say to slam you? I think you are spot on.

[knkali]

The video where the Police pounded on the door and marched everyone out of a private residence one by one while screaming at them to keep their hands up was just too much...What if someone said wait a minute I'll be right with you would the Boots have arrested them and if so for what...Looked like a Law Suit in the making to me as Marshall Law had not been declared and the Soldier Cops were way over the top and out of line....

I thought it was hilarious that the guy that actually found perp #2 was a private citizen that was allowed to go out of his home in his backyard for a smoke after the Jack Boots had given the all clear signal....Bet that little bit of intel caused a big OH CHIT moment back at the Storm Trooper command post....:eek:

I was going to mention that but not sure if I was accurate on my facts. Remember with the NDAA and, to some extent, the Patriot Act, your rights as a US citizen can cease to exist. The NDAA is vague on this issue but can be used to open the door if pushed to allow this sort of thing happening on US soil without any restrictions. Its Bullsheet.

[ripley16]

What did you expect of the people of Boston? Would it have helped the situation if some sunshine patriot had fought the police? Would the punk have been caught faster by ignoring the "stay inside" request?

It seems to me that when gun fights and bombs are going off in my neighborhood streets, I'd prefer the authorities to be active and engaged. Besides... I don't recall martial law being declared.

What solutions and options are you folks offering in lieu of what actually happened. how would you have caught the creep?

When the event was over, the cops left and went home, the bad guys dead or captured and no more citizens harmed. It ended well. Do I see a cause for alarm? Yes, but not directed at the cops. Not this time.

[Chuck54]

I wonder how many citizens told police I'm fine no terrorists here and declined police entry.:amflag:

[Bawanna]

I don't think that was an option.

[Chuck54]

I'm home alone a lot and don't always answer the door:Amflag2:

[downtownv]

what did they say to slam you? I think you are spot on.

PM sent

[Powrstroke6.0]

Damned if you do, and Damned if you don't in this country.

[getsome]

From the video the Police acted more like they were on a raid than a search....If there was a criminal on the loose in my neighborhood I would stay inside and let the Police do their job and if they rang my doorbell and asked nicely if I had seen anything or anybody around that didn't belong I would be happy to help out but if they bust down my door and drag me outside with my hands up and have a snarling dog barking a few feet away while they search through my house without asking, D@mn right I wouldn't like it because it's illegal....

I realize they were looking for a dangerous person but what about when there is a Bank Robbery which happens frequently in my City and say the robber shoots a teller and highjacks a car which also happens, do the Police lock down the city, close the Airport, Amtrack and Subway and call out the State Police, National Guard and start driving down every street in Military Armored trucks with mounted machine guns and start going house to house and forcing the occupants out to the street with their hands up with dogs on their every move? No they don't and what made the punk 19 year old on the run any more dangerous than an armed Bank Robber doing the same thing...

[jwb75]

As far as I have heard, declining was not an option. I think that is the issue with many people. Basic rights to reasonable search may have gone out the window, but I do not remember marshal law actually being declared. Either way, I am not sure it was handled in a very constitutional manner. The concept that supposed extreme situations can trump basic constitutional rights is a problem. I have actually seen one picture taken from a window of a DHS officer pointing an AR at the photographer. I can not speak to the reality of THAT particular instance, but I don't think I would have been all too pleased with that.

[downtownv]

From the video the Police acted more like they were on a raid than a search....If there was a criminal on the loose in my neighborhood I would stay inside and let the Police do their job and if they rang my doorbell and asked nicely if I had seen anything or anybody around that didn't belong I would be happy to help out but if they bust down my door and drag me outside with my hands up and have a snarling dog barking a few feet away while they search through my house without asking, D@mn right I wouldn't like it because it's illegal....

I realize they were looking for a dangerous person but what about when there is a Bank Robbery which happens frequently in my City and say the robber shoots a teller and highjacks a car which also happens, do the Police lock down the city, close the Airport, Amtrack and Subway and call out the State Police, National Guard and start driving down every street in Military Armored trucks with mounted machine guns and start going house to house and forcing the occupants out to the street with their hands up with dogs on their every move? No they don't and what made the punk 19 year old on the run any more dangerous than an armed Bank Robber doing the same thing...

Kinda the way I see it...

[TheTman]

I still think it was a demonstration to all the people talking about armed resistance to gun confiscation and the sorts. Kind of a look what we can do, what are you going to do about it?

[bulletdodger]

I agree that not much could have been done differently by the citizens of Boston. I wonder what the punishment would have been if caught out walking your dog. With all commerce shutting down there wouldn't be much else to do. Seeing videos like this and similar ones from Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans says one thing to me, move out of the city. You'd never see sh!t like this in the country. I think Boston was a failed, overly dramaticized, overpowered mess. I do see validity to the thought that this "crises" was used as a training opportunity. I don't ever remember seeing anything like this in any other similar instance. Doesn't law enforcement usually wait to act upon information? leads? tips? Door to door searches don't really seem that feasible to me in the apprehension of a suspect. Hard to say though. The lockdown served to keep people from congregating in case of another potential bombing. I mean, there could have been more individuals involved waiting to carry out more attacks. It was unknown. I think that most importantly people need to really wake up and remain vigilant all the time. Not in fear, just aware. If I would have seen one of those a$$holes set a bag down and walk away, I would have first, watched to see where they walked off to. If to a nearby hot dog stand then ok, if down the street and around the corner I would have spoke up about it and then cleared away and contacted authorities. The fact is there are a ton of pissed off people being backed into corners and if the US is doing the pushing then the aggression will be directed towards us, however misguided or in their minds warranted retaliation may be. And lets face it, they are outgunned and will resort to bombings like this simply because of limited resources. I think we need more vigilant aware sheepdogs on the streets. As long as we continue to make a mess in other countries we will continue to see more of this I guarantee it. Look at Ireland. Limited resources fighting against a huge government military. Oppressed for hundreds of years by Britain. They fought back with the only means at their disposal. I'm not saying it was right or that I agree with it. I definitely don't agree with bombing of civilians either. I think thats a weak dick move. But if the goal was to affect commerce in a major US city then yeah, I'd say they won that battle. Well, I'm just ranting now. Interesting to think about though.

[apheod]

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/21524508.jpg

[HappyCamper]

I couldn't watch the whole video. It's just...WRONG. I don't really know what the answer is either.
A couple years ago I go pulled over buy a state trooper. I had failed to put my renewal sticker on my plates, not like he was looking for an armed criminal or something but this guy managed to be professional but still treat me like a fellow citizen.
Bang on somebody's door and then treat them like that? We're are supposed to be on the same side here. If I see LOEs out in public, I try to give them friendly greeting, heck of a job I'm sure. Maybe let them know I am on their side.
Like several have said, they don't shut a city down for other crimes. I almost wish I hadn't seen it.

[muggsy]

I don't see this as a normal circumstance. The two guys the police were after weren't common criminals. They were terrorist bombers. They had killed four and wounded 170 people. I don't see the police as an enemy. I support their efforts and try to assist them if possible. The people were asked to stay in their homes for their own protection. I don't think that was too much to ask.

[apheod]

so the constitution is moot during "deadly terrorism incidents?"

i suppose you won't mind when they raid your house and disarm you because a crime was committed somewhere in your general area. it would be for your, and every one else's safety after all, i mean surely you are safer with 5 swat team members in each room of your home as 5 more lead your family out with loaded weapons pointed at your heads than holed up alone, nervously clutching a deadly assault weapon... who knows who you might kill with that thing! they're trained professionals after all, and they're here to safe us all from ourselves.

[downtownv]

I wonder how many citizens told police I'm fine no terrorists here and declined police entry.:amflag:
I'm guessing 0.0..... all shocked and awed!

[ltxi]

Boston was a test case to see if they could get away with it. A trial run.

[ripley16]

Who is they?

[Barth]

We accepted martial law too easily?

When I was in L.A. during the riots and Martial Law was called.
I don't remember having a choice about it.
Dusk to Dawn curfew with National Guard on the streets.
And naturally - banned gun/ammo sales.

It's sobering to see how quickly your rights can be taken.
The feeling of being potentially in harms way.
And nearly helpless to defend myself.
I will never forget.

[apheod]

Who is they?

http://blog.write30.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/germans.jpg

probably a few of these guys. they're practically screaming "SCHNELL, SCHNELL!!!"

2LrbsUVSVl8

B_Gb6i5DF9k

[knkali]

How quick we forget the constitution in troubled times. In WWII many Americans were put in prison and their property taken. No one said ****. Anyone remember that? Seems like we are destined to repeat such disdain for the constitution again with these recent events. Watch out for the slippery slope. Its happening and seems to continue. It happens all the time and we are becoming oblivious to it. First it is DUI check points, which IMHO are unconstitutional, then it is the NADA and the Patriot Act making our personal liberties even more uncertain in the name of security. When the army is outside your front door and demands entry it is too late to resist. You are either going to comply or die. But now that the dust settled, with the aforementioned "Acts" we cannot argue what is acceptable use of force by our government on civilians and was isn't anymore. Our forefathers would bow their heads in disgust with our complacency to relinquish our personal freedoms for the sake of security.

[ltxi]

Who is they?

Us. My agency, actually. I was just trying to dodge that bit.