Why do I NEED an AR?

[340pd]

Ran across this response.

"Why do you need a gun like an AR15?"
It's not about need, it is my second amendment right to own such a rifle.
"But 'assault weapons' aren't necessary for hunting."
First of all it is not an "assault weapon" and secondly, the second amendment isn't about hunting; it is about defending liberty from tyranny.
"So you're worried that a tyrant is going to take away your guns and your liberty?"
NO, actually I am not.... because we have the SECOND AMENDMENT.

[DavidWJ]

I don't know any LEOs that will engage in gun confiscation from good citizens. If that's generally true, it doesn't matter what the lawyers say, we'll still have our guns. Why? because lawyers depend on enforcers following blindly, which they don't.

[Scarywoody]

No one "needs" an AR. It is our duty as good Americans (the kind that stand at the National Anthem) to own, train and maintain them. Our Military is 2 million strong, formidable indeed. But when you add an extra layer of 30-50 million armed Americans, it makes the enemy think twice. The Japanese stopped short of invading main land USA because " behind every blade of grass was an American with a gun": (paraphrased, probably poorly). Secondly, it's to protect our constitution from those that would attempt to destroy it. And "C", I have one (although since the fire I can't actually find any of my guns ;), it's just F*cking cool! Get one if you don't have one already. Train with it like you are protecting your castle because you are. Maintain it for not only yourself but your heirs to come because who knows what the future holds.

[b4uqzme]

^^^ yep! What he said.

[yqtszhj]

I never figured out how they thought the second amendment was about hunting. What animals would fit the part of the amendment "being necessary to the security of a free state"? Must be some big critters.

Actually they were talking to the people who weren't taught the constitution in school I guess.

[JohnR]

It's not the Bill of Needs.

[Armybrat]

I didn't "need" an AR, but since a large segment of the political world thinks I shouldn't have one I bought this S&W Sport two years ago:

http://images.yuku.com/image/jpeg/92325784f8dd2164bbd0b928792843f4441f121.jpg

And when the wife said "why did you buy that?", I replied, "because I wanted one" - then bought this Colt LE6920 so it wouldn't get lonely:

http://images.yuku.com/image/jpeg/18b351c744bdd1891b66b55907b131fab683109.jpg

When I bought 20 extra Pmags to go with them, she asked "Why?", and I replied "Why not?'

[Bawanna]

I like your style buddy. I gotta get me one but I'm waiting for the panic to hit so I can pay 4 times what they are worth.
I can't believe it hasn't already started.

[kenemoore]

I don't have an AR either, got an AK, liked it, and never thought about AR's until recently. My god, they're like 1911's, everybody makes them and the prices and quality are hard to figure out. I got a buddy who know's his stuff, and I been leaning on him heavy, still can't make up my mind on which make and model. Now I remember why I never got one before.

[Bawanna]

I'm more familiar with AR's than AK's which is why I don't have an AK either. So many variations and made in different places. I like to get a good one but it's confusing.

My son got one from Cabela's and it seems like a good one. I shot it and it was great fun.
Wouldn't mind having one like that. Bulk import ammo is cheap or at least is until they plug that hole.

[yqtszhj]

You know, i actually need to get my first one out and shoot it. Its been a while for it.

[AIRret]

Actually, the real question should be; "why wouldn't you need an AR". They are a blast in more ways than I can count!

And you are right, they are not assault rifles, they semi auto rifles.

After Sandy Hook there were some folks on the radio talking about banning so called assault rifles. Their criteria would have included my Mossburg shot gun! So, when I called I told them that if this law passed it would force my family to buy another shot gun since without an adjustable stock I wouldn't be able to shoot any of the other shot guns we have in the house. Guess what, I never got on the radio!

[CJB]

You don't need an AR if you got an AK

I love the AR design. There are things Stoner did, maybe by accident, that are just really nice. The weight distribution along the length of the axis of the rifle (in its original form at least) is just a work of genius.

OTOH... you can't beat an AK for getting the job done at any sort of realistic distance, against human size targets, and in environments that generally would make the AR inoperative.

AR - lots of spare parts around, ammo is all over, probably will be (and be used as money) if SHTF.
AK - dependable as a brick, but ammo is cheap now, may not be as available if SHTF.

[AIRret]

We have a DD m4
and a Springfield SOCOM 308….Oh Fun!

[OvalNut]

You don't need an AR if you got an AK

I love the AR design. There are things Stoner did, maybe by accident, that are just really nice. The weight distribution along the length of the axis of the rifle (in its original form at least) is just a work of genius.

OTOH... you can't beat an AK for getting the job done at any sort of realistic distance, against human size targets, and in environments that generally would make the AR inoperative.

AR - lots of spare parts around, ammo is all over, probably will be (and be used as money) if SHTF.
AK - dependable as a brick, but ammo is cheap now, may not be as available if SHTF.


SO much right with this post. AK-74 for the win!

... Her name is Elaine.

http://i912.photobucket.com/albums/ac323/ovalnut12/AK/Tapco%20Full%2025.jpg


And, you need to feed it:

http://i912.photobucket.com/albums/ac323/ovalnut12/AK/Spam%205-25.jpg



Tim

[AJBert]

I was reading my "American Rifleman" yesterday when one of my co-workers cameo up and said she loved to read it, too. Anyways, we somehow got on to the banning of "assault weapons". I told her I had no need for an AR or AK as I've shot both numerous times and truly have no need or want for one but that I did have something that no one needs, though. Even told her my magazines are illegal in the state of CO, though mine are legal as the are grandfathered in from the POS law that was passed back in 2013.

When I told her it was a Tommy, her eyes went wide and she wanted to know when she could shoot it.

[getsome]

Today I finished reading the second most important book I have ever read in my life....Number one was the Bible, number two is titled "Unintended Consequences" by John Ross....If you are part of the gun culture and by being a member of this forum I will assume that you are then you MUST read this book.....It will make it 100% clear why it's now or never time to get an AR or AK rifle while you still have the opportunity to do so....The government is not our friend any longer and only wants to control us and make us their slaves......This weekend you should go out and get your rifle before it's too late and then buy all the ammo and magazines you can find....You can pick up a S&W or Ruger AR rifle that will last a lifetime for less than you think......Folks, bad times are coming after the Hildabeast takes power and when she stocks the high court with her left wing liberal stooges it's all over for the "Gun Culture" and our way of life.....Get a rifle as soon as you can and PLEASE get yourself a copy from Amazon of "Unintended Consequences" and read it, it's a long book over 600 pages but once you start reading it it's hard to put down and every bit as entertaining as anything John Grisham has out and will change the way you think about what the government is doing , how they operate and what their ultimate solution is........

[JohnR]

I appreciate the AK, but AR15s are so much more pleasant to shoot and to hold in one's hands. You know what they say, it's shot placement, not caliber.

[deadeye]

To these politicians who say I don't "need" my AR, I will make a deal with them. I will go to their home and tell them what they have and don't "need." We will go from there. If you don't have an AR, get one. You'll be surprised how enjoyable it is to shoot. Plus, it pi$$es Libtards off.

[JohnR]

Like Trump said yesterday, if we don't need guns, Hillary doesn't "need" armed bodyguards.

[CPTKILLER]

I think it is up to us as individuals.

Read what Jefferson said and you will know.

[CJB]

I appreciate the AK, but AR15s are so much more pleasant to shoot and to hold in one's hands. You know what they say, it's shot placement, not caliber.

Agreed the AR is more comfy than the AK. The recoil and blast don't really deserve comparison. Such a contest is akin to determination of which is worse: Being hit by a freight train doing 40mph or 60mph.

The AK requires a neck like a flamingo for many shooters to get a decent sight picture. But, the damned thing works like gangbusters. Not overly accurate, but accurate enough.

Most rifle encounters are not picking off some bad guy at 300 meters, nor 200. More like under 100 meters. Well, under 100 meters in fact. I look at it this way: If I know of a walking threat 1000 feet away, I've got time on my side. If there's a threat from vehicles, I'm screwed anyway because I do not (yet) own a .50bmg repeater.

Urban/suburban situation - threats from roof tops, windows, doorways, down the street, alleyways, a close up drive by, and the like. Out where I'll likely be, in less dense areas, I can use time to my advantage.

Aside from the SHTF scenario, I can think - hurricane emergency here, or general riotous situation of a local nature. In those cases, ya know... I'd grab my KSG and be happy with it!

No doubt, if there WERE a situation where longer range targets were a must, then the AR. Its far, far more accurate. The only thing the AK has going for it is the type of dependability that Glock and Sig "claim" they have (and wish they did have!). Its the damned Energizer Bunny of autoloaders. Just so-so on accuracy. A 94 Winchester in .30-30 is about as accurate, and about as powerful. Thought of in those terms, would you want to take on a threat at 300 meters with a .30-30 levergun? Nope. Not I. I'd turn tail and run, hide out, get away... before I'd try that sort of stunt. Would I take on a threat at 50 or 100 feet with the AK? Oh hell yes, it would do nicely for that. Call me Chuck Kalashnikov Konnerz in that sort of scenario.

I've got a folding AK. Its not fun to shoot, but fits better than a wood stock one for me. Got (thinking) several AR's. I think two, but it may be three, and the two SBR's on the AR platform, which are in progress. Why? I dunno why. The KSG is better than any SBR, just look at the length comparisons. And the Serbu Super Shorty takes the cake for being big medicine in a small size. In fact, some of us are just swimming in guns and ammo - which is a decided negative factor, or positive, depending on how you look at things

[JohnR]

I read something saying that the average rifle battle in WWII tooks place in 200 yards ot under. We don't have artillery and air cover to keep threats far away and pinned down. In 'nam it was probably less due to jungle. Where I live I can't even see over 200 yards down the road before it turns. But a gang of marauders in a WROL situation makes an AR very comforting.

[dustnchips]

If Hillary wins I'll have to get and AR or AK before she takes office. Don't feel a need for one, but you never know when you might decide that you just want one.

[Armybrat]

Why are you waiting?

[deadeye]

Yep. Why wait? Right now they are at the lowest prices Ive seen them. If it looks like HitLIARy might be elected the prices will go through the roof.

[dustnchips]

Money is the reason I am waiting. I already bought two Kahrs this year.

[Bawanna]

Me too, it's always money, money or lack thereof controls my life.

I started looking for a paper route but was told delivery is dead.

Guess I'll have to go to plan B and become a Gigalo/ Male Escort.

[deadeye]

Money is the problem. Ahh. I see you guys are married too!;)

[JohnR]

I had money to burn when I was single.

[AIRret]

Me too, it's always money, money or lack thereof controls my life.

I started looking for a paper route but was told delivery is dead.

Guess I'll have to go to plan B and become a Gigalo/ Male Escort.

I'll be your Madam/pimp

[AIRret]

Bawana, If you need a Madam/pimp to help you with your new job…….I'LL volunteer!

[AIRret]

OOPS I didn't realize the first post got through.

[Bawanna]

I need to check my records. Are we married. Did I ask you to be my cyber bride (no fringe benefits involved, kind of like my real wife)?

If not I'm asking you now. Do be gentle I've received a few rejections on another forum. I'm beginning to think I've lost my touch or my animal magnetism or something?


Visualize a derelict down on one knee if that helps, not easy to do let me tell ya.

[CJB]

..... looking forward to the next episode of "Pimp the Colonel" !

[deadeye]

Will marriage mean all that hugging, kissing and I forget what else? If so I'd probably better not until I can remember what else. Oops. I was just told I am already married. Old age is rough!

[Bawanna]

Well there marriage real. This is between a man and a woman who live in the same house and have children via germs from airport toilet seats. I have a theory on that which I think I've shared before. Guy is often nagged and welcomes death frequently.

Then there's cyber marriages. I think I have about 12 or 15 cyber brides although I think some want to start seeing other people.

Zena and MX5fan on this very forum were my first. Sadly we've drifted apart, sniff, sniff.

[AIRret]

Yes Dear, I am one of your "many cyber brides"!!!!!! I understand…no fringe benefits, but that doesn't mean I can't be your Pimp/Madam!!!!
Who better than someone who understands you!!!!
Sincerely, one of many!
Sooooooooo, what kind of contract do you want? I'll work pro-bono.

[jeepster09]

I didn't need an AR that is why I went with a HAMMER....

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv276/jeepster09/44e86618-c2d7-4505-9721-d3b9a5b0bde0_zpshuqi5xoe.jpg (http://s691.photobucket.com/user/jeepster09/media/44e86618-c2d7-4505-9721-d3b9a5b0bde0_zpshuqi5xoe.jpg.html)

[Bawanna]

Yes Dear, I am one of your "many cyber brides"!!!!!! I understand…no fringe benefits, but that doesn't mean I can't be your Pimp/Madam!!!!
Who better than someone who understands you!!!!
Sincerely, one of many!
Sooooooooo, what kind of contract do you want? I'll work pro-bono.

What a relief. I so fear rejection. I don't think we need a contract but I'll have my people contact your people and we'll work it out.
If pro bono is free that's no good. I want to support you in a manner to which your accustomed.

[AIRret]

I'll take my pay in Ammo. and Range time!!

[340pd]

The only surviving picture of the AR I built "just in case". Sadly, it was lost along with ALL MY OTHER GUNS AND SMALL SUPPLY OF AMMO in a tragic canoeing accident during my attempt to paddle across Lake Superior last month.

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/gnystrom_photos/15_zps1jrylibi.jpg

[dustnchips]

Always use a waterproof bag and strap it in. That way you have to lose the whole canoe.

[Bawanna]

I think I read about the canoe accident last year. He did in fact lose the whole canoe.
Sadly there were no survivors despite a gallant rescue attempt.

AIRret, I knew there was a reason I married you. Good priorities.

[Slugnutty]

Komrads, I shall attempt to take and post pictures of real rifle.
Now hold breath and wait.

[Slugnutty]

http://www.kahrtalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=14152&stc=1

May need to click on the image to expand. Don't know how it works here, but uploaded from PC pictures.

The rifle was put together by RPG Arms (now defunct company(I believe)) from Houston TX.
All AMERICAN made AK - (Almost)
Elk river tool and Die - Receiver - Belgrade, MT
Green Mountain Rifle barrel - Conway, New Hampshire
Magpul Furniture - Cheyenne WY
Geissele Automatics - Trigger group - North Wales PA
Krebs custom - retainer plates - Wauconda, IL
Ultimak gas tube/rail - Moscow, IDAHO!
Impact Weapons - SMC light mount - Timnath, CO
Surfire - G2X Tactical light - Fountain Valley, CA

And the only non-conus part -

Primary arms - red dot - Chena'





Yes, yes it DOES shoot darb well - I made a trade the year BHO won the presidency but before he took office, to get one GOOD -reliable - depend on with your life rifle - AR's we're a little too expensive for me and quite honestly I admired the 30 cal platform and know the AK was well regarded for a SHTF reliability.

My local gun store (for once not THE pawn shop - Right?) was willing to trade my SIG P229 plus about $150 or so for the AK - when I purchased it, it had Tapco furniture, trigger, stamped steel gas tube - I obviously added what I wanted, (who doesn't? when we can afford it)
I added the red dot this year as my eyes are going ( age and treachery) and needed the SHOOT HERE idiot assistance, and now wish I would have done it 10 years ago!


This year before Christmas I add a REAL AR to the safe also - I am in the decision process as we read this, I am leaning toward a Bravo Company - HSP Jack or the Daniel Defense DDM4V7 (M-Lok) or DDM4V11 (Keymod)
With a very distant third of Sig MCX, but shying away from the MCX as it has too may unique parts not replaceable from off the shelf AR parts.

I have a lot of feeling for both BCM and DD and have in interesting take on the decision process - but it's a weeeeee bit loony - tin foil hat type decision.
And not sure if it will hold water if brought out in the day light.

Any way, my choice with no regrets - even after I get an AR is the AK platform for robustness and reliability

[JohnR]

Dat ain't no real rifle, ain't got no wood on it nowhere.

[AIRret]

Bawanna, I'll even share my "income" of Ammo and Range time. I've NEVER had a bad time at the range!! Your judgement is good, that's why I accepted your cyber proposal several years back

Seriously, range time is a great break from everyday stress. You have to (and want to) REALLY concentrate! It's like a mini vacation, as well as an affirmation that you/me/and like minded, won't willingly be a victim. It empowers us, and makes us even with the bad guy (or terrorist). I know you have some mobility issues, and I have many orthopedic issues…….this levels the playing field. BUT STILL even though Hubby (my live in) and I train seriously, it still is a whole bunch of FUN!!

[Bawanna]

Orthopedic issues, hmmmm. I gotta look that up. That ain't like falsies or nuthin like that is it?

I really got no mobility issues, just can't stand up or walk.

I finally finished putting down that fake hardwood floor junk my live in made me put down.
8 or 9 hours wallering around on the floor like a mackerel out of water. Tuesday and I still feel like Foreman used me for a punching bag.

I won't be on the floor for awhile, I promise thee that.

[JohnR]

A few years ago I put down some "click lock" fake wood flooring, about 500 square feet of it, and it was hell on my knees. I had to spread out the work over a few days to make it bearable.

[Bawanna]

I've done about 1500 sq ft over the last few years. A few area's twice.
It's the hips and elbows on me, have to work with one hand and hold myself up with the other elbow. Knees get killed getting in and out of the chair. I try to have a box I drag around with every tool I might need but I still find myself scooting around to get something I left at the other end.

Sunday was the last section except for one bedroom that I haven't been told to do yet. But it was a little hallway area. Probably only a 120 sq ft but 5 doors and the hallway entrance. Tons of cutting and fitting and swearing. 8 or 9 hours in that tiny little area. Back in my construction days I would have been ashamed of myself for taking that long but I did the best I could and didn't waste many moves.

Used a different brand this time, quit carrying the stuff we used before and it actually went together a little nicer. I liked the darker color she picked this time too. But enough about fake wood flooring for quite a spell. I'm sitting up right and giving the old body a rest.
Probably split firewood this weekend.......maybe........or not.........hoping there's a gun show, have to check.

[SteveOak]

I never figured out how they thought the second amendment was about hunting. What animals would fit the part of the amendment "being necessary to the security of a free state"? Must be some big critters.

Actually they were talking to the people who weren't taught the constitution in school I guess.

They don't (necessarily) think that the 2nd Amendment is about hunting. It is a ploy. If you cannot win the argument you are in by reasonable means, you change the argument to one that you can win.

If they change the discussion from the Right to Keep and Bear Arms to something about hunting, then they can have an argument that they might win as in you can go to the grocery store and buy meat so you don't need to kill animals, etc.

[AIRret]

"Orthopedic issues, hmmmm. I gotta look that up. That ain't like falsies or nuthin like that is it?"
No, I'm all natural.
Orthopedic issues are a bad back, I jumped off of one too many towers when I was teaching water survival to future pilots.
Now that I think about it, I do have something artificial in my body…….My back is full of metal, two plates, 8 screws and a horizontal bar to stabilize everything.
But heck, I can still shoot a police qualifying score, so I'm good.
As you well know, you have to make do with the beat up body you have.

[Bawanna]

Terminator huh? I have two 12"? stainless steel rods wired to my lower spine. Looks wicked cool in an xray.

I'll have to check into one of them horizontal stabilizer bars, might help out on the corners..........

I remember when I was a boy scout we had a (army I think) scout master for awhile. He had a super cute daughter he tried to fix me up with but I didn't know about such things at that tender age. Bad for me. We got to camp out on military training fields and ride in the big trucks sometimes.
He took us to a military base not far away with a big pool and they had one of them cockpits like they had in Officer and a Gentleman where it runs down the track and tips over in the water.

I don't remember any military guys around but they let us actually do that. In hindsight I can't believe they let us, that was downright dangerous. I only did it 5 or 6 times and I don't much care for getting wet usually.

Right before we were gonna leave I dived off the edge of the pool and apparently dove too deep, hit my head and blinked out for a bit. Drug me out, got me together and all was ok. Scoutmaster had a whisper talk with my dad and as we were leaving he pushed me back into the pool.
When I asked what the heck he did that for, he said to make sure I wasn't afraid. Told him I was glad I wasn't since I didn't really have much of choice getting pushed...........................tough love, that's what you call that.

[AIRret]

Now I know where your Marine son gets if from……I alway knew you were tough. Seriously, for a person that is active, and does a physically demanding job it must be hard as hell to lose that, and you don't feel sorry for yourself and that is admirable.
I don't have it that bad,I have medical issues but I can still walk well, and I am thankful.

[Bawanna]

Bringing the thread back to why "I" need an AR, you've struck it on the nail head.

The most frustrating thing for me is waiting for someone to do what is difficult or not worth me figuring out how to do who then doesn't want to do it the way I ask them to do it and watch them not do it as well as I'd do it if I could do it myself.
Say that 10 times really fast.
My oldest son does this a lot to me. I had to swap out a dryer, went kaput. I got it drug out a bit need to unhook the vent hose. He tells me he has it, he'll get a nut driver, it's one of them hex nuts but has a cross place for a straight screwdriver.
I whipped out my leatherman and said use this. No go, he goes to the shop in search of the nut driver. Apparently gets a call.
After about 5 minutes, the maximum time my patience allows I remove the hose with my leather man. Drag the dryer out towards the back door (dryers are really not that heavy). Would have had it outside cept I had to make a 90 degree turn on a ramp and it kind of messed me up.

My son and my brother in law were or are both boat mechanics and both have the curse of saying I'll help with that, I'll bring my fancy wazoo whizdangit tool over next Thursday and we'll get r dun.
What they don't understand is I'm getting it done today, right now, not this evening, not tomorrow.

Break out the sawzall, hot wrench, whatever it takes to get this underway. No patience in me, that's the toughest part.

Seems as time goes by I live more and more in a world of good enough or that'll have to do. I've been fighting it lately, not settling for mediocre.

Also why I was a better worker than a foreman or superintendent when I did real work. Rather do it myself. Hated telling people what to do and then waiting for them to do it.
My record was firing 4 new guys in one week. It was a tough week and I still feel badly about it.

So maybe an AR on sight would act as persuasion for good quality control. I'll try that on the missus and see how that hot air balloon flies.

As far as feeling sorry for oneself, don't do much good. I went down the day before Christopher Reeves fell off his horse. I never really felt sorry for myself but anytime the thought entered my infinitely small mind I just thought of him and realized that I was close to normal compared to what he was going through. Can't imagine.

Hey, I can still shoot AR's, what more does a person need.

[CJB]

Orthopedic issues, hmmmm. I gotta look that up. That ain't like falsies or nuthin like that is it?

I really got no mobility issues, just can't stand up or walk.

I finally finished putting down that fake hardwood floor junk my live in made me put down.
8 or 9 hours wallering around on the floor like a mackerel out of water. Tuesday and I still feel like Foreman used me for a punching bag.

I won't be on the floor for awhile, I promise thee that.

Few years back, I got the "can we paint the bedroom" question. That turned into... rip out all the wood molding, paint, new pocket doors, new laminate floor, and all new wood molding, with matching wall sockets and switch plates.

The laminate was in her garage for over ten years and had absorbed moisture, so I had to go out and buy a router and router table, and trim both sides of the male "tongue" to fit the female "groove", and it was precise cuts of only .006 on one side and .008 on the other. Real pain in the butt. Then.... I had to route the molding curves myself, as she wanted old school fat baseboards and slim door trim with fat tops, to look "old and homey". That all had to get stained, and she demanded the walk in closet be done the same. Then came the matching ceiling fan. And I had to rework the pocket doors to look old. Now she wants me to run another 20 amp service for some sort of in the wall AC thing she got used, but free. And cut a hole in the concrete wall for it. I seriously don't think so

Took me months of Saturdays.

[b4uqzme]

^^^ yeah. We got a new microwave that turned into a whole new kitchen. That's when I finally gave up saving for retirement and started buying guns. What's good for the goose...

[b4uqzme]

I recommend you build an AR. It's fun and, if you get stuck, CJB will bail you out. :o

[Bawanna]

I gave up retirement years ago. With the constant snowball effect mentioned there's no money for even AR parts.

It's Top Ramen and 45 bullets and few of those now days.

[CJB]

I recommend you build an AR. It's fun and, if you get stuck, CJB will bail you out. :o

Which means its fun, AND easy!

[AIRret]

Seems as time goes by I live more and more in a world of good enough or that'll have to do. I've been fighting it lately, not settling for mediocre.

Also why I was a better worker than a foreman or superintendent when I did real work. Rather do it myself. Hated telling people what to do and then waiting for them to do it.
My record was firing 4 new guys in one week. It was a tough week and I still feel badly about it.

You've done SO much better than %90 of those in your situation!! You have to fight settling for mediocre, you'll be be angry with yourself if you compromise too much….that's not you. Of corse, on minor things it's not very important…..we all do compromise on the little things.

Work ethic, your old school, most young folks don't get it! Then again the pioneers would definitely put me to shame!

[OvalNut]

... That's when I finally gave up saving for retirement and started buying guns.
...

Outstanding post!


Tim