P-45 issues remain

[gene62]

Even after 800 rounds down range and one trip back to Kahr for service I can not get through a 50 round box of ammo without a jam or failure to feed.
So sad, because the gun is really accurate and comfortable to carry, but no trust in reliability here.

[Alfonse]

If you're close to me, I would love to shoot 50 rounds through your P45 and see if I can replicate the jam or failure to feed. I'm getting a decent sized pile of Kahrs around here and I can't seem to find one that is finicky. One that was would be a great test bed for checking things out performance wise. I don't suppose you're in Washington are you?

[CJB]

In January, Gene62 sez:

"I have only had time to run 50 rounds through the gun since I have received from the service department, during this time it has had no jams since."

So the question Gene62 fails to ask is:

"My pistol initially worked when it returned from the factory, but now it fails in fewer than 50 rounds, so what happened?"

And the answer is that you have not provided any sort of information other than "jam" and "failure to feed".

What ammo?
Pictures of stoppages?
Pictures of fired casings?

That would be a place to start.

Recoil system should be nice and limber with that round count, so there's some other little issue. Also, without knowing what the real failure is, do this.... Take an cartdridge, and with the slide removed, slip the cartridge up and under the extractor, making sure to note if there is any deflection of the extractor. I'm interested in seeing what you come up with there.

Something going thru my mind is.... why failure to feed when the recoil system settles in? No longer able to overcome some tension that didn't settle.... seems like an obvious answer. What tension could there be? Maybe extractor. Worth a look.

[hardluk1]

gene62 Do these problems show up after shooting 30 or 40 rounds ??

The problem is feeding a new round on ejection or firing , right ?

Could the problem be the shooters lack of control of the handgun as round count starts to climb .

Do you find s you shoot your having to adjust your grip between shots ?

Assuming the ammo is good quality here a few things to try before blaming the pistol. No matter how skilled you think you are , smaller handguns can make you look like a beginner again .

Get a old used inner tube to slide over the grip . Removes the cheese grater checker and adds a tack surface . Now buy a pair of Nytrile gloves to help hold on to the grip and try to shoot good group sizes . When group size goes to heck your probably having to regrip the pistol every shot, your done . If your still having feeding issues have another shooter give it a try. Sometimes nothing more than a new shooter can make the difference .


My first kahr came from a guy that could not make his kahr feed reliably with far less than 50 rounds . He was mad and wanted it gone and I got it cheap . He was happy to sell it and its been 100% reliable for me and now my daughter for 9 years or so and thousands of rounds along with a few more kahrs .

Try to find another kahr shooter near you to help you get squared away .

[CJB]

hardluk1, its a possibility that gene62 has some trouble that is his own, but... I'm willing to give some generous latitude because he got the pistol through the NRA Instructor Program, which seems to indicate there is at least more than casual experience on his part.

I think your suggestion of an alternate shooter is well placed.

[blamtro]

I have a P45 that had near simliar problems. Turns out it was a bad slide stop spring that allowed the slide stop lever to pop out just slighly.

[marshal kane]

. . . Could the problem be the shooters lack of control of the handgun as round count starts to climb . . . .
That's what I was thinking too. If your FTF/FTE problems occur as the round count climbs, especially with a compact pistol and large caliber ammunition, the hand tends to tire faster without telling the shooter. Suggest you pace yourself, relax a bit and see if the malfunctions continue.

[CJB]

I'd like to hear back from the OP on how the cartridges fit into the extractor. Too much tension there and you'll have some issues.

Some folks think extractors need to have the hook and extraction power of a small tow truck. If things are otherwise ok, they don't really need that, so extractor tension does not have to be extreme

[gene62]

Sorry, I do not live in Washington. I have had others shoot the pistol with same results.
I am glad you are having no issue on your end, but this forum is full of people who do. I would just like the one I have to work reliable.
Thanks for your interest and feed back.

[gene62]

All ammo is 230grn FMJ, all good quality name brand manufacture. Failure to eject and failure to feed is the issues.
I think the first 50 rounds after return from service department was not enough rounds at one time.
The last three times I have had the gun at the range I have never got through a 50 round box without some type of issue. This is shooting this gun first in the line up or last in the line up, so I do not think shooter fatigue is the issue.

Also since I have no issues on shooting a wide range of pistols, small frame or large frame ,limp wristing does not seem likely.

One note is the guide rod has groves in it from the recoil spring. The rep at Kahr said that is normal. Also the groves were there when I sent the gun back for service, so they do not seem to think that is an issue. Also I believe they replaced the extractor then. Another note from them was they did some slide work.

[CJB]

Gene62, did you try the extractor test?

Reason I'm saying this, is the recoil system may have worked at first, but if the extractor was not quite right, as the recoil spring got to the point of where it ought ot be in its "set" (long term stability) then the extractor issue may have become evident.

[hardluk1]

Gene62 Good name brand ammo as what brand and type ?? Not wwb is it . How about names . What HP ammo you have tried . Can you supply any photos of the problem . I'm sure your skilled but even skilled shooters have problems . Does the problem starts as it nears 50rounds fired it may very well be grip control issues like it or not , how about shooting it thru 40 or 30 well fired rounds. Have you checked some of the ammo in a case gage ? OR do a random plunk test a few rounds with each new lot number of ammo ? There are some ammo lines from well known ammo industry standards that are not always up to snuff . I well not buy as I found some years ago that lacked qc like wwb . One reason I mostly reload now . Some ammo that may run well in a glock or m&p may not chamber reliably in a kahrs tighter chamber .


I know that being a well seasoned and highly skilled handgunner may not be a benefit with every small and light snappy handguns . I bought my first kahr brand unknown to me from a 52 year old NRA instructor and long time uspsa shooter that could not make it run reliably. He hit the wall with it at a range I visit and offered it for self cheap and I had enough money . I did nothing but clean it , learn about it feed in good quality ammo and run it wet . 2000 rounds down range and 7 or 8 years later its still never failed to run 100% and is my daughters CC now. The first owner later got to shoot it again and now has another kahr . It was ether ammo or him . Never will know . I still wear a nitrile glove and inner tube on my kahr grips come range day . I hate the texture design even on my old semi tough build builder hands .

Try a 200gr speer lawman ammo . Hard to find better factory fmj ammo for break in . Oh all my guide rods have ripples , new , old , they all look alike .

[Ikeo74]

OK Gene, try this: The groves on your guide rod is an indication that the rod is not properly lubed. When the rod & springs are not lubed enough the springs bind when the gun is fired. Binding causes a lot of friction between the springs and the guide rod. This friction will cause the problem you have described, failure to eject and failure to load. Now here is the fix: Get your grease gun out that you lube your car with, chassis grease, not axle bearing grease. Lube the guide rod assembly with enough grease to coat the springs and get the grease all the way down to cover the guide rod. Use a liberal amount. Now with your finger or a rag lightly coat the slide rails from front to back. Don't put grease anywhere else. I guarantee that this will cure your problem and you can shoot more than 50 rounds without a problem. Post back after you do this and shoot another 50 rounds.

[gene62]

It should run with Blazer brass or blazer alum.case, or Winchester 230 fmj case or other brands but it does not. I have not tired ant HP's because if it does not feed FMJ,I am not going to trust HP's. Also I have not seen a disclaimer on it only functioning with certain types ammo, and for suggested retail price it has, it should run all FMJ for sure.
If it is me, the gun is still unreliable at this point, for my purpose any way. And what a shame, because I really want it to work ,nothing on the market I see comes close for size and weight.

[gene62]

Thanks for the help, but I tried the grease some months back with no better results. Also tried different lube, still the same.

[hardluk1]

Have you tried to plunk test the ammo yet ?? To to see if they fit the chamber well and can you hand cycle the slide and chamber those rounds cleanly and slowly . I will say one more time Try a quality fmj ammo just to see if it is the ammo or the handgun. Blaser and wwb are not always good quality and surely never a premium quality ammo . Other wise , good luck with what ever you decide to do with your pistol in the future.

Plunk Test -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdJLNox1hpk

[gene62]

Just an up date. Kahr asked for me to return the pistol and all of my magazines .
They put in a new barrel, new extractor and new recoils spring.
No one can say that they are not trying to make it right. That is not a cheap fix. More to follow after the next range trip.

[b4uqzme]

Thanks for the update gene. Best of luck to ya.