Two Kahrs to the range today

[O'Dell]

A week or so ago, someone on another forum ask about the recoil of Kahr 9mm's and 45's. I posted that I had never shot them back to back, but I didn't think there was much difference. I was WRONG, big time! Today I shot 100 rounds of questionable NATO 9mm and 25 rounds of GD's through my CW9. I can still say that this pistol has never failed in any way. Then I shot 75 rounds of Federal 230 gr ball and 25 rounds of GD's through the PM45. On the first round of with the PM45, I nearly knocked my baseball cap off. I continued to let the gun roll with the recoil instead of using a death grip, and the gun cycled just fine. Again, 100 more rounds through the PM45 w/o the hint of a problem.

I'm still amazed at the reliability of these little pistols. I also found out that I shoot better with the 45. It's easy to cut out the center of the target with those big, wide open GD's. I was really enjoying myself, but my range isn't AC'ed, and when the sweat rolled into my eyes and then fogged my shooting glasses, I called it a day.

[wyntrout]

Ditto on everything... even the un-a/c'd range.:D
Wynn:D

[Bawanna]

This is the kind of report we live for around here, I note the lack of a target phot, wait, checking tattoo's. Hmmmm O'Dell, photo challenged. Never mind. (Knew the tats was gonna come in handy) It's amazing that so many that own the 9's of different flavors PM's, CW's etc that also have 45's always claim to shoot the 45 better. Don't really make sense unless your attention or focus is at a higher level thinking you gotta hold on which really isn't much of an issue. While there is recoil, to me its not a big bother. I prefer the push of the 45 over the jolt of the 9 and certainly more the extra jolt of the 40 although even it isn't really bad.
Glad those baby's are running for ya.

[jocko]

A week or so ago, someone on another forum ask about the recoil of Kahr 9mm's and 45's. I posted that I had never shot them back to back, but I didn't think there was much difference. I was WRONG, big time! Today I shot 100 rounds of questionable NATO 9mm and 25 rounds of GD's through my CW9. I can still say that this pistol has never failed in any way. Then I shot 75 rounds of Federal 230 gr ball and 25 rounds of GD's through the PM45. On the first round of with the PM45, I nearly knocked my baseball cap off. I continued to let the gun roll with the recoil instead of using a death grip, and the gun cycled just fine. Again, 100 more rounds through the PM45 w/o the hint of a problem.

I'm still amazed at the reliability of these little pistols. I also found out that I shoot better with the 45. It's easy to cut out the center of the target with those big, wide open GD's. I was really enjoying myself, but my range isn't AC'ed, and when the sweat rolled into my eyes and then fogged my shooting glasses, I called it a day.

port it!!

[O'Dell]

I have to say that a 230 gr Gold dot out of a 17 oz [empty] pistol is a bit more than a push. The guy in the lane next to me had a SIG P229 and a P220 45. He was fascinated by the tiny PM45 compared to his fullsize P220. I was familiar with his guns since I had a 220 and just sold a 228, so I let him shoot a couple of mags from the PM. After a few rounds to figure out the trigger, he shot about the same groups as with the SIG. Then I showed him how easily the PM45 slipped into my pocket. When I went into the store to pay for the range time, he was at the showcase looking at Kahrs.

[Bawanna]

port it!!

Good idea, I'm thinking of porting mine even though I'm perfectly content with it as is. It looks cool.
I'm curious to see how much it helps.
You be the guinea pig this time and give us a full report, w/pictures since the PM45 slide is a bit different than the smaller calibers. I think it'll even look cooler but I want to see yours first.
Oh crap, forgot your the photo challenged one. You'll just have to have somebody take care of it for ya, in this case we gotta have photo's.

All in favor of O'Dell getting the PM45 ported enter and sign in please.

Hmmm, looks unanimous to me. Send it!

[Bawanna]

I have to say that a 230 gr Gold dot out of a 17 oz [empty] pistol is a bit more than a push. The guy in the lane next to me had a SIG P229 and a P220 45. He was fascinated by the tiny PM45 compared to his fullsize P220. I was familiar with his guns since I had a 220 and just sold a 228, so I let him shoot a couple of mags from the PM. After a few rounds to figure out the trigger, he shot about the same groups as with the SIG. Then I showed him how easily the PM45 slipped into my pocket. When I went into the store to pay for the range time, he was at the showcase looking at Kahrs.

Mine actually shot softer with the Gold Dots than with the aluminum case Blazers I used for break in. And it loved them alot. The groups tightened right up despite it being toward the end of a long 350 round range session. I expected to really go down hill but it did really fine with my favorite Gold dots.

[O'Dell]

Good idea, I'm thinking of porting mine even though I'm perfectly content with it as is. It looks cool.
I'm curious to see how much it helps.
You be the guinea pig this time and give us a full report, w/pictures since the PM45 slide is a bit different than the smaller calibers. I think it'll even look cooler but I want to see yours first.
Oh crap, forgot your the photo challenged one. You'll just have to have somebody take care of it for ya, in this case we gotta have photo's.

All in favor of O'Dell getting the PM45 ported enter and sign in please.

Hmmm, looks unanimous to me. Send it!

Don't think so. I tend to keep my guns stock. I don't even add lasers, lights or sights. As often as I buy and sell guns, it's better to stay stock. However, the way I feel about these elegant little pistols right now, if I sold every gun I have, they would be the last to go.

No camera, but maybe I could scan it.:)

[O'Dell]

Mine actually shot softer with the Gold Dots than with the aluminum case Blazers I used for break in. And it loved them alot. The groups tightened right up despite it being toward the end of a long 350 round range session. I expected to really go down hill but it did really fine with my favorite Gold dots.

The GD's I shot today, errr, yesterday, were probably +p's. I bought 4 boxes a while back, and they sent me 2 standard and 2 +p's. The half box was left over from shooting the XD last week. It's almost twice as heavy as the PM, so probably wouldn't have noticed. I don't remember the PM being as lively or the muzzle flash being as big the last time I shot it.

[deadhead1971]

porting cuts out some of the rifling groove portion of the barrel. I know thay claim it won't affect accuracy but on a 3" barrel, it just seems it would affect something. Maybe since the cut is towards the front and not back helps.

Can anyone explain why cutting out little holes in the barrel would not cause accuracy issues?

[Moto_joe]

Try the 9mm, then a .40 back to back. Or even the .380, then the .40. My .40 after about a box and a half my hands start to tremble slightly and accuracy goes to crap. I can shoot the 9mm or .380 for 8-10 boxes (well I have only done that on the 9mm) and still be fine.

[Bawanna]

porting cuts out some of the rifling groove portion of the barrel. I know thay claim it won't affect accuracy but on a 3" barrel, it just seems it would affect something. Maybe since the cut is towards the front and not back helps.

Can anyone explain why cutting out little holes in the barrel would not cause accuracy issues?

The holes aren't very large, they are within a half inch of the muzzle. I don't know exactly how they cut them, has to be a laser or something, there's no finish damage, or any kind of cosmetic repair. Looks like the hole just magically appeared somehow. Suppose to be little or no negative impact on accuracy or velocity. Didn't hurt my 40 one little bit accuracy wise, don't have a chrono so can't attest to the velocity statement. When I get my nerve built up and my piggy bank a little fuller my PM45 will go under the laser. No qualms whatsoever from me. In my infinitely small mind, I don't think it hurts a thing.

[wyntrout]

Don't you have a drill press and vise?? You can port your own.:D

Dang! I just remembered all of those cutting and drilling thingies that came with my DLT!:w00t:

I imagine that they use some kind of plasma cutter or high-powered laser so that the metal is just vaporized, leaving no burrs or debris.

I need to take my Nines to the range and compare steel to Tupperware again. After shooting that High Power the other day, I'm wondering if the guy was using "reduced" target loads, making it feel like a .22.

Wynn:D

[Bawanna]

Don't you have a drill press and vise?? You can port your own.:D

Dang! I just remembered all of those cutting and drilling thingies that came with my DLT!:w00t:

I imagine that they use some kind of plasma cutter or high-powered laser so that the metal is just vaporized, leaving no burrs or debris.

I need to take my Nines to the range and compare steel to Tupperware again. After shooting that High Power the other day, I'm wondering if the guy was using "reduced" target loads, making it feel like a .22.

Wynn:D

You better stay away from the DLT for awhile till your condition stabalizes. Your becoming the Tim the Toolman of the Kahr world down there. While your at it, why don't you send that PM45 back to the mothership and tell them to send you one with writting on the side like it should be. Should help your kahr karma and produce a more harmonious outcome.

[jocko]

Try the 9mm, then a .40 back to back. Or even the .380, then the .40. My .40 after about a box and a half my hands start to tremble slightly and accuracy goes to crap. I can shoot the 9mm or .380 for 8-10 boxes (well I have only done that on the 9mm) and still be fine.

glock 19 is magna ported and it shoots in the same hole. My K9 is magna ported and it shoots better than I willever shoot it. I don't think the cuts mae one bit of difference in accuracy. Sure never been proven otherwise that I am aware of.

[wyntrout]

I emailed Ian last Friday evening and sent about a dozen pictures of my project P380 and asked about the look of the slide lock and spring. I haven't heard from him and I wonder if he's on vacation??
P380 owners, does your slide lock have a stepped-pin like mine. Since I discovered that and fiddled with the spring, it's much harder to poke the pin back in because of that step... maybe if I beveled the step just a teensy bit...?
Wynn:w00t:

[jlottmc]

The process Magna Port uses is called EDM machining, short for electrode discharge machining. The process works by basically turning a chemical into plasma, the only place that gets warm is at the chemical, it actually uses the metal for a catalyst to reduce the surrounding heat. It's more complicated than all of that, but that's it in a nutshell.

[wyntrout]

Yeah, that's what I figured, but those industrial lasers are pretty clean cutters, too, but probably leave too rough a surface. Controlled vaporization is good.
Wynn

[Bawanna]

I emailed Ian last Friday evening and sent about a dozen pictures of my project P380 and asked about the look of the slide lock and spring. I haven't heard from him and I wonder if he's on vacation??
P380 owners, does your slide lock have a stepped-pin like mine. Since I discovered that and fiddled with the spring, it's much harder to poke the pin back in because of that step... maybe if I beveled the step just a teensy bit...?
Wynn:w00t:

Step away from the DLT. Not good to mess with mother nature or Justin Moon. If it needed a teensy bit of bevel they would have beveled it.
Don't make me come down there.
If I do come down there I'm stealing your van. I don't got a Harley and the air conditionings on the blink in mine. Another one of Ford's better freaking idea's.

[jlottmc]

They leave lots of slag. With the EDM process, there is no slag, and it's halfway polished when done. The metal comes out of the process smooth, and the holes look like they've always been there. The equipment is rather expensive, but pays for itself in short order. As a side note, the process was developed for the aerospace industry, and in fact the man who started Magna-Port came from NASA.

[racuda]

I emailed Ian last Friday evening and sent about a dozen pictures of my project P380 and asked about the look of the slide lock and spring. I haven't heard from him and I wonder if he's on vacation??
P380 owners, does your slide lock have a stepped-pin like mine. Since I discovered that and fiddled with the spring, it's much harder to poke the pin back in because of that step... maybe if I beveled the step just a teensy bit...?
Wynn:w00t:

Yes, my slide stop is stepped just like yours. Perhaps you should "unfiddle" the spring...:) It actually looks bent up. Does the slide still lock open when empty?

[Michael W.]

I emailed Ian last Friday evening and sent about a dozen pictures of my project P380 and asked about the look of the slide lock and spring. I haven't heard from him and I wonder if he's on vacation??
P380 owners, does your slide lock have a stepped-pin like mine. Since I discovered that and fiddled with the spring, it's much harder to poke the pin back in because of that step... maybe if I beveled the step just a teensy bit...?
Wynn:w00t:


Wynn,

My P380 has the stepped pin and the thinner part is a sleeve that
rotates although not as freely as the pin on my PM45.
My P380 also requires that I am more careful when inserting
the pin back in because everything is miniaturized and the "stepped"
design of the pin allows the pin to be "off center" or slightly angled
before it is properly "located" by the fatter part of the pin.

What I do is push the pin in gently until the step then carefully wiggle it
until it's located correctly before popping it into place. This avoids
catching the wrong side of the slide stop spring when it goes in.
I would highly recommend against beveling the polymer pin hole.
This can only exacerbate the issue by allowing the pin even more play
when initially inserting the stepped down portion and I think would precipitate
wear in the polymer frame by allowing the pin hole to be wallowed out more
easily.

Michael-

[jocko]

definitely do not mess with the slide stop hole. If u bevel it and it doesnt work then you hacve certainly voi8ded your warranty.

[Michael W.]

Yes, my slide stop is stepped just like yours. Perhaps you should "unfiddle" the spring...:) It actually looks bent up. Does the slide still lock open when empty?

racuda,

Off topic: is that a Westie in your avatar?
Our first "child" was a Westie. He hung in there for 16 years
was a faithful loyal friend to us, welcomed each of 3 of our
babies when they came and guarded them loyally.
We lost him in 2004. It was pretty devastating.

Michael-

[racuda]

racuda,

Off topic: is that a Westie in your avatar?
Our first "child" was a Westie. He hung in there for 16 years
was a faithful loyal friend to us, welcomed each of 3 of our
babies when they came and guarded them loyally.
We lost him in 2004. It was pretty devastating.

Michael-


Yes, it is Max the vermin killer Westie. He is just a youngster at 2 1/2 years. He is easily the smartest dog I've ever had, eagerly learning every command and trick I've tried to teach him.

[wyntrout]

No, I wasn't thinking of beveling the plastic, but the leading edge of the step a tiny bit. I always thought it was the hole on the other side that was hard to get the pin into, but it's the edge of that step, I guess. I'm not altering any of that, but I am taking more care than before and making sure the free end of the spring is atop and in its groove to properly tension the slide stop.
My next trip to the range, I'm thinking of putting the original Kahr springs back in the magazines and see if the P380 works better and doesn't have the premature slide-locks before the magazine is empty. A new slide stop and spring might help, but I'm waiting to hear from Ian. Maybe he's on vacation?
My mods to the magazines were drastic and since doing that, I've figured that all I needed to do was a tiny inside nick on the rear inside of the magazine lips, with a small triangular file... just a tiny bit to create the smallest detent necessary. I can't undo the ones I modified, but they seem to work. A lighter spring might solve the problem with my "project gun".
Hmmm... looking about for more uses of the DLT. There are a lot of little bits and thingies that I haven't tried to use.
Wynn:w00t::D

[jlottmc]

Wynn you just leave those bits alone. We all know how you get carried away, and what happens next. If you must play with your tools, then don't do it on your new guns, find some old pipe or metal or something, just stay away from the guns with that thing. :31::7::crazy::boink:. I hope these little guys help some.