Classes/seminars for CC responsibility

[Allen]

We go to a class when initially applying for a CCW permit, which concentrates on the applicants ability to use the gun, but has anyone ever seen a class or seminar to instruct carriers about the responsibility and repercussions when actually using the weapon?

I've never seen such advertised any place but thought about giving our local LE department a call to see what they might offer.

After reading about several recent home breakins and the couple being robbed while shopping at a Mall in Oklahoma City it got me to thinking just what all would happen once that trigger is pulled. Reading about what Zimmerman and the pharmisist who shot the person who was attempting to rob his store at gun point went through gets really scary. And the race of the victim seems to always enter into the equation.

[Tinman507]

Either of the NRA Basics of Personal Protection Inside the Home or Outside the Home focus on the legal responsibilities and ramifications heavily.

Check those out.

[AIRret]

Massad Ayoob's Mag 40 covers it EXTREMELY well and he offers classes in several areas.

[getsome]

Massad Ayoob is a retired Police Detective, firearms instructor and expert witness in self defense by firearms court cases for both civilians and Police Officers....He has written many books on the subject of self defense with a firearm and is a well known authority on the subject....His book "In the Gravest Extreme" is the Holy Grail for anyone interested in CCW....Like AIRret mentioned anything by Massad Ayoob comes highly recommend and he tells it like it is in real life....

[RRP]

Excellent advice, above. Let me add a few resources and suggestions.

1. Get the DVD entitled Judicious Use of Deadly Force by Ayoob. You can find it here. (http://www.gunlaws.com/videos.htm) This is the best 30 bucks you can spend on the subject. Watch the video a few times and you will know more about this topic than most people.

2. You can find the NRA courses mentioned above at this site (http://nrainstructors.org/searchcourse.aspx). Simply select the course(s) you want, then scroll below to enter your zip code and distance you're willing to travel. There are fewer offerings during the holiday season, but things will pick up again in Jan/Feb.

3. MAG-40 has been mentioned. This is a full immersion, 40 hour course on the subject. Ayoob travels around the country teaching this class. You can find his website, here (http://massadayoobgroup.com/). It looks like he is just beginning to build his calendar for 2014.

4. This website (http://www.useofforce.us/) provides a very basic primer on the use of deadly force. It's a great place to start to be introduced to the basics.

Congratulations on your desire to want to learn more about this subject.

[xsailer]

In our CC class and two follow on classes much discussion was had on repercussions from using force to protect ourselves (guns). Not as much as maybe needed but certainly enough to scare the poop out you.

[berettabone]

The class I took was 8 hours, six of it being the ramifications and laws concerning carry....................................

[Allen]

RRP - Really found your link in #4 to be very informative for a lot of initial instructions, and also very scary. I didn't realize you must almost have to be shot at before using deadly force in order to prove you feared for your life.

Since we eat out in fast food restaurants, where robberies seem to take place often, I've often wondered what I'd do if someone came in waving a gun and demanding the clerk to empty the cash register. At that point you don't know someone might get hurt, only property (the cash) is being taken, and that doesn't warrant the use of deadly force, from what I understand from reading the #4 link.

I never realized that if you looked out your home window and several thugs were taking your vehicle apart, all you can do is call the police. If you run out to stop them you might get knocked to the ground but that still doesn't allow you to shoot them.

According to the news the couple in OKC who was robbed in the Mall parking lot at 2:00 AM was aware they were being approached but didn't realize the situation until a gun was pulled. Then the BGs said they wanted all their packages, money, phones, and keys to the car then drove away in the car. The victim said he was applying for a CC permit the next day but from what I heard on TV I'm not sure he would have had the chance to use a weapon, or the legal right to use it since only his property was taken and no one was hurt.

No wonder the BGs will jump out of their car and run when the police are after them since they can't be shot for running. Most policemen are probably a little out of condition to run the mile in 4 minutes and the BGs know this so why hang around and get arrested. I certainly sypathasize with the police and the jobs they have to do.

I now realize how much more I have to read and study before I continue to carry.

[RRP]

RRP - Really found your link in #4 to be very informative...

I'm pleased the information was helpful to you.



I didn't realize you must almost have to be shot at before using deadly force in order to prove you feared for your life.


I'm confident you know one does not have to wait to be fired upon to meet AOJ(P), but I understand your point. Establishing an affirmative defense for the use of deadly force is much more complicated than most people know.




I now realize how much more I have to read and study before I continue to carry.

Carrying a loaded firearm comes with tremendous responsibility. You obviously take that responsibility seriously.

[AIRret]

Allen, the responsibility is huge!!

I think most of us went through the thought process that you are going through now, and we each have to decide what we can live with.

I know that shooting someone is the second last thing I ever want to do. The last thing
would be to watch a loved one murdered, raped, kidnapped etc. nor could I live with myself if a crazy person was standing there picking people off one at a time.
What I can live with is looking out my living room window and seeing my truck stolen.
The truck can be replaced……I'll just call the cops.

[TheTman]

Appropriate use of deadly force was covered very well in my CC class.

[Bob T]

Just completed the 16 hour course here in IL, and the third 4 hour module was devoted to the legal issues surrounding CCW.

It was enough to make everyone in the class reevaluate our reasons to carry...

[ltxi]

Allen, the responsibility is huge!!

I think most of us went through the thought process that you are going through now, and we each have to decide what we can live with.

I know that shooting someone is the second last thing I ever want to do. The last thing
would be to watch a loved one murdered, raped, kidnapped etc. nor could I live with myself if a crazy person was standing there picking people off one at a time.
What I can live with is looking out my living room window and seeing my truck stolen.
The truck can be replaced……I'll just call the cops.

Ahhh....I've always rather enjoyed it...appropriately applied. Seriously.