Gun range refuses access to Muslims

[AJBert]

Kudos to the lady in every way possible!

http://news.yahoo.com/muslim-free-gun-range-arkansas-160333108.html

[GLOCKROCKER]

My kind of girl!:yo: Another suggestion would be to put the muslim entrance on the target end of the range.

[kenm]

I was initially very troubled when I saw this thread's heading, as religious liberty is something most of us take for granted in this country.
I read the linked article and then decided to do a little research on the Oklahoma beheading - which is WAY too close to home.
I lived in Oklahoma for quite some years before I came to CA, so I made a couple of phone calls (yes, that old-fashioned, non-SMS text communication option).
Turns out the local rags found evidence that the perp had been delving into some extremist Islamic ideas, although as of yesterday, there is no clear evidence he'd changed his religion. He was a Christian and had Jesus tattooed on his body, although he was trying to "convert" workmates to Islam!! (BTW, Islam very clearly recognizes the divinity of the Christ). As we know, Moses, Jesus and Mohammed were all Middle Eastern.
Islam is attractive to the poor and downtrodden because in general it has no "class" or "caste" system. So historically, "lower caste" Asians and other disenfranchised people tended to gravitate towards that religion.
I'm not sure if the range owner is simply grandstanding for publicity, but I'm now leaning towards supporting her right to act upon her fears and to "protect herself and her customers, without using physical force, but by taking a stand.

[jocko]

I would allow them to stand downrasnge and hold the targets, but this lady gets my vote.

[Bawanna]

I always believed that any business has the right to not serve anyone they choose not to serve for any reason.

If I had a gun shop I would not want a bunch of long haired freaky dudes hanging around scaring off normal folks.

I wouldn't be a good business owner with my profiling skills. Probably wouldn't let anybody in.

[b4uqzme]

I was initially very troubled when I saw this thread's heading, as religious liberty is something most of us take for granted in this country...

I believe in Liberty too. Also in everyone's Liberty to EXCLUDE anyone for any reason. How is forcing someone to do business with another with whom they do not want to do business Liberty? Regardless of her motive, she is free to do as she pleases IMHO.

[Bawanna]

I believe in Liberty too. Also in everyone's Liberty to EXCLUDE anyone for any reason. How is forcing someone to do business with another with whom they do not want to do business Liberty? Regardless of her motive, she is free to do as she pleases IMHO.

Dang it son, you oughta be one of them statesman. Motivational speakers. That was beautiful. Went down like fine scotch. Very tolerable.

Well done.

[b4uqzme]

'Twas bourbon...but thanks.

[b4uqzme]

The true test of Liberty is respecting someone's right to be wrong.

[GROTMAN]

Have to give her a big thumbs up. Pretty, smart and likes guns !!
http://thepoliticalcarnival.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/thumbsup.png (http://thepoliticalcarnival.net/2011/05/22/second-poll-has-d-hochul-leading-in-ny-26/thumbsup-6/)

[kenm]

I always believed that any business has the right to not serve anyone they choose not to serve for any reason.

If I had a gun shop I would not want a bunch of long haired freaky dudes hanging around scaring off normal folks.

I wouldn't be a good business owner with my profiling skills. Probably wouldn't let anybody in.

Haha - good one.

Yes, I, too tend to "profile" after numerous hassles with a certain Middle Eastern ethnic group.
When they call for appointments and I recognize the last name, I say "sorry we are full" - even if we're not and I need food on the table.
My business partner tells me off for losing paying clients, but ...

I was trying so hard to be unbiased and fair in my post - guess I'm glad I was, since the other responses have been pretty strong !! (in the direction I was "leaning").

BTW, we can refuse to allow clients who we fear might disrupt our business or cause our other clients harm. The laws that "we the people" passed in this country (Republican and today's Tea Party legislators also pushed them through) do not allow us to discriminate on Race, religion, etc. But nothing stops us from refusing service to someone we believe is dangerous - whether he looks like a radical muslim or a Hassidic jew.

I love this forum - its a breath of fresh air where one does not have to be PC.

Keep on shooting, and "Onward .......soldiers.......war....."

[GLOCKROCKER]

I believe in Liberty too. Also in everyone's Liberty to EXCLUDE anyone for any reason. How is forcing someone to do business with another with whom they do not want to do business Liberty? Regardless of her motive, she is free to do as she pleases IMHO.

AMEN +1:amflag:

[Bawanna]

"I love this forum - its a breath of fresh air where one does not have to be PC."

Partly true but we do have a line. Perhaps sadly I'm probably one of the worst offenders for charging right up to and sometimes on the PC line in the sand.

Our wise and highly respected admin allows loose reins especially when discussing our gun rights and the people who would take them away.

So we're a little loose perhaps but we do have guidelines to be sure.

I do often times regret the day we added a political arena, seems to have taken over the whole forum. A lot of thought went into weather to create one or not, we mostly thought against it but ended up doing it anyway in an effort to save the good parts of the forum.

Often times I think now we made a mistake. But you can't turn back the clock.

[Ikeo74]

The last thing we want to see is renting a firearm to a Muslin and having him kill you with your own gun at your own range. We sure as he!! don't need to help them become better shots by letting them use our ranges.

[b4uqzme]

"I love this forum - its a breath of fresh air where one does not have to be PC."

Partly true but we do have a line. Perhaps sadly I'm probably one of the worst offenders for charging right up to and sometimes on the PC line in the sand.

Our wise and highly respected admin allows loose reins especially when discussing our gun rights and the people who would take them away.

So we're a little loose perhaps but we do have guidelines to be sure.

I do often times regret the day we added a political arena, seems to have taken over the whole forum. A lot of thought went into weather to create one or not, we mostly thought against it but ended up doing it anyway in an effort to save the good parts of the forum.

Often times I think now we made a mistake. But you can't turn back the clock.

It's OK IHMO Colonel. There's just a lot to be frustrated about in today's world. Besides, we do get a gun post every now and then.

[sharpetop]

My feeling is that she owns/runs the range, she can invite or ban any body she wants. It's not like she's violating any equal opportunity employment laws, she's just protecting other patrons. It's no different than Buffalo Wild Wings banning firearms, to protect other patrons, IMHO. Screw CAIR!

[TheTman]

I think a good way around all that for the gun shop owner, is that they require every weapon brought in to be examined, and then use a product with lard added to it, to wipe their fingerprints off the gun, and state the fact that their cleaner has lard in it. In large signs, with in English and Arabic. Or even better, don't put up any signs, just inspect the gun and wipe it down, and mention that the cleaning product had lard in it as they handed the gun back, the muslims wouldn't be able to touch the gun, or mention it after they had already took hold of the weapon and watch them freak out. They might get some free guns out of the deal, and keep them out of the hands of some Jihad minded turd bucket.

Because I imagine that she will be forced to accept the ragheads in the name of PC. Just as Christians are forced to bake cakes or take pictures of some **** "wedding", I would say my religious beliefs trump your right to force me to do anything for their sorry arses. Unfortunately some libtard judges don't see it that way.
Christians need to organize, and take on that 2-3% noisy minority that identify themselves as lgbt, and make a LOT of noise. Start suing them over the smallest things. Even if they know the case will get thrown out of court, I'm bet there are some Christian lawyers that would file the suit for whatever it cost him, and tie up the resources of the perverts. And start preaching about homosexuality being a sin again, and how bad liberals are messing up this nation. Too many Preachers are worried about losing their tax exempt status over political speech, or being sued for hate speech. The tax exemption is probably on it's way out anyway. Grow a freaking pair, and preach what the Bible says, and not this PC watered down crap. All the Pastor has to do is read a Bible passage like Leviticus 18:22 "You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination" (NKJV). Let em try and sue you for hate speech over quoting the Bible. There are a lot of other passages that say much the same thing. The congregation will get the idea. Christianity didn't grow out of people being wimps, it grew because of people willing to give everything for their beliefs. We need more people like that now.

The perverts are going to say that abominations stuff was from the Old Testament, and Jesus never said anything like that. Well, in Jesus's time they took perverts out and stoned them to death, so he probably didn't meet any. Besides, God made that statement about it being an abomination, and he doesn't change his mind about what is an abomination and what isn't. Yes Jesus spoke a lot about love, and God may love the person, yet hate the things they do.
Christians need to get organized and make some noise and drown out that noisy minority of perverts. Now they are even wanting to make pedophilia legal, and they have a real sweet and innocent looking poster gal, that got convicted of pedophilia for messing around with another gal that was a minor. Then there is this group of perverts MANBLA the Man-Boy love association trying to do the same thing with males, so they can molest young boys. This is a sick, sick society we are living in, and we need to stop this crap. And do it loudly but tastefully, not like that Westboro Baptist Church with their "God Hates ****" protests at some very inappropriate place. Sorry if I got carried away, but I am just sick to death of all this crap that is going on these days. If we don't try and change things now, or indoctrinated children sure aren't going to do anything to change things.

[b4uqzme]

... Yes Jesus spoke a lot about love, and God may love the person, yet hate the things they do..
.

There's a valuable lesson in that line.

[kenm]

TheTman
"This is a sick, sick society we are living in, and we need to stop this..."

This is so true. A small minority has been relentlessly attacking the innocence of our children, the morals of our society, and have succeeded in getting more people to believe that these perversions are "okay".
They even dare to compare the acceptance of their perversions to society's acceptance of voting rights for women!!

We have to get together to fight this now. Not just Christians, but many Buddhists, Hindus, and agnostics are horrified by all this.
Perhaps the elder statesmen of KahrTalk can help organize us into a formidable resistance to this anti-God onslaught by what can only be demonic forces, or simply George Bush's "evil doers". (before any Dems attack, I've always been registered as an Independent / non-partisan).

[jocko]

I hope u don't mind if ol jocko disagrees with yur stance. If we are prohibited from speaking our minds, then the anti's have won. be they black white or pink.I personally think that we are the majority and so we should start acting like the majority. This ferguson sh!it is totally out of hand. They want to now hang anutter cop for shooing a 18 year old out on b ond and awaiting trial and was supposed to be HOME ARREST not out on the street. He ran because he knew he was suposed to be home BY LAW. and then carryng a stolen gun, and then stupidily running. All the m edia wants now and even his commanding officer wants to know is why he shot 17 times. Fokk he missed 80%of this shots, U think he would have emptied his gun had he head shot him the first time. But this sh!t makesd news interesting, screw the facts of the case, and now u have rioters coming a thousand miles to protest AND FOR FOKKING WHAT, Two dead thugs, that just happened to be blacvk and on this fourm we seem to b e swayed away form knocking or sayinbg anythiung negative ab out blacks. Screw Muzzy's though, we can hammer the piss out of them.Its bull sh!t and I personally am offended tyhat I cannot express myself about situations that ineed are gun relarted because they are black. I do not make the rules here, and I probably donb't abide by most of them either, so thats why someof my stuff never makes it to the forum also, but I am just not gonna be told I cannot say what I thinkabout thiss situartion in ferguson. They burn the american flg right in front of our faces (*yes black did that at ferguson) and we are stupposed to temper our comments. I don';t care if a white person did that either. Veterans should be pissed and I know theyt are but they like me and most of this forum, we are the majority but we seem to have a line that we canot cross but the rioters (in this case blacks) seem to pay zaero attention to any lines. I feel bad for the police sent into ferguson and have blacks screaming down their ears and busting therir windshields and they have been told by their commander to just eat sh!t through all of this. LEO are damna good people they should not be pushed into this mess when told tha that the rules for this engagement is 99% in favor of the blacks. Bull sh!t

We can knock utter gun makers, car makers, crap obn restaurants who ban guns etc buyt oh please leave these blacks alone. Bull Sh1t.

sorry colonel, u stated ur stance hopefuy I can state mine. I thinkI still have that right, I think.

Talking about kahrs on this fourm can get very boring expecally for those of us who have been here since day one, Every damn thing about kahrs has been hashed and rehashed a 100 times. Just sayin

[jocko]

good point kenm, but where are all these buddists , Hindus and agnostics (have no fokking idea what that means). I don't see them out there makiung comments for the American flag whennitis burned right in our own cuntry. I wanna believe you but until I see some proof from these people, I just ain't buyingt into it. We all know that the majority of the black folks are good law abiding people to but where in the fokk are they when their presence shold be seen??? I have yet to see a peadceful or what ever march of theMuslim world in the cuntry about the atrocities that the ISIL is doing to our people. Where are they???Just to say these things off the tops of ones heaqd with no real factual backup, is like trying to make peace with people who don't want peace. Any towel head that walks into the restaurant that I have been regular at for over 8 years gets 100%of my attention. I hver to show my ID to vote in Indiana but yet we have judges that rule against that in uttert states for reasons that blow my mind. Get pulled over fgor speeding and tell thecop that you don't hav eto show ur license and see where it gets ur, but fokk its ok to vote 10 times with a towel wrapped around ur face. bull fokking sh!t.

[b4uqzme]

... All the m edia wants now and even his commanding officer wants to know is why he shot 17 times. ..

I shot another IDPA event today and the 17 shot topic came to mind. Truth is I couldn't always see where my shots were hitting and I took a couple of "insurance" shots to boost my score. And I was just shooting at paper silhouettes. If I had to shoot a BG who was shooting back, I'm gonna take all the insurance shots I can...until the gun goes "click". Just sayin'.

[Marine One]

Islam is attractive to the poor and downtrodden because in general it has no "class" or "caste" system. So historically, "lower caste" Asians and other disenfranchised people tended to gravitate towards that religion.

Beg to differ. Most Islamic countries have class or caste systems. They may not actively advertise that they do but it is there nonetheless. Think about Iraq, Iran, & Saudi Arabia as just a few examples. I base this on personal observation while stationed or deployed to Iraq, Saudi, and Kuwait during my Marine Corps career.

[jocko]

actully if they felt 6 shots would do the trick we would have never had 17 rounds mags. We or most all of us have noclue what adrenalin dump is, Papoer targets don't shoot back. BG's do. I just don't recall ever hearing a cop telling me they are traind to wound not stop the threat. ABG is also full of adrenalin also, so maybe it takes more than one or 4 rounds to stop the threat. These are not lone ranger movies this is reallife. I am just not sure if ur a cop if u owe any BG the first 3 shots before u do ur thing.

[yqtszhj]

I've done well and refrained for 24 post. I might as well join in.

To the original post its a free country for now so the range owner can allow in whoever she wants. I dont imagine she's getting any government money to run the range so the givernment shouldn't be able to tell her what to do.

To what ole jocko said i agree, why have we got to be so sensitive about what we want to say? Everyone can say what they want except us white guys? Well i guess I'll let the wife speak for me since she's a "minority" because she makes jocko sound like a choir girl when she gets on the topic. And don't mention jesse or al or she'll go through the roof. When jesse showed up in Dallas the other day she suggested he eat excrement since he likes stiring it up so much. Then go to liberia and help out if he's so worried.

[GLOCKROCKER]

good point kenm, but where are all these buddists , Hindus and agnostics (have no fokking idea what that means). I don't see them out there makiung comments for the American flag whennitis burned right in our own cuntry. I wanna believe you but until I see some proof from these people, I just ain't buyingt into it. We all know that the majority of the black folks are good law abiding people to but where in the fokk are they when their presence shold be seen??? I have yet to see a peadceful or what ever march of theMuslim world in the cuntry about the atrocities that the ISIL is doing to our people. Where are they???Just to say these things off the tops of ones heaqd with no real factual backup, is like trying to make peace with people who don't want peace. Any towel head that walks into the restaurant that I have been regular at for over 8 years gets 100%of my attention. I hver to show my ID to vote in Indiana but yet we have judges that rule against that in uttert states for reasons that blow my mind. Get pulled over fgor speeding and tell thecop that you don't hav eto show ur license and see where it gets ur, but fokk its ok to vote 10 times with a towel wrapped around ur face. bull fokking sh!t.

Don't hold back Jocko, tell us how you really feel! BTW that's exactly how we spell cuntry here in NC.

[knkali]

I believe in Liberty too. Also in everyone's Liberty to EXCLUDE anyone for any reason. How is forcing someone to do business with another with whom they do not want to do business Liberty? Regardless of her motive, she is free to do as she pleases IMHO.

THATS IT! I would prefer the world where this fact is not relevant but until then, this sums it up. That's freedom. However, most people are not ready to handle that kind of power(being free). When you realize you are free, I bet that the aforementioned scenario would seldom be in play. I think the overall human condition will improve to the point that many of the things we discuss here would be moot. This can only happen if you believe that people are fundamentally good and that stratifications/subgroups always form in society(s).

[muggsy]

As far as freedom of religion is concerned the first amendment prohibits the federal government from establishing an official state religion and it prohibits the federal government from denying the free exercise of any religion. It doesn't say one damn thing about me having to accept Allah as my savior. That PC crap doesn't wash with me.

[jocko]

oh my I think I am in luv with ur wife. Just sayhin