Don't get high capacity

[Jeremiah/Az]

I'm not condemning anyone that wants to carry large capacity guns or 2-3 extra mags, but I don't understand why. I can't really think of a defense situation where you would need or be able to use all that ammo. More than one attacker & you will probably only get off 2 or 3 shots. I can see a mag malfunction where you might need another, but 15-16 shot guns I just don't get. Your thoughts?

[RogerP9fan]

You should run for CA State Assembly.

[steve666]

I've never heard anyone who has ever been in a firefight complain about having TOO MUCH ammo.:7:

[Popeye]

I guess it depends on where you live, and where you go on just how much is to much. I very rarely carry more ammo then what's in the pistol. I don't ever remember carring and extra mag with me. Most of the time it's 6+1 but there are times when I carry my XD9sc where it's 13+1.. That is mostly in the winter months though when it's easier to carry and people are wearing heavier clothing. Most SD situations last for only a couple of shots if that. The way you hear some of these guys talk on some of these sites they carry a ton of ammo with them but really only need one to get the job done because they're such crack shots. Always found that to be interesting.

[jlottmc]

When I was a young devil dog, I got sent to Bosnia. I never once wished I had less gun or less ammo.

[Popeye]

When I was a young devil dog, I got sent to Bosnia. I never once wished I had less gun or less ammo.

Yup like I said depends where you go. I'll bet you didn't rely on a pistol to get the job done in Bosnia.

[jlottmc]

I had one, but since I was an armorer...I also had things like a pile of M16A2's, M249 SAW's and such as well. Even the street fights I've been in and seen never once wished for less. I've also done a lot of work with PD's, and some habits are hard to break, I still carry two reloads for whichever piece I'm carrying that day.

[cw45fan]

It's a very personal thing that has a lot to do with your circumstances and range of activity, eh? A person who frequents dangerous areas or, perhaps, has a security-related job... dealing with a lot of cash every day, for example... or a LEO... is going to be more interested in packing a higher-cap weapon... maybe even wearing a body armor vest. I used to have a friend who often said: "If you're not paranoid, you're not very well informed."

[Popeye]

"If you're not paranoid, you're not very well informed."

Well I must not be well informed, because I'm sure not paraniod about anything, never have been. Living in fear of everything just isn't in my make up. Being Paranoid is a state of mind often considered a personallity disorder.

[slowpoke]

I live in a small town in SE Texas where the weather is hot and sweaty most of the time. The police do a good job of keeping the pecker heads pinned down so I don't bother with big guns with lots of extra mags. I find a small single stack 40 suits my needs rather well. On those rare occasions when I do carry a mag, I carry it in a back pocket carrier. I found that with the Firestar I used to carry as well as with the CW40 I now carry, the mags can start to unload themselves if not secured.

[rholmes69]

In the extreme event of an encounter where shots are fired, I think I recall reading that most people don't recall how many shots that they fired. Clearly evidence that when the adrenaline is pumping and you are taking cover, the last thing on your mind is keeping track of your rounds fired.

I just think of the one time I got jumped by a rattlesnake and how quickly I fired off three shots. Had their been two snakes or three, I would have been out of ammo. Switch that to two or three bad guys. I am no crack shot and have so much to still learn as far as becoming sufficient in protecting myself and my family and training with my SD pistols. My CCW instructor stressed two shots at BG's, one center mass and one head. Like I stated before, I can only imagine in a real life situation how my shooting might be negatively effected.

Prepare for the worst and hope for the best. I'm no pessimist, but as others stated, I would sure hate for a grave marker to say "If he only had one more round...". I'll sacrifice the pain of carrying around something the size of a pack of gum for peace of mind. Just my two cents.

[unclenunzie]

A person who lives in a nice area with no expected exposure to gangs, would probably do just fine with a 5-shot revolver or a small single-stack autoloader 6-8 rounds. If a person regularly travels through bad neighborhoods or lives in or near such places, they would probably do better and feel more secure with a higher round count, say 10-15. I don't think it's paranoid to carry more ammo in or near rough places, as the likelihood of any attack involving multiple assailants is higher.

If you drive lonely roads between nice places at night, and your car breaks down, you are exposed to whatever dangers make come along. Better more than fewer rounds.

If you get into a lethal force encounter you may need to drive an assailant to cover, you may miss due to extreme stress, you may want to fire three rounds as a mayday. That could be half your rounds gone.

Having said all this, in the tame circles where I travel and can be legally armed, I go small with a single reload. In my case it is enough, but I would not hesitate to go larger/more if I felt it was prudent.

[Frankhenrylee]

If I find myself in a gunfight I want to make darn sure that I've got enough bullets to finish the job or get away. I don't want to pull my gun in self defense and then find myself defenseless after 6 rounds. I don't want to feel like I've got to conserve ammunition when either me or my families life is on the line. I carry a PM40 with 2 spare mags. Its still only 18 rounds. Thats maybe 6-8 times I can send lead down range. Still not enough, just the minimum I'm willing to live with.

[wyntrout]

I don't want to be overloaded with a bunch of stuff, but I think that 5+1 or 6+1 could prove to be too few rounds, or that one magazine might malfunction or be dropped when you most need it. If you do need to draw your weapon and someone is shooting at you, you're probably going to have an adrenalin rush along with the "tunnel vision" that your body experiences as it tries to support the most needed faculties and physiological needs for survival... if you live long enough. The little things can really trip you up there and that's where practice and "muscle memory" are really needed. You have to consider the threat, available cover, and a lot of other things all at once and act on the most immediate so that you live long enough to even consider the other things, especially if someone else’s life depends on your being able to defend them.
I won’t get carried away here with everything that needs contemplation and consideration before leaving the house on any trip, but one thing I can do is carry at least one reload… a larger one if I have it. I only have 6-round mags for the P380, a 7-round for the PM9, and 6 or 7-round ones for the PM45. My choice there is a 7-round with extended grip. I’m going to break down and get some of those 8-round extended grip 9mm mags for the range and a reload for the PM9… or the K9, should I ever carry that.
I may never need a reload, just like I may never need insurance for some things, but I would rather have extra than not enough.
If you’ve never had an experience that triggers the adrenalin rush and tunnel vision, you’re going to be “rattled” and maybe wet yourself, but a lot of things can trigger that reaction… usually “life or death” imminent danger, even if it’s just perceived or imagined. Critter encounters, car accidents(or near ones), “things that go bump in the night”, injuries, and threats like muggers or robbers or assailants are just a few, not to mention actual combat experiences with high “pucker factors”.
I haven’t been robbed, and I’ve never been in a gunfight, but I’ve certainly experienced most of the other things and can remember a lot vividly… surreal and scared sh*tless at times. Sometimes the tunnel vision signals the onset of shock... been there a few times... injuries... once induced by an idiot volunteer worker trying to insert an IV needle in the back of my hand (for my first colonoscopy... good medications)... through a vein, pulled back a bit, and then was wiggling it around for an eternity while I kept gritting my teeth and thinking the pain would be over soon. Finally, I had the tunnel vision thingie and spoke up, whereupon the real staff rescued me from the idiot and treated me for shock.:blah:
If you're ever waiting to be stuck like that and there's some idiot that says "Let me! Let me!", don't let them touch you... unless it's a good-looking candy striper.:D

JMHO.

Dang! I just get carried away!:blah: :typing:
Wynn:D
Safe at home in my computer/office chair… as usual. Armchair tactician.

[Bawanna]

At the risk of scenting a big huge +1 on that good buddy.

It's just like when you say I'm just going a short distance and won't be gone long, I won't need my gun or my knife, or my flashlight or my flashbangs, or my smoke grenades, or my handcuffs, you get the flow of my river?

If I'm killed in the street I don't want it to be cause I ran out of projectiles.

[wyntrout]

Amen. I think I kind of expressed that while I was rambling a bit.:rolleyes:
Wynn:D

[jocko]

At the risk of scenting a big huge +1 on that good buddy.

It's just like when you say I'm just going a short distance and won't be gone long, I won't need my gun or my knife, or my flashlight or my flashbangs, or my smoke grenades, or my handcuffs, you get the flow of my river?

If I'm killed in the street I don't want it to be cause I ran out of projectiles.

more reason why I never leave home without my PM9 in my front pocket. It is now after 3years just part of my life. It goes where I go. I shoot it well, I trust it completely and 7 runds trumps my Model 60 Smith every day, and also I never could hit jack sh-t with my Model 60. Sometiems I do think we strive to carry the smallest gun around, negative of what caliber it is etc. Godo example is the North American Arms Mine revolver. I bet we sold 200 of them when I was in the gun business. I still have mine today after 30 years, Damn Ijust wold hate to have to pull that thing today though. BG have gotten bigger, they carry much bigger guns than 30 years ago. They carry even bigger knives than 30 years ago and they certainly are more tanked / hopped up than 30 years ago.

You can never have a big enough caliber,but you can have a to big of a gun that tends to sit more than being carried and that surely should be a NO-NO.

I had a great huntig buddy that back 25 years ago, held the WORLDS record (Boone and Crockett) for a Black Bear killed in the United States and he shot it with a Ruger 22 single six. So maybe that statement just shot all I said above right square in the a-s:D

[RogerP9fan]

Tell the violent thug who's methed out of his mind looking to assault you that he shouldn't choose high capacity. Nor should I, just two rounds oughta do it............ooooopps here come 4 of his violent friends and two of them are armed. Oh my GoD! Sure glad I didn't listen to your advice. I like breathing.

[jocko]

:) I find it interesting how many folks talk about good or nicer area's vs. bad areas.

Affluent neighborhoods are NO safer than Shi!hole neighborhoods.

Criminals often will go to a so-called "NICER" neighborhood cause WHY ???

That's right !.......cause they have nicer stuff to steal there. And, the people tend to have more money on them when you ROB them !

You should be at the same level of ALERT no matter where you are. Be it Beverly Hills or Downtown Detroit.

Just my 2 cents :D


about that Cabreanie square in Chicago OUT CLASSES MY ENTIRE AREA FOR 200 SQUARE MILES IN CRIMES per night. agree, be alert, but IMO not Paranoid...

[jocko]

Tell the violent thug who's methed out of his mind looking to assault you that he shouldn't choose high capacity. Nor should I, just two rounds oughta do it............ooooopps here come 4 of his violent friends and two of them are armed. Oh my GoD! Sure glad I didn't listen to your advice. I like breathing.

if your scenario happened--YOUR DEAD ANYWAYS..:confused:

[Bawanna]

Beverly Hills scares me really bad too. Course the Clampetts are there so maybe ole Jed will have my back while I'm puttin my moves on Elly Mae? Course he's only got a 1 shooter but that would at least be a good signal.

[wyntrout]

Elly Mae, A.K.A. Donna Douglas, will be 77 next month. Her beauty has faded just a bit. I hate to bust your bubble. LOL
http://www.gossipcraze.com/gossip/donna-douglas
Wynn:D

[Bawanna]

:) HECK, with your expertize Bawanna. I would 'nt be suprised if'n your wheel chair has 12 gauge tubes under the armrest and, tires made out of C4. And, of course the ability to lay down a oil slick as you speed away after killing the bad guys and wooing all the women. :D

That expertize word ain't never been used in the same sentence with Bawanna before that I ever heard of.

Truth be told in an earlier life I did in fact have 20 ga tubes under my armrest of an earlier manual chair. They worked and were functional and we've discussed them here before. They were very crude especially the fire control system, since the armrest easily swivel back and forth a good field of fire was possible, kentucky elevation was another dilemma, but I always figured a good blast to the general area of the belt buckle would get the job done.

I just wasn't comfortable sitting in a theatre environment with 2 loaded 20 gauge barrels with no safety to speak of and easily tripped crude (very crude) triggers.

Now I got a couple power chairs which open a whole new world of possibilites one of the basic good ones is shooting and moving again. In a manual chair that's very tough. Arm rest don't swing side to side but go up and down, with the joy stick I can control windage. With the additional weight I'm thinkin 10 ga now. Ithaca Mag 10 under each armrest. Damn I forgot about the Angel for just a split second.

Excellent thought on laying down an oil slick, never thought of that. I'll need to break out the drawing board.

My people do get perturbed from time to time like when they went to boost me up a step and discovered I had to boxes of Gold Dot 45, an officers model 45 plus my usual junk in my backpack, plus me and my usual carry pieces and a couple spare mags. I plumb forgot the boxes of ammo were in there. My bad!

[Jeremiah/Az]

As I said in my OP, I have no argument with anyone about what they carry & of course should be able to carry anything they want. Thank you, gentlemen for the discourse.

[RogerP9fan]

Oh heck, I'm gonna just trade my Glocks and P9 for a Dillinger .22
Anybody know where I can get a good deal?

[aray]

I may never need a reload, just like I may never need insurance for some things, but I would rather have extra than not enough.

That's actually a very good analogy. I never expect to use the fire insurance I have on my house, but you can bet that I always keep it in place. I expect that's true of every reader of this forum who owns a house as well. And that's not paranoid. It's a simple risk equation: the probability may be low, but the costs are very high. You take steps to mitigate risks associated with high costs, regardless of the probability of occurrence.

[jeep45238]

Oh heck, I'm gonna just trade my Glocks and P9 for a Dillinger .22
Anybody know where I can get a good deal?
I'll take care of ya on that :)

[Tack]

For those of us who have been there and done that, the answer is easy.

For those who have not, just look at your range training.

Did your weapon ever malfunction?
Was it because of an ammunition or magazine issue?
Did you ever lose count of the number of rounds you fired?
Have you ever had a weapon break while at the range training?
Have you seen these things happen to another shooter?

All of the above can be solved by another magazine or more ammunition, or another weapon depending on the situation.

In a real life and death situation, you will default to your lowest level of performance in training. You will not rise to your very best day in training.

If you think you'll suddenly become an IDPA or IPSC Master Class Shooter when the balloon goes up, you're fooling yourself.

Carry some spare ammunition, magazines, and a second gun isn't a bad idea.

And practice like your family's life depends on it, nevermind your own.

[deadhead1971]

IF I could carry a 15 rd gun in my pocket, I would. I can't so that's why I pocket carry the PM9 with the 7 rd mag in my back pocket. ;-)

[jlottmc]

For those of us who have been there and done that, the answer is easy.

For those who have not, just look at your range training.

Did your weapon ever malfunction?
Was it because of an ammunition or magazine issue?
Did you ever lose count of the number of rounds you fired?
Have you ever had a weapon break while at the range training?
Have you seen these things happen to another shooter?

All of the above can be solved by another magazine or more ammunition, or another weapon depending on the situation.

In a real life and death situation, you will default to your lowest level of performance in training. You will not rise to your very best day in training.

If you think you'll suddenly become an IDPA or IPSC Master Class Shooter when the balloon goes up, you're fooling yourself.

Carry some spare ammunition, magazines, and a second gun isn't a bad idea.

And practice like your family's life depends on it, nevermind your own.

That's it right there. Couldn't agree more.

[RogerP9fan]

I can fit 10 powerhouse .40S&W in my pocket with the G27 without the Pearce.
G26 can do 11 9mm I believe
Not too shabby?

[rickmn50]

I'm not condemning anyone that wants to carry large capacity guns or 2-3 extra mags, but I don't understand why. I can't really think of a defense situation where you would need or be able to use all that ammo. More than one attacker & you will probably only get off 2 or 3 shots. I can see a mag malfuction where you might need another, but 15-16 shot guns I just don't get. Your thoughts?

I agree with you! In most cases I would think you would only have a couple of shots (need a couple of shot) and it would be over. Unless you are going to take on a group of gang bangers...then the hell with a handgun...take an AK! I think they also call that premeditated.

The other possibility is that they carry/need 15 rounds because they are an aweful shot!:cool:

[alank2]

Hi,

High capacity is a lib-tard anti-gun term. It should be called "standard capacity".

The other magazines (limited for the stupidity sake) should be called "reduced capacity".

Limiting magazine capacity to something lower than its design or best is just plain stupidity.

I am definitely on the side of more is better. You don't know what you might be up against. Could be one person, might be multiple, who knows. Prepare the best you can in terms of training, awareness, and equipment capability.

I just got a PM9 I am getting "road tested" for pocket use to replace my 442. 7 x 9mm sure beats 5 x 38 special. It is also much more easy to shoot accurately. It still needs to prove itself in the reliability department. Really, for its size, the PM9 is an incredible gun. If I were in a fight, I'd still rather have a G19 with 16 rounds however.

Thanks,

Alan

[wyntrout]

I still think you guys are dreaming and haven't ever faced anyone throwing lead at your face... at least that's what it seems like. Maybe you're the guys who have nice neat groups and expect to only need a couple shots since you're great shots.
You'll be crapping your britches and showing shots at the ceiling while trying to get to cover. That's one reason for more ammo than 5-7 rounds. Throwing lead towards the bad guys at least gets them to duck and maybe throw off THEIR aim as well. You don't always have time for well-aimed shots. It's Whack-a -Mole. If you're standing there and drawing a gun you're target numero uno and get whacked. You had better be scrambling for cover and throwing shots in their general direction so that they duck or don't have a chance to aim at you.
JMHO. I have to go entertain my wife.
Later.
Wynn:blah::typing:

[RogerP9fan]

Better not make a wrong turn while driving through the south central district of Los Angeles.

[Mits3kgt88]

I've bought a Crimson Trace laser for my P40 to increase my chances of hitting the assailant in those situations. Seeing the videos on CT's website sold me on them. I'm surprised that there aren't any posts on here about anyone having a CT laser to their advantage! lol I know, lasers don't compensate for crappy shooters. But they do help you get back on target easier and allow you to line up a shot without your head exposed.

[wyntrout]

The CT could definitely help with snap shots, but you still have to see where the dot is without acquiring a red dot in your head. :eek:
Sorry about the earlier post... a bit too much sarcasm or whatever.:boink:
I'm no expert, but no practice has other guys trying to kill you... and the BGs tend to duck and weave, too. And everybody should know, that old Murphy loves to liven things up when you least expect him... or should expect him.
It's generally true that the first casualty of a battle is the plan. Things just don't go as you plan, because the other guy is thinking and trying anticipate your actions.
Wynn:blah: :hippie:

[Tack]

Gentlemen
Some may be missing the point.

It's not that you have 7 or 15 rounds in the magazine you started with. It's that you have a spare magazine (Or another pistol) to fix an issue with the pistol in your hand.

Perhaps you run out of ammunition, or the magazine or ammunition is defective.

Perhaps in the heat of the situation, you press the magazine release, and your magazine drops out and disappears in the darkness. If that's your one and only magazine, the bucket of **** you're in just got alot deeper.

Statistics say you'll more than likely never be in a shooting....

Statistics say you'll fire x rounds and that they'll be x number of badguys....

But being that you're there now, I wouldn't put much faith in statistics.... After all the statistics said that this wouldn't happen remember?

The statistics say, that for a Police Department of the size of the one I work for, we wouldn't have 3 of us who have been in shootings....

I think you get the idea of what I think about statistics.

Take Care All, and Be Safe.

[Popeye]

Being aware of your surroundings and what's going on is a big part of you and your family staying safe long before carrying extra mags will. I never did believe in throwing alot of bullets around aimlessly. It might be fine in war but in civilian life it's important to remember there is a lawyer behind every bullet. You hit and innocent while spraying bullets around aimlessly,guess who in deep doo,doo. It's not how many shots are fired,it's how many shot were fire that meant anything. The last thing I'd ever want to do is kill some 6year old kid or one of his family through aimless and negligent fire on my part. I guess that might be considered Negligent homicide.
Gun control is you keeping your gun under control at all times,sometimes that's harder to do than others.
When the juices start flowing and it hard to even think, you still have to use your head before you use your trigger finger. The odds are allot greater that you will miss before you hit anything worth hitting.

[tv_racin_fan]

To each his own I suppose. I always want at least one reload and two is much better than one. I see no reason not to carry at least one. Mag malfunction can render even the largest of semi's useless without one.

Now as for what particular handgun, I leave that up to the carrier. I personally chose the Kahr K9. Just small enough to go in my pocket and the wife has her Kahr CW9.

[RogerP9fan]

I just ordered a CZ 75 B. It will have four 16 round magazines +1 in the pipe. Is this high capacity?

[jlottmc]

For the libtards yes, they think that one is high cap... But usually settle for the ten round limit.

[jocko]

Being aware of your surroundings and what's going on is a big part of you and your family staying safe long before carrying extra mags will. I never did believe in throwing alot of bullets around aimlessly. It might be fine in war but in civilian life it's important to remember there is a lawyer behind every bullet. You hit and innocent while spraying bullets around aimlessly,guess who in deep doo,doo. It's not how many shots are fired,it's how many shot were fire that meant anything. The last thing I'd ever want to do is kill some 6year old kid or one of his family through aimless and negligent fire on my part. I guess that might be considered Negligent homicide.
Gun control is you keeping your gun under control at all times,sometimes that's harder to do than others.
When the juices start flowing and it hard to even think, you still have to use your head before you use your trigger finger. The odds are allot greater that you will miss before you hit anything worth hitting.


well said popeye, Ihave read this numerous times and it just gets better every time

Have to live with the gun contril thing to.

very well said, nice job, kudos, back atcha, ;)

[boraxis]

I carry an MK40 with one in the chamber (=6rd) and no extra mags. That'll get me through a lot of situations. Any other situation and I guess I lose.

The thing about losing gun fights is if you win 999 out of 1000, you're dead. And the one in a 1000 might be the first one. The high caps have a good point.

Nonetheless I'm comfortable with the point I chose to balance my preparedness level.

[oldtex]

I'm not condemning anyone that wants to carry large capacity guns or 2-3 extra mags, but I don't understand why. I can't really think of a defense situation where you would need or be able to use all that ammo. More than one attacker & you will probably only get off 2 or 3 shots. I can see a mag malfunction where you might need another, but 15-16 shot guns I just don't get. Your thoughts?

You asked, so here's my answer. I carry a Glock 34 (16+1... I download one rd ) in an IWB holster, spare mag(16 rds), and an S&W 642 in my front weakside pocket. If the fight comes to guns, I expect to be moving while I'm shooting, and I expect my target to be moving and shooting back. This will play hell with my marksmanship. I expect a normally reliable gun to choke when my stress is highest, in a gunfight. I expect each bad guy to require as many as 3-6 well-placed rds to put them out of the fight. I expect to face multiple adversaries. I plan on staying in the fight and winning it as long as I'm conscious, even if I get shot.

There may be only one bad guy, or there may be several. They may retreat when I resist, or they may decide to fight. They may retreat when I kill the first one, or they may stay in the fight. They may give up easily, or they may want to win the fight as much as I do. I may lose the fight, but it won't be because I didn't bring enough tools to the fight.

Carry what you want. That's your business, not mine.

[jlottmc]

You asked, so here's my answer. I carry a Glock 34 (16+1... I download one rd ) in an IWB holster, spare mag(16 rds), and an S&W 642 in my front weakside pocket. If the fight comes to guns, I expect to be moving while I'm shooting, and I expect my target to be moving and shooting back. This will play hell with my marksmanship. I expect a normally reliable gun to choke when my stress is highest, in a gunfight. I expect each bad guy to require as many as 3-6 well-placed rds to put them out of the fight. I expect to face multiple adversaries. I plan on staying in the fight and winning it as long as I'm conscious, even if I get shot.

There may be only one bad guy, or there may be several. They may retreat when I resist, or they may decide to fight. They may retreat when I kill the first one, or they may stay in the fight. They may give up easily, or they may want to win the fight as much as I do. I may lose the fight, but it won't be because I didn't bring enough tools to the fight.

Carry what you want. That's your business, not mine.


That's what I'm sayin...

[jocko]

SCENARIOS, are always fun to read IMO..

[f44life]

i havent got my permit yet....heres my two cents

If you cant get the job done in one clip then you shouldnt be conceal carrying. If you need more then one clip and you are accurate then you are in a fight you should of avoided or not be in. Most of the time its one on one.

[Popeye]

SCENARIOS, are always fun to read IMO..

Most of them are flat out lame IMO. Senarios can be made to justify just about anything that could possibly go on in life. Most BG's will not get into anything where the odds are even. If you don't look or act like you haven't a clue then most of the times BG's move on to easier targets. Most victoms walk around in a daze and then wonder what happened and why did it happen to me. I'm a nice person. That they might be, but there clueless about what going on around them. Awareness of your surroundings will save your life faster then any gun will. That my friends is not a senario that is a fact. Who knows if Gen.Custer would have been more aware of his surroundings history might have turned out completely different.:)

[jlottmc]

Most of them are flat out lame IMO. Senarios can be made to justify just about anything that could possibly go on in life. Most BG's will not get into anything where the odds are even. If you don't look or act like you haven't a clue then most of the times BG's move on to easier targets. Most victoms walk around in a daze and then wonder what happened and why did it happen to me. I'm a nice person. That they might be, but there clueless about what going on around them. Awareness of your surroundings will save your life faster then any gun will. That my friends is not a senario that is a fact. Who knows if Gen.Custer would have been more aware of his surroundings history might have turned out completely different.:)

Couldn't agree more. People always say "they came out of NO WHERE..." Situational awareness, 'nuff said. I view my use of force as failure on my part, not to say I am not wholly prepared to use force for there are times when force is the only option, but it is not my first option. I will use force when it becomes necessary, and I have no qualms about using it, unless there is another option. Like the old adage, always leave your self an out, and be aware of what is going on around you. I will also use what I feel is appropriate force, I will not be in a situation to survive, but rather to win. My goal is to win handily too, which means that I take any edge I can get. If that means I carry more ammunition than you like, so be it.

[wyntrout]

Wow! How macho, f44life… and spoken like a true novice with all of the answers. You’ve disdained the rest of us here who have discussed carrying reloads or not, and the rationale for our decisions. I guess we’re all wusses.
I’ve seen a lot of crime scene surveillance videos and police dash camera videos… enough to know that things just don’t go like you would have them go. Most of the videos showed professional, trained police and bad guys exchanging fire at close range… lots of shooting… with little damage to each other. Funny thing, but when someone’s shooting at your face… and that’s what it seems like when someone is pointing a gun at you and trying to kill you… most guys are ducking and trying to make themselves smaller and throwing wild shots in the process. If you have any smarts, you want to survive the encounter and not stand tall and take precise shots.
I’m sure all of those guys… cops and bad guys… thought they were tough and could handle any situation with a couple of well-placed shots. They were usually carrying pistols with a lot higher capacity than any of our Kahrs.
My planning and rational for a reload leave room for malfunctions or mistakes like dropping the magazine while trying to shoot and not be shot. Also, it’s better to have extra rounds than not enough for the situation at hand. I don’t want my last thoughts to be about not carrying enough ammo. It’s cheap easy to carry a reload, ‘cause you can’t call a time out if you need more. You don’t want to come in second place in a fight for your life.

Wynn:yo:

[alank2]

Hi,

Hopefully a deadly force situation will never come to any of us, but if it does, I don't think it will be anything like we expect or go exactly to plan. Best you can do is train as often as you can, have confidence in your equipment, and make the decision to act and fight with all your ability if it ever comes down to it. Beyond that, hoping things go your way, because they may or they may not.

Good luck,

Alan

[MikeyKahr]

Amen to what wyntrout said! Why even carry a whole magazine, half-loaded should be plenty. Actually, just one in the hole should do the trick, forget the magazine. :angel:


Wow! How macho, f44life… and spoken like a true novice with all of the answers. You’ve disdained the rest of us here who have discussed carrying reloads or not, and the rationale for our decisions. I guess we’re all wusses.
I’ve seen a lot of crime scene surveillance videos and police dash camera videos… enough to know that things just don’t go like you would have them go. Most of the videos showed professional, trained police and bad guys exchanging fire at close range… lots of shooting… with little damage to each other. Funny thing, but when someone’s shooting at your face… and that’s what it seems like when someone is pointing a gun at you and trying to kill you… most guys are ducking and trying to make themselves smaller and throwing wild shots in the process. If you have any smarts, you want to survive the encounter and not stand tall and take precise shots.
I’m sure all of those guys… cops and bad guys… thought they were tough and could handle any situation with a couple of well-placed shots. They were usually carrying pistols with a lot higher capacity than any of our Kahrs.
My planning and rational for a reload leave room for malfunctions or mistakes like dropping the magazine while trying to shoot and not be shot. Also, it’s better to have extra rounds than not enough for the situation at hand. I don’t want my last thoughts to be about not carrying enough ammo. It’s cheap easy to carry a reload, ‘cause you can’t call a time out if you need more. You don’t want to come in second place in a fight for your life.

Wynn:yo:

[jlottmc]

I think that by not having at least one reload, that it shows a lack of preparedness in that you are not prepared to use the tools you have available to you. It's something similar to keeping only the state mandated insurance minimums, and then you have a wreck. Fifty thousand dollar liability does nothing for your broken legs, and the guy you just hit who is screaming whiplash at the top of his lungs. I firmly believe that just owning and maybe even carrying one is not the end of the preparations that need to made, rather the beginning. In the end you must be willing to use the force that you carry, otherwise you have lost the fight before it even began.

P.s. the first casualty in a fight is your great plan, and the back up plan. Believe me Murphy, O'tool and all of their minions will find you when the stanky stuff hits the air circulating device. Albonian satellites fall from the sky on your head, yup that too. One would not believe the strange things that happen in a fight...

[jlottmc]

Amen to what wyntrout said! Why even carry a whole magazine, half-loaded should be plenty. Actually, just one in the hole should do the trick, forget the magazine. :angel:
One between the running lights and it's all good. Maybe we should all give up our Kahrs, Springfields, Glocks, and what not and carry an over and under derringer. That let's us deal with a buddy, a malfunction, or a miss too. ;)

[boraxis]

You don’t want to come in second place in a fight for your life.
Wynn:yo:

Yah, well put.

Hey I seen in this movie once where you can throw an empty pistol and hit a BG in the throat. Bam! He goes right down. (Sorry but this thread was way out of hand already... )

If you don't want to carry high cap (I don't) that's fine, but don't tell yourself 5 or 6 rounds is plenty. Of course it's not. It's something. Maybe enough. Wear good running shoes.

[jocko]

boraxis, is right IMO. I only carry the magazine in the gun of my PM9. If I can't do it in 7, then I am done. I just don't get to pumped up over some of these scenario's. I won't dress to carry. My PM9 fits in my front pocket with ease. Gods knows I have no more availalbe space for a couple of spare mags. I will not dedicate my other pockets to defense stuff. Just for me to paranoid to think that way. Most gun fights with leo's don't last past one magazine or full cylinder. Course we are know, Mr. Murphy's law to, so this is just my opinion. u can tape um to your legs if u want and if it makes you feel better. (shave first though)

just shoot it like you stole it..

Now that being said, if u enter my home in a harmful way, u will meet Mr. Glock and all 16 rounds with the spare loaded magazine right with it. But I have alot of storage space in my home for all that stuff to.

[OldLincoln]

Yeah I guess you are right, leave your pocket free and hang a grenade around your neck just in case the one mag doesn't do it.

[f44life]

Wow! How macho, f44life… and spoken like a true novice with all of the answers. You’ve disdained the rest of us here who have discussed carrying reloads or not, and the rationale for our decisions. I guess we’re all wusses.
I’ve seen a lot of crime scene surveillance videos and police dash camera videos… enough to know that things just don’t go like you would have them go. Most of the videos showed professional, trained police and bad guys exchanging fire at close range… lots of shooting… with little damage to each other. Funny thing, but when someone’s shooting at your face… and that’s what it seems like when someone is pointing a gun at you and trying to kill you… most guys are ducking and trying to make themselves smaller and throwing wild shots in the process. If you have any smarts, you want to survive the encounter and not stand tall and take precise shots.
I’m sure all of those guys… cops and bad guys… thought they were tough and could handle any situation with a couple of well-placed shots. They were usually carrying pistols with a lot higher capacity than any of our Kahrs.
My planning and rational for a reload leave room for malfunctions or mistakes like dropping the magazine while trying to shoot and not be shot. Also, it’s better to have extra rounds than not enough for the situation at hand. I don’t want my last thoughts to be about not carrying enough ammo. It’s cheap easy to carry a reload, ‘cause you can’t call a time out if you need more. You don’t want to come in second place in a fight for your life.

Wynn:yo:

thanks for the compliment;)

Well carry your 50 round drum mag in your fanny pack....dont drop that one on the ground:rolleyes:

So how many clips is adequate?....if i honestly thought how important my life is by how many bullets i carry then ill carry a duffel bag full...then why not 4 or 5 clips? Were not hunting for tremors with bert.

One perp at the "7yard average" and your conceal carrying with the surprise. You have the advantage. Somebody should do a poll how many clips you carry not including the one in the gun...

When i get my permit ill ask what the instructors view is about that

[Jeremiah/Az]

I carried a .22 or .38 spl. Derringer for many years until the light weight Kahrs came out. I know some elderly men that still do carry small Derringers or the diminuitive .22 North American Arms revolver. Some people just will not carry large or heavy guns all the time.

Incidentally, the op title was not advice, but saying--I don't get it.

[f44life]

I know you didnt ask for advice, but im sure you wanted to hear why people do carry high capacity, because they think a mob of people are going to try to attack them and they will be diving behind cars firing rounds and dropping clips.:40:

My dad has a few derringer and one is a .38, i feel one clip is adequate in most scenarios.:p

[jocko]

this is a thread that can and is giving alot of different opinions and reasons, so keep it nice guys. We all have our reasons for carrying, some are into it more than others. If you carry 50 rounds or 6, at least CARRY. #2 thing is if you use your head, 99.999% of the people carrying have to use it either.

If I am not mistaken, my M1 Garrand had a clip and all my semi's have magazines..

[gjeepguy]

Daily Carry... 7 rounds will have to do. All I am trying to do is get me and my family away.

Home Defense... give me as many rounds in the gun as possible. My family and I are am not leaving our home.

[f44life]

this is a thread that can and is giving alot of different opinions and reasons, so keep it nice guys. We all have our reasons for carrying, some are into it more than others. If you carry 50 rounds or 6, at least CARRY. #2 thing is if you use your head, 99.999% of the people carrying have to use it either.

If I am not mistaken, my M1 Garrand had a clip and all my semi's have magazines..
true, one clip is better then not carrying....no beef here

[Tack]

Perhaps Clint Smith says it best.

Two Is One. And One Is None.

My daily carry is a Les Baer TRS with 9 rounds and an 8 round spare mag. My K9 is on my ankle loaded with 8 rounds and a 7 round spare mag on my belt.

If I'm going light it will be the K9, with a spare mag. With a Kel Tec P3AT and a spare mag.

Everything is loaded with Corbon DPX.

A Surefire 6P, folding knife and a Dejammer Kubaton round out the package.

And I conceal all of that in jeans with an untucked polo shirt.

I won't even get into what I carry on duty.

The question was raised and those of us with experience in the area gave our reasons for the carry of spare ammunition and back up weapons.

If you choose not to take our advice and learn from our experiences, fine that's your choice. But I don't think this needs to degenerate into a playground arguement.

Be Safe.
Tack

[Popeye]

Well it looks like we all agree. If you feel that you need the extra rounds take them with you . If you don't feel like you need them don't. There is no right or wrong in any of this. Purely a matter of choice. It's really great to live in a country where we still have choice and not have to live by what others say or think. God bless America. Now who's turn was it to buy the beer........http://harleytechtalk.org/htt/Smileys/classic/Drinking_trink41.gif

[wyntrout]

Well spoken, Tack. Clint Smith has stature and standing when he gives self-defense advice. I’ll admit to having to Google his name and refresh my memory on who he is. He WAS the first result on my search:
Thunder Ranch® Oregon Director (http://www.thunderranchinc.com/director.html)

I’m sure that there are forum members here with like experience and many members with advanced training and decades of military and combat experience, as well as those with decades of decorated law enforcement experience. Most of these men and women share their CCW equipment choices and their reasons or rationale for the level of “preparedness” they personally choose for off-duty daily carry.

We have a great community here on this forum. We share our experiences with each other and try to help our membership or visitors who want to learn about the care and use of Kahr pistols. Our discussions aren’t limited to only Kahrs or other pistols and we learn as well as try to aid those seeking help with problems.

It’s quite ludicrous and rankles me that a young guy fresh from minimally fulfilling his state’s requirements for applying for a CCW permit, would take it on himself to explain why others carry too much ammo and are overly worried about taking cover or having weapon malfunctions. He even judged anyone not capable of ending an altercation with a couple of shots incompetent for licensed CCW.

We try to remain open minded and civil in our discourse, but sometimes it’s hard to do this in every case. I’m really holding back, myself, and if my DSL connection hadn’t gone down yesterday during line maintenance in the area, I would have gotten a bit carried away, too.

Wynn:yo::hippie:

[Tack]

Well spoken, Tack. Clint Smith has stature and standing when he gives self-defense advice. I’ll admit to having to Google his name and refresh my memory on who he is. He WAS the first result on my search:
Thunder Ranch® Oregon Director (http://www.thunderranchinc.com/director.html)

I’m sure that there are forum members here with like experience and many members with advanced training and decades of military and combat experience, as well as those with decades of decorated law enforcement experience. Most of these men and women share their CCW equipment choices and their reasons or rationale for the level of “preparedness” they personally choose for off-duty daily carry.

We have a great community here on this forum. We share our experiences with each other and try to help our membership or visitors who want to learn about the care and use of Kahr pistols. Our discussions aren’t limited to only Kahrs or other pistols and we learn as well as try to aid those seeking help with problems.

It’s quite ludicrous and rankles me that a young guy fresh from minimally fulfilling his state’s requirements for applying for a CCW permit, would take it on himself to explain why others carry too much ammo and are overly worried about taking cover or having weapon malfunctions. He even judged anyone not capable of ending an altercation with a couple of shots incompetent for licensed CCW.

We try to remain open minded and civil in our discourse, but sometimes it’s hard to do this in every case. I’m really holding back, myself, and if my DSL connection hadn’t gone down yesterday during line maintenance in the area, I would have gotten a bit carried away, too.

Wynn:yo::hippie:

Agreed on all counts.
Tack

[jocko]

wyn. I have found that with some of this forum stuff, if one just counts to ten, things seem to mellow alittle. IMO not worth a reply to some, sometimes, as u know where it usually ends.

[jocko]

Yeah I guess you are right, leave your pocket free and hang a grenade around your neck just in case the one mag doesn't do it.

now where can I find a grenade???

[wyntrout]

Take your pick.
Wynn:D

[jocko]

Middle one, it looks mean...

[wyntrout]

Yeah, that's my favorite, too, the classic pineapple grenade. It was probably one like that, that a Gunnery Sergeant used in hand-to-hand combat... as a stone to pummel to death NVA when overrun and out of ammo, or time to reload during the first Tet Offensive in '68. I remember reading about that... in the Stars and Stripes, I'm sure. I'm not sure of all of the facts and it was quite a few years ago. I tried to Google that but only found where a Marine officer had used a grenade like that under those circumstances.
Anyhow, you use what you have with you and fight as long as you have the means to resist... second place in a fight for your life sucks.
Wynn:D

[wyntrout]

Here in Florida, I wear shorts and Tees or Polos and don't always wear a belt, so I tend toward less stuff carried. Last time I ordered shorts from Lands End, I got all of them with belt loops, as well as elastic.
I didn't always carry a spare mag, but with my experience at the range and reading here, It's nice to to cover possible malfunctions AND have a few more rounds for our LOW CAP Kahrs. The extended grip mags are friendlier for spare carry AND usually have another bullet or two. The largest 9mm only holds 8 rounds... K925G, but for the PM9 that gives me 6+1+8 and for the PM45 5+1+7(K725G).
Wynn:D

[alank2]

Hi,

You know, I've heard that you got 2 you got 1, you got 1 you got none at a training class too, and I understand the reasoning behind it - anything can malfunction, but there are two issues. The first is that in all likelihood, the one you have as long as you've had no issues with it and it goes bang at the range, should work fine. Hence 1 is 1. Second point being that if you do have a magazine failure in a bad situation, you are going to find that out at the least opportune time--In the heat of the encounter. There may not be time to unload the bad mag, if it will drop free, retrieve the new mag from its holder or worse yet, your closed pocket. So, again, I understand the 2=1, 1=0 thing, but I'm not sure I totally agree with its "accuracy". You can't compare a gun with a single mag to nothing, which would you rather carry today? With that said, I try to always carry a spare mag as much as I can.

Good luck,

Alan

[wyntrout]

With the pistol IWB on my right and the reload and sometimes my cell phone on the left as well, I feel more "balanced". The cell phone gives me one more projectile to throw if necessary... after the pistol and the reload.
Wynn:D

[recoilguy]

For anyone who thinks they will stay calm and focused under the pressure of a gun fight and that they will formulate a plan and excute it flawlessly, you are my heros.

I shoot IDPA and USPSA competitions, and I always plan my strataegy before hand and know exactly how many shoots before I drop and reload, And how many shots I will take and how many alpha I will surely have...............then the buzzer goes off and what the he!! just happened? how many shots was that, was I going right or left next, did I hit that one? did I shoot at 2 target or all 3 of them? Why isn't the gun going off why isn't the gun going off? Thats just from a buzzer going off and competition adrenaline........I hate to think how hard my brain might melt if the buzzer were a gun in the hands of a BG and the targets actually got to return fire. It is easy to say this is what will happen and this is all you need in any given situation. Prepare big and practice. Carrying a gun is a giant responsibility. Until you step away from a range line with a stationary target at 21 feet and you get to breath between each shot and the biggest concern you have is will you find all your spent brass, you really don't know how you will react when your looking for a place to hide, wondering if there is one in left in the mag, how freaking far is the target anyways? should I run then shoot, shoot then run, run and shoot at the same time.

I would rather have a couple left over at the end then be one short.

RCG

[wyntrout]

Amen. That's what I've been saying. At least you're getting some practice under stress and doing something besides standing there shooting at a paper target. THAT sure gets boring and doesn't prepare you for anything... except a false sense of confidence, security, and competence.
Situational awareness is one thing that everyone should develop... whether you're driving, walking, entering a convenience store, pumping gas into your car, or choosing a seat in a restaurant. I always think of Luby's Cafeteria. :eek:
Wynn:D

[jocko]

For anyone who thinks they will stay calm and focused under the pressure of a gun fight and that they will formulate a plan and excute it flawlessly, you are my heros.

I shoot IDPA and USPSA competitions, and I always plan my strataegy before hand and know exactly how many shoots before I drop and reload, And how many shots I will take and how many alpha I will surely have...............then the buzzer goes off and what the he!! just happened? how many shots was that, was I going right or left next, did I hit that one? did I shoot at 2 target or all 3 of them? Why isn't the gun going off why isn't the gun going off? Thats just from a buzzer going off and competition adrenaline........I hate to think how hard my brain might melt if the buzzer were a gun in the hands of a BG and the targets actually got to return fire. It is easy to say this is what will happen and this is all you need in any given situation. Prepare big and practice. Carrying a gun is a giant responsibility. Until you step away from a range line with a stationary target at 21 feet and you get to breath between each shot and the biggest concern you have is will you find all your spent brass, you really don't know how you will react when your looking for a place to hide, wondering if there is one in left in the mag, how freaking far is the target anyways? should I run then shoot, shoot then run, run and shoot at the same time.

I would rather have a couple left over at the end then be one short.

RCG

argue with any of that...

[f44life]

you dont have to count bullets when you have only one clip lol just playing......nothing prepares you for the real thing

[MattTheKnife]

High capacity . . . "low" capacity . . . I really don't care what people choose to carry.

I always recomend carrying one spare magazine in the case the currently-loaded mag starts to malfunction (it can happen at any time).

But do this: look at the LE officers in your area and try to determine the approximate number of rounds they are carrying (I'd guess it's somewhere around 45). LE know their weapons may start to develop problems and they know they may face more than one assailant.

The people LE face are the same people we may have to defend ourselves from. Just because most of us live lower-threat lives doesn't mean we will face lower-threat criminals.

When I'm carrying my Glock 19, I only carry one spare magazine; 30 rounds should be sufficient. But I still carry a back-up (with its own spre mag).

[f44life]

High capacity . . . "low" capacity . . . I really don't care what people choose to carry.

I always recomend carrying one spare magazine in the case the currently-loaded mag starts to malfunction (it can happen at any time).

But do this: look at the LE officers in your area and try to determine the approximate number of rounds they are carrying (I'd guess it's somewhere around 45). LE know their weapons may start to develop problems and they know they may face more than one assailant.

The people LE face are the same people we may have to defend ourselves from. Just because most of us live lower-threat lives doesn't mean we will face lower-threat criminals.

When I'm carrying my Glock 19, I only carry one spare magazine; 30 rounds should be sufficient. But I still carry a back-up (with its own spre mag).

look at the swat team....lol

[GunByte]

"If you're not paranoid, you're not very well informed."

Well I must not be well informed, because I'm sure not paraniod about anything, never have been. Living in fear of everything just isn't in my make up. Being Paranoid is a state of mind often considered a personallity disorder.

Amen to that. Life has many risks and it is prudent to address those with the highest probability of happening. A smoke alarm in the house is prudent. A fire engine in the garage is not. Sure a crack addict can attack you in your surburban neighborhood or a gang may want to kill you to see what is in your wallet but the odds of that happening are so much less than other things we ignore but seem to get more attention because they involve guns. Guys like guns. I admit it. I like guns and have liked them for 40 years. Give me an excuse to buy another and I will. On the other hand, my fire extinguisher is sitting in my garage over a year waiting to be hung in my kitchen. ;)

[TheTman]

I think it's a personal decision, and not one that needs to be legislated on what capacity mag you carry or how many you carry. No need to 2nd guess someone elses choices, you have no idea of their circumstances. My car has a spare tire, hope I never need it. My gun has a spare mag, hope I never need that. Both are there for emergencies. Some parts of town I drive thru, I want a high capacity weapon with a couple extra mags, and a bug, while other parts I feel safe with my Kahr and 1 extra mag. Normal carry for me is the one of my Kahrs and 1 extra mag. I don't care about statistics, or the average number of shots fired in a gunfight, or any other crap, I only know what I feel safe with. I do know if the $hit hits the fan I'm gonna be crapping my pants and running for cover and maybe getting a shot off here and there and probably wanting as much ammo available as possible. I think anyone that thinks they are going to maintain their cool in a gun fight is seriously fooling themself, maybe with the exception of someone thats been thru a few of them, LEO's, combat veterans, etc.

[Bawanna]

It's all about personal confidence, just like the gun or caliber itself. If your ok with no spare mag that's fine, if you think you need 6, that's ok too. What some guys carry I wouldn't even bother with. What I carry might make people think I'm nuts. I think I just walked into a wall of ridicule right there by golly.

It's really not reasonable to compare to a police officer or certainly a swat guy. They are offense and are paid to stay and play. We're mostly defense and we can raise the white flag and run away with our tail between our legs without ridicule. In fact in most cases thats what should be done.

We may indeed have to play offense to protect a family member or a damsel in distress so there no rock solid mandate but two different games for sure.

[paul34]

You never know what the situation will be when you have to defend yourself. Having more ammo is always better. I don't think anyone who has ever been in a gunfight has wished for a smaller gun, or less ammo, or a smaller/less powerful caliber.

Most instances of armed self defense result in zero shots fired. Simply the display of the gun sends the perp running. By your logic, should we just carry unloaded handguns? :)

In fact, the chances of even getting into SD situation is actually statistically rare. Perhaps we shouldn't carry at all? ;)

[Willieboy]

Gee, I just bought a G19 and having more ammunition makes nothing but sense to me. I hope to never need the first round, but if I ever do, I know I'll appreciate every round held in reserve.

[Dietrich]

I carry what I carry to make me happy.I don`t give a damn if someone else approves or not.Them that don`t like it can smooch my pooter.

[Willieboy]

"...smooch my pooter"? Man does that conjure up disturbing images. I may have to write to Dear Dietrich for therapy.

[Bawanna]

"...smooch my pooter"? Man does that conjure up disturbing images. I may have to write to Dear Dietrich for therapy.

Please, please do, I seem to be relapsing into a halucinegenic thumb sucking floor crawler myself. Disturbing but mildly curious images for sure.

[Willieboy]

Please, please do, I seem to be relapsing into a halucinegenic thumb sucking floor crawler myself. Disturbing but mildly curious images for sure.

I may be okay Bawanna, as long as he Dietrich doesn't twitter me an image of his pooter being smooched. I bet Anthony Weiner would pay Dietrich a tidy sum to put that image on the internet and take some of the pressure off him.

[Bawanna]

I may be okay Bawanna, as long as he Dietrich doesn't twitter me an image of his pooter being smooched. I bet Anthony Weiner would pay Dietrich a tidy sum to put that image on the internet and take some of the pressure off him.

Makes me thankful I have no idea how to twitter. Mr. Weiner will get no pressure from me other than to get out of town. I just saw him on TV for the first time, who says you can't judge a book by its cover.
Looks like a loser to me.

[Jeremiah/Az]

That name "Weiner" sure seems apropos doesn't it ?:rolleyes:

[Willieboy]

Such a pig.

[O'Dell]

It's all about personal confidence, just like the gun or caliber itself. If your ok with no spare mag that's fine, if you think you need 6, that's ok too. What some guys carry I wouldn't even bother with. What I carry might make people think I'm nuts. I think I just walked into a wall of ridicule right there by golly.

It's really not reasonable to compare to a police officer or certainly a swat guy. They are offense and are paid to stay and play. We're mostly defense and we can raise the white flag and run away with our tail between our legs without ridicule. In fact in most cases thats what should be done.

We may indeed have to play offense to protect a family member or a damsel in distress so there no rock solid mandate but two different games for sure.

That's very good Bawanna. When did you develop insight?;)

[Bawanna]

That's very good Bawanna. When did you develop insight?;)

I think it was just a hotflash or something. I haven't had any insight before or since. That might have been all there is.

[LuckyGunner]

I would rather have too much vs not enough for a couple of things. Ammo during a firefight would be tops on my list.

I train regularly but I recognize that my shooting skills will deteriorate quite a bit once the lead is flying. I'd rather have more chances to stop the BD.

[earle8888]

WoW, got tired of reading,:), All the opinions!

Were not hunting for tremors with bert. --- That would be fun!!, liked that movie on TV. Had a 460 WTHBY mag at that time and enjoyed the movie, Was that Earl that drove to 2 1/2 ?

[Bawanna]

WoW, got tired of reading,:), All the opinions!

Were not hunting for tremors with bert. --- That would be fun!!, liked that movie on TV. Had a 460 WTHBY mag at that time and enjoyed the movie, Was that Earl that drove to 2 1/2 ?

That was a great movie. I liked it when he shot thru the wall and into the engine block of the tractor or truck they were gonna escape in.
I love Reba and she sounded so natural when she asked if he wanted her to bring the 375H&H Magnum?

Always wanted one of those, had one for just a little bit, no clue what I would ever do with it but the want is there. Hanker for a 416 Rigby too, same criteria.

[rwblue01]

I'm not condemning anyone that wants to carry large capacity guns or 2-3 extra mags, but I don't understand why. I can't really think of a defense situation where you would need or be able to use all that ammo. More than one attacker & you will probably only get off 2 or 3 shots. I can see a mag malfunction where you might need another, but 15-16 shot guns I just don't get. Your thoughts?

Odds are I will never "need" a gun, but I like having one.
Odds are I will never "need" a car, but I like having one.
Odds are I will never "need" a balls, but I like having one.
:19:

I suggest you give up all the above.

[joshh]

i carry a pm9 w/ 7 shots that i hope would do the trick if needed. my "house gun" holds 15 rounds of .40 and an extra mag sittin next to it. i would hate to have a few people breaking in and run out of rounds. if i lived in an open carry state, i would carry that pistol more often.

[CJB]

We've had at least two instances where civilians fired and emptied high capacity magazines into moving vehicles, when the driver of that vehicle was intent on running them over. They were separate Florida cases, both civilians were charged, and acquitted. The one guy lost his dog, and his house while in jail waiting to clear himself - the dead BG's associates burnt his house down! That charges in the case involved "emptying the gun" at the BG. Following the law, in Florida at least... there was no case against the victim, only a case of the prosecutor trying to make a name for himself.

But... I can see using many rounds in a scenario like that.

[earle8888]

Yep Bawana I had a 375 H&H and traded it for a 378 Wthrby mag. Great varmint gun! Don'y care how big they are or what they are hiding behind:) and more fun to shoot than the 460

[wdg]

I would think one extra mag would be sufficient - in case of a mag malfunction. But, to each his own! Whatever makes you comfortable carry.

[Barth]

I'm not condemning anyone that wants to carry large capacity guns or 2-3 extra mags, but I don't understand why. I can't really think of a defense situation where you would need or be able to use all that ammo. More than one attacker & you will probably only get off 2 or 3 shots. I can see a mag malfunction where you might need another, but 15-16 shot guns I just don't get. Your thoughts?

Haven’t read the responses to this question.
And am no gun expert by a long shot.
Still, I’ve had a permit for over 15 years.
And unlike some others I actually carry on a daily basis.
Full size guns, and even sub-compact guns with double stack mags,
just don’t conceal well in my sub-tropical Tampa Florida environment.
I carry, and would only recommend, single stack autos for CC

I have a different feeling about extra mags though.
Even though most gunfights seem to end quickly without reloading.
And having a “Magnum Force” style combat range shootout seems unlikely.
I can see the potential need to lay down some suppressive fire gaining cover.
Once cover is obtained - reloading sounds like a fine idea (especially with my MK40 six shooter).
I use the two following options for carrying two extended mags:
1) DeSantis Mag Packer Pocket Magazine Pouch
2) DeSantis Amidextrous - Black - Neoprene Ankle Double Magazine Pouch

[wyntrout]

"I can see the potential need to lay down some suppressive fire gaining cover.
Once cover is obtained - reloading sounds like a fine idea"

That's what I say all of the time. Most people "train" by standing upright and laboriously assuming the proper stance, breathing, and trigger pull... which is fine if you're fighting paper targets. Most likely though, your opponent(s) will be armed and spraying lead your way... or about to, especially if you've pulled out a weapon! Have you ever played "Whack-a-Mole"??

Wynn:D:

[Bawanna]

I love Whack a Mole, one of my favorites and good exercise for the arms and keeps your senses sharp so you don't lose em. This aids in not forgetting what your were talking about when you started talking which could lead you to talk about something other than what you started to talk about in the first place. If you can remember what the first thing was.

Barth, I gonna check out those ankle mag pouches, that seems like a fine idea. I have a PM45 on my left ankle all the time but nothing on my right. Good place to hang a couple mags or even just one.

That way when I lose the waist gun on those times when I can't wear it I'll still have the PM and a couple mags.
Thanks for the idea.

[yqtszhj]

Beverly Hills scares me really bad too. Course the Clampetts are there so maybe ole Jed will have my back while I'm puttin my moves on Elly Mae? Course he's only got a 1 shooter but that would at least be a good signal.

Better watch out for Granny. I think she's the toughest of the bunch. But she had a shotgun.

My great grandmother looked and dressed just like Granny and was about as mean too (only from middle Tennessee and not the hills in the east.) My mom tells me about great granny making great granddad strip to his shorts outside after work before she would let him in the house. He was a roofer. She said he was nasty and wasn't coming into the house until he undressed. She lived to be 92.

[Bawanna]

You just gotta love grannys with attitude.

[TheTman]

I was just marveling at how this thread has really taken on a life of it's own. 110 responses so far, and has remained very civil for the most part. Cool.
I've never heard anyone say, Darn, I brought too much ammo with me today.

[O'Dell]

Nearly all of my 'carry' guns hold 6 or 7 rounds in the mag - the exceptions being the HK45C with 8 and the M&P c 40 with 10. Sometimes I have an extra mag, sometimes not, depending on how I'm dressed. One way I look at it is that the fewer rounds mean less weight, and that's an important consideration to me for carry. I really don't feel undergunned with 7 or more rounds unless it's the LCP which is only a 380.

In the two burglaries I've had, there were two or three intruders according to the fingerprints the police found. For that reason my 'house' gun is a HK USP 40 which has 14 round mags. It's the only gun, and extra mag, I keep hidden outside the safe for easy and quick access. It's really too large and heavy loaded for carry anyway.