Portraying the Good Guys : 1920s/30s cops

[Story]

Something I haven't seen addressed before, is how to turn out as one of the good guys. I'd think the best starting point for this conversation should be a few photos (with a bias towards NJ, since it was between those two hotbeds of crime, Philadelphia and New York City).

The entire Teaneck NJ police force, circa 1930.
http://www.teaneck.org/virtualvillage/police/1930.jpg

..and some better detail of your standard wool-coated beat cops and civilian-clothed Supervisors, from the Fairlawn NJ PD.
http://www.fairlawnpd.com/history/images_history/late_1930s.jpg
It's a big pic, but image trying to find your sidearm, let alone draw it fast during the winter!
FLPD History (http://www.fairlawnpd.com/history/history.htm)

...and Camden motorcycle cops in 1928
http://www.dvrbs.com/Camden/images/Bike1.jpg
http://www.dvrbs.com/Camden/CamdenNJ-MotorcyclesInCamden.htm


..and Schwarzkopf's NJ State Police
http://www.capitalcentury.com/20stroop.jpg
New Jersey State Police - History -1930's (http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/about/30s.html)
1928: The first troopers (http://www.capitalcentury.com/1928.html)

[The Hustler]

Great topic. Not everyone wants to play a bad guy. And you can't play "Cops and Robbers" with only robbers. We want to see more good guy characters at Zoot Shooters matches. Those old cop uniforms would make excellent costumes. We'd also like to start using the Good-Bad Caper design. I think it'll add a great element to the sport.

[G Man]

I was the only good guy at the Zoot Shooters National Championships. As the "G Man" I was wearing a suit with a badge. I have looked at putting together a period police uniform but it would be very hot to wear in the summer even in the Colorado mountains. One other consideration would be, that to be period correct I would have to shoot a revolver or revolvers. I do enjoying dressing period correct but I would also like to have some chance of shooting competitively as well. We do need to have separate revolver categories.

[Story]

TRENTON, N.J. (AP) -- Howard Barton Unruh, who killed 13 people as he walked the streets of Camden in a psychotic 1949 shooting spree that was the nation's worst mass murder at the time, died Monday. He was 88.

TBO.com - News From AP (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_OBIT_UNRUH?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=US)

So what's this got to do with Zootshooting? Check who's toting Thompsons while hunting for Unruh.

Detective Kelly, Camden PD
Camden People - William E. Kelly (http://www.dvrbs.com/PEOPLE/CamdenPeople-WilliamEKelly.htm)
http://www.dvrbs.com/PEOPLE/CamdenCops/WilliamKelly-Unruh-01.jpg

and Officer Hance
Camden People - Charles S. Hance (http://www.dvrbs.com/People/CamdenPeople-CharlesSHance.htm)
http://www.dvrbs.com/People/CamdenCops/CharlesSHance-Unruh-01.jpg

Note : there's caper/scenario potential here, one or two 'Good Guys' versus the pre-TV age insane serial killer.

Straight out of the original **** Tracy comics.

[paul0660]

If you have a good guy outfit can you take bribes to complete the effect?

[Story]

Vintage **** TRACY movie
YouTube - Dick Tracy Detective (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06WWlQu10VI)

Note the suit and hats on the detectives, as well as the cops' uniforms.

[The Hustler]

AZSA member number 17 is "**** Tracy"

[Story]

Eclectic fashion inspiration for 2010.
http://www.filmsquish.com/guts/files/images/untouchables1.jpg

[Story]

While they portrayed period prison guards, Morse and Hanks in good vintage representations of metropolitan police uniforms.

http://images.allmoviephoto.com/1999_The_Green_Mile/tom_hanks_david_morse_the_green_mile_001.jpg http://images.allmoviephoto.com/1999_The_Green_Mile/tom_hanks_the_green_mile_002.jpg

[Ghostsoldier]

While they portrayed period prison guards, Morse and Hanks in good vintage representations of metropolitan police uniforms.

http://images.allmoviephoto.com/1999_The_Green_Mile/tom_hanks_david_morse_the_green_mile_001.jpg http://images.allmoviephoto.com/1999_The_Green_Mile/tom_hanks_the_green_mile_002.jpg

I don't see any pics, Story....:(
Rob

[Story]

I don't see any pics, Story....:(
Rob

I've been having that problem too - but if you hit the Quote on my post, you'll see the image tags around the link.

[Story]

Stumbled on this -
Police Rifles Then and Now
The beautiful craftsmanship and deadly accuracy of antique police rifles match any in today’s squad cars.
http://www.policemag.com/Channel/Weapons/Articles/2003/03/Arsenal.aspx

[kahrnut1]

notice hance with camden police 2nd. picture has finger on trigger. if he was still alive we would have to chastise him

[Story]

While they portrayed period prison guards, Morse and Hanks in good vintage representations of metropolitan police uniforms.


http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/3420/tomhanksdavidmorsethegr.jpg

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/3169/tomhanksthegreenmile002.jpg

[Ghostsoldier]

That's a great period movie (and an even better book).

Rob

[DeaconKC]

Here's a link with some great photos of Railroad Police:
http://www.therailroadpolice.com/photos.htm

[Story]

Note : there's caper/scenario potential here, one or two 'Good Guys' versus the pre-TV age insane serial killer.

Unruh files released.

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/5924/20091020inqjunruh20d.jpg


http://www.philly.com/philly/news/140345203.html

http://www.philly.com/philly/video/BC1472070325001.html4

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/Howard_Unruhs_initial_statement_to_prosecutors.htm l

[Story]

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/641/hiddenbooze.jpg


Jan. 9, 1930 New York Times: “The latest thing in speakeasies: Sergeant Frank T. Zimmie and Detective Joseph Pallinado of the Philadelphia Police, exhibiting one of the twelve pint bottles of liquor cached in the papier-mâché clothes dummy, draped with an evening gown, found in the tailor shop they raided.” Two days later, The Times published an article about claims of a “police protected” speakeasy made at a luncheon of the Women’s Organization for Prohibition Reform in Philadelphia.

[DeaconKC]

Here's a great link on Lawmen's holsters from history:
http://www.gunblast.com/WBell_PoliceHolsterHist.htm
and another cool link:
http://njrpfa.com/njstatepolice.pdf

[Story]

A History of FBI Handguns
http://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/history-of-fbi-handguns/

[DeaconKC]

Thanks for the pics, a very nice piece of history.

[DeaconKC]

Great picture of a gambling raid in 1925
http://www.shorpy.com/node/9192?size=_original

[Story]

Philadelphia Police Department circa 1944.
Some of them look sharp.
Others, not so much.

http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/9495/ppd1944.jpg

[jlottmc]

I may have to look into this, I kind of want to get into some fun shooting, and this would be right up my alley, I'd have to use reproductions though, I'm still a working man.

[DeaconKC]

We got another one on the hook folks!

[G Man]

Gentelmen,

If you look at the Wall Street Journal photos you will see how to portray a good guy.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203513204576047843270055436.html#p rev

Thanks
G Man AZSA #11

[jlottmc]

My concern there would be that most police in the period carried a 32, or 38 revolver. Not a bad thing to have to get a model 10 to shoot with, but dump pouches would be a pain, and I like my 1911. Of course I would have to get one a little more period correct, and would have to use my MILSURP rifles for those stages, which would knock out my Enfield. That one is a 2A, and since the .308 was not around then, I don't figure I could use it.
How would an M44 Moisin-Nagant fair in rifle matches, and a breech-break shotgun (single shot) do as well?
Dang it, now I'm going to be spending more money on guns and gear. Thanks guys.

[DeaconKC]

Hi ya JL, here is the link with the rules for your guns:
http://www.zootshooters.com/rules
And now you have a great excuse to get another 1911 or a 1917 revolver. You will have to reload for a milsurp rifle as the 1400 fps rule will not allow factory loads [unless there is some seriously downloaded stuff being made i don't know about].

[Bawanna]

Hi ya JL, here is the link with the rules for your guns:
http://www.zootshooters.com/rules
And now you have a great excuse to get another 1911 or a 1917 revolver. You will have to reload for a milsurp rifle as the 1400 fps rule will not allow factory loads [unless there is some seriously downloaded stuff being made i don't know about].

Oooh, I want another 1911 and a 1917 revolver (I know where one is).

Can I be Melvin Purvis? He the right era. Maybe Frank Hammer? I better study up on my gangster history so I can talk intelligent.
Definitely have to get that SBR license and the correct barrel on my Tommy too.

[jlottmc]

Guess that means I need an M-1 carbine too. Reading that means getting into this is going to be expensive, and difficult. Then there is the start up around here, no club, hmmm, more thought is required.
I saw also that military type costumes are not generally excepted, unless they were of a Prohibition type action, kind a shame that I wouldn't be able to have a persona with a China Marine background. Maybe something that is more true to life than I care to admit. I dunno, looks fun, so we'll see.

[Race Bannon]

Depending on the persona, a Rossi Model 92 (Winchester 1892 clone) would be a great rifle. I would look for somethig that holds 10 shots. a companion revolver, like a used model 10 would be a great way to start. Although a shotgun is not manditory, there are plenty of pre 1950 style pump shotguns available for modest cost at gun shows ana at many gunshops. The 10 foot rule is pretty forgiving for revolvers so you don't need a 5 screw S&W, a more modern used S&W will serve just as well.

[DeaconKC]

JL, check out the archeological expeditions of the 20s and 30s of guys like Roy Chapman Andrews. Your campaign hat would work just fine in them.

[jlottmc]

I was thinking about that, and the persona would be more of a Marine mail guard for the time than a China Marine. I was also thinking like Race, and thinking a Marlin lever gun in 38/357 would be a good choice, or a Henry Bog Boy in 44mag/44spl. with a companion revolver as well. I know the 44 mag would not be period, but the 44spl would be. Been meaning to pick up some of that action anyway. This is going to take some doing and is not going to be an overnight process.
I do appreciate the help and information you guys are giving me. My wife not so much. I may have to find a range down here that wouldn't mind playing host, and starting a chapter here. Again, thanks guys, you've given me much to think about.

[DeaconKC]

Marine Mail Guard? IMA has lots of repro holsters and accessories marked USMC! [nudge, nudge]
http://www.ima-usa.com/u-s-m-1912-cavalry-holster-u-s-m-c.html

[Story]

In a 1920s brick fortress near the gritty corner of York Boulevard and Figueroa Street in Highland Park, the intertwined history of Los Angeles and its police force is slowly being recovered from fragile documents that were never meant to be saved.

A few steps from the bullet-riddled patrol cars from the 1997 North Hollywood bank shootout and relics of the Symbionese Liberation Army on display at the former station, Los Angeles Police Museum volunteer Joan Renner, under guidance from the Getty Museum, is painstakingly archiving half a century of bulletins that provide snapshots of the LAPD starting in 1907.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-harnisch-20120619,0,7602035.column

[Story]

Gratuitous inspiration

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m879y46R0e1qmp5efo1_500.jpg

[Story]

Found this while looking for something else -

1930's Group Photos Of FBI Training Classes
http://historicalgmen.squarespace.com/1930s-group-photos-of-fbi-trai/

From
Faded Glory: Dusty Roads Of An FBI Era
http://historicalgmen.squarespace.com/

[Story]

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/116/philadelphiapolicepract.jpg

[DeaconKC]

Now that is a fantastic find! Thanks!

[Story]

LASD Pistol Team Exhibition, Historic, 1936

http://youtu.be/jDP8BRSEjrA

[Story]

This might be useful in general - http://www.paper-dragon.com/1939/

[Ghostsoldier]

That is pretty cool...thanks for posting it, Story.
Rob