View Full Version : God Help me if I don't agree with Putin
Tinman507
09-12-2013, 05:07 AM
This is a MUST read.
The man makes sense.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/opinion/putin-plea-for-caution-from-russia-on-syria.html?src=me&ref=general
downtownv
09-12-2013, 05:34 AM
More sense than our fearless leader......
Barth
09-12-2013, 05:40 AM
More sense than our fearless leader......
Everyone makes more sense than our brainless leader.
Except for, of course, his right hand man - Shotgun Joe Biden.
http://www.frugal-cafe.com/public_html/frugal-blog/frugal-cafe-blogzone/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/lmaobama-joe-biden-diary-made-ass-myself-political-humor.jpg
RevRay
09-12-2013, 09:15 AM
It was a very well-written article, that's for sure.
garyb
09-12-2013, 09:28 AM
This is a MUST read.
The man makes sense.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/opinion/putin-plea-for-caution-from-russia-on-syria.html?src=me&ref=general
Well written. Good sense. From the onset of this Syrian gas issue, I have wondered if Ovomit had it right or not.
downtownv
09-12-2013, 09:37 AM
I want to know when and where the nobel peace prize winner grew a pair of lil hawk wings! :D
muggsy
09-12-2013, 10:42 AM
The Russians murdered 20 million of their own people. They oppressed the people of Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Estonia, Georgia, Kazakhstan, Latvia, Moldova, Poland Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan, How soon we forget.
knkali
09-12-2013, 10:59 AM
The Russians murdered 20 million of their own people. They oppressed the people of Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Estonia, Georgia, kazakhstan, Latvia Muldova, Poland Tajikistan, Turmanistan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan, How soon we forget.
The article lost me when in the first two paragraphs it was speaking the virtues of the UN.
Thanks Muggs for your succinct review of history. It is accurate and means you better watch your 6 when dealing with Putin (who has a dubious past)
muggsy
09-12-2013, 11:12 AM
The article lost me when in the first two paragraphs it was speaking the virtues of the UN.
Thanks Muggs for your succinct review of history. It is accurate and means you better watch your 6 when dealing with Putin (who has a dubious past)
Not to mention Poland and Czechoslovakia. My error. The next thing you know the members of this forum will be endorsing the UN Arms Treaty. :)
getsome
09-12-2013, 11:46 AM
My worry is this, Putin absolutely despises Obummer and wouldn't pi$$ on him to put him out if was on fire but suddenly Putin is all warm and friendly and helped Ovomit out of a real jam on the "Oh chit did I really say a red line" deal so I have to wonder what exactly did Barry have to offer Putin in U.S. nuclear weapon concessions, money, gold, the White House, a BJ or all the above in order for brother man Vladimir to decide to help BarryO out and save the day in Syria....Maybe Putin is just misunderstood and is really a nice guy after all!!!....Naaaaaaaaa
RevRay
09-12-2013, 11:47 AM
It was a very well-written article, that's for sure.
I endorsed nothing ... I just it was a well-written article.
JohnR
09-12-2013, 12:38 PM
The UN praise turned me off, too. While I admire Putin's self-confident no-BS approach, we must not mistake confidence for veracity. I still don't trust him. His KGB career was spent finely honing his lying and propaganda skills.
knkali
09-12-2013, 12:45 PM
Not to mention Poland and Czechoslovakia. My error. The next thing you know the members of this forum will be endorsing the UN Arms Treaty. :)
Or The Purge by Stalin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Purge
I'm wondering if Vladimir Farting actually wrote that. There is so much BS on the internet it's impossible to know for sure.
JohnR
09-12-2013, 03:37 PM
I'm wondering if Vladimir Farting actually wrote that. There is so much BS on the internet it's impossible to know for sure.
That was my first thought.
Tinman507
09-12-2013, 03:42 PM
Not to mention Poland and Czechoslovakia. My error. The next thing you know the members of this forum will be endorsing the UN Arms Treaty. :)
No endorsement here either. But you gotta admit, taken on it's own merits aside from Putin's past history, he makes a compelling case. Yeah, he can't be trusted but neither can our Dear Leader.
xsailer
09-12-2013, 03:55 PM
I don't think he wrote it either. Considering he's as arrogant as O there weren't enough "me"s or "I"'s or "I'm your Commander in Chief'S in the article to convince me.
Bawanna
09-12-2013, 03:58 PM
I'm with Tinman though. Regardless who wrote it, the arrogant ones should read it and try to grasp it. I doubt they have the capacity but they should give it a good effort.
SGT5711
09-12-2013, 06:37 PM
Obama has made a mess of this situation in almost every possible way. I don't trust Putin at all. I don't buy what he's selling either about the UN and international law. Did he seek UN Security Council approval a few years ago when they invaded Georgia?
I am slightly torn on this whole situation though now. I am tired of making the same historical mistakes and arming or assisting people who hate us, which we will only have to fight again later. However, I also feel the right move is probably exactly opposite of what the Russians want us to do. Putin definitely doesn't have our best interests at heart.
mr surveyor
09-12-2013, 06:55 PM
I think that the only reason the Russians are so tightly tied to Syria has to do with preventing Arab oil from flowing directly to the Europeans and the Russians losing their only means of export profits. From what I've read recently, Syria is the last roadblock preventing a major pipeline of Arab oil from flowing into Europe. That may explain why the French were willing to side with "thu wun" on spanking Syria, and why the Saudis were willing to assist in the "finance" of a strike on Syria.
Who knows, it may turn out that the powers that be have been orchestrating this for several years trying to do whatever it takes (like covert arms movement to Syrian "rebels" via Bengazie) to shift the flow of oil from Russia to Europe to a system of Saudi Arabia, et al, to Europe.
We could easily upset the entire economic dynamics of that entire part of the globe just by focusing on our own massive oil reserves and becoming totally petro-independent. Too many of our politicians spend too much of our time, money, resources and blood trying to micro-manage the rest of the world.
jocko
09-12-2013, 07:46 PM
probably right surv. the sade thing is we don';t need imported oil if our ******** POTUS would get off his ass. Hell the fokking Saudie's hate us to, they only appease us do to our protecting their asses and Oil. theycertaily give us no breaks.
Putin IO madeour POTUS look weak as a 2 legged pig.
I endorsed nothing ... I just it was a well-written article.
x2....Despite the "flaws" or whatever it made more sense of the situation than our leader....who's put himself and almost our country in a no-win box doing save face with his red-line crap.
JohnR
09-13-2013, 07:55 AM
If it's about oil, so what? There's not one damn thing wrong with that. Fight for it! But why make it secret? There's no reason to pretend it's about other BS when we all know how important oil is. We all use it, we all need it, what's the problem?
If it's about oil, then one day the history books will call the last 40 years "The Oil Wars."
b4uqzme
09-13-2013, 09:12 AM
It was a very well-written article, that's for sure.
Yes it is...but I don't trust him (Putin) as far as I can throw him.
TheTman
09-13-2013, 09:50 AM
Well, whether you trust him or like him, at least Russia has a MAN for a leader, not a lost little boy in over his head that tells lies and cover ups anything he doesn't want to deal with. In another letter, Putin said that Assad is a son of a *****, but he is Their son of a *****, and they will support him.
So, do we want to start WWIII over two groups of animals fighting? I don't think so. Nothing we've done over there has worked out well. Any changes we've made will be undone as soon as we leave. I certainly can't support a group that randomly massacres Christian villages, which have been left alone by the current regime. Probably all the more reason Obama wants to support the Rebels, kill all the Christians while you're at it. Yes the Soviet Union killed 20 million or more of it's own citizens, mostly under Stalin, and has warred with neighboring countries recently, but we are not spotless ourselves. How many Native Americans did we kill or cause to die? How many Banana republics have we manipulated?
Armybrat
09-13-2013, 09:58 AM
Putin has absolutely schooled this administration and is laughing at Kerry's severe foot-in-mouth gaffe.
This is where O's "leading from behind" community organizing has gotten us.
Weak, weak, weak.
In the meantime, between guffawing at Obama, Putin is ramping up the missile sales to Iran and pledging to help the crazed mullahs to build their nukes.
downtownv
09-13-2013, 03:09 PM
Russian President Vladimir Putin recently published an op-ed on the Syria situation where he claimed America wasn't exceptional.
I could not disagree more and wanted to use this opportunity to take him to task.
You see, American exceptionalism is rooted in our values and principles.
Our country recognizes that our rights are granted by our Creator and guaranteed by our Constitution.
And America is the shining city on hill that has sacrificed and bled for freedom and human rights around the globe for over 200 years.
So in short: President Putin is dead wrong.
I hope you'll take a few moments to read my op-ed below and share it with your friends and family.
In Liberty,
Senator Rand Paul
P.S. After you read my op-ed, please chip in a contribution so I can continue to lead the battle for liberty in the United State Senate.
Paul: President Putin, America Is Exceptional
A recent op-ed by Russian President Vladimir Putin has prompted me to respond. While his position that the Syrian conflict can and should be settled through a political and diplomatic solution is correct, virtually everything else in his writing should be taken to task. So I shall.
I begin with Mr. Putin’s disagreement regarding the exceptionalism of the United States of America. I could not more strongly disagree with him. While he is correct that God created every human being as an equal in His eyes, clearly the results of each of our efforts on this earth, individually and collectively, are not equal.
America’s exceptionalism is rooted in our founding documents and values. From the rights granted by our creator, but guaranteed by our Constitution. We should not shy away from saying so, especially when our actions are in keeping with this exceptional founding, as they were this week in our debate over going to war in Syria. Our constitutional checks and balances were on full display, largely resulting in the at least temporary halting of a rush to war.
Mr. Putin’s second mistake is to focus on the speck in the eye of the United States, while ignoring the plank in his own. He accuses the United States of alarming interventions in foreign countries. While I certainly have my bone to pick with our foreign policy over the last 15 years, the Russian President is the least qualified person I can think of to make this argument with a straight face.
We went to war in Afghanistan because they were harboring those who attacked us on 9/11. Mr. Putin’s cohorts went to war there three decades earlier for no legitimate reason.
The United States until now has resisted arming one side of the Syrian civil war – all the while the other side has been armed by Russia.
The United States has used diplomatic pressure to attempt to resolve the ongoing situation with Iran – Russia has just announced a large arms sale that will escalate tensions in the region.
Being lectured to on foreign intervention by Mr. Putin would be comical if it weren’t such a serious example of a lack of self-awareness.
Nevertheless here we are. Sometimes the enemy of my enemy is my friend, or at least my temporary ally. As Mr. Putin correctly pointed out, the United States and Russia banded together to defeat the menace of the Nazis a generation ago. And both countries certainly face real and present threats from Islamic extremists, both at home and in areas of strategic importance.
American should not act militarily in Syria because it cannot and should not join the same side as Al Qaeda. Russia cannot and should not continue to support militarily the brutal Assad regime.
And so, the dialogue that began this week must go forward, and it must be given a chance to succeed.
The issue of course, is with the participants and the details of the plan. Asking us to “trust them” is clearly not a palatable option, and we cannot act naively simply to bypass war. Any diplomatic solution must involve a clear plan to rid Syria of these weapons, with strong verification and enforcement mechanisms. As Reagan used to put it, Trust but Verify.
So while I welcome the engagement of the Russians, and the dialogue Mr. Putin this week attempted to begin with our country, I remain to be convinced of the details.
And I respond to him directly with the statement that yes, American is indeed exceptional. Our history has proved it so. While we all share the same Creator, we do not all share the same richness of history regarding human rights, freedom and democracy. There has been in the past 200 years a city on the hill that has shone brighter than all others. We will not be ashamed of that. May God allow us to continue to model this example to the world in these difficult times.
muggsy
09-14-2013, 07:10 AM
To those of you who are charmed by Putin, need I remind you that Eve was tempted by a snake, too. And look where that got us.
downtownv
09-14-2013, 08:25 AM
To those of you who are charmed by Putin, need I remind you that Eve was tempted by a snake, too. And look where that got us.
I'll never be charmed by an avowed Commie (that was Pure KGB.)
The fact that he looks like a hero in the eyes of the world and the view of Our country, as a result of this Jackazz and the rest of his admin, is the joke of the world. So they try to spin it like it was his incredibly small threat of an attck that made this thing resolve itself!:puke:
Israel has successfully realized that Barry "ain't got your back"
Armybrat
09-14-2013, 10:52 AM
I'll never be charmed by an avowed Commie (that was Pure KGB.)
The fact that he looks like a hero in the eyes of the world and the view of Our country, as a result of this Jackazz and the rest of his admin, is the joke of the world. So they try to spin it like it was his incredibly small threat of an attck that made this thing resolve itself!:puke:
Israel has successfully realized that Barry "ain't got your back"
Nailed it right on the head.
This administration is a bad joke.
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