fumble (w/video)

[marcinstl]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/05/darryl-jouett-shoots-himself-in-the-stomach_n_6420688.html
I'm starting to think that carrying condition 3 and training to rack a round into the chamber on the draw might be a good idea for some people and some guns.

[Scarywoody]

Doesn't look like he was competent in gun handling. Just because you carry one doesn't make you competent. At least no one was seriously hurt or killed.

[muggsy]

Ky, that explains it all. :)

[marshal kane]

With semi-autos I always carry with a round chambered. 1911: safety on. SIG P220: decocked. P9: chambered w/long trigger pull. All of my holsters have a retention strap. I don't want to add racking the slide after making my draw. Just my preference. If it's serious enough to make a draw, it's highly likely that I will shoot. With my S&W revolvers: I chamber 5 with an empty charge hole under the hammer. Again retention straps on the holsters. I think that LEO had his finger on the trigger while he was reholstering his pistol otherwise how could his gun discharge? Just shows that even with experienced shooters, you have to stay focused when handling firearms, especially loaded ones. Yes, a good thing nobody was seriously hurt or killed.

[berettabone]

Why was he going to carry it in his hand on the way to the car? We had a brain trust LE drop his firearm at a local mall last year. It went off, luckily no injuries. No firearms allowed at the mall. Cmon man.............................

[marcinstl]

was that an XD? that's got a grip safety and a safety trigger. it also had a clumsy hand and bad finger. what was he thinking? nothing. he will live to face the ridicule he deserves.
what is the difference in draw speed from an open holster to a thumb break holster? on a gun with a "hair trigger" what is the difference in draw speed if you have to thumb the safety off?
here's a question for berettabone-- how does any modern gun go off from being dropped? they're supposed to be drop safe? more to that story than what got reported?

[berettabone]

I watched it a bunch of times, and it looked to me, like a Shield, or a Walther..................I didn't see any muzzle flash either. Looks like he pressed/pulled the trigger, from being at a bad angle.

[SlowBurn]

I think that LEO had his finger on the trigger while he was reholstering his pistol otherwise how could his gun discharge?He's wearing a jacket. Sometimes they have draw strings that can get caught up in the trigger guard. Personally, I carry "israeli". I understand the disadvantages, but I've thought it through and decided its right for me.

Just shows that even with experienced shooters, you have to stay focused when handling firearms, especially loaded ones.Amen. And they're ALL loaded.

[Scarywoody]

Well at least it only went off once unlike the Police Chief in Peachtree City, GA.

[knkali]

He's wearing a jacket. Sometimes they have draw strings that can get caught up in the trigger guard. Personally, I carry "israeli". I understand the disadvantages, but I've thought it through and decided its right for me.
Amen. And they're ALL loaded.

Carry "Israeli" ....seems you know your comfort level very well. I added this link so others know what you a talking about when you said Israeli. If I am incorrect, let me know and I will remove the post.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGD2j9ks38g

[knkali]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/05/darryl-jouett-shoots-himself-in-the-stomach_n_6420688.html
I'm starting to think that carrying condition 3 and training to rack a round into the chamber on the draw might be a good idea for some people and some guns.

Thought about that too. I always thought that it would be a bad idea if the BG is right on top of you and you need to fire from the holster.

[340pd]

Is it possible he actually fumbled and attempted to catch the gun? It does look like a Shield. Mine has a safety that is always "on".

Condition three is great untill the bad guy has hold of one of your arms.

[knkali]

Is it possible he actually fumbled and attempted to catch the gun? It does look like a Shield. Mine has a safety that is always "on".

Condition three is great untill the bad guy has hold of one of your arms.
I guess you could rack it on his skull???????

[marcinstl]

watched it again, could be a Shield or maybe a Walther PPS?
the guy in the condition 3 video looks to be spending more time clearing the cover garment and going to 4 o'clock to find the gun than he does getting a round in the chamber.
are there any recorded "gun accidents" with a long pull DA pistol or revolver?

[Bawanna]

Not for me. If a gun jambs that's when it will jamb. Most likely when you need it your gonna need it quick.
You'll probably have something in your hand or pushing a shopping cart or carrying your granddaughter.

No place to be racking the slide and calling go go gomez to stop the picture while you get ready.

Personally in my opinion retention straps are band aids for poorly fitting holsters too. I used to insist on them and an instructor here tried to insist that detectives have retention straps, fortunately we didn't get that pushed through.
They are a detriment to reholstering and other than adding a little security to folks concerned with cocked a locked carry it really isn't necessary. I'll grant that leather between hammer and firing pin are a good thing but I can do fine without.

[marcinstl]

a couple of the (cheaper) holsters I have are set up with thumb break straps. yes, it's a fix for a nylon taco. on a fitted holster(leather or kydex pressed to the shape of the gun), the strap is redundant, the gun won't jump out. the problem is that evil finger that wants to go in the trigger guard. John Browning with his large on/off switch, as seen on a 1911, might have saved countless negligent discharges. smart guy, huh? how many cops got off an unintended shot when they were carrying a S&W mdl. 28 (Highway Patrolmen) revolver?
(anybody got an old, dusty, 28 with a 6" barrel laying around? I could put it to good use. thank you.)

[knkali]

a couple of the (cheaper) holsters I have are set up with thumb break straps. yes, it's a fix for a nylon taco. on a fitted holster(leather or kydex pressed to the shape of the gun), the strap is redundant, the gun won't jump out. the problem is that evil finger that wants to go in the trigger guard. John Browning with his large on/off switch, as seen on a 1911, might have saved countless negligent discharges. smart guy, huh? how many cops got off an unintended shot when they were carrying a S&W mdl. 28 (Highway Patrolmen) revolver?
(anybody got an old, dusty, 28 with a 6" barrel laying around? I could put it to good use. thank you.)
I don't think the original J, Bowning design had an on off switch. I am no expert though.
http://forums.officer.com/t144283/

[muggsy]

Carry "Israeli" ....seems you know your comfort level very well. I added this link so others know what you a talking about when you said Israeli. If I am incorrect, let me know and I will remove the post.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGD2j9ks38g

Comfort level my behind. If you carry in Condition III and actually get into a gun fight it might be the last thing you ever do. Most modern guns are designed to be carried safely in Condition I. You run the risk of a mis-feed if you carry in Condition III. The best safety is the one that God put between your ears. The Chief should have put the package down or handed it to his wife before he handled the gun. He was purely negligent. Safe gun handling is no accident.

[getsome]

I dropped a CW40 once and it didn't go off but I did do the try and grab it before it hit the pavement deal which is a very bad idea but it's a natural reaction to dropping something and hard not to do....Luckily I didn't get my finger in the trigger guard and cause a disaster but I can see how it could easily happen especially with a Glock or M&P with no safety....I recently picked up a little Ruger LCP with the new improved trigger and that thing sure has a short easy pull and I have to be real careful with it and be sure it's all the way in the pocket holster before I put the whole thing in my pocket as a unit.....

I mostly CCW my J frame Smith in a right front pocket holster and I feel pretty safe with that but I did start doing something a little different after last Christmas Eve's Church Service....I had it in my pocket and realized it was pointing directly at the children in the pew in front of me and even though it's a revolver and it's not very likely to go off in my pocket accidently I started carrying it with an emply chamber under the firing pin just in case while in church....I know it takes away 20% of my available ammo but it makes me feel better and I still should be able to settle a problem with 4 in the gun and a speed strip in my pocket with 5 more....After church lets out I reload all 5....Call me crazy but if something really bad were to happen, it would happen to me...Murphy aint got nothing on this ole boy...

[Bawanna]

I don't think the original J, Bowning design had an on off switch. I am no expert though.
http://forums.officer.com/t144283/

Your correct, John Moses original design had no safeties at all. He didn't feel the need for them.
The military required them. It was also a smaller caliber in the original configuration.

Ole Mr. Browning was one sharp cookie.

[marcinstl]

the Tokarev T-33, a design "heavily influenced" by Browning, didn't have a thumb safety, just a notch in the hammer for "half cock". the Soviet army carried them condition 3 in a leather holster with full flap. not a gun fighter rig.
"emply chamber under the firing pin just in case while in church" religion is a faith based thing. ah, where's the faith in S&W? if the old Model 36 barked in church, it would be "an act of God"? (you know I'm just kidding around here, glad your thinking safety.)

[b4uqzme]

... you have to stay focused when handling firearms, ...

I witnessed my first unintended discharge on Sunday. Yes they can happen. And NO this wasn't negligent IMHO. New to owner used trap gun with some kinda problem...closed the action and gun went off. Fortunately he was following the other rules of firearm safety and the shot went innocently down range. That's the reason for multiple/overlapping rules of safety...because sh!t happens.

The subject of this thread doesn't appear to be applying safe handling techniques...I too am glad no one was hurt.

[340pd]

There is a lot to be said for DA style trigger systems. I always have a kydex trigger cover on any of my striker fired firearms that do not have a manual safety.

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/gnystrom_photos/20141223_083532_zpsb2c971a8.jpg

[marcinstl]

wow! learn something new everyday-- I googled, "manual safety for Glock". clicked on the Brownell's link and there it is, $85 thumb safety kit for Glocks. so you end up with an ugly, black, plastic, high capacity, reliable Glock, with trigger of choice options and a thumb safety. is that Glock perfection? maybe Gaston should look into this?