Glock 23 to CW9 Questions

[MichSteve]

I just purchased a PM9 and have shot it and like it, if it carries well in the front pocket I won't need my Ruger LCP either.

I have had a Glock 23 for 10 years or so, it is a great accurate gun, I took my CCL with it, however, I never have carried it for more than a couple of hours. I know there are some great holsters that make carrying 23 easier and comfortable. I don't like the 3-4 o'clock position for carry, I prefer the appendix position. The Glock is to thick and heavy for this.

To be honest the Glock 23 is in the safe unloaded 99% of the time.

So I was thinking of a Glock 26, one reason is to go to 9mm, and the other was for easier carrying, the weight a little lighter than the model 23, but the thickness the same. The local gun shop said the difference between the two not worth the money, I agree.

The Kahr CW9 was at the gun store and I looked at it and held it, I am new to Kahr's so they feel different to me. The slimness and weight of the CW9 looks like a easy carry in appendix position.

Question #1: Is the CW9 as accurate as a Glock 26, or am I kidding myself and will always miss the Glock?

Question #2: The Kahr CW9 is $435 new and the trade in price for my Glock 23 is $315, is this a descent price?

Question #3: Appendix carry anyone have any experience, if so what holster?

Thanks for your help.

[jocko]

U wll miss the glock, IMO it is more accurate for sure, due to the trigger systems being different. BUT the CW9 will put um in the same hole if you do your part. The trade price to me sounds reasonable.

Is there any chance you can rent a cw9 to give it a trial????. I love my G19, it out shoots my PM9 any day of the week for me BUT it is my home/range fun and would be my go to gun if shtf also. Love thosue 15 rounds over 7. Would be ice to just keep both if possable.

[rkirk]

I would keep the 23. I don't think $300 is a good price for your Glock. I paid $425 for my CW9. While the trigger on the CW9 is different from the Glock your CW9 is as accurate as the Glock. My CW9 has over 500 rounds fired and I am able to accurately shoot the pistol. It took a good part of the 200 round break in recommended by Kahr before I was able to shoot my CW9 comfortably. I did buy a Hogue slip on grip to soften the abrasive Kahr polymer grip. It is my carry pistol and I am certain the pistol would carry in the appendix position. I would look at the Comp-Tac 2 O'clock or other holsters IWB or OWB that have little or no forward cant for carrying in this position. Perhaps someone that carries their Kahr in the appendix position will chime in with a holster.

-- Richard

[recoilguy]

I have the CW9 and the G26. I carry my CW9 99% of the time. I can shoot it as good as the Glock. I shot the Glock very well the first timeI touched it. Once I shot a box through the CW9 I was right there with the Glock. I love my CW9 and carry it everywhere. I would also keepthe Glock.....300 for the Glock unless you really need the $$$ to make the deal.

Holster...look here http://kahrtalk.com/holsters-gear/2176-leather-kydex-hybrid-holster-pm9-p380.html

I carry mine in a NICE HOLSTER (http://www.jndtactical.com) very good too.

RCG

[linksrds]

I would opt for the CW9 over the Glock..The Glock is a good pistol and it does shoot well, but i do not prefer the trigger system...

I have the CW 9 and at 7 yards, I can keep a magazine in 1 1/2" circle if I work at it...If I just shoot rapidly, I can keep all the rounds in a fist sized group...More than adequate for a combat situation.

I find that the Kahr points better than the Glock, somthing tha makes it very easy to shoot.

While the magazine does hold 7, or 8 + 1 in the chamber, I do believe that would be more than enough for a personal protection situation.

I also have a Beretta 92FS, and that is just too big for day in, day out wear. I think you would find that the same with the Glock.

AS far as a trade in, $300 is not a unreasonable price. Figure the owner will mark it up to about $425 to $450 depending on the condition of the pistol.

To keep it would be good, but if you must get rid of it, see if they will put it up on consignment. Most consignment sale fees are 10 to 15% of the sale price.

One additional thought...my CW9 never had so much as a hicup while shooting it during the break-in period.

[medezyner]

It’s kind of interesting how many wrestle with these same or very similar questions regarding Glock & Kahr. Myself; I had the G26 first, then the PM9. I was so happy with the PM9’s accuracy (but not until I went through a fair amount of rounds) and it’s concealability, that I sold the 26 and don’t regret it (even though I liked it). I’m just not into guns collecting dust in my safe; I buy them to use them. Ok, well maybe I don’t fire the M1 as much as I should.

[jfrey]

After getting my CW9 I put my G36 in the safe and only shoot it when I want something different. The Kahr is just as accurate as the Glock and a lot easier to carry and conceal. I've put a lot of shots into a 2X2 in. hole at 10 yds. many times so far. The more I shoot it, the more I like it. The trigger took some getting used to but I really like it now. I can transition between it and my target model 1911 with no problem.

[citrusdog]

I just purchased a PM9 and have shot it and like it, if it carries well in the front pocket I won't need my Ruger LCP either.

I have had a Glock 23 for 10 years or so, it is a great accurate gun, I took my CCL with it, however, I never have carried it for more than a couple of hours. I know there are some great holsters that make carrying 23 easier and comfortable. I don't like the 3-4 o'clock position for carry, I prefer the appendix position. The Glock is to thick and heavy for this.

To be honest the Glock 23 is in the safe unloaded 99% of the time.

So I was thinking of a Glock 26, one reason is to go to 9mm, and the other was for easier carrying, the weight a little lighter than the model 23, but the thickness the same. The local gun shop said the difference between the two not worth the money, I agree.

The Kahr CW9 was at the gun store and I looked at it and held it, I am new to Kahr's so they feel different to me. The slimness and weight of the CW9 looks like a easy carry in appendix position.

Question #1: Is the CW9 as accurate as a Glock 26, or am I kidding myself and will always miss the Glock?

Question #2: The Kahr CW9 is $435 new and the trade in price for my Glock 23 is $315, is this a descent price?

Question #3: Appendix carry anyone have any experience, if so what holster?

Thanks for your help.

CC considerations for firearms...

1.) Reliability
2.) Reliability
3.) Reliability
4.) Concealbility
5.) Fire power (caliber)
6.) Round count
7.) Accuracy... needed for B.)

To me, there's 1 approach... and two 2 different components.

A.) "A get off me... or get away from me" carry...
B.) "Holy sh*t... all hell is breaking loose!" carry...

Although, after conducting my own 2 year study of personal defense - I'm sure my belief/carry system is different than most.

Older Glocks need trigger jobs... I upgraded a 1998 23 to a 2009 23... Newer is better.

Although new to Kahr... I'm attracted to the quality and purpose of their stuff. Have two P380's... love 1... the other in Worcester, MA ...we'll see

[Bawanna]

Pretty much agree except for the newer is better line. Perhaps specifically related to old Glock triggers and new Glock triggers but for me things are usually just the opposite. I usually get along better with old stuff, guns, tools, cars, PEOPLE. Plus I really dig old stuff except perhaps myself, I hate my old self, so in some respects I guess old sucks.
As far as your 2 year study on personal defense, I'm curious what you studied the other 23 months and 2 weeks.

Welcome to the asylum, we like it here and hope you do too.

[citrusdog]

Pretty much agree except for the newer is better line. Perhaps specifically related to old Glock triggers and new Glock triggers but for me things are usually just the opposite. I usually get along better with old stuff, guns, tools, cars, PEOPLE. Plus I really dig old stuff except perhaps myself, I hate my old self, so in some respects I guess old sucks.
As far as your 2 year study on personal defense, I'm curious what you studied the other 23 months and 2 weeks.

Welcome to the asylum, we like it here and hope you do too.

Yes, it is related to the old glock triggers. The newer ones are much better.

Yes, all of my revolvers are older... the newer stuff - is just not the same quality as the older stuff - I would agree. I own 5 revolvers made before 1997 - and their quality is superior to most of the revolvers produced today... (many are Taurus)... Although, I might exclude a relatively recent Ruger sp101 or two from that group... Even Smith is saving money and reducing their Q&A of firearms going out the door. This stuff can be seen all the time - at an old friend of mine - who is a gunsmith.

Since you're old, ...think you're a witty old fellow - and don't know me from a hole in the wall. I'll be kind and only partially bite...

I'm not your brown-eyed buddy. I have a couple of copyrights and multiple pieces of published literature after conducting multi-year studys - on a few different subjects. My 3rd independent study - is one of 'defense with a handgun' ...which turned into home, car, everywhere.... It's been going on since early 2008... I'm not sure you understand what the basis or approach is for a study like this is... or how you go about even beginning something like this.

But... I am sure I could change your thoughts about personal defense, home defense, car defense, transition defense, etc... As I have changed many, many very seasoned gun owners/ccw holders, policemen and women who think differently about personal defense with fireams - after seeing and hearing my findings. I train and consult with ccw holders all the time - and most switch to all my methods - because they create significant advantages. Best $ they ever spent - according to them. It is not by accident that my stuff is NOT on youtube. As a matter of fact, that is quite purposeful. I don't train bad guys - or anyone that do not posess a ccw.

I will leave you with 2 clues... First, what I do for a living is tear things down to their most base level - and rebuild them in a superior fashion - that no one has or would have considered before. Second, for a deeper understanding of anything - work in reverse. ;)

Btw, I turn 50 soon... I'm old too... :eek:

[Bawanna]

With the exception of the brown eyed buddy? Not sure where that came from? Probably so, probably so.
I'm still recovering from the fact that I haven't shot 1000 rounds thru a 357 Sig so I don't know what side my butters breaded on, so thanks so much for the only partial bite. Hardly any pain worth mentioning.
Just for the record I didn't mean to imply that 2 years of personal protection study was a waste or frivolous, I was more curious as to what the study entailed. You've enlightened me in that area immensely now and I feel no need to pursue it further. Your quite obviously on a higher plane in the defensive world than I which to my thinking is as it should be. Obviously my choice of wording was apparently off the mark for which I apologize immensely.

All of which means very little to you of course or I for that matter.

ok bye

[citrusdog]

With the exception of the brown eyed buddy? Not sure where that came from? Probably so, probably so.
I'm still recovering from the fact that I haven't shot 1000 rounds thru a 357 Sig so I don't know what side my butters breaded on, so thanks so much for the only partial bite. Hardly any pain worth mentioning.
Just for the record I didn't mean to imply that 2 years of personal protection study was a waste or frivolous, I was more curious as to what the study entailed. You've enlightened me in that area immensely now and I feel no need to pursue it further. Your quite obviously on a higher plane in the defensive world than I which to my thinking is as it should be. Obviously my choice of wording was apparently off the mark for which I apologize immensely.

All of which means very little to you of course or I for that matter.

ok bye


"As far as your 2 year study on personal defense, I'm curious what you studied the other 23 months and 2 weeks."

Yes... your words (and they mean something) struck a nerve with me. They're actually quite condescending. Sir, you don't know me - you don't know what I do - and your words imply that you think I am full of sh*t (my eyes are not brown). You speak in jibberish - in an effort to degrade what I've said. It proves my point that you think - there's no more to learn about the subject - and you've got it covered for all of us. Well, I've met and changed many seasoned firearm owners - over to better systems.

[yoyomeng]

Well this came out of no where...

:53: :59:

[getsome]

No kidding, Wow, looks like we better round up the women and children before the lead starts to fly!!!...:behindsofa:....By the way, I just completed my own 2 year study on CCW and self defense....In the end after countless hours of extensive research and study I found that the bottom line is that it's always best to shoot back first!!!...:D

[Bawanna]

No worries about the woman and children. There will be no lead flying from my direction. Perhaps in my direction but I'm not fighting back.
I fully intended to just leave this thread and roll away but find it nawing at my innards.
Anyone who has been with kahrtalk more than 1 day knows that bawanna don't put nobody down, he don't look down his nose at nobody, and rarely will criticize anyone. I'm a firm to each his own believer. Occasionally someone new or old will take it upon themselves to pick on some of our members who I consider very good pals. THAT will usually set me off which of course really shouldn't be frightening to anyone of course. My thoughts and opinions are my very own, many times folks don't agree with me, sometimes nobody agrees with me and you know what, that's ok.
I once again and for the last time apologize to citrus dog if I hit the wrong buttons. I'm also a firm believer that when the balloon goes up I'll be resorting to tribal instincts, I'll just do the best I can, draw, aim, push trigger and let God sort us out. I've been a student of the gun and all things related a whole lot longer than 2 years, still dont have it figured out. I've not published a 3x5 card to share with anyone. I dont claim to be an expert at anything and question the credibility of anyone who claims to be. I find that those who claim to be so are usually the least qualified.
In summary, I get along with 99.7% (just a guess, not a rocket scientist) of people. I don't slander or put down anyone unless they just sorely deserve it. Whatever works for anyone is A ok with me. Give the children ice cream and roses to the ladies, this battle is over on my end.

[jocko]

not sure an apology was even needed Bawanna. Citurs Dog IMo needs to count to 10 before he comes back with a post like that. Might must save alot of embarrasment on each side. If your gonna wear your feelings on the end of your shirt sleeve then this forum will bite you where u don't want to get bit. Book um Dano!!

[jim3597]

Amen Jocko!:75:

[citrusdog]

No worries about the woman and children. There will be no lead flying from my direction. Perhaps in my direction but I'm not fighting back.
I fully intended to just leave this thread and roll away but find it nawing at my innards.
Anyone who has been with kahrtalk more than 1 day knows that bawanna don't put nobody down, he don't look down his nose at nobody, and rarely will criticize anyone. I'm a firm to each his own believer. Occasionally someone new or old will take it upon themselves to pick on some of our members who I consider very good pals. THAT will usually set me off which of course really shouldn't be frightening to anyone of course. My thoughts and opinions are my very own, many times folks don't agree with me, sometimes nobody agrees with me and you know what, that's ok.
I once again and for the last time apologize to citrus dog if I hit the wrong buttons. I'm also a firm believer that when the balloon goes up I'll be resorting to tribal instincts, I'll just do the best I can, draw, aim, push trigger and let God sort us out. I've been a student of the gun and all things related a whole lot longer than 2 years, still dont have it figured out. I've not published a 3x5 card to share with anyone. I dont claim to be an expert at anything and question the credibility of anyone who claims to be. I find that those who claim to be so are usually the least qualified.
In summary, I get along with 99.7% (just a guess, not a rocket scientist) of people. I don't slander or put down anyone unless they just sorely deserve it. Whatever works for anyone is A ok with me. Give the children ice cream and roses to the ladies, this battle is over on my end.


You really have a tendency to speak out of one side of your mouth - and then other. We have enough of those in the white house. You preach to people that you don’t put anyone down… Yet, you slip in subtle little jabs that seem to come off your keyboard - without control.

Well, let’s see here…

”Anyone who has been with kahrtalk more than 1 day knows that bawanna don't put nobody down, he don't look down his nose at nobody, and rarely will criticize anyone.”

*** okay, good guy

Really? Well, according to you I was sleeping for the last 23 months and 2 weeks.

*** okay, bad guy

“I once again and for the last time apologize to citrus dog if I hit the wrong buttons.”

*** okay, good guy

“I've been a student of the gun and all things related a whole lot longer than 2 years, still dont have it figured out. I've not published a 3x5 card to share with anyone. I dont claim to be an expert at anything and question the credibility of anyone who claims to be. I find that those who claim to be so are usually the least qualified.”

*** okay, bad guy

”In summary, I get along with 99.7% (just a guess, not a rocket scientist) of people.”

*** okay, good/bad guy… get along with everyone except me (the rocket scientist)

Well, okay, let me ask you a couple of questions…

Have you interview 20+ people (both male and female) that have been fired upon at short and medium range - and have lived to tell about it?

Have you collected over 70 pages of the most detailed information surrounding each and every event - to the fullest level of detail?

Have you sat with these and other people who train for events like these - and discussed current training techniques and their corresponding responses?

Have you considered all exposure, vulnerabilities and motion in situational defense?

Have you considered that woman and men have different exposures and challenges - and they must take different to satisfy their maximum the chance of winning the altercation - if it arises.

If you have pursued all of this information and collected it… your entire outlook changes. You begin to realize that many new and different aspects begin to become paramount - as they relate to personal defense.


I can only tell you so much.. before I begin to educate the bad guys. BTW, do you defend your home with shotgun - and own a safe for your guns? If so, you might just be more old school than I thought... Did you know there are far superior methods to address issues like these?


Signed,

The Rocket Scientist

[Bawanna]

You really have a tendency to speak out of one side of your mouth - and then other. We have enough of those in the white house. You preach to people that you don’t put anyone down… Yet, you slip in subtle little jabs that seem to come off your keyboard - without control.

Well, let’s see here…

”Anyone who has been with kahrtalk more than 1 day knows that bawanna don't put nobody down, he don't look down his nose at nobody, and rarely will criticize anyone.”

*** okay, good guy

Really? Well, according to you I was sleeping for the last 23 months and 2 weeks.

*** okay, bad guy

“I once again and for the last time apologize to citrus dog if I hit the wrong buttons.”

*** okay, good guy

“I've been a student of the gun and all things related a whole lot longer than 2 years, still dont have it figured out. I've not published a 3x5 card to share with anyone. I dont claim to be an expert at anything and question the credibility of anyone who claims to be. I find that those who claim to be so are usually the least qualified.”

*** okay, bad guy

”In summary, I get along with 99.7% (just a guess, not a rocket scientist) of people.”

*** okay, good/bad guy… get along with everyone except me (the rocket scientist)

Well, okay, let me ask you a couple of questions…

Have you interview 20+ people (both male and female) that have been fired upon at short and medium range - and have lived to tell about it?

Have you collected over 70 pages of the most detailed information surrounding each and every event - to the fullest level of detail?

Have you sat with these and other people who train for events like these - and discussed current training techniques and their corresponding responses?

Have you considered all exposure, vulnerabilities and motion in situational defense?

Have you considered that woman and men have different exposures and challenges - and they must take different to satisfy their maximum the chance of winning the altercation - if it arises.

If you have pursued all of this information and collected it… your entire outlook changes. You begin to realize that many new and different aspects begin to become paramount - as they relate to personal defense.


I can only tell you so much.. before I begin to educate the bad guys. BTW, do you defend your home with shotgun - and own a safe for your guns? If so, you might just be more old school than I thought... Did you know there are far superior methods to address issues like these?


Signed,

The Rocket Scientist

I'm not going to do verbal judo with you and this will be my last communication with you. For what it's worth you are improving in your communication skills in that your at least giving a brief summary of what you researched, something that might have been valuable in your original post, instead of bragidacio that you can't share with mere mortals, it's sooo good. In my own infinitely small mind your reinventing the wheel as all the things you've mentioned have been researched before both in civiallian capacities and LE officer scenarios. While I spend precious little time reading them they are interesting but doubt they will save me in a civillian capacity in a gun fight.
In case it matters I do not defend my home with a shotgun although I have them available for options. I do indeed own a gun safe but my home defense and ccw weapons are not in it unless I'm away for an extended period of time.
I'm sure theres 1 or 2 others here that would gladly sent you a check for your invaluable information but I think I'll just stumble thru as I have and hope for the best.
Regards
Missouri Dirt Farmer

[MichSteve]

Guys, guys, I am sorry I started the post could the moderator please stop or remove this post.

[jocko]

Mich Steve. No harm,no foul. I just feel citrus dog wants to argue which is his right, but also our right to just from now on ignore and move on which is what I fully intend to do as of this post..

Personally Bawanna, u own us no explanation of what kind of defense you have in your home...

[Bawanna]

Guys, guys, I am sorry I started the post could the moderator please stop or remove this post.

MichSteve, it's cool, it was a good thread. Keep em coming. I'm going to a neutral corner and I'm filled with joy. We experience this from time to time and it sometimes actually relieves the boredom on slow days. I'm sure there's lots of lurkers out there flopping around on the ground laughing till their sides hurt.
I hold no animosity, for some reason we're just not gelling.
Thank goodness we don't each own a country or something where we could start a war, no good for me. I'd be Switzerland.
I'll be 10 10 on the side.

Peace out.

[MichSteve]

Thanks for the reply Bawanna45cal I was just looking for information, I understand some just like to be difficult, so just ignoring them is best. No harm done on my part.

[Bawanna]

Information is what this place is all about. I wouldn't even label him difficult, that would be picking sides which shouldn't be necessary around here, but just in case it ever does, I want you on my side.
Nothing wrong on your part and no harm done. Where's the white flag sticky.:p Best I could come up with.

[jocko]

Information is what this place is all about. I wouldn't even label him difficult, that would be picking sides which shouldn't be necessary around here, but just in case it ever does, I want you on my side.
Nothing wrong on your part and no harm done. Where's the white flag sticky.:p Best I could come up with.

the french have all the white flags:D

[Bawanna]

Your right I forgot. My Bad!

[Michael W.]

Well I may be late in laying my scent onto this fire hydrant, but to
get things back on point, as I have replied in other "Glock vs. Kahr"
posts.....I don't think that it's really an "either/or" proposition
but rather a "both". I won't go into the boring details of why a Glock
19 or 23 is a highly desirable weapon to have on hand. I also will not
argue against why a "proven reliable" Kahr will accompany you places
where your G23 or G26 will probably stay at home in the safe.

Keep the Glock, save up and buy a Kahr. Two guns is always better than one:)

Michael-

P.S. My opinion is wholly my own but was derived after at least 2 weeks of
intense research. Bawanna, please don't ask me what I was doing during the
latter 12 of those days......it's not a pretty picture......you'll regret asking
me.....and no you won't find it on Youtube......

[Bawanna]

Well I may be late in laying my scent onto this fire hydrant, but to
get things back on point, as I have replied in other "Glock vs. Kahr"
posts.....I don't think that it's really an "either/or" proposition
but rather a "both". I won't go into the boring details of why a Glock
19 or 23 is a highly desirable weapon to have on hand. I also will not
argue against why a "proven reliable" Kahr will accompany you places
where your G23 or G26 will probably stay at home in the safe.

Keep the Glock, save up and buy a Kahr. Two guns is always better than one:)

Michael-

P.S. My opinion is wholly my own but was derived after at least 2 weeks of
intense research. Bawanna, please don't ask me what I was doing during the
latter 12 of those days......it's not a pretty picture......you'll regret asking
me.....and no you won't find it on Youtube......

Right when the fire dies down to embers and coals, there's always someone comes along with a can of kerosene.
Not a pretty picture huh? I feel kind of stupid but what's Youtube? Like whatagrip? No regrets, I'm not asking, would like to see the picture though.

[jlottmc]

I carry a P45 in about 4-6 o'clock, I use either a Don Hume model unknown, or an el cheapo tuckable from CTD, as for the Glock vs Kahr, I agree two guns are always better than one. If Glock trips your trigger, then by all means, I personally don't care about a Glock one way or the other. Your Kahr should be able to hold it's own against the Glock or any other taker, if you do your part. Bottom line, if you like shoot it, if not don't. As for the Glock being too large, some might say that, but I won't. I carry full size steel framed guns all the time, and to barrow a line from Clint Smith..."It's a big gun when I put it on, and it's a big gun when I pull it out."

[RogerP9fan]

This thread has been very helpful to me as well. (Day 1 here)

[Bawanna]

This was a good one, I'd forgotten all about this one. Thanks for bringing it up again.

[jlottmc]

I love this bar... This is what we do here, and as has been pointed out, we need to get back to it.

[RogerP9fan]

Yeah, I'll be keeping my G23 as primary HD.
My G27 as primary carry.
But, hey...... that may just change as I just ordered my P9 15 minutes ago! :)