Help me figure out what blew up my CW9.... (pics)

[ElMateo487]

Alright....

So I bought a CW9 a few weeks ago, and have been loving it, (though getting used to the trigger is taking a bit). A year ago I bought 1000 rounds of reman 9mm from a place called Triune Defense (http://triunedefense.com/product-category/ammunition/9mm/). I have been plinking with this stuff for a year now, and have had no major problems. I found a few rounds that looked sketchy, and just though "Eh, I probably shouldn't shoot that" and set them aside (pics later).

But last night I had a catastrophic failure. I was practicing controlled pairs, and the round fired right before the round that blew up did not sound light or funny. So I don't think it was a squib load, everything was looking normal. Then this...


http://i.imgur.com/19NuaJR.jpg

Hurt pretty bad, but mostly just rattled me.

http://i.imgur.com/Kq3zRyC.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/JyBfQrD.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/6JGA8BW.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/4FbD3H3.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/4Ao8EJC.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/abl9wcC.jpg

So a few questions......

Am I just stupid for not checking every single round I loaded into a mag? Is that a normal thing people do for reman ammo?

Was this just a bullet that was set too low in the case and thus has excess pressure? Or what caused this...?

Is there anything salvageable left of the gun?

Here is a picture of a poorly loaded round... But I am fairly confident I didn't shoot one of these. Could it have just been a hot loaded round? The picture is of 3 rounds from the same batch

http://i.imgur.com/nCwQMvf.jpg


Thanks for your input

[Alfonse]

Your story makes a good argument for using only quality, factory rounds. The ammunition you used probably cost less than quality, factory rounds. But seeing the photos, I think the factory rounds are worth the extra cost.

On the pistol, my first thought was to start over. But, looking at it again, I might have a good gunsmith check it out. It might actually not need much.

[ElMateo487]

Your story makes a good argument for using only quality, factory rounds. The ammunition you used probably cost less than quality, factory rounds. But seeing the photos, I think the factory rounds are worth the extra cost.

On the pistol, my first thought was to start over. But, looking at it again, I might have a good gunsmith check it out. It might actually not need much.

Hindsight is 20/20 for sure, I completely agree. Will not be doing reman ammo again... The savings for reman definitely don't make up for the cost to fix this or replace it.

p.s. I bought your +1 extension, and mag extension sleeves/bases. Ill be doing a review of them sometime this week. Thanks :)

[jagower]

Looks repairable from what I can see,but I would send it in and get an estimate. Better to have kahr give it a good inspection to be safe. Looks like a weak spot in the web area of the case and being a reload their could have been a bulge there that they ironed out. These are the reasons I only use my own reloads, my inspections are alot better and I know what i'm getting. Thank goodness the pistol did what it was designed to do and you were not seriously hurt but I don't think I would shoot anymore of those.

jag

[RonW]

Here is a picture of a poorly loaded round.http://i.imgur.com/nCwQMvf.jpg


Thanks for your input


This is what destroyed your gun... a deep set bullet will create excessive pressure that can & will damage a pistol...

is the pistol repairable? yes. That side panel is designed by kahr to pop out incase a event such as this occures. I would send it back to them along with a letter explaining what happened & have them inspect the frame to be sure it is safe

[Bawanna]

I'd also contact the reloader with these same pictures. I just got a box of ammo in from a citizen last week. It's commercial reloads and blew up his gun. The reloader paid for a new gun. Guy wanted us to destroy it so he doesn't blow up another.
He had a very large bag of 22 from the same manufacturer that he didn't have an issue with but didn't trust it. I'm not sure on that stuff. I may try shooting the 22 stuff, looks ok.

The gun is definitely fixable, it was an over pressure or weak case situation or combination of both.

Kahr should fix you up. Hope the reloader helps offset the cost for you.

[Longitude Zero]

Your story makes a good argument for using only quality, factory rounds. The ammunition you used probably cost less than quality, factory rounds. But seeing the photos, I think the factory rounds are worth the extra cost

Exactly why I NEVER use remans or reloads. The cheap price is NOT worth the risk. IIRC Kahrs warranty, an most if not all others, deny service for problems caused by remans and reloads as they should.

[Longitude Zero]

Like RonW posted bullet setack and over pressure are the almost certain culprits here.

[Bawanna]

Kahr may not do it for free but it shouldn't take much to check things out and reinstall the side plate.

I don't think any other new parts will be required from what I can see anyhow.

Shouldn't be too horrible expensive to get it back on the track.

Have a dealer send it for you so you don't get worked over on shipping.

[Longitude Zero]

Kahr may not do it for free but it shouldn't take much to check things out and reinstall the side plate.

Repairs look to be simple for Kahr to do but they should not do it for free.

[wyntrout]

I lost the extractor in a similar incident. I narrowed the culprit casings to one brand after cases burst in my PM9, P9, and K9. The last was one fired in the K9 and I lost the extractor. On the P9 the sideplate blew off but I put everthing back in place and put a spare P9 extractor in with no subsequent problems. I broke down the remaining few rounds, fired the primers, and burned the powder. I only found one of the three extractors that blew out... one from each of the pistols.

[yqtszhj]

Do everything Bawanna said. Looks fixable to me from the pics too. Glad you didn't get hurt too bad.

[OvalNut]

Thank goodness you're OK, pistols are replaceable. I've not had near this level of problem with any rounds I've shot, though it brings to mind a bulk purchase of fairly popular .45 ACP reman rounds which I shot through a Beretta PX4 Storm. They were generally reliable though occasionally one would go just pop instead of bang, and then later another would go "Holy ***** BANG!!":eek:, instead of just bang. Took me a minute to catch my breath.

Factory fresh ammo only now for me. Speer Lawman TMJ is my flavor for range work. Federal HST for SD.


Tim

[Jollyrogers]

I have reloaded 1000s of 9mm and other pistol and rifle cartridges without issue. I would not shoot other's reloads (except my Dad's, he is an engineer and a perfectionist, and taught me). Setback was definitely a culprit. That round pictured with the extreme setback, was it cycled through your Khar, or was it like that coming outta the box? Either way, that would have triggered a red flag to an issue that said do not shoot this ammo. If one looks like that, I would bet that as they cycle, it is setting the bullet back during the process. One thing I have noticed, using even factory ammo that has a crimp, cycle them through the small Khars results in additional setback. I would presume those 9mm reloads you have do not have much neck tension, and hence when cycled, overcoming the feed ramp to enter the chamber set the bullet back, and you experienced the result, unfortunately.

Regardless, notify the ammo manufacture if they are still in business or even care, send the pistol to Khar, and get it taken care of. And very glad to see you weren't hurt, Kahr's design came through for you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[leftysixty]

I don't think that the round was over pressure (no signs on the primer) looks like a bad case, that should not have been reloaded.

The blown out spot is in a place of little support above the feed ramp. I would not shoot any more of those remans.

I don't think that the pistol is hurt, may need a coupl'a small parts. If it were mine I would clean it up replace and damaged parts and carry on. But that's just me, probably safest to send it to Kahr for a check up and fix estimate.

Let us know what happens with it.

[gun papa]

9mm is very sensitive to over all legnth. As I recall, my Speer manual states this right off the bat. I don't shoot anybody else's reloads but my own. I have seen too many kabooms over the years.

The last 1k of Magtech bullets I loaded was difficult to determine exactly what OAL was appropriate as loading data specifically for the Magtech bullets was not easy to find. Fortunately, I located a box of same grain, factory loads. I created my OAL by taking a measurement of a cross section of the factory loads. It was quite a bit longer than other load data I could find.

[OldLincoln]

When I started reloading I bought a lot of brass at a good price. I inspected each one and ended up tossing about 20%. Most were scars that I could easily feel with a fingernail even if they didn't look deep. Some though were for slightly bulged cases about where this one blew. They would have sized okay but why did they bulge to begin with. Now I shoot only my recovered brass. Yeah that takes a toll on my supply of brass but at this rate I'll be gone before they are. The problem I see with remanufactured rounds is you don't know what the brass looked like before it was resized. If you clean then inspect like a Drill Sargent you should be okay. I used a headset with 1.5X glass under a halogen lamp and took my time. As for OAL, I use the old drop test and ensure it is within specs.

Also, yours isn't the first to blow a panel. The first I read about was a few years ago and it was decided that the panel was made to blow easily to prevent really bad damage and hurt. Note the itsy bitsy screw into poly holding it on. Easy to strip also.

[ElMateo487]

Thanks so much everyone. A lot of great information.

A bit more info to answer some questions. The pictured round with a low set bullet was a round I set aside because it didn't look loaded right. I had been setting aside rounds that didn't look right while loading them.

I had never bought reman ammo, and unfortunately assumed it was a normal thing that some would be bad, so I tried to filter them out. I know now that this was probably just a red flag for more issues that I could not have noticed.

As for the gun, I thought the thing was toast. Haha, so that is good to hear I'll be able to fix it and carry on. I sure appreciate the design. My guess though is if I had been shooting left handed that the gas would have vented right into my support thumbs. My hand is already slightly flash burned. But definitely nothing dramatic.

I have contacted both Kahr and the company who sold me to reloads. We will see what happens. I'll keep you updated. Thanks again.

[Shoop]

I use Freedom Munitions all the time and even their factory seconds (Blaster) ammo has been immaculate for me. Some have said they got some underloaded rounds, but I've never had a problem.

New ammo from regular manufacturers has all sorts of problems too. Can't tell you how many times I've seen that (Winchester WB, Tula, Fiocchi). I usually notice something hinky like you did first.

[muggsy]

Your kaboom occurred for one of three possible reasons. An overcharge of powder, the wrong powder, or a weakened case that wasn't properly inspected before it was reloaded. Bullet set back, while undesirable for a number of reasons, will not cause a catastrophic failure.

[hardluk1]

Don't use anymore of that triune defense ammo after you have kahr look your cw9 over and side plate replaced . In the future . Buy a case gage and learn to plunk test ammo and try a few random rounds in both the gage and chamber . If ammo looks like QC is on a vacation , don't use it . Maybe you can get Triune Defense to buy that stuff back and pay for any repairs . Contact them and send photos of there ammo .

[CPTKILLER]

I'm selective with my ammo for all of my weapons. It is a good lessons learned. Without a comprehensive analysis the pistol looks like a write-off.

[jpshaw]

I'm always checking for setback from rounds that have been chambered, especially if chambered more then once. I will set them on the table and visually check them. If one is just a bitty bit I might chunk it into "shoot this next range session jar" but if one looks anything like yours do it will be discarded. When I say a bitty bit I mean I had to hold lay a piece of paper on top of several to see the difference.

[muggsy]

I use Freedom Munitions all the time and even their factory seconds (Blaster) ammo has been immaculate for me. Some have said they got some underloaded rounds, but I've never had a problem.

New ammo from regular manufacturers has all sorts of problems too. Can't tell you how many times I've seen that (Winchester WB, Tula, Fiocchi). I usually notice something hinky like you did first.

The difference between the regular manufacturers and the re-manufacturers is that he regular manufacturers stand behind there products and will replace your gun if their ammunition is the cause of your guns failure.

[Frequent Flyer]

Those rounds don't really look crimped to me. Maybe just enough to take the bell out of it. Kahr's steep feed ramp could easily set back an uncrimped or under crimped bullet. No telling where they get their brass or how many times it has been used also. I only shoot factory ammo or my own reloads. I have seen many kabooms from factory reloaded ammo on my range.

[marshal kane]

As a reloader, I would break down those rejects and reuse the components with my powder charge. I seldom toss away cartridges.

[muggsy]

Those rounds don't really look crimped to me. Maybe just enough to take the bell out of it. Kahr's steep feed ramp could easily set back an uncrimped or under crimped bullet. No telling where they get their brass or how many times it has been used also. I only shoot factory ammo or my own reloads. I have seen many kabooms from factory reloaded ammo on my range.

The 9mm Luger rounds are taper crimped. You probably won't be able to see the crimp with the naked eye. The 9mm Luger head spaces on the case mouth.

[ElMateo487]

As a reloader, I would break down those rejects and reuse the components with my powder charge. I seldom toss away cartridges.

Do you live in Southern California? Because you can have them :)

On another note. Kahr got back to me super fast, and have been very accommodating. It'll cost an hours worth of labor, and parts. So around 80 bucks. Not bad, and I would rather them look it over than me just replacing the parts myself.

Triune Defense, as I suspected they would, have not gotten back to me at all.

[CJB]

Not too bad!

[ElMateo487]

Well! I got my gun back! Looks flawless, and for some reason they didn't charge me anything, though they quoted me!

It also looks like they polished the feed ramp.

Awesome service. Did take about a month. But overall they took care of me.

They replaced the following

- barrel
- extractor, front pin, rear pin and spring
- side panel

And tested it

[Bawanna]

Not charging you......that's a good thing. Heck that's a great thing.

[Alfonse]

Sweet! That must feel pretty good.

[Armybrat]

Glad they took care of you, now hope it shoots like it's supposed to.

[Bobshouse]

If Kahr fixed it and didn't charge you it means one of two things:

They charged the ammo manufacturer or

They are admitting fault.

Of course they could be under new management and have decided to turn things around and hold true to "the customer is always right!"....naw, couldn't be that.

[CJB]

Nah. They were just being nice.

[CPTKILLER]

I do not use remanufactured or steel case rounds in any of my weapons.

[wyntrout]

Probably all you need is a new extractor, side plate(if you lost the original), and the pins or screws that held it in place. As long as you didn't have a squib, you're probably OK.

I had three instances of case failure from the last 150 rounds of a case of remanufactured ammo. I was able to tell which cases were the culprits after two incidences and isolate the last 5 of those cases.

The first incidence was with my PM9... lost the extractor... didn't know what happened. Kahr sent me a replacement for it, and I got a spare for the PM9.

The next was with my P9 and the side plate blew off and I lost but found the extractor at the end of the range trip. I initially replaced the P9 extractor with a spare for the PM9. I pushed the sideplate back into place and was able to continue shooting. After this time I got spare extractors and springs and pins for the rest of my polymer Kahrs... P380, PM9, P9, PM40, and PM45.

Here's my post with pictures and video:

http://www.kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?15235-Update-with-K9-Drama-with-the-P9-on-my-first-trip-to-the-range!&highlight=powder+burn


I isolated the last 5 rounds of the weak cases and thought I would fire them off in my all-steel K9. Second shot, the extractor disappeared, but I had the parts to fix it and gave up on the remaining few cases. I destroyed them... tore them apart with pliers, fired the primers and burned the powder... video posted on Photobucket.

My pistols have all been fine, especially the P9... no other problems.

Wynn :)

[CJB]

If the barrel ramp, from Kahr, was suspect by them, then I can see them neither taking blame nor pointing fingers, as they appear to have done.

That would explain the "new barrel" as well.

At any rate, lesson learned on the "reloads" and kudo's for Kahr giving everyone (including themselves) benefit of doubt.

(edit ....)

Y'know, lots also has to do with attitude. Its like traffic. Someone noses in and cuts you off and gives you a bunch of crap, you get pissed off at 'em. Same person give's you a wave like they need a break getting into traffic, you generally give it to 'em. The difference is attitude. Same with sending in that pistol. You go in kickin' and screamin' and pointing fingers and making accusations and demands... that probably isn't gonna set too well. You go in polite, ask if anything can be done, nobody gets on edge and you got a good outcome. Just sayin!

[Bills1873]

There's that nail on the head! Right on, CJB

[ElMateo487]

Y'know, lots also has to do with attitude. Its like traffic. Someone noses in and cuts you off and gives you a bunch of crap, you get pissed off at 'em. Same person give's you a wave like they need a break getting into traffic, you generally give it to 'em. The difference is attitude. Same with sending in that pistol. You go in kickin' and screamin' and pointing fingers and making accusations and demands... that probably isn't gonna set too well. You go in polite, ask if anything can be done, nobody gets on edge and you got a good outcome. Just sayin!

One of the many lessons my father taught me was..

"The squeaky wheel does NOT get the grease. So don't even bother."

[Bawanna]

Amen to that. Your father is a very wise man.

[FireMoose]

Is there any chance that could have been a firing out of battery issue?

[ElMateo487]

Is there any chance that could have been a firing out of battery issue?

It was in the middle of a shooting off a full magazine without stopping (but slowly). So I guess if it came closed on something then fired out of battery, it is possible. But I find that unlikely. I was shooting two at a time, pausing, shooting another two.

The discharge sounded very quiet. I assume that was because the gasses were released sideways and forwards?

Also when thinking about it more. It seems like Kahr might think that the feed ramp was adding to the issue of the impacted rounds. I did think the feed ramp was too rough when I first got the gun, but had nothing to compare it too. It had the look and consistency of a fine file, though felt smoother than that.

The feed ramp now is a mirror polish.

[Pacn45]

In response to the statement about using new as opposed to reloads because the maker of new lives up to their product liability, tell that to winchester. A round of their white box target ammo destroyed "Sparky" and they claimed it was a reload that just materialized in a new sealed box of ammo. If you check the thread the pictures show what happens from a overloaded round. Good for you that Kahr stepped up and took care of things. Bad for me that winchester did not.

Charlie

[muggsy]

This is what destroyed your gun... a deep set bullet will create excessive pressure that can & will damage a pistol...

is the pistol repairable? yes. That side panel is designed by kahr to pop out incase a event such as this occures. I would send it back to them along with a letter explaining what happened & have them inspect the frame to be sure it is safe

Bullet set back will not cause a handgun to experience a catastrophic failure. An over charge of powder or the wrong powder will.

[muggsy]

It was in the middle of a shooting off a full magazine without stopping (but slowly). So I guess if it came closed on something then fired out of battery, it is possible. But I find that unlikely. I was shooting two at a time, pausing, shooting another two.

The discharge sounded very quiet. I assume that was because the gasses were released sideways and forwards?

Also when thinking about it more. It seems like Kahr might think that the feed ramp was adding to the issue of the impacted rounds. I did think the feed ramp was too rough when I first got the gun, but had nothing to compare it too. It had the look and consistency of a fine file, though felt smoother than that.

The feed ramp now is a mirror polish.

Kahr pistols will not fire if they are out of battery by as little as 1/8 of an inch.

[warbird1]

Exactly why I NEVER use remans or reloads. The cheap price is NOT worth the risk. IIRC Kahrs warranty, an most if not all others, deny service for problems caused by remans and reloads as they should.
Amen!!!

[Bawanna]

Bullet set back will not cause a handgun to experience a catastrophic failure. An over charge of powder or the wrong powder will.

I have to humbly disagree. The powder charge is counting on a certain amount of space to expand. If the bullet is pushed back into that space, you increase the pressure exponentially. (big word, had to look it up myself).
I would agree that in most cases it would not case catastrophic failure but in some cases it would and it certainly would be a contributor if there was anything else off. A weak case, overcharge, undercharge etc.

Most guns can handle a pretty good overcharge so the pressure from a set back bullet as stated usually isn't a big deal but never say never.

[RonW]

After looking at the O.P's original post & pics. It's clear to me that he was using reloads, probably his own... Clear example to closely inspect each case & discard any that have defects & to pay close attention to how you reload your ammo.... Kahr pistols are designed to have that side panel blow out in the event of a failure such as this... The pistol is repairable, but only on the O.P's dime.

[CJB]

Yes, yes... reloads... he states they were reman - re-manufactured, aka reloaded.

Most of the loading manuals, the good one's at least, show the effects of bullet seating back. Very old now, but the Speer #9, #10 manuals show a 9mm cartridge before and after, and state the pressure rise. Most of the time, that pressure rise won't hurt things. Then again, sometimes it does.

Re-manufactured ammo is a real bug bear, and since I was in that business for ten years working as production consultant, tool maker, keeper of things that switched on and off, and general fix it man, I will tell you that the 9mm is the WORST to put back together in a production basis, when you're getting all sorts of mixed brass, range sweepings etc etc. You have no idea what you're gonna get. The 9mm case will bulge at the bottom, as the brass flows in that direction from loading. We'd iron it out with a specially altered sizing die and shell plate I came up with. All of that tends to weaken things. Its just an evil bastard to work with. More problems, more blown primer pockets, more of nearly everything (357 takes the cake on split cases). And we loaded soft... with undersized bullets. Yah, we purposefully undersized the bullets to .354 on LEAD bullets, just to preclude things going wrong. Oh they'd feed and go bang ok, but were usually a bit keyholed at the target... oh well. Nobody's gun went boom.... except one certain mishap with a 45acp that could not have happened to a nicer guy. Seems he used a compressed charge of WW231 and a 230g hardball tip. And a large rifle magnum primer. And mixed it into all of his other weird box of rounds, just so it would sneak up on him without warning. Happens I guess. Like hand grenades happen in the cot of the new second lieutenant from time to time too. Happens.

[Bawanna]

The downfall to the range reloading process is nobody knows where those range pickup cases have been. They may have been reloaded 10 times already, maybe hot loads.
I used to try diligently on my own stuff to keep track of how many loadings each batch of brass has had. It's near impossible.

I tried keeping it in batches of 50 but of course you don't want to clean and tumble 50 at a time, you want to tumble 500.

So I tried larger batches, but you get all mixed up. Even worse in your case where your dealing with more unknown and more volume too.

Now I just carefully inspect. I still have a pretty good idea and I have tons of once fired brass picked up from the PD range so not many get reloaded more than twice at least yet. Down the road they might get a few more loadings.

Of if social unrest is on the horizon they might all get reloaded at once. Too long in the Boy Scouts. Be Prepared don't cha know.

[muggsy]

I have to humbly disagree. The powder charge is counting on a certain amount of space to expand. If the bullet is pushed back into that space, you increase the pressure exponentially. (big word, had to look it up myself).
I would agree that in most cases it would not case catastrophic failure but in some cases it would and it certainly would be a contributor if there was anything else off. A weak case, overcharge, undercharge etc.

Most guns can handle a pretty good overcharge so the pressure from a set back bullet as stated usually isn't a big deal but never say never.

You can humbly disagree, Bawanna, but you'd be wrong. There has never been a documented case where bullet set back caused a kaboom. In the early days of handloading compressed charges of powder were not uncommon. Some time back I posted an article on experiments where pistol bullets were intentionally set back to see if they would cause a kaboom. Even when the bullets were set back to the point where the cases started to be deformed and the bullets had to forced into the chamber there was no kaboom. Bullet set back kabooms are a long held myth. In all cases an over charge or the wrong powder is what caused the kaboom. If I can find the article I'll post it again.

Here you go. https://plus.google.com/+LuckyGunner/posts/CiVxdHvWjYS

[RonW]

Very good article.... I guess the early unsupported barrels were the ones going Ka"Boom But these new pistols being produced today are much stronger than they used to be...

[muggsy]

I hope that this article puts this myth to rest, but good stories die hard. There are many cases where a gun has experienced a catastrophic failure and bullet setback was the claimed cause, but no definitive proof has been presented. The only reloaded ammunition that I trust is my own and even mine is a tad suspect, especially when I'm approaching max loads. Caution is the word. A bullet that is set back may cause feeding problems and it's best to expend them at the range. A gun that won't go boom, because of a jam is not a good thing to have in a serious social engagement. It ain't so hot in a gun fight neither.

[RonW]

I'll add that any bullets that I discovered that were set too deep were the ones that didnt feed or jammed while feeding in my M&P shield... Ever since I started discovering the occasional set back bullet in my store bought ammo, I've been opening the boxes & sorting thru them weeding out any suspect rounds.

[wyntrout]

I rarely inspect factory ammo, but it's not a bad idea. I've found damaged primers and at least once the primer was rotated so that it was in there sideways and pressed flat. I don't know what might have happened, but it sure looked like you could detonate the primer and have a bad flashback at least. I squirted lubricant into the primer on that one. It's still lying around somewhere in my gun stuff. :)

I've seen wrinkled cases, too, where the cartridge rim caught on the die and pulled down from the bullet a bit. That kind is usually no problem as long as it chambers.

I just went to a gun show and didn't buy anything... did look, but the G43 I wanted was $490 out the door. I have one on order for $450, but they are hard to come by for small dealers.

Wynn :)

[CJB]

Can we differentiate kaboom from blown case that causes little actual damage?

[muggsy]

Nope. A kaboom is a kaboom not a pffft. :)

[wyntrout]

I think that a Kaboom is major damage with a split barrel or broken slide or frame, at least. I've had a few split cases... same manufacturer or headstamp in remanufactured ammo. There was no structural damage, but I lost a few ejectors and some springs and pins from the ejector train... talking 9mm Kahrs here, three of them before I figured out that it was bad cases. The worst blew the side panel off my P9 and lost an ejector, but by then I had a spare and replaced it and the other parts, popped the side plate back in, and kept on shooting.

I have spares for all of those parts for my Kahrs and Glocks, though I haven't lost any Glock parts... yet. :)

I've also had one "sphfftt" with a squib in my new Glock 30S, but with a weird split and burn around the middle of the case in a factory round. I haven't had a kaboom... thankfully.

Here are a couple of Kahr Kabooms... not mine.

Wynn :)

[CJB]

You can humbly disagree, Bawanna, but you'd be wrong. There has never been a documented case where bullet set back caused a kaboom

Here you go. https://plus.google.com/+LuckyGunner/posts/CiVxdHvWjYS

Muggs. That article is nonsense. And the "testing" with the dye was on the barrel and slide. Well, dear boys, the case is gonna go before the barrel and slide let loose, when the cause is over pressure. What our intrepid author did was stop short of finding out anything.

Here's what. Speer did testing. They found pressure increases. What I just stated in that last sentence has been published. It is verified, and it is repeatable by anyone with the equipment to do it.

[QUOTE=muggsy;367241]There has never been a documented case where bullet set back caused a kaboom.[QUOTE]

How can you make such a statement? How do we know, just in practical terms, that some "blown case" in the midst of otherwise normal and seemingly identical cartridges, wasn't as a result of pressure rise due to setback, either before or during chambering, since the evidence is wholly destroyed with upon firing?

[QUOTE=muggsy;367241]In the early days of handloading compressed charges of powder were not uncommon.[QUOTE]

Muggs, this type of statement is intellectually void, using a known truth in a misapplied manner, to better apologize a rather weak position, and frankly you're better than that. Sure, compressed charges, duplex charges, all sorts of recipes. Thing is - its always about the pressure, compressed, duplex, triplex, wadded, or whatever. If the load is safe, its safe.

For all we know a marginal case may have held under normal firing pressures, but its concealed defect would not withstand over-pressure caused by setback.