"Rules of Engagement?"

[muggsy]

As some of you guys might know, my 94 year old Uncle John served in WWII as a Marine on Okinawa and Iwo Jima. The other day I ask him what the "rules of engagement" were when he fought in the Pacific. He gave me a puzzled look and asked what I meant by "rules of engagement". I explained the term to him and his puzzled look turned to one of anger. He told me that the only "rules of engagement" that the marines had ever been given was to kill Japs and that the government wasn't too damned concerned about how they did it. Knife, bayonet, gun, flame thrower, grenade, mortar, bazooka, tank, or cannon, it mattered not. That may just be why WWII was the last war that this country ever won.

[Second Try]

Well spoken!

[CJB]

Patton's rules of engagement were few.

1. Don't tell me you're holding your position, you should be holding the enemy by the balls instead.
2. Keep advancing, and cut through the enemy like sh!t through a tin horn.

[OldFatGuy]

We need to be nice. If we are nice, they will see how our way is the best way and they will lay down their arms eventually. :cheer2:

[getsome]

Too bad we can't let this guy loose on the Muzzies

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sv9XNFpRdhg

[CJB]

We need to be nice. If we are nice, they will see how our way is the best way and they will lay down their arms eventually. :cheer2:


Spill the enemies blood, rip out his guts and use them to grease our tank treads!
--- George Patton

The enemy is the enemy. Victory is achieved by killing more of him than he does of us. There isn't any other way about it. Playing nice is what the girly men do between the times their butts are getting stuffed.

[Longitude Zero]

Be nice, be polite, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet!

[sharpetop]

No political correctness in this thread! As it should be!

[Longitude Zero]

Shoot First...Shoot Second...Shoot Some More and when everybody is dead move on to the next target rich environment.

[jocko]

As some of you guys might know, my 94 year old Uncle John served in WWII as a Marine on Okinawa and Iwo Jima. The other day I ask him what the "rules of engagement" were when he fought in the Pacific. He gave me a puzzled look and asked what I meant by "rules of engagement". I explained the term to him and his puzzled look turned to one of anger. He told me that the only "rules of engagement" that the marines had ever been given was to kill Japs and that the government wasn't too damned concerned about how they did it. Knife, bayonet, gun, flame thrower, grenade, mortar, bazooka, tank, or cannon, it mattered not. That may just be why WWII was the last war that this country ever won.

you hae a very wise uncle, I salute hm, for his merits. Luv his rules of engagement. very simple when u think of it. I remember back some 60+ uyears that we never had one item in our business made in JAPAN. who the fokk ever heard of bangolash, or Taiwan or komifornia or Washington back then??? Just sayin

[Armybrat]

We need to be nice. If we are nice, they will see how our way is the best way and they will lay down their arms eventually. :cheer2:

The spokesfemale for John Kerry's state department just said in February that the solution to taming these ISIS butchers was not to kill them, but to give them a jobs program - I kid you not:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/02/17/state-department-spokeswoman-floats-jobs-as-answer-to-isis/

[Scarywoody]

The "ROE" have made us forget how to win. With ISIS making advances I hope we re-think our ROE and kill all those f*ckers.

[Armybrat]

you hae a very wise uncle, I salute hm, for his merits. Luv his rules of engagement. very simple when u think of it. I remember back some 60+ uyears that we never had one item in our business made in JAPAN. who the fokk ever heard of bangolash, or Taiwan or komifornia or Washington back then??? Just sayin
Hey, 60+ years ago I had a couple of tin windup toys that were made in "Occupied Japan". :p

[Handy]

What were the rules of engagement that caused us to "lose" Korea?

[Longitude Zero]

The "ROE" have made us forget how to win. With ISIS making advances I hope we re-think our ROE and kill all those f*ckers.

Agreed.

[Longitude Zero]

What were the rules of engagement that caused us to "lose" Korea?

We did not "loose" in Korea but we dang sure did not win either. It was at best a draw ended by an armistice which is a formal agreement of warring parties to stop fighting. It is not necessarily the end of a war (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War), since it may constitute only a cessation of hostilities (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessation_of_hostilities) while an attempt is made to negotiate a lasting peace.

[jocko]

The spokesfemale for John Kerry's state department just said in February that the solution to taming these ISIS butchers was not to kill them, but to give them a jobs program - I kid you not:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/02/17/state-department-spokeswoman-floats-jobs-as-answer-to-isis/

jpretty damn hard to fight that kind of mentality to. I think they really believe that crap to.

[Armybrat]

What were the rules of engagement that caused us to "lose" Korea?

Truman wouldn't listen to MacArthur to nuke the Norks.

So Doug got fired.

[Pteridine]

As my pilot buds used to say "Nuke 'em 'till they glow and use their a$$es for runway markers."

[Handy]

Dropping nukes isn't "ROE".

We won the wars we did because we were fighting uniformed men, not a series of insurgencies where it was unclear who were the bad guys and who we were fighting the war for. That's where ROE's came from - no easy way of telling who was supposed to be killed, so some guidelines were provided. We never fought "Japs" anyplace where there was a Japanese civilian population, so it didn't take much brain power to figure out who gets killed.

As with many of these threads, I don't understand the point - are you guys saying simply everyone is a particular place should be killed, or are you just talking about genocide for certain religions, ethnicities, etc?

[muggsy]

Kill them all Handy and let Allah sort them out. In war, everyone is a soldier. We seem to have forgotten that. There is only one rule in a war. Win, or lose. Which side do you want to be on?

[marshal kane]

Seems to me that ROE come from those who have never served in the military nor have ever shouldered a rifle in anger. Seems to me that we are going to have to kill every one of them like the crusaders did in order to win. We are fighting a religion regardless of what the neighborhood organizer says and religions are difficult to eradicate. IMO, there is no room for ROE if you're fighting for your life.

[Longitude Zero]

Seems to me that ROE come from those who have never served in the military nor have ever shouldered a rifle in anger. Seems to me that we are going to have to kill every one of them like the crusaders did in order to win. We are fighting a religion regardless of what the neighborhood organizer says and religions are difficult to eradicate. IMO, there is no room for ROE if you're fighting for your life.

Yuppa

[Handy]

US soldiers, like myself, have NEVER just killed everyone. Not in the Civil war, Indian wars, Mexican-American war, WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Panama, Gulf War 1 or 2 or Afghanistan.


You guys are a bunch of genocidal Nazi racists. That isn't a "personal attack" - it's a label you've earned with your deeply un-American hate rhetoric. Luckily for the rest of the earth, your ridiculous ideas are as impossible to implement as they are evil.


Mods: Ban me if you want, but please remove skinhead hate talk from your website. Thanks.

[Handy]

And I'm pretty damn sure Kahr Arms doesn't need or want to be associated with a forum that tolerates this kind of hate and calls for crimes against humanity.

[Bawanna]

There's a lot of emotion and desire for retaliation given the events of late around the world.

I'm not reading this as racist or Nazi at all.

I have to agree and I'm sure all soldiers would agree that Rules of Engagement while certainly necessary are way over done in many cases.
The thought of a soldier being convicted as a criminal for shooting an innocent by accident in a war zone does not set well with me.

Usually kids, I have one in that situation right now, well trained but under intense pressure, mistakes happen.

Keep in civil, thoughts and prayer to the most recent victims.

[CJB]

Handy - The US military has in fact, inflicted mass killing, for reason (or not).
We burned entire villages - with and without order in Vietnam.
We nuked two cities of absolute minimal military importance.
We destroyed native Americans (Indians for those in Rio Linda) by the scores upon score.
We carpet bombed in WWII.

And that's off the top of my head, so don't be self righteous.

Here's what. I can remember times when a few bullies on the playground at school ended up in having the whole recess - six or eight elementary school classes - kept inside, in their classrooms instead of out for playtime. Why did the teachers do that? Because nobody would come forward, everyone got punished.

We go over and destroy a "stronghold city", or two, or five, or twenty, we will break their back, break their morale, and put and end to it. Whack another person someplace with an Allahu Akbar... and we level another city.

These people are cowards. Innate, piss soaked cowards. You fire back and they crap themselves and run or give up, trying to make a spectacle of things. Their mentality is no different from any mass killing individual. They all give up, run, kill themselves, but never put up a fight against real force. They cannot fight, are in reality poorly trained to fight, and wouldn't be fit to clean the urinals in a Howard Johnson's truck stop on the graveyard shift.

They are cowards. They can only terrorize, or attempt to, by being opportunistic, like the kid who threw the water balloon, who runs when someone tries to put an end to things. They are cowards, they cannot fight, and they cannot win - UNLESS we do nothing.

Our God damned cornhole in chief - Barack Hussein "the Arab-lovin" Obama will see to it that we do nothing. The man is so pathetic he could be gettin' gang raped up the ass by a group of camel jockeys, and he'd have the unmitigated courtesy to hand them each a fresh condom before hand, and be absolutely and resolutely proud for his own actions.

[SlowBurn]

Dropping nukes isn't "ROE".

We won the wars we did because we were fighting uniformed men, not a series of insurgencies where it was unclear who were the bad guys and who we were fighting the war for. That's where ROE's came from - no easy way of telling who was supposed to be killed, so some guidelines were provided. We never fought "Japs" anyplace where there was a Japanese civilian population, so it didn't take much brain power to figure out who gets killed.

As with many of these threads, I don't understand the point - are you guys saying simply everyone is a particular place should be killed, or are you just talking about genocide for certain religions, ethnicities, etc?


US soldiers, like myself, have NEVER just killed everyone. Not in the Civil war, Indian wars, Mexican-American war, WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Panama, Gulf War 1 or 2 or Afghanistan.

You guys are a bunch of genocidal Nazi racists. That isn't a "personal attack" - it's a label you've earned with your deeply un-American hate rhetoric. Luckily for the rest of the earth, your ridiculous ideas are as impossible to implement as they are evil.

Mods: Ban me if you want, but please remove skinhead hate talk from your website. Thanks.

Blatant falsehoods, wild name calling, and a demand that whoever disagrees shut up. Must be a university student.

[muggsy]

We firebombed and incinerated civilians in WWII. Our enemies in every war tortured and murdered P.O.W.s. I'm not stating that as a justification for those actions. It's just a statement of fact. War is hell. If our enemies don't want to see hell then they shouldn't tread on us.

[Handy]

Handy - The US military has in fact, inflicted mass killing, for reason (or not).
We burned entire villages - with and without order in Vietnam.
We nuked two cities of absolute minimal military importance.
We destroyed native Americans (Indians for those in Rio Linda) by the scores upon score.
We carpet bombed in WWII.

And that's off the top of my head, so don't be self righteous.

Here's what. I can remember times when a few bullies on the playground at school ended up in having the whole recess - six or eight elementary school classes - kept inside, in their classrooms instead of out for playtime. Why did the teachers do that? Because nobody would come forward, everyone got punished.

We go over and destroy a "stronghold city", or two, or five, or twenty, we will break their back, break their morale, and put and end to it. Whack another person someplace with an Allahu Akbar... and we level another city.

These people are cowards. Innate, piss soaked cowards. You fire back and they crap themselves and run or give up, trying to make a spectacle of things. Their mentality is no different from any mass killing individual. They all give up, run, kill themselves, but never put up a fight against real force. They cannot fight, are in reality poorly trained to fight, and wouldn't be fit to clean the urinals in a Howard Johnson's truck stop on the graveyard shift.

They are cowards. They can only terrorize, or attempt to, by being opportunistic, like the kid who threw the water balloon, who runs when someone tries to put an end to things. They are cowards, they cannot fight, and they cannot win - UNLESS we do nothing.

Our God damned cornhole in chief - Barack Hussein "the Arab-lovin" Obama will see to it that we do nothing. The man is so pathetic he could be gettin' gang raped up the ass by a group of camel jockeys, and he'd have the unmitigated courtesy to hand them each a fresh condom before hand, and be absolutely and resolutely proud for his own actions.

You just posted a list of things that most normal people are a bit embarrassed about - like giving the Indians smallpox blankets. They are the exceptions, not the norm. And we nuked Japan specifically to avoid having a major ROE issue if we had to invade conventionally - and it almost didn't work.


But this isn't about Dresden or Mi Lai - it is about a bunch of so-called Americans announcing that we are in a war with 23% of the earth's population, and that those 1,620,000,000 need to be killed. Of that 1.62 billion, 6,600,000 live here, and 70% of those are your fellow citizens.


What you're specifically suggesting - that if we just do something big enough Muslims will stop hating the west - is a little silly. We dismantled, in days, the fourth largest army on earth and beat the Taliban when the Soviet Union could not. I can't imagine what level of destruction is suddenly going to make the group of people that we're killing suddenly uninterested in fighting us. The Japanese thought we wouldn't fight if they bombed Pearl Harbor - why are you expecting anyone else to lie down and take it?

[muggsy]

I don't believe that anyone has ever been banned for expressing a liberal point of view. Several people have been banned for repeatedly violating the TOS.

[Handy]

I don't believe that anyone has ever been banned for expressing a liberal point of view. Several people have been banned for repeatedly violating the TOS.
I very much doubt that the TOS is there to safeguard attacks on all Muslims, including Muslim members of Kahrtalk. This is firearms website, not a KKK message board.

I haven't even posted anything that is "liberal". In 9 years of military service, I don't think I ever met a group of people that would agree with the racism in this thread or hopelessly foolish strategies suggested. They are about as nutty as some 14 year old kid in Yemen thinking he can beat the US by throwing rocks and blowing up a cafe.

[muggsy]

[QUOTE=Handy;355020]You just posted a list of things that most normal people are a bit embarrassed about - like giving the Indians smallpox blankets.

You are of course aware that the U.S. Government never gave the Indians blankets that were infected with smallpox. It was a total fabrication made by Ward Churchill. I guess that one might say that you may have taken one long drink of the liberal Kool-aid.

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/p/plag/5240451.0001.009/--did-the-us-army-distribute-smallpox-blankets-to-indians?rgn=main;view=fulltext

[muggsy]

I very much doubt that the TOS is there to safeguard attacks on all Muslims, including Muslim members of Kahrtalk. This is firearms website, not a KKK message board.

I haven't even posted anything that is "liberal". In 9 years of military service, I don't think I ever met a group of people that would agree with the racism in this thread or hopelessly foolish strategies suggested. They are about as nutty as some 14 year old kid in Yemen thinking he can beat the US by throwing rocks and blowing up a cafe.

Kahr Talk is a private message board. Kahr Arms is in no way associated with Kahr Talk, nor are they responsible for it's content.

[Handy]

[QUOTE=Handy;355020]You just posted a list of things that most normal people are a bit embarrassed about - like giving the Indians smallpox blankets.

You are of course aware that the U.S. Government never gave the Indians blankets that were infected with smallpox. It was a total fabrication made by Ward Churchill.

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/p/plag/5240451.0001.009/--did-the-us-army-distribute-smallpox-blankets-to-indians?rgn=main;view=fulltext
It doesn't matter (and we've been talking about it since before Ward Churchill published in 1994).

We did bomb Dresden, and if we had lost the war that would have been a topic of a Nuremberg type trial. The fact that the US has been involved in war crimes in the past doesn't support their future use. What you all seem to be so confused about is that no US infantry soldier has been officially and legally ordered to kill everyone in a particular population. Believe it or not, genocide is something the US has taken a strong stance against.

[Handy]

Kahr Talk is a private message board. Kahr Arms is in no way associated with Kahr Talk, nor are they responsible for it's content.
And the rules for this board are:





All posts must be in some way firearms or shooting sports related.
Posts containing off topic, vulgar, insulting, inflammatory, or adult content will be removed.
Members are asked to treat one another with respect and civility at all times.
Posts containing verbal attacks on the moderators, employees of Kahr Arms, or the company itself will be removed.
Keep posts in their appropriate sub-forums, in particular advertisements of items for sale or trade.
Commercial vendors wishing to post items for sale on the forums must seek moderator approval before posting. Once vendor sponsorships are in place, procedures will be outlined for proper posting of such for sale items.


This thread violates 1, 2 and 3. 4 sure makes it look like Kahr has a vested interest in this board.

I just don't understand why you guys sully this firearms board with this filth. It's not like there are many useful posts about firearms going on. I'm sure Stormfront would welcome you with open arms.

[muggsy]

War is a firearms related topic. Politics are also firearms related because of the liberal politicians who want to ban them. People who violate rule #3 are warned and repeat offenders are banned. Posts that contain verbal attacks are remove at the moderators discretion. I'm not a moderator. If you have a problem with the TOS take it up with a moderator. Their names are listed.

[Bawanna]

I'm a member of one other board and recently was asked to be a moderator there too. It's a very pleasant forum usually much like this one usually. One of the other mods adheres to and suggest a very hands off approach, kind of live and let live and things will work themselves out.

I generally adhere to the preemptive strike, don't let little brush fires turn into out of control forest fires.

I've tried to adopt the hands off approach but it's just not working for me too well.

To be clear here, this forum is in fact very much related and endorsed by Kahr, the only Kahr forum that Kahr does in fact endorse.
That being said, nobody here in admin or mod works for Kahr although we probably all wish we did.
Kahr "the company" is not responsible for the content of this forum.

I was also told early in my moderator internship long long ago that it doesn't take long to become hard and intolerant, I like to think even after all these years that hasn't happened yet. But I do see it a coming.

All that being said I just flipped a coin Head for hands off approach and Tails for Premptive Strike and well it came up tails.

I've regretted the day we ever created a political subforum but you can't hardly mention a gun without politics being involved now days.

All this being said I'm shutting this one down, both sides have aired their opinion, I don't foresee anything good or beneficial forthcoming. If one wants to study history there are books and internet searches we all can learn a lot from.

So as the sun finally shines thru on bawanna's house I bid you adieu.