Profiled at MO Conservation range

[tiretroll]

I was at J. Henges Dept. of Conservation shooting range sighting in my CETME. I had been there a couple hours. There was only about 5 other shooters but this guy walks up and takes a Lake City 7.62 reload out of my bag of ammo and looks it over. He seemed a little different than the usual people you meet there. He asked what I was loading with so I told him but I felt I was being profiled. When they called cease fire I looked for him but he was gone. When I left, at the gate there was a bomb and arson van positioned so he could see who was in a car and license plate number. This is really bothering me. Has anyone had a similar experience? http://images.thehighroad.org/smilies/uhoh2.gif



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[Bawanna]

Describe how he looked different, dress, mannerisms? Was he shooting also or just wandering through.

The van was local, like county or state?

Seems kind of strange putting the different dude so close to the bomb van.

Try not to let it bother you, nothing you can do about it, you didn't mention doing anything illegal which dont' mean much but long as you were rightous in your own mind, don't let it mess with your sleep at night.

[JohnR]

Poor range etiquette, just grabbing a person's ammo like that. Don't touch my stuff.

[deadeye]

I understand how you must feel but you haven't done anything wrong so don't worry about it. Our country is full of self righteous "police" types right now. Their is a department of everything to keep us peons on the right track. Afraid to take a leak anymore. "Smile you're on candid camera." Just go on with your life and try to ignore it. I have to agree with JohnR. Keep your hands off my property. Another reason to VOTE!!!!!

[yqtszhj]

Our country is full of self righteous "police" types right now. Their is a department of everything to keep us peons on the right track. Afraid to take a leak anymore. "Smile you're on candid camera." Just go on with your life and try to ignore it. I have to agree with JohnR. Keep your hands off my property. Another reason to VOTE!!!!!

Exactly what he said.^^^

There's been a guy at my range lately thats kinda wierd. He thinks he's something and wants to be in charge. I wanted to tell him to be quiet and get out of my way maybe a couple of trips ago. Last time he brought a couple of other people one being a teen female. Well he looked in my truck bed and saw one of the ball targets I had in the back and told the teen girl she should ask me if she could shoot at it. Well being the nice guy I am i told her she could. Later he let me shoot his ruger Blackhawk (i couldn't hit crap) then his Rossi lever gun in .45LC (I could nail 100 yard targets standing with the rifle). The rifle was nice. Anyway, I guess he's ok but he's still wierd.

You could have told the guy to give you a dollar for fondling your ammo. Looking is free but touching cost.

[tiretroll]

This guy was clean cut, did not look / act military, did not act like anyone I have talked to there before and I have talked to a lot of people, was not shooting, vanished I looked for him about 2 minutes later and the rather large box van was marked Bomb and Arson with what looked like a camera in front and the windshield was dark. I know there are a lot of great LEO's he did not seem like a bad guy, just had this LEO feel or I would have told him to get out of my bag. My CETME has a H&K grip with the fun switch but he never said anything.

[JohnR]

Ask the range staff.

I fully expect a lot of sneaks and snitches at ranges, shills for the government/Bloomburg.

[tiretroll]

Funny, when I checked out the Dept of Conservation guy said you have been here a long time ( 3 hours) I don't see the same people working all the time.

[yqtszhj]

He may have been envious of your toys too and you may have made a positive impression on him. :cool:

[tiretroll]

It's 2:45 AM I just woke up with a thought. My CETME has the K&K plastic select fire, clipped and pined fire control group housing. Maybe one of the range officers thought it was real. I doubt they know much about H&K 91, G3 or CETME's. I have never noticed one there and when they call cease fire they look at every gun to make sure the action is open before they allow you to change targets.

[muggsy]

Your first question should have been, "Who wants to know?" Your second question should have been, "Do you always go through someone's personal belongings without asking for permission?"

[TheTman]

Perhaps one of those Moms Demand Justice or whatever they are, placed a prank call saying there was a bomb or illegal weapons at the range. They've been known to do crap like that.
They pulled some pretty crappy stunts in the past, like calling in a robbery in progress if they see someone open carrying, actually hoping the cops will shoot the open carrier. I wish they'd phone a bomb threat in at every Hillary speech.

[marcinstl]

I live way around the corner of I-270, up on the N.side. for me it's a haul to get to J. Henges Dept. of Conservation shooting range and only go there with one friend who likes to shoot outside(Bush Wildlife is closed for remodel). frankly, I think the Henges range sucks, it's an acoustic nightmare (concrete bunker built in a crater, puts your ears on in the parking lot). if your south and less than impressed with public ranges, try https://www.arnoldgunclub.org/ .
when the team is repelling out of the helicopter onto your roof, have your lawyer on standby and the cameras rolling.
if your thinking about taking the toy stuff off of your gun, that could be a plan. damn near anything is "probable cause" these days.
if you want a real rifle, pm me and I'll point you in the direction of a Hawken or similar. if you want auto, I know a guy that does that, if you have the money for all the legal stuff.
you were shooting and the guy comes up and is looking thru your bag!? WTF!? that's just rude and worth a formal complaint to the range personnel.
good luck.

[ltxi]

Your first question should have been, "Who wants to know?" Your second question should have been, "Do you always go through someone's personal belongings without asking for permission?"

I be real good with that....

[Planedude]

It's 2:45 AM I just woke up with a thought. My CETME has the K&K plastic select fire, clipped and pined fire control group housing. Maybe one of the range officers thought it was real. I doubt they know much about H&K 91, G3 or CETME's. I have never noticed one there and when they call cease fire they look at every gun to make sure the action is open before they allow you to change targets.

Maybe...
I have a coworker that built a "zombie hunter AR" using a Spikes lower. Their zombie lower has a safe/selector switch that has "living, Dead, Undead" logo that made a local range master just nuts about the "fully automatic weapon" on his range. Even after the range guy was handed the AR and allowed to prove to himself that it was just another AR, he watched my coworker and his brother like a hawk for his two hours at the range.
The guy said the whole thing creeped him out. His zombie gun was... I guess... neat, not my style, but well made. The attention it draws in public is sometimes good and sometimes bad.

[Nytcrawler93]

I certainly do not tolerate anyone going through my crap without permission. Period.


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[CJB]

Well for what its worth, I got questioned by "....some people...." who were damn near instantly recognizable in their "plain clothes".

Pssssst. Nobody wears nylon windbreakers and turtle neck tees with plaid pants, AND... thick solded black shoes!!!

And, I didn't do it. Nobody talks, everybody walks!

[yqtszhj]

You know I have this role play in my head when I comes to CJB being profiled. Imagine it with me if you can, it goes something like this:
CJB, deeply embedded in the Florida swampland, takes to his coolest "assault" toys to the range. Lays them out on the bench. Someone get's paranoid and calls the local overly ambitious LE. CJB stays cool and answers in his politest tone. Dialog goes something like this:

Officer: Excuse me, I need to talk to you for a moment.
CJB: OK.
Officer: What are you shooting?
CJB: My guns.
Officer: I mean what type are those and why do you need them?
CJB: They're all legal, I have papers to prove it, and because I have the right too.
Officer: What do you use them for?
CJB: Whatever I may need to use them for at the time.
Officer: Is that your ammo?
CJB: Yes.
Officer: What have you loaded those rounds with?
CJB: Bullets
Officer: I mean what kind.
CJB: It's LC Brass that I have polished to a pristine shine. I have resized the cases and trimmed the neck by .0005 inches and have reduced the powder load by 1.5 gr. because I get the best velocity at 100 yards and groups that cloverleaf with a maximum group of .35246 inches.
Officer: What?
CJB: Full metal jacket.
Officer: OK. Is that your range bag?
CJB: Yes.
Officer: Can I look in it?
CJB: No.
Officer: Why not?
CJB: Because it's mine.
Officer: Do you have something to hide?
CJB: No
Officer: Then can I look in it?
CJB: No.
Officer: Why?
CJB: Because it's mine and you have no reason.
Officer: I could get a warrant.
CJB: Not likely because you don't have probable cause but if you would like to try feel free.
Officer: Wait here, I'll be right back. (Officer steps away, makes a phone call, and comes back.)
Officer: Can I look in your bag?
CJB: No.
Officer: Why not?
CJB: Because it's mine.
Now the officers HEAVY female supervisor with a USMC haircut and combat boots pulls up. She gets out of the car and makes her way to CJB and the officer.
Supervisor: Good afternoon sir. Officer, is this the gentleman in question?
Officer: Yes.
Supervisor: Mr. CJB, can we look in your bag?
CJB: No
Supervisor: Why not
CJB: I already told the other guy because it's mine.
Supervisor: Please step over this way.
CJB: I can't.
Supervisor: Why not?
CJB: All my weapons are on the bench and it would not be wise to leave them here unattended as I know the kind of people around here.
Suprevisor then instructs the officer to stand guard over CJB's guns while CJB and the supervisor step away.
Supervisor: Mr. CJB, do you have a gun in your pocket?
CJB: Yes.
Supervisor: Well for my safety I need to remove your gun while we are talking. Please raise your arms straight out.
CJB then raises his arms and supervisor struggles and tries to get the pistol out of his pocket.
CJB: Officer, I have some jewels down there I would like to keep so would you use caution when removing the pistol?
Supervisor: I have everything under control. (She finally get's the pistol out and CJB for a moment breathes a sigh of relief)
Supervisor: Is this pistol loaded?
CJB: Yes
Supervisor: Why do you keep it loaded?
CJB: Because an empty pistol wouldn't do much good, would it?
Supervisor removes the mag and tries to rack the slide to empty the chamber. She can't do it plus she has her finger in the trigger while trying.
CJB: For my safety, your safety, and those around us would you like me to do that for you?
Supervisor: No. Just don't touch the gun while we are talking. (she gives up and places the pistol on the table.)
Supervisor: What are you doing here today?
CJB: Shooting my guns, not bothering anyone, and being annoyed for no good reason by local LE.
Supervisor: (She gives CJB a good look over) Mr. CJB, do you ride a motorcycle?
CJB: Yes
Supervisor: Why?
CJB: Because I like motorcycles.
Supervisor: Don't you get hot in the Florida sun wearing black shirts?
CJB: Well, it's like this. Bikers are easy to satisfy, give us a pair of jeans, some black tee shirts, and we're good to go. Kind of like a lesbian, give her a flannel shirt and a pair of work boots and her wardrobe is finished. (Don't forget the female supervisor description above.)
Supervisor: What is that suppose to mean?
CJB: Nothing, just stating an observation.
Supervisor: (Supervisor then gets a mad/frustrated look on her face) Sir, You're free to go.

CJB picks up his PM45, puts the mag back in, and places the pistol in his pocket. CJB then goes over to the bench, picks up his weapons, and leaves because half his day was wasted.

On the way out CJB sees the bomb squad van with camera at the entrance. He pulls up and then backs up where the camera can get his plate number. He then gets out, goes and leans against the back of the vehicle, and begins watching the second had of the fine quality time piece he is wearing. After 60 seconds CBJ yells at the van, "Did you get it?" The occupants of the van give CJB a scowl, CJB gives them a thumbs up, and then leaves.

Can anyone else see that happening?

[CJB]

That scenario is about right!

You know I got "road way checked" up outside of Deltona/Sandord along Rt 46..... it was FHP, Volusia County and DHS conducting some sort of joint effort. They basically set up a checkpoint, and were asking to search vehicles, running license info, being aholes. I think they must of had a dozen cars pulled over, and every time one left, they pulled another over to fill the gap.

They tried to spoof me with the "we don't need a warrant' (then why ask?)
They tried to spoof me with the "the dog hit positive on your truck" (then you'd be inside, not talking to me!)
And of course the "what do you have to hide" (everything!)

The best part of that.... and I wish this was BS because it shines non to lightly on the Volusia County guy, but... they did disarm me of my PM45, the Deputy dropping the magazine, and laying the pistol and mag on hood of my old Ranger. When it was time to go, he handed me the magazine, told me to put it in the glove box before he would hand me the pistol. I did. I didn't have to heart to tell him he didn't clear the chamber, and he didn't point it at me (but did at himself... oh well). I support the police. They do a thankless job. Sometimes there is a reason its thankless... jeeze.

I call the two "....persons..." who have taken an interest the Mod Squad. I'd probably have respect if they showed in jeans, t-shirts and sneakers. As it is, I'm reminded of "Sherman, set The Wayback Machine to June 1967....".

[marcinstl]

ah now, local law enforcement is trying to spend the taxpayers dollars wisely and make sure there's no bag guys on the loose. cops these days don't want to be like Andy Taylor or Barney fife, probably want to be more like Jack Bauer. after Ferguson and Baltimore, "thug" looking blacks are on the LE radar. after the Biker shootout in Texas, bikers are on the radar. after Charleston, I guess Glock 41 shooters are on the radar.
so far, fat, bald headed guys pushing 70 are not on the radar. be under the radar, be nice, don't chew and don't go with girls that do.

[muggsy]

Hey, I resemble that last remark, Marc! :)

[CJB]

Ya know, thinkin' on it some. You got one thing wrong.



Officer: Excuse me, I need to talk to you for a moment.
CJB: OK

My answer would be "Sorry, I don't wish to talk with you" and I'd have resumed by business.

[yqtszhj]

Ya know, thinkin' on it some. You got one thing wrong.



My answer would be "Sorry, I don't wish to talk with you" and I'd have resumed by business.

Yeah you're right. I figured you had the lesbian supervisor interaction all planned out just for the entertainment value was the only reason you agreed... :rolleyes:

[diablo53]

Poor range etiquette, just grabbing a person's ammo like that. Don't touch my stuff.
No kidding, you don't walk up and pick up property of a man who holding a loaded gun without asking permission first- if at all!!

[Baklash]

No kidding, you don't walk up and pick up property of a man who holding a loaded gun without asking permission first- if at all!!

I don't walk up and pick up the property of a man without asking permission first, gun or no gun.

[marcinstl]

I was at the range yesterday morning, first customer. 2 guys show up and they're buddy shooting, taking turns in the same lane (cheap or gay? hmmm?). then another guy shows up(70+ black guy) and he's shooting a SR22. when the old black guy stops to sit on the bench and reload the 2 older white guys come over and the conversating* begins. the old black guy says that .22 is the only thing he can afford to shoot, but just for grins, pulls his 2, 9mm pistols out of the bag to wave around. one of the white guys says, "I got one of those" and returns with his new tan cerakoted Jimenez 9mm(very desert tactical looking). without getting shot, I left. now, there's signs all over about no guns on the benches, guns must be in the booth, pointed down range. guy at the check in desk gives a short speech about all this.
if a shooter at a range becomes "afraid for his life" because some idiot is breaking all the range rules and pointing a loaded gun at him, can he defend himself and "stop the threat"?
*converstating-- St.Louis slang as in, "we bees conversatin'".

[CJB]

Learn somethin' every day. I thought conversating was when you was wearin' your Chucky Taylors.... WTF do I know, I'm just an old fat white guy.

[marcinstl]

"I'm just an old fat white guy."
yeah, but are you bald? how many guns do you carry? still having fun?

[CJB]

Not bald. Usually carry two plus two auto knives. No fun in Mudville.