Brand new pistol will not fire

[Marshalljman]

I purchased a pm9 two days ago and finally had a chance to take it to the range today. This is a brand new pistol and would not fire with any ammo. Every pull of the trigger resulted in no bang. The staff at the store inspected the gun and couldn't readily find the problem so they have shipped to Worcester to be repaired by Kahr. My question is, can I expect this "lemon" to ever be reliable even if repaired?

I hope Kahr will make this right for me because otherwise I am losing money if I have to sell it back to my dealer and peace of mind if I am stuck with a gun that was this detrimentally unreliable straight out of the box.

[JERRY]

if they field stripped the gun and ensured the firing pin/striker moved properly and protruded properly I don't know what it could be.


what did the gunshop tell you?

[Bawanna]

Nothing to worry about. Kahr will take care of it. Start over, shoot it a bunch and the reliability and trust will be there.

We got nothing to help diagnose it. Apparently no strike from the striker, so it was short or broken or not installed correctly at the factory.

Just a wild guess.

[b4uqzme]

Sure. They'll fix it and it will be fine.

Happy New Year. Welcome.

[bandrich]

For sure Kahr will take care of it. I had an issue with slide stick back over a year ago. Kahr paid for shipping and I had it back in three weeks. Flawless since. My EDC for the most part. No worry needed IMHO.

[FLBri]

Nothing to worry about. Kahr will take care of it. Start over, shoot it a bunch and the reliability and trust will be there.

We got nothing to help diagnose it. Apparently no strike from the striker, so it was short or broken or not installed correctly at the factory.

Just a wild guess.


Or even missing! Or the striker block hanging up! or a bad cocking cam not releasing the striker block!

It's a mechanical machine with definable mechanisms. Something is at the cause and they will find it and fix it. None of it is voodoo or magic. When it is fixed, it will work, and you can trust it without hesitation.

[muggsy]

Did you or the gun shop disassemble, clean, and lube the gun before you fired it as you were instructed to do in the owners manual? Whether you did, or didn't, therein probably lies the problem. If it wasn't cleaned and lubed, shame on you or the LGS. If it was cleaned and lubed, but not properly reassembled shame again. If the gun was damaged between the time it left the factory and when you bought it Kahr will make it right at no cost to you. The gun went bang before it left the factory or it wouldn't have left. Kahr stands behind its products.

[garyb]

Obviously this will get fixed, so no need to worry. However, I can't imagine pulling a gun like this out of the box and shooting it before it gets cleaned up and properly lubed. Many new guns are gunked with junk and need to be cleaned up properly before first use, or you can expect problems. I would hope your dealer did this as Muggsy suggested and if not, hopefully it is a lesson learned. Just sayin. Best of luck with it when it returns.

[southern thunder]

All will be OK.

[zamboni]

I'm sorry for the possibly very dumb question, but you just never know... Did you chamber a round before pulling the trigger?

[Marshalljman]

Thanks for the reassurance guys. It just makes me nervous that there could be more things wrong with the gun than I know about and that it could be a compounding issue.

To answer some questions, yes the gun was properly cleaned, lubed and reassembled as expressly instructed in the owners manual. And yes, I chambered a round before I attempted to shoot the gun....lol. I am not an expert but I am guessing that there is something wrong with the trigger system or striker. When I would dry fire the pistol there was a delay in the click from when I pulled the trigger all the way back...perhaps a second or two. However, there was no click or bang when a round was chambered, the trigger felt dead.

[turn signal]

I'm sorry for the possibly very dumb question, but you just never know... Did you chamber a round before pulling the trigger?


:rolleyes:

[340pd]

As big a pain as it seems to be, send it in. Kahr will go over the entire gun and you will forget about this issue a few minutes after you come back from your first range outing.

[muggsy]

You new gun came with a spent cartridge case. That cartridge was fired from your gun, so it worked when it left the factory. It will work again when it comes back from the factory. That you can count on. Let us know what the service department does to correct the problem.

[JimC]

As big a pain as it seems to be, send it in. Kahr will go over the entire gun and you will forget about this issue a few minutes after you come back from your first range outing.

No you won't, it will linger in the back of your mind. You will wonder if it's going to happen when you need your pistol the most. ;)

[JimC]

You new gun came with a spent cartridge case. That cartridge was fired from your gun, so it worked when it left the factory. It will work again when it comes back from the factory. That you can count on. Let us know what the service department does to correct the problem.

In my experience w/Kahr CS (PM9 back twice), they didn't give much of an explanation...:(

[Rubb]

I've sent guns back to 4 different manufactures, Kahr not being one of them.
All 4 came back flawless...don't sweat it...it happens.

[Marshalljman]

No you won't, it will linger in the back of your mind. You will wonder if it's going to happen when you need your pistol the most. ;)

Yea, that's what I'm saying. And if I decide to sell it back its going to be at a loss. I think it BS that the gun is considered used when it hasn't even fired yet. Why should I take all the risk here, the place I bought it from and kahr should too.

[Marshalljman]

You new gun came with a spent cartridge case. That cartridge was fired from your gun, so it worked when it left the factory. It will work again when it comes back from the factory. That you can count on. Let us know what the service department does to correct the problem.

Actually it didn't come with a spent cartridge now that I think of it. I wonder if the gun center i bought it from is screwing me over here?

[garyb]

Anything is possible. If you purchased it new, Kahr will make it right anyway. Not to worry. You will have a good gun in the end and I believe you will love it.

[MBSL500]

Have you considered disassembling the slide to see what's wrong?
You'll very likely will know the problem within minutes.
It's simple, and parts are inexpensive.

[lamppa]

Simple and inexpensive is not the issue.
Just mail it in. Dont open the weapon up past field strip.
Just mail it in.

Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk

[RRP]

I purchased a pm9 two days ago and finally had a chance to take it to the range today. This is a brand new pistol and would not fire with any ammo. Every pull of the trigger resulted in no bang. The staff at the store inspected the gun and couldn't readily find the problem so they have shipped to Worcester to be repaired by Kahr. My question is, can I expect this "lemon" to ever be reliable even if repaired?

I hope Kahr will make this right for me because otherwise I am losing money if I have to sell it back to my dealer and peace of mind if I am stuck with a gun that was this detrimentally unreliable straight out of the box.

...

[Marshalljman]

Simple and inexpensive is not the issue.
Just mail it in. Dont open the weapon up past field strip.
Just mail it in.

Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk

I left this detail out, but the gun is on its way to the factory already. I will update everyone on the progress, good or bad, when it is returned and I have spent some time with it at the range.

[Tpsfoto]

Actually it didn't come with a spent cartridge now that I think of it. I wonder if the gun center i bought it from is screwing me over here?

I bought a new CM9 from a dealer in October with no spent cartridge as well.......
Mine went back to Kahr after 250 rounds for the slide staying open with rounds still in mag.....came back from them in a week or so fixed.....I had 2-6 round and 1-7 round mag and they all did it. The 7 round is still acting up a bit .....I had to drop the mag to straighten out a round that was stuck in the mag last week...it was not the first one in the mag.....out of 50 rounds this happened once.

[Bawanna]

Not all states require the spent rounds. Most states do nothing with the spent round. Some states require that the spent round is turned in to LE for future reference.

I think many manufacturers just include the case in all guns just to make sure. Easier to deal with when they don't know where the gun is being shipped to.

[garyb]

NYS used to collect the spent round when a gun purchase was made, with the intention of using it in shooting cases. After many years of collecting them, they never used the spent round in a single case. They no longer collect them. Crazy NY gun laws.

[340pd]

Forget the negative comments from a couple of people here that hate Kahr's. As a range officer I have seen dozens of new guns, from virtually every manufacturer, give their owners fits on the first trip to the range. Yes, this includes Glocks that have been sent back to the factory more than once.

The only real issue I have seen with Kahr's, is iffy performance from the magazines, especially the 7 rounders. They are an easy fix if you want to take the half hour it takes to do a half dozen of them.

I would break in your new gun by loading the mags one round short and use the slide release/stop to chamber the first round.

Pay attention during reassembly of your gun.

The use if 124 gr. ammo will also help during break in.

Let us all know what was wrong.

[Marshalljman]

I've thought about this thoroughly and I've decided that once the gun comes back I'm asking for another brand new Kahr pm9. If Kahr and the gun store really stand behind there products then they won't force me to accept a product with such a fatal flaw right out of the box. I will never be able to fully trust this pistol regardless of the repair. I can't risk mine or my families life with that.

If I don't get what I believe I deserve then I will have no problem making it very public on every gun forum on the net how Kahr and the gun store screwed me over with a substandard product.

[JimC]

Forget the negative comments from a couple of people here that hate Kahr's.

I don't think anyone here, including me, hates Kahr pistols.
Some, like me, call it they was it is when something goes wrong with a product, any product, that they pay good $'s for.
I can document each problem that I've had with my PM9 and what Kahr has had to do to correct the problem. There must have been an issue because they had to correct it or send me replacement parts to make my pistol run correctly. ;)
I don't feel that a pistol that has an MSRP of $958 should have so many problems.
Kahr CS is top notch, it should be seeing as how many pistols are sent back for the same problems over and over.
I don't feel that Kahr owners should have to revert to home modifications to correct issues with new pistols either.
BTW, Kahr mags are pure crap!

[muggsy]

I've thought about this thoroughly and I've decided that once the gun comes back I'm asking for another brand new Kahr pm9. If Kahr and the gun store really stand behind there products then they won't force me to accept a product with such a fatal flaw right out of the box. I will never be able to fully trust this pistol regardless of the repair. I can't risk mine or my families life with that.

If I don't get what I believe I deserve then I will have no problem making it very public on every gun forum on the net how Kahr and the gun store screwed me over with a substandard product.

That kind of attitude will get you nowhere. If the gun comes back from Kahr and works perfectly they are under no obligation to give you anything. There is nothing substandard about Kahr pistols. They are CAD designed and CNC manufactured from the finest materials available. There are tens of thousands in use daily that are totally reliable.

[addictedhealer]

Some people overreact about everything. Those same people think they deserve so much. My car as a recall from subaru. **** happens but I'm not gonna demand another vehicle and special treatment because I got my feeling upset.

Grow up.

[Marshalljman]

Some people overreact about everything. Those same people think they deserve so much. My car as a recall from subaru. **** happens but I'm not gonna demand another vehicle and special treatment because I got my feeling upset.

Grow up.

First of all, check the attitude. I'm not on here trying to start trouble with anyone.

If you bought a brand new car and you couldn't even drive it off the lot due to some major defect, you would get a different car. How is this situation any different. Not to mention, the car isn't meant to save your life, it's meant to get you from point A to B. A gun needs to be reliable so that you can trust it when it needs to be used.

[Marshalljman]

That kind of attitude will get you nowhere. If the gun comes back from Kahr and works perfectly they are under no obligation to give you anything. There is nothing substandard about Kahr pistols. They are CAD designed and CNC manufactured from the finest materials available. There are tens of thousands in use daily that are totally reliable.

Do you believe that you would be able to trust a gun that didn't fire straight out of the box to the same degree as one that performed flawlessly from day one?

This has nothing to do with Kahr bashing. Many of my friends stand by them and recommended one to me. I expected to be as pleased as them. I still want a Kahr, just a functional and reliable one. The finest materials can't save my life if they don't work we'll in conjunction with each other.

[JimC]

I've thought about this thoroughly and I've decided that once the gun comes back I'm asking for another brand new Kahr pm9. If Kahr and the gun store really stand behind there products then they won't force me to accept a product with such a fatal flaw right out of the box. I will never be able to fully trust this pistol regardless of the repair. I can't risk mine or my families life with that.

If I don't get what I believe I deserve then I will have no problem making it very public on every gun forum on the net how Kahr and the gun store screwed me over with a substandard product.

I understand why you feel like you do however, I doubt if you will get a new pistol out of Kahr for your troubles.
I would suggest that when you get it back, take it to the range with a good quality ammo and give it a chance.
I would suggest a good full power 124 gr. FMJ load.
I prefer either Winchester or Federal NATO spec 124 gr. ball when testing or breaking in a new pistol.
Good luck. ;)

[addictedhealer]

First of all, check the attitude. I'm not on here trying to start trouble with anyone.



If you bought a brand new car and you couldn't even drive it off the lot due to some major defect, you would get a different car. How is this situation any different. Not to mention, the car isn't meant to save your life, it's meant to get you from point A to B. A gun needs to be reliable so that you can trust it when it needs to be used.


I would have them fix it just like kahr will do. Instead of crying on every forum like you are threatening to do.

Handguns like cars are mass produced. Things get missed or messed up. That is why they will cover it at no expense to you.

Pistols are simple to understand and if kahr fixes it there is no reason not to trust it.

It truly does suck you didn't even get to shoot it. I would be pissed to, but once kahr handled the problem id move on. My cw9 has over 1k through it, carry it every single day. Trust it as much as i trust my own skills. Not a single failure of any kind. Have shot the crappiest of ammo and it ate it no problem.

Be patient give kahr a chance and I along with many others promise it will be worth it.

[Marshalljman]

I would have them fix it just like kahr will do. Instead of crying on every forum like you are threatening to do.

Handguns like cars are mass produced. Things get missed or messed up. That is why they will cover it at no expense to you.

Pistols are simple to understand and if kahr fixes it there is no reason not to trust it.

It truly does suck you didn't even get to shoot it. I would be pissed to, but once kahr handled the problem id move on. My cw9 has over 1k through it, carry it every single day. Trust it as much as i trust my own skills. Not a single failure of any kind. Have shot the crappiest of ammo and it ate it no problem.

Be patient give kahr a chance and I along with many others promise it will be worth it.

I understand what you are saying, but now how many rounds do you think I would need to put through it to trust? It already has a 200 round break-in period excluding the problem I have. I suppose I'm just nervous that the gun will function for a while and then another mechanical issue will surface when I Need it the most.

[kerby9mm]

I agree with how you feel mr M but it is most likely something simple that went wrong with your gun. (Haven't read everything because I'm on a phone). When it comes back give it a range session or two & see how your gun is then. Parts can break for various reasons on anything. If your gun does this again then maybe its time to talk replacement.

[CJB]

Ok... we know, spent cartridge or not, that the pistol was test fired at the factory. Thats a given. It went bang.

So what happened in the interim? The pistol was cleaned. And the tell-tale is the claim that there was a delay in the "click", sometimes two seconds.

This sounds to me like the ol' trigger bar issue. I'm not sure if its the trigger bar itself, or a hanging chad of plastic on the frame that lets loose, but occasionally the OP's problem is seen. Its one of two problems that seem to be recurring - the other being the broken follower issue.

I have no doubt that Kahr will not only "fix" the problem, but that the pistol will return with a very very sweet and smooth trigger pull as well. Seems to be the Kahr way on any rework.

Personally, except for the PITA factor, relax, and know that you're getting some custom tuning at the price of time spent and a little aggrivation.

[FLBri]

I've thought about this thoroughly and I've decided that once the gun comes back I'm asking for another brand new Kahr pm9. If Kahr and the gun store really stand behind there products then they won't force me to accept a product with such a fatal flaw right out of the box. I will never be able to fully trust this pistol regardless of the repair. I can't risk mine or my families life with that.

If I don't get what I believe I deserve then I will have no problem making it very public on every gun forum on the net how Kahr and the gun store screwed me over with a substandard product.

You may get some mileage out of your dealer with that attitude, but Kahr won't give you as much as a nod. Once they fix the problem, it is trustworthy ...even more so than a "new out of the box" pistol.

And your statement "I can't risk mine or my families life with that" is not accurate. It is only your perception of risk .... the actual risk is diminished because of what CJB said below. Changing your perception might be a better way to go. At least give it a chance.

I also chuckle at the thought of people threatening the same old "I'll blow this issue wide open on every gun forum" schtick. Any one that really thinks that does anything other than make them look ridiculous is kidding themselves.

Kahr will do their part. You should accept yours, as purchaser. Even with a car, the "Lemon Law" allows them 3 chances to fix an issue before the "nuclear" option.

I'm not trying minimize the frustration you have over the problem. Just suggesting you take a more productive posture.

[CJB]

First of all, check the attitude. I'm not on here trying to start trouble with anyone.

If you bought a brand new car and you couldn't even drive it off the lot due to some major defect, you would get a different car. How is this situation any different.

I can say with absolute certainty, you would not get a new car. Sorry, papers signed, done deal, you'd get a loaner and they they'd fix it. My late friend Andy bought a Volvo wagon that he couldn't drive off the lot. Electrical issue stemming from the incorrectly, and dealer installed, wiring for the fog lights. It took 'em two days to fix, and even then not correctly. When it was "fixed" if you turned off the car with the fog lights on, you could never get them to turn off again, unless you pulled the battery cable. Andy, being an astute engineer, fixed it himself and lambasted the dealer mercilessly.

And I've personally tried to take delivery of not one, but two different pickup trucks (both Ford, and I love Fords....) that literally would not run. One had water in the fuel, the other had a bad ECM. This was oh... at least 20 years apart. Both cases, I got loaners. Case of water I got an instant two year extension of the factory warranty, which was three years back then, taking it to five, with no miles limit. Never had a lick of trouble with either after that.

So sorry to pee in the Wheaties, but... thats what they do.

[CJB]

Do you believe that you would be able to trust a gun that didn't fire straight out of the box to the same degree as one that performed flawlessly from day one?

This has nothing to do with Kahr bashing. Many of my friends stand by them and recommended one to me. I expected to be as pleased as them. I still want a Kahr, just a functional and reliable one. The finest materials can't save my life if they don't work we'll in conjunction with each other.

Yes, I would, because I don't believe in voodoo, or magic, or some sort of spiritual mumbo jumbo with firearms. They're metal, and plastic. They are designed correctly. There may be inconsistancies with the execution of the design during the manufacturing process. Those inconsistancies are correctable. I tend to consider engineering, and physics - and human nature in a mass assembly process. Once defective part A is replaced with good part A, you have a good assembly. Once dimension Z is adjusted to conform with its specification, its in conformity. No emotion need be involved.

Consider this, once a pistol goes back, its gets TLC beyond whats given during mass assembly. One might actually look upon a trip to the mothership as a very good thing.

And, that pistol did fire. And then it was disassembled, and re-asembled. There very well exists a possibity that the lack of firing virtue in the gun is unknowingly user created.

Time will tell.

[CJB]

Wait... wait... I was wrong.

Yes, the pistol is jinxed. Its a bad omen Marshalljman. The gun's got a mind of its own, and there is no telling what it may do. I tell ya, that pistol is gonna be trouble. It is gonna give out at the most inopportune time, and lull you into quiet complacency by working well at the range in the meantime. In fact, you're gonna draw on a BG in your hour of desperate need, and right before the barrel falls right off, the pistol is going to backfire into your face.

I'll give you a hundred bucks for it, when it comes back, and you're getting the better end of the deal. I just happen to need a Kahr shaped fishing sinker for my collection, lucky for you that I'm feeling rather generous this morning.

[muggsy]

I think that the best course of action for this new Kahr owner to take is to stamp his feet, jump up and down, hold his breath until he turns blue and kick and scream at the top of his lungs. That seems to have worked with his parents. Now that I know what with were dealing with here, I'm done. Some people just never grow up.

[Rubb]

Again...I've sent guns back to 4 different manufacturers.
All 4 came back flawless and didn't require a second trip.
If you not comfortable(and it sounds like you're not)with ever trusting it ask for a refund or credit towards another purchase and move on.

[Marshalljman]

I think that the best course of action for this new Kahr owner to take is to stamp his feet, jump up and down, hold his breath until he turns blue and kick and scream at the top of his lungs. That seems to have worked with his parents. Now that I know what with were dealing with here, I'm done. Some people just never grow up.

Thank you all for the reassurance. I will test the gun out with hopes that it functions properly. Obviously, I have no other option, other than to sell it at a big loss.

For the others, specifically muggy and Cjb, I just have to laugh at the ignorance of those that claim to be able to sum a man up by interpreting one upset and nervous statement by him. You don't know the half about me and I can't take such ignorance seriously, so check your Internet courage for anger-baiting at the door and please offer me constructive criticism. I am very open to that, otherwise I would not have posted here.

[CJB]

Sir, I offered you a nice helpful response to your querey a long ways back in this thread. You however, began the aforementioned nervous and upset commentary after that. As such, sarcasm and ridicule are my personal norm in such instances.

And just for that, my offers down to seventy-five, take it or leave it!

[Marshalljman]

Sir, I offered you a nice helpful response to your querey a long ways back in this thread. You however, began the aforementioned nervous and upset commentary after that. As such, sarcasm and ridicule are my personal norm in such instances.

And just for that, my offers down to seventy-five, take it or leave it!

I actually found you're example of the car that couldn't be returned very helpful, that's exactly what I needed to hear. I've never owned a non functional gun so I may be less informed on how these matters work and I need that light shed upon me.

However, your sarcasm is unnecessary and counterproductive. It just makes you look like a sad soul that has too much time on his hands and needs to feel superior by bashing people he knows nothing about through the convenience and security of his own home. You must feel pretty tough.

[kerby9mm]

Mr M. Sometimes on forums the members feel insulted when their guns are criticized which could be the case here. You feel insulted by the sarcasm maybe? If you can relax some maybe some productive results can be achieved/lets all chill out. I do feel your frustration but I also feel that your gun will be fixed. Can everyone just get along?

[gb6491]

.... Can everyone just get along?
Let's do that folks.:angel:

[RRP]

If gun owners can't find common ground, how the he!! can we expect to hold-off the anti-gun crowd, that would like to ban all our guns?!!

[b4uqzme]

Mr M. Sometimes on forums the members feel insulted when their guns are criticized which could be the case here. You feel insulted by the sarcasm maybe? If you can relax some maybe some productive results can be achieved/lets all chill out. I do feel your frustration but I also feel that your gun will be fixed. Can everyone just get along?

Yes and no. The members on this forum are very understanding and helpful. They have great tolerance and even empathy when posters find themselves in a similar predicament...and we have seen it before. But threats about brand bashing...those are fighting words and it's hard to hold back. Sometimes you get what you ask for.

Meanwhile, hang in there. Kahr has every intention to return you a trustworthy firearm. Whether or not you can trust it will be your choice alone. But please don't trash Kahr because of your decision.

Best wishes and welcome to the forum.

P.S. Some of the most expensive automobiles are also the most likely to break due to the sophistication and complexity of their manufacture and design. Owned a Ferrari lately?

[CJB]

Offer's down to fifty. Pretty soon you're gonna have to pay me to take it.

[Marshalljman]

Offer's down to fifty. Pretty soon you're gonna have to pay me to take it.

I came here to find common ground and help. And that's what I still here for. I don't want anyone to make trouble for me here and I want to get along with everyone but I can't tolerate unnecessary bashing of me based on one comment I made. I apologize if I offended anyone by it. Now, please let's be civil and I will be as well.

[muggsy]

From what I can see no one gave you any attitude until you displayed a bad attitude. Everyone on this website was trying to assist you including me. If you want to start over from square one that's perfectly acceptable to me. I'm sure that goes for the rest of the people on this forum.

[Marshalljman]

From what I can see no one gave you any attitude until you displayed a bad attitude. Everyone on this website was trying to assist you including me. If you want to start over from square one that's perfectly acceptable to me. I'm sure that goes for the rest of the people on this forum.

Glad to hear. For the record though, I never gave any individual an attitude. People were displeased with my attitude towards the situation I was in and decided to attack my character.

My attitude was poor, but I attribute that to my ignorance of how gun repair and returns work and my frustration with being a long term gun owner and never having malfunctions, never mind a gun not firing.

If anyone here wants to put the blame on me for being pissed off, so be it, but don't be in denial that your bashing comments were in anyway mature or called for.

[kerby9mm]

Has there been any alcohol involved in this discussion?