P380 First range report - no slide lock

[mobidutch]

My wife and I took our new P380s to the range today. We got them for CCW, hers is pink with serial RB4xxx, mine is black with serial RD7xxx.

I cleaned and lubed both guns before we shot them, using the instructions on this site with the handy "lube diagram".

Between the two of us we shot about 175 rounds. The pink P380 performed quite nicely. PMC Bronze is not its best friend, with 3 failures to feed and 2 FTEs. Only one feed failure using American Eagle FMJ, and flawless using PMC Gold Starfire. I think that if we find the right ammo to feed this gun, it will perform very reliably.

My black P380 was another story. At least 7 or 8 feed failures using PMC Bronze, plus a few FTEs. Also a few feed failures using American Eagle, and one with PMC Gold. Disappointing. I guarantee you that I am not limp-wristing this gun.

But most annoyingly, my black P380 refused to lock back the slide on empty magazine. Not once, no matter which ammo. I am not holding my thumb on the slide release lever.

Could I have done something wrong when reassembling the gun with the slide lock nut or spring?

[mobidutch]

Just started cleaning the gun, and looked a little closer at the slide lock spring. Could it have been possible that when I reinserted the slide lock nut, the slide stop spring was BELOW the protrusion on the slide lock nut, instead of resting on top of it? If that happened, would I still have been able to make the slide lock back manually?

[dsk]

Whenever you reassemble a P380 you need to double-check that the slide stop went in correctly and that it has the correct springiness (spring wants to push the SS down, not up). Assuming that is okay then the other possibility may lie with your magazine. Of course if you tried several mags during your shooting session then it's probably not that.

Sorry to hear of your pistol's teething troubles, but unfortunately it seems these pistols typically cough and choke a lot during the initial break-in. Make sure there aren't any machining burrs sticking up anywhere and that the pistol has been thoroughly cleaned and well lubricated. These are fabulous pistols when they work, but I agree it can be frustrating when they don't. BTW I'm surprised your wife's pistol liked the PMC Starfire ammo. Mine absolutely hated them.

[mobidutch]

Thanks for the reply. Just cleaned both guns this morning, and made sure the spring is in the correct position (pushing the lever down). So I'll just have to do some more shooting to see if there's any difference. At least I was glad to see the slide did not chew up the polymer like I have seen on some posted pictures.

Yes, the PMC Starfire fed well in both guns. I'll probably finish the second box I have next time, and then try a box of Hornady Critical Defense FTX. If those feed and eject correctly, I'll use those expensive little suckers for my carry rounds.

[jocko]

My 21 cents. : the slide willnot chew up the polymer rails like weso often seee. The slide will indeed wear down any high spots on thepolymer rails, =but it doesn't chew them up. mOST CHEW MARKS ARE JUST IMPROPER RE-
INSALLING OF THE SLIDE. aLL THE POLYMER RAILS DO IS SERVE AS A guide TO INSTALL THE SLID EON CORRECTLY AND IT SEEMS THAT some do force the slide on at an angle that will indeed produce chew looking marks. If u slide has slivers when new, just leave it alone andlet the slide take care of those high parts of the polymer, or u can take some 600 grip paper and just smooththem down. Normally after a couple hundred rounds the polymer guide rails no longer even make any contack witht he slide during cycling action, which is the way it is designed to work.

If u seen my PMJ9 slide with over 32K rounds thorugh it and probably being off the frame atleat 300 times, there is not one sliver, or chew mark on those rails, because I was"careful" not careless. Thechew makrs that many make will cause no harm or function issue, but to the owner might look like sh!t..

[mobidutch]

Shot another 150 rounds today. This time it locked back the slide on empty mag perhaps 50% of the time. Seems to do better on more powerful rounds, I guess that makes sense. But not consistent at all.

What really annoys me though is the many many failures to feed. Starting with slide locked back and feeding it a full mag, then releasing the slide stop, it would jam many times. I made sure to slap that magazine in place nice and tight. Also gave me many feed issues on 2nd and 3rd round, no matter the ammo. Tried round nosed PFC Blazer Brass, PFC Striker HP, and Hornady Critical Defense. They all have feed issues, on both my magazines?

Is this normal??

[muggsy]

If the slide locks back manually, but not when you are shooting, I can almost guarantee that you are limp wristing the gun. If the slide locks back manually, but not when you are shooting it's because the slide isn't traveling back fully. That would also account for the miss feeds. Sorry bro, but sometimes the truth hurts.

[dsk]

Whenever limpwristing is suspected you'll always want somebody else to shoot the gun just to be absolutely sure it's not just you. These pistols are very sensitive to the way they're held, how clean they are, and what ammo is used. Unfortunately it's not just the Kahrs, but most other tiny pocket .32/.380s as well.

[mobidutch]

If the slide locks back manually, but not when you are shooting, I can almost guarantee that you are limp wristing the gun. If the slide locks back manually, but not when you are shooting it's because the slide isn't traveling back fully. That would also account for the miss feeds. Sorry bro, but sometimes the truth hurts.

I appreciate your reply, but I guarantee you that I am not limp wristing. My wrist is completely immobile when I shoot. To back that up, I am not having any slide lock issues when I shoot my wife's P380. Plus, compared to some other guns I shoot, the recoil of the P380 is medium at worst. And the P380 are very easy to grip, so no issues there either. Limp wristing is not the issue.

[jocko]

Shot another 150 rounds today. This time it locked back the slide on empty mag perhaps 50% of the time. Seems to do better on more powerful rounds, I guess that makes sense. But not consistent at all.

What really annoys me though is the many many failures to feed. Starting with slide locked back and feeding it a full mag, then releasing the slide stop, it would jam many times. I made sure to slap that magazine in place nice and tight. Also gave me many feed issues on 2nd and 3rd round, no matter the ammo. Tried round nosed PFC Blazer Brass, PFC Striker HP, and Hornady Critical Defense. They all have feed issues, on both my magazines?

Is this normal??

It isnever normal when a gun doesn't function PERIOD. I would let anutter good shooter try ur gun, if he can duplicate the issues, then give kahr a call, or write kahr, attn: Jay , state ur case and what you have done up to the point of the phone call or email. We can only giv eu opinions here, so take them with the attitude that we are tryiing to help. Nodoubt shooter error many times is the culprit. U can eliminate that or pin point it by letting anutter shooter shoot the gun. Doesn't matter what one does with another gun etc.

My bet, it sound slike it might need a trip back tokahr, but u need to eliminate the possabilities before wasting yourtime and kahrs. The little P380 is the best out there WHEN IT WORKS AS DESIGNED, but they also tend to be more problemantic than the entire kahr line of guns and IMO I attribute that to the over all small size of the gun.

Have u read the kahr tech section ahd some of the good sticky's posted there to let you know of some thigs to check to eliminate a possability?? Hell we have seen mag springs in backward from the factory. Most never check to see, but it takes a minute to check and therefore u eliminate that possability. Sometimes a new set of recoil springs solves issues that we think are not even related to the recoil springs, but in any semi auto, IT IS ALL ABOUT PERFECT TIMING. I am sure if u ask kahr will send u a new setto try out NC. My opinion is to eliminate all the things that YOU YOURSE3LF can do in house and if all fails, then indeed call or write kahr. They will make it right:Amflag2:

There is no disgrace in having to send a gun back to get right. Just sayin

[newCW45guy]

Did you swap magazines between them?

If you didn't, check that the mag spring is installed correctly.

[mobidutch]

I think the magazine spring was NOT installed correctly, as far as I can tell. It was installed as depicted in the documentation on Kahr's site, like in the parts diagram here (http://www.kahr.com/PDF/P380_PartsList.pdf), where it shows the lowest portion of the spring sticking out the magazine. With the spring installed that way, the "highest point" of the spring rests against the "lowest point" of the magazine follower.

It seems to me this a) could cause nosedives while feeding bullets and b) would not push the little notch in the magazine follower up high enough to engage the slide stop in time.

My wife's P380 had the springs reversed, which seems more logical. I have reversed the springs in mine as well, and will test again at my earliest opportunity. If it still does not lock back, I'll try the mag from my wife's P380, just to rule out issues with the little metal notch in the follower.

I'll report back here. Thanks for the suggestions!

[jocko]

if u lay the sringon the table, the top highest portio nof the spring tip?anglegoes towards the front of thefollower.U canreverse thesrings and use the other end and it makes no different, just keep the top angle towardsthefront of the follower.

there is a good photo on this forum "somewhere" showing proper angle.

[JFootin]

That diagram looks correct to me, though you cannot see the top end of the spring. But what you are saying is correct; the top end of the spring should be oriented so that it supports the front of the follower.

[glock813]

I have a black P380 with a RB**** serial number. I too had the same problems as you described. I called them and they were excellent about repairing it. They even paid for the shipping for me to send it back. They ultimately replaced the extractor, recoil spring, ejector, cocking cam, both magazines, striker block and they polished the feed ramp! Worked like a champ when I got it back. No issues at all now...

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

[mobidutch]

OK thx. I'll probably make it to the range again sometime this weekend. Will post an update.

[Engineer88]

Let us know how it goes!

[mobidutch]

Shot another 100 rounds with my P380 last night. Perhaps a slight improvement, but things are still too unreliable for my taste. Still getting at least 1 failure to feed on every 2 mags, and with at least 1 (random) out of 3 mags no slide lock back. Also tried swapping in my wife's mags, but getting same result. Her P380 performs better. On hers I get perhaps 1 failure to feed every 8 mags, and no issues with slide lock back.

I suppose I could swap slides between the P380s to continue testing, but the best I could accomplish with that is pinpoint the issue towards slide or frame, at the expense of quite a few more rounds.

So I contacted Jay at Kahr, and I'll be sending my P380 in for inspection today. Will post results here again in a few weeks.

[mobidutch]

Sent my P380 in last Monday, and got it back today, exactly one week later. That was a nice and quick turnaround. Definite thumbs up for Kahr on that!

The work sheet states that the recoil springs and the extractor spring were replaced. In a way I'm 'glad' to see that Kahr deemed it necessary to replace parts. I'll probably take it to the range coming weekend. Fingers crossed...

[DKD]

In light of what JOCKO just said, I would definately recommend that you also get the sticky from this sight that gives a detailed picture & explanation of how to modify the magazines follower. I have done this on one a way back when all three magazines wouldn't feed the first few rounds on a preferred hollow point load. The bullets wouldn't load via the slide stop or hand racking method and would lock up on the feed ramp jamming the action badly.
The fix was fast and easy and now functions perfectly regardless of slide stop loading or hand racking.

[mobidutch]

Ok thx for the tip!

[mobidutch]

Shot another 100 rounds through both P380s today. My wife's P380 had zero issues. No failures to feed, no stovepipes, and slide locked back on empty every time.

My P380 still has issues. Had one FTF, two stovepipes, and out of the 16 mag loads, I had the slide lock back on empty only 4 times. I guess I'll contact Jay again. I'm a little disappointed.