New Kahr CW380 - My Experience So Far

[mitchell4198]

I would like to first start by saying that I am not new to this forum or to Kahr.

I have a PM9 that is almost 4 years old and has been problem free after the initial break in.

I purchased a CW380 on February 4, took it home and cleaned and lubed as per Kahrs instructions. Racked the slide several hundred times and left the slide locked back for 2 days. Also cleaned up the magazines eliminating any drag that the follower might have on the sides of the magazines.

First trip to the range:

PPU FMJ 94 Grain-50 Rds -- To many stovepipes to count
S & B FMJ 92 Grain-25 Rds -- Would not return to full battery on almost all rounds - looks like this ammo is not made to fit the Kahr
Federal Champion FMJ 95 Grain-18 Rds. -- 2 stovepipes
Winchester White Box FMJ 95 Grain-24 Rds. -- No problems
Monarch Brass FMJ 94 Grain - 18 Rds. -- No problems


Followed this range trip with 4 others with similar results (cleaned and lubed before each range trip). I added two other types of ammo to the mix along the way - Remington UMC 95 Grain and Summit FMJ 100 Grain. None of the ammo was 100% trouble free.

After firing over 600 mixed rounds thru this pistol I have no faith in it whatsoever, except that it will fail at random for no obvious reason.

I called Kahr yesterday and spoke to a gentleman named Matt. He said to send the gun back and they would check it out. Also emailed me a FedEx shipping label (so shipping cost is on Kahr). I will be sending this CW380 to Kahr on Monday. Per Matt, lead time for repairs is around 4 weeks.

When I get this pistol back if it continues to fail after another 100 rounds down the pipe, I will cut my losses and move on after having sent almost $300 worth of ammunition downrange (380 is hard to find and expensive).


I will probably go to a Ruger LCP or a Smith and Wesson Bodyguard w/o laser and not look back.

[Evan]

I had the same experience with ppu but after upgrading to american eagle for the rest of the 200 round break in i didnt have any issues. Now that the gun is broken in it even fires ppu... I hope kahr can work everything out for you

[mitchell4198]

380 ammo is almost nonexistent in this part of the country (Alabama).
All that I have been able to find is Summit at 2 different gun shops. $21 at one and $22.95 at the other.


I was able to find 3 boxes of Winchester Training ammo online for $19.99, but I have shot up 2 of those. I have 250 rounds of reloads on order. If they won't function in the CW380, I know that I can use them in my wife's Ruger LCP.


I still have some WWB and Remington UMC left that I can also use in the Kahr for testing. I just don't want to waste my whole stash trying to break it in.

[DavidR]

Seems like this one never should have left the factory.

[jlr2267]

I'm having similar problems, although I only had 3 ammo brands, all 3 jammed up the gun almost every shot (fail to return to battery). I wasted about 300 rounds and sent the gun back to Kahr. Mine's been there 4 weeks and counting.

[RRP]

I have a PM9 that is almost 4 years old and has been problem free after the initial break in.


I will probably go to a Ruger LCP or a Smith and Wesson Bodyguard w/o laser and not look back.

If you have a reliable PM9, what is the attraction to .380?

[cloud]

If you have a reliable PM9, what is the attraction to .380?

Can't answer for 4198 .But for me I like to carry in my front jeans pocket. I prefer the size of my p380 over the size of my cm9.

[mitchell4198]

If you have a reliable PM9, what is the attraction to .380?


Smaller size and weight for easier pocket carry. Wishing now that I'd have gone ahead and got an LCP instead of waiting for the CW380.

[RRP]

I did not care for the trigger or the sights on the LCP. I was told they had been improved, so I recently fondled one at the gun store, to assess the improvements. It still does not hold a candle to the Kahr, in my opinion.

Do your homework, so you don't end up with another disappointment.

[70CM9]

I would like to first start by saying that I am not new to this forum or to Kahr.

I have a PM9 that is almost 4 years old and has been problem free after the initial break in.

I purchased a CW380 on February 4, took it home and cleaned and lubed as per Kahrs instructions. Racked the slide several hundred times and left the slide locked back for 2 days. Also cleaned up the magazines eliminating any drag that the follower might have on the sides of the magazines.

First trip to the range:

PPU FMJ 94 Grain-50 Rds -- To many stovepipes to count
S & B FMJ 92 Grain-25 Rds -- Would not return to full battery on almost all rounds - looks like this ammo is not made to fit the Kahr
Federal Champion FMJ 95 Grain-18 Rds. -- 2 stovepipes
Winchester White Box FMJ 95 Grain-24 Rds. -- No problems
Monarch Brass FMJ 94 Grain - 18 Rds. -- No problems


Followed this range trip with 4 others with similar results (cleaned and lubed before each range trip). I added two other types of ammo to the mix along the way - Remington UMC 95 Grain and Summit FMJ 100 Grain. None of the ammo was 100% trouble free.

After firing over 600 mixed rounds thru this pistol I have no faith in it whatsoever, except that it will fail at random for no obvious reason.

I called Kahr yesterday and spoke to a gentleman named Matt. He said to send the gun back and they would check it out. Also emailed me a FedEx shipping label (so shipping cost is on Kahr). I will be sending this CW380 to Kahr on Monday. Per Matt, lead time for repairs is around 4 weeks.

When I get this pistol back if it continues to fail after another 100 rounds down the pipe, I will cut my losses and move on after having sent almost $300 worth of ammunition downrange (380 is hard to find and expensive).


I will probably go to a Ruger LCP or a Smith and Wesson Bodyguard w/o laser and not look back.

Wow, does this ever sound familiar. Same experiences here - except I (stupidly) paid the premium and got a P380 with night sights. Mines been with Kahr for a couple of weeks now.

I'd never experienced any issues that weren't easily rectified with any of my previous Kahrs. I bought a CM9 new that had a couple of hiccups during the "break-in" period but ran fine afterwards. Used CM9 I had gave no issues. New CW45 had a quite loose slide stop spring that would allow rounds to push out the slide stop during firing - that was a new one - but once tightened ran fine and presented no further probs. New CW9 ran flawlessly from day one (I "tested" it for her, :) ) but wifey (who bought it for herself, lol) decided to stick with her Glock 26 after one mag through it.

This P380, however...wow. There'd better be a HUGE difference in it when I get it back. Already bought another gun to take its place, however, that runs like a top, so I'm not holding out a lot of hope for the Kahrs longevity in my household.

QC in my case (and yours, it seems) is INCREDIBLY lax in Kahr land at the moment.

[70CM9]

Smaller size and weight for easier pocket carry. Wishing now that I'd have gone ahead and got an LCP instead of waiting for the CW380.

THIS ^^^. The LCPs I've owned have been great. P380 has been the worst gun mistake I've ever made - even worse than my 9mm Tokarev I owned for a short time 20 some years ago.

[cloud]

THIS ^^^. The LCPs I've owned have been great. P380 has been the worst gun mistake I've ever made - even worse than my 9mm Tokarev I owned for a short time 20 some years ago.

I added a stainless lcp to the collection last week. My p380 seems to be ok since its return from Kahr . My cm9 has been a good reliable gun.

[70CM9]

My p380 seems to be ok since its return from Kahr.

See, not trying to sound TOO "ranty", but this seems to be a quite disturbing trend. Far too many seem to need further attention from Kahr.

$600 for a gun ought to buy one that's right from the start. The CW380 should be right, as well - since it's mechanically not really any different from the P380.

Inexcusable.

[RRP]

Inexcusable.

I'm curious what kind of car you drive.

[70CM9]

I'm curious what kind of car you drive.

Actually I've been in the automotive dealership world for 23 years. In the direction I think you're heading, yes, I've seen vehicles that need attention after arrival. Some are to the point of not being driveable, but that's far from the norm. Most cases don't involve a massive failure to function - i.e., they still go down the road, just not as they should.

Most of the function issues we've been discussing are the automotive equivalent of the engine stopping dead in the middle of the interstate in heavy traffic - not a pulsation in the brake pedal when applied or a piece of trim that's loose.

Fwiw.

[RRP]

So let's not assume the problems we read about in this forum are the norm. We can't tell, from reading this forum, how many guns are trouble-free.

[berettabone]

Geez, I hope you first sexual experience with a woman turn out well, mitchell4198. I hate to see you go the other way. I've never understood why some people come on to this website just to rant.
No one else will listen??????????????????http://kahrtalk.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[skiflydive]

My CM9 and my P380 have both been perfect. I'll carry either of them anywhere, anytime. Some folks have trouble. I don't.

[mitchell4198]

I didn't just fall off a tater truck yesterday and this is not my first time on this forum. I don't feel that my initial post was a rant, but more just stating the facts of my experience with my CW380.


For your information, this is not my first experience with handguns or with women.


I am 63 years old and have been happily married to the same woman for 38 years.


I also own the following handguns:

Glock 26 and 19 (the 26 has over 10,000 rounds thru it with 2 failures (lightly loaded ammo). I shoot both of these in GSSF competition.
S & W 3913 9MM and Chief's Special 9MM
Sig SP2022 9MM
Walther P22
Colt Chief's Special (38 Revolver)
S & W 38 Victory Revolver
Taurus Model 85CH 38 Special
Bauer 25 Auto
H & R 22 Revolver


Now that's what I would call a rant.

[JERRY]

my old style PM9 has been perfect from day one. my PM45 was a problem child. I cant see gambling on another poly kahr other than a PM9. the K9 and MK9 I had way back yon were great, but heavy.

[70CM9]

I feel that this comment is out of hand for this forum.


I just re-read this entire thread to see what I'd missed. I have no idea where the sexual encounter comment came from, nor do I see why it was even posted.

It certainly wasn't warranted.

Let's face facts, here, people, a LOT of this forum is devoted to problems with the Kahr firearms in question. I fail to see where posting such is somehow taboo that ought to bring down a completely off-topic smack like that.

Back ON topic, and to the point, there seems to be a pretty high percentage of this happening. Granted, we all know that statistically there should be lots of happy owners compared to those who are online positing their issues, but it's also true that there seem to be far more instances and complaints issued on here than I see referencing other brands in the other forums I frequent, save for Kel-Tec. I feel pretty safe in saying there's a higher-than-should-be-considered-normal rate of problems being talked about here.

[PattayaPistol]

I feel that this comment is out of hand for this forum.


I have to agree with you that the sexual comment certainly appears to be out of line. Unfortunately as always with the written form, it really isn't possible to know exactly the spirit in which it was posted. However, regardless of the spirit, the comment was unnecessary.

Also, your post was no rant, and should not have been called out as such. If we cannot complain about Kahr pistols here and get advice, I don't see where we can, and unfortunately the little .380's often do appear to be troublesome.

Cheers
PP

[DavidR]

FWIW I agree that 70CM9s original post was not out of line. We don't know what the defect rate is on the CW9 but anecdotally it seems high. It also seems as though test-firing one full magazine at the factory would have revealed that this gun has problems.

The good news is that Kahr does seem to be able to fix these problems in a reasonable amount of time and once they are fixed owners really seem to love this pistol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mitchell4198]

OK, my CW380 arrived at Kahr today. Now the wait begins.


Thought (per Federal Regulations) that handguns had to ship "Overnight", but the FedEx shipping label that Kahr provided was for 2 day shipping???

[smokersteve]

I have to agree with you that the sexual comment certainly appears to be out of line. Unfortunately as always with the written form, it really isn't possible to know exactly the spirit in which it was posted. However, regardless of the spirit, the comment was unnecessary.

Also, your post was no rant, and should not have been called out as such. If we cannot complain about Kahr pistols here and get advice, I don't see where we can, and unfortunately the little .380's often do appear to be troublesome.

Cheers
PP
An unnecessary comment from muggsy. Imagine that. Him and a few others with their comments keep me from frequenting this forum too often. When I do visit I just ignore him and the other goofballs.

[jlr2267]

OK, my CW380 arrived at Kahr today. Now the wait begins.Mine's in its 5th week, so sit back and get comfy...you'll be here a while, lol.

[RRP]

Mine's in its 5th week, so sit back and get comfy...you'll be here a while, lol.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease. If you haven't already, I would follow-up and ask for a progress report. Politely, of course.

[cloud]

The squeaky wheel gets the grease. If you haven't already, I would follow-up and ask for a progress report. Politely, of course.
I agree. I also asked them to have the gunsmith call me when he was done. He did call and went over everything that he did to the gun .

[Bawanna]

I did a little cleaning up in this thread.

Per my leader we're open to critical discussion in a constructive manner provided Kahr is given an opportunity to correct an issue and the results are posted good or bad.

All negative with no chance given to take care of an issue isn't gonna get off the runway.

We're fine here in that respect so far.

Feeling a bit like a custodian lately which isn't all bad, would be a step up in my professional career I think.

[jocko]

I know of no one on this forum TODAY who is not here to help an owner with an issues. Now mind u, some feel they shouldnot have to tweek nuttin on their gun,. That is fine, then send it back. But sme do come here for helpful advice and suggestions on to fix certin issues without sendingit back and without voiding ones wrraqnty. Either way it always remains ur choice. I will have to side with the colonel who is normally right on target (kils me to say tha tto), but coming on a bein negative asur first choice will get u no where and probalby gonna get u some comment su jdon't like either. U only real on these gun forum those with issues as that is one way fo rtem to vent to ALL readers Does it mean anything? Sure it does, if u can read between the lines, we never know of the issues as to what was done before by the owner, or if it could be evne "pray tell" shooter error, which u know we are all super experienced gun owner as i HQAVE OWNED 30+ GUNS SO THA TMAKES ME AQN EXPERIENCED SHOOTER.

Some people never cuddle up to a kahr either. It is what it is, we live by the sword and we die by the sword. I can tell u in the 5 years on bein on this forum I have learned alot nd it makes people think ol jocko knows his sh!t, but in exxeence it i sthe results of many wiser than I who have ocme forward with helpful posts that have me a better more knowledeagle person about kahr guns.

This is still the best forum out there, we banter alot but again it is because without some of this bqanter, this wold be a boring $4 forum, as what the fokk are we gonna taqlk aoub ty that has not been talked about a 100+ times. U can only tell an owner to check his magazine spring for proper installation so fewdifferent ways,but we keep telling it over aqnd over.

If u don't like ol jocko';s bantert and posts, like some have stated, jsut pass over anything that I say, or Muggsy, r thecolonel. U are not required to ead every post, find what please us and learn from it.

U gotta be a real a$$wipe to get banned from this forum, I know, I am still here, so that speaks for itself. adrress members and kahr service peole with respect and u will get it two fold in return.. Some posts are meant in humor but when written seem alittle out of contex but when I see the posters name, I can tell the mannerit was meant. Just sayin

[DavidR]

I'm stunned - I could actually decipher a jocko post. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jocko]

don't get bigt headed over that. It doesn't happen every fokkin day. It not tht I have changed it is tha tyou havejust jgotte better. I tldu that $25 u sent me for that decoder ring was worth every dollar. Just sayin

[jlr2267]

The squeaky wheel gets the grease. If you haven't already, I would follow-up and ask for a progress report. Politely, of course.

I called last week. He looked up the RMA# and said "shouldn't be too much longer." Sounded to me like they don't actually keep a status, other than "received" and "fixed/shipped"

[jocko]

I called last week. He looked up the RMA# and said "shouldn't be too much longer." Sounded to me like they don't actually keep a status, other than "received" and "fixed/shipped"

not sure they are gnna tell u everythig either. Theire job is to fix the damn gun asap and get ity back to u asap. not provide status reports. U get that in a hospital. I am sure the kahr techs like most gun makers techs are damn busy, backlogged to the hilt and certinly understaffed. These guys are paid by the hour not by the repair, so my thoughts are kahr will keep them busy and more understaffed than over staffed. Wehav esene next day turn around statedon this forum, so alot depends on what th eissues are, if parts are there to put in etc.

When I skent my 3 kel teks in a total of 16 times kt's policy was 4 weeks turnarund and by golly they lived upto that. I never got a week turn around, but u do the math,my 16 time sin to kt for issues combned my guns was sitting there for over 64 weeks.Is it whatit is. back then they were about the only game on the block, today not so. We also are very aware that the gun makers today areturning out gunbs asap as the public is buyin them asap, sowe are gonnahave some product issues, no doubt..:Amflag2:

[jlr2267]

not sure they are gnna tell u everythig either. Theire job is to fix the damn gun asap and get ity back to u asap. not provide status reports.

I respectfully disagree. It is reasonable to expect that, after 4 weeks, they could at least tell you if a gunsmith has it, or if it's still in the waiting line. Other companies manage to do it quite easily.

[mitchell4198]

I respectfully disagree. It is reasonable to expect that, after 4 weeks, they could at least tell you if a gunsmith has it, or if it's still in the waiting line. Other companies manage to do it quite easily.


Agreed!!

[Tboltdon]

I have gone through an almost identical process. I sent the P 380 back to Kahr 6 weeks ago. When I call or email them to get a status report, all I get is "turn around time is 4-6 weeks". No answer when I say, it's been 7.I like the gun, great carry, I just want it to work better. I'm rapidly getting a case.

[mitchell4198]

One week and waiting.


I did take my PM9 to the range and shoot it today. Still shoots great.

[mitchell4198]

Two Weeks and Waiting.


Did speak to someone at Kahr earlier this week. Could only say that my CW380 was there and that the lead time was 3 to 5 weeks. Also, mine was produced in November (second month of production). If I would have only waited a few months my story might be completely different.


Anyone wanting a new CW380 I would advise waiting about a year from now before buying. Maybe the bugs will be worked out by then.

[Evi1joe]

I did not care for the trigger or the sights on the LCP. I was told they had been improved, so I recently fondled one at the gun store, to assess the improvements. It still does not hold a candle to the Kahr, in my opinion. Do your homework, so you don't end up with another disappointment.

I like the new, slightly bigger sights and the shortened trigger-pull on the LCPs--it isn't a target gun, but I can shoot the gun very well out to 10-15Y...even COM all day at 25Y. It points very naturally for me even at 30-40Y (confirmed with a laser). Also, with the Galloway follower, I can carry 7+1 rds of .380.
BUT my main attraction to the LCP is that it's been 100% with a wide variety of FMJ and JHP--from 90gr to 102gr. With the Hogue Hybrid Handall and a pinky extension, it fits well in my hand and pocket. I still love the P9 too. Just can't get into that Kahr .380. (I did see one guy trying to "give" his gun away--a car parked next to mine in a movie theater parking lot had his back window down half-way, and I noticed a Kahr .380 stuck between the console and the from seat.)

[ammodave]

My CW380 is a dog with multiple failure to feeds. I'm sending it back to Kahr and then I'll sell it when it returns.

[mitchell4198]

Three Weeks And.......It Came Back!!!


Action Taken:
Inspected Firearm - New Extractor and Recoil Springs - Reworked Slide Stop - Lubed and Test Fired, OK


Took to range to test fire. 75 rounds, 3 different types of ammunition. Experienced 12 Failures (Premature Slide Locked Back, Stovepipes and Failures to Feed).


It is gone. I could not keep wasting expensive 380 ammo.


I'll have a spare magazine and holster posted for sale soon.

[jlr2267]

Three Weeks And.......It Came Back!!!


Action Taken:
Inspected Firearm - New Extractor and Recoil Springs - Reworked Slide Stop - Lubed and Test Fired, OK


Took to range to test fire. 75 rounds, 3 different types of ammunition. Experienced 12 Failures (Premature Slide Locked Back, Stovepipes and Failures to Feed).


It is gone. I could not keep wasting expensive 380 ammo.


I'll have a spare magazine and holster posted for sale soon.

Sorry it didn't work out. I also got rid of mine too. What a disappointment.

[2tango2]

Bummer to hear some CW380s aren't working out. Mine was my first Kahr so I want used to having a break in period

It's pretty much money spot on now. Maybe 6 or 700 rounds through it I think

My only gripe is disassembly is still a pita and when I pull the trigger to release the slide nothing happens. I pretty much have to yank the slide off the frame.

Ideas on that anyone?

[smokersteve]

When I pull the trigger to release the slide I found it works best to keep the trigger pulled back the whole way.

[2tango2]

When I pull the trigger to release the slide I found it works best to keep the trigger pulled back the whole way.


Does it click or make any noise?

[smokersteve]

Does it click or make any noise?
Just tried it. I don't hear a click. The slide doesn't come off super smooth, but with some light force it comes off.

[2tango2]

Just tried it. I don't hear a click. The slide doesn't come off super smooth, but with some light force it comes off.


Ok thanks for the heads up. Next time I take it down I'll hold trigger back


Thanks!

[mitchell4198]

I now am the proud owner of a new Ruger LCP with Lasermax Laser. Hope to get it to the range next week to see how it works out.


It is a pity that Kahr got everything right about the CW380, except for functionality. Good looks, good grip, good sights, good trigger and a soft shooter.


I hope someone from Kahr is reading this.

[kerby9mm]

Kahr doesn't need to read this they might figure it out by how many p380's have come back to them when they don't work.

[leftysixty]

Please consider this;

MOST modern firearms are NOT custom hand fitted.

All of the parts are mass produced and delivered to the assembly area in big boxes, barrels, ect.

Because of this, all dimensions of said parts are made to a +/- specification. The person that assembles the gun or sub assemblies of it, grabs a part and adds it to the gun.

When the gun is complete it is checked for function. If too many parts are plus or minus in the wrong direction, the gun don't work. If enough parts are close enough, it will appear to function. Maybe even well enough to fire a coupla rounds.

This whole process is meant to provide enough product to meet the demand. And at a price that "normal" folks can afford.

This process is used in most, if not all, mass produced products. We don't have to like it, but it is what it is.

Profit and loss is based on percentage of successful builds for each product. Included in the costs is what it takes to rebuild/replace the failures.

Sorry for the long post, but this is the world as it is today.

Maybe this explains some of the pain.:D

Stay Safe :amflag:

[cloud]

I now am the proud owner of a new Ruger LCP with Lasermax Laser. Hope to get it to the range next week to see how it works out.


It is a pity that Kahr got everything right about the CW380, except for functionality. Good looks, good grip, good sights, good trigger and a soft shooter.


I hope someone from Kahr is reading this.

Sorry about the cw. I like my p380 but I also bought a stainless lcp a couple of weeks a ago. I am really liking the lcp.Congrats on yours.

[DavidR]

Please consider this;

MOST modern firearms are NOT custom hand fitted.

All of the parts are mass produced and delivered to the assembly area in big boxes, barrels, ect.

Because of this, all dimensions of said parts are made to a +/- specification. The person that assembles the gun or sub assemblies of it, grabs a part and adds it to the gun.

When the gun is complete it is checked for function. If too many parts are plus or minus in the wrong direction, the gun don't work. If enough parts are close enough, it will appear to function. Maybe even well enough to fire a coupla rounds.

This whole process is meant to provide enough product to meet the demand. And at a price that "normal" folks can afford.

This process is used in most, if not all, mass produced products. We don't have to like it, but it is what it is.

Profit and loss is based on percentage of successful builds for each product. Included in the costs is what it takes to rebuild/replace the failures.

Sorry for the long post, but this is the world as it is today.

Maybe this explains some of the pain.:D

Stay Safe :amflag:

That's a well written summary of a common business model. To a large extent that business model was developed before the Internet and social media existed. I believe the model still exists but companies are thinking more about the defect rate because consumers now have a forum for publicizing complaints about defects which can have an effect on demand.

[mitchell4198]

This process is used in most, if not all, mass produced products.


Yes, and most mass produced products work as they should right out of the box. Just not those from Kahr.