PM45 pocket carry - Yes, it can be done.

[el_presidente]

Played dress-up tonight :cool:, and here's what I've learned.


If you want to pocket carry a PM45, a pair of Levi's 550s (relaxed fit) will do you right. Get those and a belt, and you're set. I use a Mika pocket holster. It'll look like a cellphone is in your pocket. As a bonus, you can carry a spare mag in the coin pocket on the right hand side.


Or, a pair of Eddie Bauer cargo shorts will do a perfectly nice job (what I have are similar to these: http://www.eddiebauer.com/product/expedition-cargo-shorts---solid/10307842/_/A-ebSku_0036415225001032__10307842_catalog10002_en__ US?showProducts=&backToCat=Cargo%20Shorts&previousPage=&tab=men&color=225). They're even better than the Levis in terms of breaking up any pattern. The pockets are so deep you might want a holster with some tackiness/stickiness to keep from drawing the holster with the gun. I use a Remora. A holster with a good tab or hook to keep it in the pocket will probably do the job, too.

Anybody else pocket carry the PM45? What do you wear?

[JohnR]

I sometimes pocket carry mine - back pants pocket.

[el_presidente]

Use a holster for that?

[Nytcrawler93]

I tried back pocket and it just tears my back up. I am paranoid of a print even though it probably doesn't...

[el_presidente]

The printing really is minimal. The only dimension of substantial difference between the PM45 and PM9 is the height. Even the weight difference isn't as much as you'd think.

[CJB]

I just throw the PM45 into my Wrangler jeans pocket - front right - and thats that. Very comfy, very discrete.

[RRP]

I just throw the PM45 into my Wrangler jeans pocket - front right - and thats that.

If this means you do not use a holster, I disagree with the practice.

[CJB]

I don't, and thank our founding fathers in their recognition of your right to disagree!

Some handguns I'd pocket carry, other not. Glock (even it it would fit) no way. Enhanced trigger Kahr, not a chance. Any of the single Browning/Colt/FN striker fired ie those little 25's, 32's and 380, no way.

But the Kahr PM45, with its rather long, rather heavy trigger pull is safe enough. I've always contended for a Karh, the reason the pocket holster is used is to conceal the outline in the pocket. In my daily activities, how and where I go, this is not an issue. The big issue is lint. After a while you get some lint buildup, and so regular cleaning is a good thing. I've been using that TW-25b lube for that. Once you understand how it works, and how to apply it, you'll see that it leaves a very long last ing slippery film on things that does not want to come off without the use of solvents. So, it attracts less lint, is clean, not smelly, and good enough lube for a few shots if and when needed. Once I carried for months, no cleaning, took out the PM45 in the backyard and fired off six as quick as I could, just to see how it would do. No hiccups.

The same PM45, wont rest under my pillow with the chamber loaded. I don't trust myself on what I might do at night - mostly asleep! But for me, pocket carry, no holster, is no more, no less safe than with a holser.

[RRP]

But for me, pocket carry, no holster, is no more, no less safe than with a holser.

We are all entitled to our opinions, and I will respect yours. I cannot, however, agree with you on this matter. I can only hope you don't preach this in your NRA classes.

Good luck to you.

[kwh]

My DeSantis pocket holster keeps my CM9 oriented in the same position. Makes it easier to grab the grip.

[97hmcs]

IMHO. When split-seconds count, that pocket holster can get in the way.

[RRP]

IMHO. When split-seconds count, that pocket holster can get in the way.

I agree that split-seconds count. I prefer to gain speed advantage through ongoing training than by sacrificing safety. YMMV.

[bsmith712]

We are all entitled to our opinions, and I will respect yours. I cannot, however, agree with you on this matter. I can only hope you don't preach this in your NRA classes.

Good luck to you.

No doubt!!!

[TheTman]

At the very least, I'd want a Kydex or some other stiff material to cover the trigger guard and kept the trigger from catching on something. Maybe tie it to a belt loop so that it pops off automatically as soon as the gun is drawn. If it was a revolver I wouldn't be so concerned, but with the Kahr you could have little have little indication the trigger was caught on something until it fired. I can't fit the CM45, and pocket holster into any of my pants pockets, so it's not a big thing with me, but I would still want to be safe about it, if I were able to pocket carry.

[el_presidente]

But back to the original topic, :D I'm looking for khaki recommendations for PM45 pocket carry. Anyone have any luck with a particular brand?

[ReManG]

Cabelas brand flat front khakis have some HUGE front pockets, also their Trailhiker II cargo pants...
Check under the product information tab, I think the pockets are 10" wide and 13" deep...
http://tinyurl.com/my78n7z

Best Best can do for a link on my phone here..

[CJB]

We are all entitled to our opinions, and I will respect yours. I cannot, however, agree with you on this matter. I can only hope you don't preach this in your NRA classes.

Good luck to you.
Other than disagreeing and chastizing me, do you actually have anything of real substance to say?

[RRP]

Other than disagreeing and chastizing me, do you actually have anything of real substance to say?

You expressed an opinion with which I disagreed. I offered a counter-point and that's all you can come back with to defend your position?

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, folks.

[el_presidente]

Cabelas brand flat front khakis have some HUGE front pockets, also their Trailhiker II cargo pants...
Check under the product information tab, I think the pockets are 10" wide and 13" deep...
http://tinyurl.com/my78n7z

Best Best can do for a link on my phone here..

Thank you! Ordered two pair of khaki and a pair of shorts. I'll report how they turn out...

[JohnR]

You expressed an opinion with which I disagreed. I offered a counter-point and that's all you can come back with to defend your position?

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, folks.
...other than the dig at his NRA instruction practices...

[Bawanna]

Umbrella's open! I'm scheduling an ice water air drop. Chill baby.

[CJB]

You expressed an opinion with which I disagreed. I offered a counter-point and that's all you can come back with to defend your position?

We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, folks.

With due respect to the Col. and to decorum, I stated the why's, the backup to my belief, and the narrow scope of its implementation.

Maybe I missed it, but why do you disagree? I've not seen one thing to state why, anything to back up your disagreement. Just a inference that my students are somehow the recipient of ill fated knowledge.

Please.... why don't you share with all of us, just how you came to your disagreement?

[LD48750]

At the very least, I'd want a Kydex or some other stiff material to cover the trigger guard and kept the trigger from catching on something. Maybe tie it to a belt loop so that it pops off automatically as soon as the gun is drawn. If it was a revolver I wouldn't be so concerned, but with the Kahr you could have little have little indication the trigger was caught on something until it fired. I can't fit the CM45, and pocket holster into any of my pants pockets, so it's not a big thing with me, but I would still want to be safe about it, if I were able to pocket carry.

Can I ask why you feel a revolver would be safer?
With similar trigger pulls and the common belief that semi-auto's can't be fired from inside pockets .....

[ScottM]

Can I ask why you feel a revolver would be safer?
With similar trigger pulls and the common belief that semi-auto's can't be fired from inside pockets .....

Similar trigger pulls? When's the last time you drew through a DA revolver?

I took my Charter Arms .38 detective special to the range yesterday and was reminded just how long and strong that pull has to be - it really is much different from a striker-fired action pistol.

[ReManG]

Thank you! Ordered two pair of khaki and a pair of shorts. I'll report how they turn out...

Please do, they work for me, but the more opinions the better! I have been impressed with the Trailhiker II's myself...

[JohnR]

What I've gathered (from reading the internet, of course) is that the main danger of pocket carry is when you're putting the gun in your pocket or taking it out, and a holster doesn't automatically eliminate that danger. The other danger is having crap in your pocket that would get in the trigger guard, then obviously a holster will help prevent an ND, so don't keep anything in that pocket with it (holster or not), and unless you have spontaneously generating little gremlins down there what could possibly cause the trigger to pull, that wouldn't pull it within a holster as well? Possibly something outside your pocket could push against it, but Your pocket is basically a holster itself, if it's snug fitting and dedicated only to the gun. I'm not saying to pocket carry without a holster, but with a Kahr I believe the chances of an ND are minimal compared to other trigger types. But don't take my word for it, take the advice of a professional (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=am-Qdx6vky0).

[bsmith712]

But don't take my word for it, take the advice of a professional (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=am-Qdx6vky0).

John you've added some good points. I typically avoid Internet forums unless I have research I'm working on specifically and will occasionally find a thread that catches my eye like this one. From over 20 years as a law enforcement firearms instructor and owner of a firearms training company for over 11 years I'll offer the following:

The idea of pocket carrying a firearm without a protected trigger is absurd in most instances. A misplaced finger near the trigger while putting it into the pocket is plenty enough reason to never do it but in daily life I run across dozens of things daily to pull that trigger if it were in my pocket unprotected. I suppose each persons daily activities would effect the level of danger they encounter but for myself it would be extremely dangerous. Even for an office worker who could simply have the trigger snag on a chair or table is bad enough. I run another business as well that has me constantly climbing ladders, crawling through attics, on roofs, climbing and crossing fences, cutting and removing trees and limbs, bending and hanging over ledges, carrying heavy equipment, digging trenches, operating heavy equipment...the list goes on and on. In my case I'd be highly likely to have a hole in my leg relatively quickly compared to some but there's still a level of risk in everyone's daily life that makes the practice of pocket carrying in this manner very hazardous. The firearm's trigger pull isn't very strong when it catches on an object that is heavier or will not move.

For the reasons above I cannot tolerate any pocket carry, even when done properly. Most guns of significance are way too big. I've got multiple Kahrs and none are small enough for me to do so. I demonstrate in classes with proper holsters pocket carry with a Ruger Lcp for those who'd want to consider pocket carry and it's way to big. If it's how you carry or are reading this and contemplating this as a carry method go for it. If it works for you great, but please do so in a safe manner!

[LD48750]

John you've added some good points. I typically avoid Internet forums unless I have research I'm working on specifically and will occasionally find a thread that catches my eye like this one. From over 20 years as a law enforcement firearms instructor and owner of a firearms training company for over 11 years I'll offer the following:

The idea of pocket carrying a firearm without a protected trigger is absurd in most instances. A misplaced finger near the trigger while putting it into the pocket is plenty enough reason to never do it but in daily life I run across dozens of things daily to pull that trigger if it were in my pocket unprotected. I suppose each persons daily activities would effect the level of danger they encounter but for myself it would be extremely dangerous. Even for an office worker who could simply have the trigger snag on a chair or table is bad enough. I run another business as well that has me constantly climbing ladders, crawling through attics, on roofs, climbing and crossing fences, cutting and removing trees and limbs, bending and hanging over ledges, carrying heavy equipment, digging trenches, operating heavy equipment...the list goes on and on. In my case I'd be highly likely to have a hole in my leg relatively quickly compared to some but there's still a level of risk in everyone's daily life that makes the practice of pocket carrying in this manner very hazardous. The firearm's trigger pull isn't very strong when it catches on an object that is heavier or will not move.

For the reasons above I cannot tolerate any pocket carry, even when done properly. Most guns of significance are way too big. I've got multiple Kahrs and none are small enough for me to do so. I demonstrate in classes with proper holsters pocket carry with a Ruger Lcp for those who'd want to consider pocket carry and it's way to big. If it's how you carry or are reading this and contemplating this as a carry method go for it. If it works for you great, but please do so in a safe manner!

I'll skip most of this theory and go right to a challenge.

Unload the Kahr pistol of your choice.
Cock it.
Put it in your pocket & carry it until it fires.
Report back & tell us how long it took.

If you are so clumsy that you are constantly bumping into chairs & desks or tables with enough force to pull the trigger on any gun, you need help.
I am sure you rip the pockets out of your pants everyday from what you have said. Must be expensive buying new pants everyday.

Oh... and the "professional" in your example wasn't pocket carrying, the gun was out in his hand while he was playing with the trigger.
Don't pull the trigger & you won't have to worry about a gun (even a Glock) going off.

[bsmith712]

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j230/bsmith712/Mobile%20Uploads/image.jpg (http://s81.photobucket.com/user/bsmith712/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image.jpg.html)

Yes indeed. I go through pants at an an alarming rate. To the point it becomes funny to take pictures of them at their deaths. Here's a bunch from the past year. I'll run through 8-10 pairs that will be shredded pretty well every 6 months or so. It wouldn't take long for my gun to go off with all the fences, limbs, ladders, pipes and boards I encounter. It's not a matter of clumsiness its a matter of crawling through attics, crawl spaces, roofs and walls where you can't even see where your legs are. For others maybe it would take a bit longer. Time is truely the only factor with that game of Russian roulette. The fact is...while likely not to occur, guns have gone off in pockets both from fingers and snagging on obstructions period. You aren't likely to get struck by lightning either but you get your butt in the house when it storms don't you? Send me your kahr and I'll run it with yours. I can barely get a pm9 in or out of my pocket so I don't know if the 45 will be able to fit. If it does I'd rather destroy your finish and frame than mine.

[el_presidente]

Please do, they work for me, but the more opinions the better! I have been impressed with the Trailhiker II's myself...

Got the khakis in the mail today. Either the shorts or the pants will work with the PM45 in pocket just fine - the depth and width is excellent. The design of the shorts is just strange, though. Sending them back. Keeping the pants for some concealed carry at work.

[ReManG]

Got the khakis in the mail today. Either the shorts or the pants will work with the PM45 in pocket just fine - the depth and width is excellent. The design of the shorts is just strange, though. Sending them back. Keeping the pants for some concealed carry at work.


Great on the pants, I agree on the shorts so I guess I should have said something, but Cabelas is great on returns. If you have an Academy Sports near you, hit them up, I found some shorts there that were there house brand that work for me (Magellan, I think, labels too faded to make out the model). I try all my shorts and pants on via the pockets prior to even pulling them from the rack. Slide a hand in the front pocket and pass if it is not past my wrist. More than just pocket carry of pistols, this keeps my wallet and other stuff from falling out when I use the front pockets. I have found a rough correlation between the quality of the front pockets (depth, width and feel of materials) with my overall satisfaction of the pants, but that is just me. The Pocket Guns and Gear article HERE (http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2012/02/nice-pants-for-pocket-carry.html) shows a couple of more good pairs of pants for carry. I was surprised at the Members Mark Jeans from Sam's Club, $15 and great front pockets....