New CW380 Prep question

[Justinotto]

Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum and new to kahr with a cw380. I went to the range the other day to begin the break in process and had mixed results. It ran really well for the first 50 rounds or so but then I started having issues with a failure to feed.

I came home and reviewed the proper prep sticky and it now has me scratching my head. With regards to the following note:

#6 To check to see if you have any issues with the slide lock lever hitting the rounds in the magazine, take the slide off and insert the slide lock lever, then reinsert a loaded magazine. Check to see if the top round is hitting the slide lock lever and moving it upward. That is a NO-NO.

I checked this this and I do indeed have this issue. The question is, what is the fix? Different ammo that may have a different geometry? Or...send back to kahr because the slide lock lever has not been machined correctly?

Thanks to anyone in advance.

[GeezerD]

The slide stop issue is usually the cause of premature slide lock. A failure to feed is most likely a result of the cartridge dragging on the breech face and extractor and can be cured by polishing these areas. Most issues will resolve themselves with extensive break in but can be helped along with some light polishing. I am sure more folks will have some more info on the issue. ------------------------------- Good Luck, GeezerD

[timboy]

From what I have read you need to sand or file some material away from the area of contact on the mag catch,I'm sure someone who has done it will chime in.

[Justinotto]

I see what you're saying. What method do you use to polish the breech face and extractor?

Also, it seems to me that if the cartridge is contacting the slide lock enough to feel and visibly see the slide lock move up slightly as the round is being pushed past it, that this might be causing a problem. The sticky that I referred to said that this condition is a no-no…just wondering what the fix is to that scenario in particular…anyone else have any experience with this? Thanks

[Justinotto]

What part of the magazine exactly would I need to sand? The sides of the black plastic portion that sits directly below the last round in the magazine? Are we trying to create more clearance between this and the metal sides of the mag? Thanks

[jocko]

Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum and new to kahr with a cw380. I went to the range the other day to begin the break in process and had mixed results. It ran really well for the first 50 rounds or so but then I started having issues with a failure to feed.

I came home and reviewed the proper prep sticky and it now has me scratching my head. With regards to the following note:

#6 To check to see if you have any issues with the slide lock lever hitting the rounds in the magazine, take the slide off and insert the slide lock lever, then reinsert a loaded magazine. Check to see if the top round is hitting the slide lock lever and moving it upward. That is a NO-NO.

I checked this this and I do indeed have this issue. The question is, what is the fix? Different ammo that may have a different geometry? Or...send back to kahr because the slide lock lever has not been machined correctly?

Thanks to anyone in advance.


U have a couple of c hoices. Chanbge ammo brand to see if that correecxts it,and I would emalkahr, attn: Jay and state that the ammo ishitting the indise of the slide stop lever, and more tyhan likely they will send u a new lever, but if they say it needs to come back then let them pick it up on their dime. If rounds are hitting tyhe lever then ur gonna have issues PERIOD. If it is hiutting the inside of the lever with normal fmj ammo then IMO it needs a new slide stop lever and then if kahr says they will send u one, then u can do the doctoring to the lever u hve now by just filing that little nub down enough to provide clearance, fully knowing that if u fokk it up u have a new one coming in the mail.

[Justinotto]

U have a couple of c hoices. Chanbge ammo brand to see if that correecxts it,and I would emalkahr, attn: Jay and state that the ammo ishitting the indise of the slide stop lever, and more tyhan likely they will send u a new lever, but if they say it needs to come back then let them pick it up on their dime. If rounds are hitting tyhe lever then ur gonna have issues PERIOD. If it is hiutting the inside of the lever with normal fmj ammo then IMO it needs a new slide stop lever and then if kahr says they will send u one, then u can do the doctoring to the lever u hve now by just filing that little nub down enough to provide clearance, fully knowing that if u fokk it up u have a new one coming in the mail.


Thanks Jocko...I'll send the email.

[erichard]

I asked Kahr for a new slide lock, and they graciously sent a new one to me. With all due respect to Kahr, though, the slide stop lock was exactly the same as the one on my new Kahr. In my opinion, the slide stop lock is designed with the tab a bit too long for many rounds out there. If the rounds didn't slide forward after the first round is fired it wouldn't be an issue, but of course, the slide tends to pull the rounds forward after the first round. Because that round is forward, and if it is fattish, like a truncated flat nose FMJ or even a hollow point, it tends to hit that slide stop lever, activating the slide stop. The exception to that rule would be the round nose FMJ, which is more pointy. As disappointing as that is, the fix is pretty easy: if you slide that magazine in, with the slide off, and notice if the top round hits the slide stop tab, then you need to sand or grind that back. Grind or sand it back until the bullet nose clears slide stop tab. You could even sand beyond that a bit, but the limit is, the tab must be long enough to hit the magazine slide stop release (part of the follower). If you look the follower/slide stop release mechanism over for a few minutes, it becomes obvious. My opinion is that this needs to be done almost routinely, if my gun is any example. This really is inexcusable, but in the end, it's not too bad, because you can do it without going to a gunsmith. It's an easy fix, and one I wouldn't hesitate doing. There is margin for error (meaning you can grind more than necessary and still have the slide stop work). Bottom line, though, is that asking Kahr for a new slide stop doesn't solve the problem IMHO. Good news, bad news, but it is fixable without sending it in.

[Justinotto]

Thank you you for this info...so did you just use like a flat hand held grinding tool? I think I'll contact kahr as well to see about a replacement slide lock just in case I goof it up.


I asked Kahr for a new slide lock, and they graciously sent a new one to me. With all due respect to Kahr, though, the slide stop lock was exactly the same as the one on my new Kahr. In my opinion, the slide stop lock is designed with the tab a bit too long for many rounds out there. If the rounds didn't slide forward after the first round is fired it wouldn't be an issue, but of course, the slide tends to pull the rounds forward after the first round. Because that round is forward, and if it is fattish, like a truncated flat nose FMJ or even a hollow point, it tends to hit that slide stop lever, activating the slide stop. The exception to that rule would be the round nose FMJ, which is more pointy. As disappointing as that is, the fix is pretty easy: if you slide that magazine in, with the slide off, and notice if the top round hits the slide stop tab, then you need to sand or grind that back. Grind or sand it back until the bullet nose clears slide stop tab. You could even sand beyond that a bit, but the limit is, the tab must be long enough to hit the magazine slide stop release (part of the follower). If you look the follower/slide stop release mechanism over for a few minutes, it becomes obvious. My opinion is that this needs to be done almost routinely, if my gun is any example. This really is inexcusable, but in the end, it's not too bad, because you can do it without going to a gunsmith. It's an easy fix, and one I wouldn't hesitate doing. There is margin for error (meaning you can grind more than necessary and still have the slide stop work). Bottom line, though, is that asking Kahr for a new slide stop doesn't solve the problem IMHO. Good news, bad news, but it is fixable without sending it in.

[Justinotto]

I have a follow-up question. Wouldn't this issue also be the potential cause for a failure to feed? It seems like the round hitting this slide stop on the way up would interfere with the smooth feeding operation as well.

[smokersteve]

Send it in on their dime and have Kahrs gunsmith fix it.
I wonder if they got all there guns back that are not working properly, instead of us fixing them, that there quality control might improve. That would be nice.

[erichard]

Thank you you for this info...so did you just use like a flat hand held grinding tool? I think I'll contact kahr as well to see about a replacement slide lock just in case I goof it up.

I used a little grinding bit on a Dremel, but would be pretty simple to take that piece out of the gun and use a file and or sand paper made for metal. The shape that is left should compliment the shape of the side of the bullet nose, probably a fatter nosed bullet as these are the problematic ones. Normally in my gun, after the first bullet from the mag cycles into the chamber after firing one in the chamber, the new top bullet in the magazine is situated slightly forward, maybe an eighth of an inch from the back of the magazine, sometimes more, sometimes less. If you want to get rid of all future premature slide locks, you could push that bullet as far forward as it ever seems to go on its own, and then use that as a guide for how much to take off that slide release pin's tab. That's what I did, and it simply requires putting that slide pin back in the gun and then slowly moving that magazine up past the pin to see if you have taken enough off to satisfy your requirements of clearing that tab. I actually took a fair amount off, more than just a little sanding would take care of (which is why the grinder was handy), but be careful not to take too much off, or your follower will not engage the slide stop release after the last bullet is fired. As I said before, you can see how it works if you put an empty mag up into the gun with the slide off the gun and see where the follower engages the slide stop release (have to put that slide stop release back in the hole fully to see it in action).

With regards to feed issues, it's a good question. I think the answer is not perfectly simple. I don't think the longer slide stop tab obstructs the feed exactly, because by the time the bullet needs to feed that tab is below the nose of the bullet (as I recall, without actually looking at it now), but I do suspect the drag of a tab that is not long enough to engage the slide stop but long enough to rub the bullet as it moves to the top of the mag may change the orientation of that top bullet by flattening it a bit (rather than aiming upwards at the same angle as the lips of the magazine.) I do think bullets that are in this flattish orientation (speaking of the top bullet in the mag) are a cause for nosediving when it comes time to cycle up the feed ramp. And that would also be seen more frequently on fattish, squarish nosed bullets like the WWB and the new Lehigh XP for example. I could be wrong on that, but I suppose you could do an experiment and see if that holds up as true before and after grinding down that tab. That flattening hypothesis would mainly concern the top bullet in a nearly full magazine. As there are fewer and fewer bullets, I think the upward orientation of the follower has more impact on keeping the nose of the bullet pointing upward slightly (as you have more and more bullets above the follower, that follower unfortunately can't quite keep the top bullet pointing up because the front circumference of the bullet is smaller than the rear shell circumference, and that difference adds up as you stack more bullets on top of one another, thereby allowing that flattening of the top bullet.). Maybe more than you asked for, but that's my working theory so far.

By the way, I am using the MagGuts springs and followers now, so the part where that slide stop tab hits the follower is slightly different. At one point it seemed like I had taken too much off the slide stop tab, but I merely had to bend the piece on the follower a little outward for it to work again. Hard to understand that unless you have the MagGuts follower because it significantly different than the Kahr follower, though the general principles still apply.

Because that second slide stop from Kahr was the same as my original one, I suspect the majority of folks need to modify their slide stops. Could be wrong, but I don't see how. I guess some never notice it because they use FMJ with a round nose and or Hornady Critical Defense rounds which are pointy. That combo really makes the gun sing with regards to feeding, though I think the Hornady under penetrates somewhat on denim gel tests. I do think the other poster suggesting sending it in to Kahr has a point in the sense that they should see so many of these that they eventually get the financial message that they should alter this part for good and not burden customers with inferior function from inferior parts. One day they will change this part I suspect. If you do send it in, wait and find out all the problems you need them to look at, so you don't have to resend it later for something different. While they may pay for this shipping, they might not pay for the next problem's shipping. Hard to know. It can be very expensive to send guns, especially if shippers demand you send it overnight express. Big bucks relative to the price of the pistol.

[Justinotto]

Thank you erichard, very good info. I also found your discussion on the magguts and alternating rounds in the mag...interesting.