P380 satisfaction

[Serge]

Months ago I purchased a P380, shot it through the "break in" period and it only got worse. Multiple types of failures out of every mag. I was quite frustrated and expressed that here. I sent it back to Kahr, got it back, and after a few months, finally got to the range. I had every intention to trade it as partial payment on the new Sig P938 We The People. I take back every bad word and thought! 200 rounds, 4 types of ammo and not a single malfunction. Kahr says they polished the extractor. Sorry if I offended anyone earlier. I had been sold on Kahr, having fired others and dry firing mine and was very frustrated. So what's next a K40?

[Alfonse]

I'm glad they got it sorted! They are sweet shooters. Enjoy.

[TheLastDaze]

excellent report !!!! stoked its worked out for ya... love my pm9 just wished my cw380 would get up to par,love the gun regardless but would also like to be able to carry it someday..

[k2ue]

The extractor is indeed the issue. I am a retired engineer, and became interested why my CW380 had such trouble going into battery -- the common problem where a thumb nudge is necessary. By taking the slide and a case and looking at how the case goes from the angle and position it is presented by the mag to under the extractor and in battery position over the case imprint on the slide boltface, the problem is apparent. The extractor spring is significantly compressed, and so the extractor tension does not vary greatly with the lateral position of the extractor hook, yet to get into position on the boltface the extractor must be significantly deflected from its resting position, and the spring resistance to that deflection and poor mechanical advantage converting recoil spring force to upward motion of the barrel and case make that very difficult -- hence the tendency to hang. Ideally the resting position of the extractor hook at the tangent to the rim should equal the distance from the case extraction groove bottom to the opposite wall of the slide, and also there is no point in the extractor hook being deeper than the case extraction groove.

According, I found that if I took a 3/8" end mill and cut into the extractor at the case tangent point I could reach a point where both: a) the distance to the left slide wall equals the extraction groove to far side of the rim dimension; and b) there is still enough extractor depth at the tangent point to reach the bottom the the case extraction groove. Note that after doing this the extractor also grips the rim for a longer distance above the tangent point. The mill was them moved down the extractor so that the profile below the tangent point was the same as at the tangent point, all the way to the bottom. The last mod is to note where the extractor last engages the rim below the tangent point when it is in battery, and taper the extractor depth with a file from there to zero depth at the bottom.

The resulting modified extractor has approximately the same rim engagement area, owing to the greater depth above the tangent point making up for the lesser depth below. Functioning is much improved, and battery is attained even when releasing the slide slowly by hand from lock-back.

I won't, however, call this fait accompli until more extensive range testing is completed, which I will do soon. This posting is meant to nudge Kahr into taking a look at improving the 380 extractor, for all users.

[yqtszhj]

Functioning is much improved, and battery is attained even when releasing the slide slowly by hand from lock-back.
.

My new CW380 will do the above but in looking at pictures of the cw380 posted by others my extractor sits a bit more forward of the breech face than some others do. Also my extractor seems beveled where it picks up a round from the mag. So as you well put it its an extractor issue on some of the .380's.

[topgun1953]

In one of these threads I had reported Kahr had modified the extractor to improve feeding. Probably 6 months or so ago. Not sure exactly what they did as no one has checked old vs new.

[mark7mod0]

I called Kahr when I first bought my CW380 and was having feed problems. I thought my extractor was broken because of the angle of it.....which it was not. I gave them my serial number and asked if there have been any factory mods to the CW 380 since mine was manufactured....he said no. Mine is RL 31XX

[Ed M]

Having recently aquired a pretty good size stash of Perfecta 380 ammo, I decided to try to get my CW380s to be able to feed this ammo.

Having already watched the extractor mod that was posted on you tube, I figured I'd give it a shot.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwrBbUQze2k

Looking at my extractor, I noticed that Kahr had already ground the bottom edge of the extractor claw that Mr. Beck had rounded off in his video. It wasn't rounded, but rather ground off at an angle. This still wasn't enough to get Perfecta ammo to feed properly.

I wound up doing Tigman's extractor mod, and took off .010 from the inside of the extractor pivot post. This worked like a charm, and now I can slingshot a round into place even with Perfecta ammo. As of today, I now have 300 rounds of Perfecta through my CW380's with no more issues.

Hopefully, Kahr has figured this out as well, and incorporated these changes in to the production line...

[mark7mod0]

took off .010 from the inside of the extractor pivot post .....I'm lost on this part.

[Ed M]

took off .010 from the inside of the extractor pivot post .....I'm lost on this part.

Professor Greg made a typically awesome illustration of this...


http://www.kahrtalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=14897&stc=1

[mark7mod0]

Alright, I just did the extractor pin mod....I do not have a micrometer so I doubt if I removed .10 exactly. I was having a few rounds not feeding, but most all did after the mod of rounding the corner of the extractor S&B mostly. Just manually cycling, seems to be fine. Will go to the range in AM and check it out with some Perfecta and S&B. Thanks for the tips and the pictures.

[dsk]

Fiocchi ammo seems to be the acid test for the extractor mod. That stuff flat out will not run with an unmodified extractor.

[Ed M]

Agree with this. It's been my experience as well.

Perfecta is made by Fiocchi. It's actually my favorite range ammo in 9mm and 380 for the rest of my guns. It's inexpensive, a fairly hot load, and runs cleaner than anything else I've tried.

My 380s get dirtier after shooting just one mag of Winchester white box than they do after shooting 2 boxes of Perfecta!

Glad I did the extractor fix on my Kahr 380s - they chamber the first round of any kind of ammo easier now too.

My local gunshop told me yesterday that Walmart is dumping Perfecta because of the many complaints they got about it not working well in 380s. It's supposedly going to be available from other sources now, and I've seen it on several other ammo source's sites already. It was originally offered as a Walmart exclusive by Tula, and made by Fiocchi in Italy.

[mark7mod0]

Well, looked all over town for 380 Perfecta, S&B or Fiocchi and found none. I did find some over priced PPU in a pawn shop...something different that I never have used so I tried it. Shot 35 rounds of it, was 100% as was some Estate, Federal target and some of the Pow"RBall I tried also. Everything ran thru better and ejected better since the extractor work last night. Pawn shop had 1 Kahr....a 3 year old CT40....for the price of $499.00!!!

[Ed M]

It's a rare day when I see Perfecta on the shelves at a Walmart.....

http://www.bulkammo.com/380-auto-95-gr-fmj-fiocchi-perfecta-1000-rounds