Glock Gen 5 bait and switch?

[JethrosDad]

Let me preface this by saying that I am definitely no expect and I'm hoping that someone with more knowledge than me can enlighten me on this subject. :cool:

With all the hoopla surrounding the Gen 5 release, one thing in particular is really got me scratching my head because it seems to be going unreported....For years I've heard from Glock fan boys locally and online espousing how superior polygonal rifling is compared to traditional land and groove. They say that it is more accurate, has better velocity, and was handed down to Gaston Glock by God himself. Conspicuously absent from all the reviews is that Glock has ditched polygonal rifling in Gen 5 and gone back to land and groove saying that it is more accurate, faster, ect.

It appears as if everything old is new again. I can't wait to see how the die hard Glock fans react to going back to conventional rifling.

So what are your thoughts, is this whole rifling thing a bait and switch by Glock?

[Bawanna]

I don't see it as a good thing myself. Other changes other than the barrel which I don't really care about. I never thought polygonal was that superior to a rifled barrel in the first place especially in a 3-5" barrel.
On the plus side it will handle lead which is getting more and more non PC at ranges so not that big a plus anyhow.

I hate to see the changes overall. Right now most all parts interchange across the board except the 42 and 43 which I'm not terribly fond of either.
Now one will have to be far more careful when needing replacement parts.

Fortunately at least so far they are only messing with the 9. So my 21's at work are still safe and hopefully I'll get more before they cross over into other calibers.

It's like when VW quit making the Bug and came out with other cars, things went down hill. The new bug while kind of cute I'm told isn't that great.
They had a good thing going.

[yqtszhj]

Is it only me or does the gen 5 look really more like Gen 1B. Like jethrosdad said everything old is new again.
Didnt they go from a 3 pin frame back to 2 pins again with this new Gen 1B?

[Bawanna]

Yup, that's one of the changes, 2 pins instead of 3.

[JethrosDad]

yeah, I think the Gen 5 is a hard pass for me.

Not left handed so I don't need an ambi slide release, don't mind the finger grooves on my Gen 4, and cant see any benefit of getting the Gen 5.

I really like my gen 4. Great home defense gun because the cost of aftermarket parts is so cheap.

A set of night sights, a good flashlight, and 18 rounds of Hornady critical duty.

[jeepster09]

Glocks are made for carpenters.....after all nothing more than a block. Perhaps they would also be good to pound nails in with..:target:

[mark7mod0]

I thought about Glocks decision with the barrel also. I also wonder about the decision CZ made with the P10 to not have their inside rail design that for years has been their trademark and claim to fame. That also was to cause better accuracy for their firearms as with the polygonal barrel was for every other firearm on earth....except now for Glock.

[ltxi]

I had no idea Glock was now doing Gen 5. Hadn't even quite head bothered with the fact there was a Gen 4 yet.

I have two Glocks...a Gen 2 G23 and an earliest G27. Both are good reliable and accurate. But have no interest at all in buying new(er)/more.

I find my G23 in particular a pleasure to shoot. Only double stack I've small hands ever felt really comfortable with.

Fact be, though, Glocks are essentially appliance guns. Any quality rifling/barrel is more than perfectly adequate. Add to that...most of these guns end up in the hands of professional amateurs and polygonal rifling leads like a b****.

[TheLastDaze]

ouch to much hate for my love..

what goes around comes around, history repeats..

they probably just wanted to be different on the barrel, as bawanna said outstanding for lead reloads but not as much people casting as there used to be or maybe there is, ?? dunno... This glock is more like Gen 2 with pins, no grooves...

Changes thay i see... ambi stop, flared beveled mag well, florescent follower, belveled slide at muzzle, blacker slide finish (suppose to be better than tennifer *cough*), more factory sight options, barrel.. thats about all i can tell...

only sig and glock made it past the 2k round mark with no malfunctions but sig got the contract... gen 5 is suppose to be more durable as well and able to outlast 20k rounds with zero issues... funny i thought they all did that, ive never had one single problem with any glock i own and i have a decent amount... in fact my 26 has well over 20k rounds and i haven't replaced anything not even return spring... still going like all my glock hammers...

glock in the most indestructable firearm on the planet, nuff said and i digress...

just wished they could still use teniffer and if this new finish actually is better than tennifer I think i will at least pick up a g17....

but i still need a 29.... but im happy with gen3, finger grooves dont bother me a bit...

[TheLastDaze]

bawanna btw Ive been a big fan of aircooled dubs for many many years... have had a lot and restored a notch and bus..... currently have a 69 ghia vert all orginal....
the smell alone is nostalgic...

[Bawanna]

When I was in High School I wouldn't ride in a bug. My grandfather a body and fender man hated them, said they didn't have any power and held up traffic. I drank his kool aid, really respected him.
But he was wrong. After High School I had a friend who was a VW mechanic and I probably owned 4 or 5 bugs.

Fastest car I ever owned was a bug. Had a 4 barrel Holly on one but found it ran it's best with two two barrel Webers.
Drove it on the street, but took it to a Bug in at our semi local drag strip, nothing but VW's. Turned in the 12's.
Lot of jaws hit the pavement when that thing left the line, we put my engine in a pretty ratty looking bug but boy did it move.

I'd probably have one now if I could figure a way to shift the thing.

[Bawanna]

I've owned several Glocks, most went to cops who needed them more than me. I don't currently have any.

If the planets align I might one day get a 19 with the MOS set up for a dot sight. Probably even more so if they ever make that set up for a 45.

I think the 19 is about the best size of them all. Same with the 23 of course but I'm pretty much done with 40.

There will be no Gen 5 in my life, prefer a Gen 3 if I can find one when the time is right. I like the finger grooves.

[kenemoore]

Well...I hate the finger grooves.
I have a Gen3 model 19, and it's not a bad gun, I shoot it okay, but my fingers don't fit the grooves. Had been looking for a Gen2, or maybe grinding off the finger bumps. A local gun reviewer, Sootch00, says the Gen 5 trigger is about a pound heaver, 6.5 vs 5.5, but that the new trigger is much improved, not so mushy, crisper, slight stacking.

Glock reports the old barrel was good for 4" groups at 25 yds, new barrel, 4" groups at 50 yards. Maybe it's not the rifling, but the manufacturing method that gives the improvements, local Glock dealer said the new barrel is "straighter", whatever that means.

I am not a Glock fan boy, but not a hater either. I have the 19 and a 26, if I had bought the 19 first, I never would have bought the 26. I often recommend new shooters to at least consider the G19 as their first gun. Big enough for home defense, range gun. Plus small enough to carry (at least for me, about the same size as 1911 commander, just a lot thicker). Simple operation, and will tolerate low/no maintenance from part time shooters.

I think after the hoopla dies down a bit, I might see what kind of trade I can get for my Gen 3, really hate those grooves.

-Ken

[JethrosDad]

I thought about Glocks decision with the barrel also. I also wonder about the decision CZ made with the P10 to not have their inside rail design that for years has been their trademark and claim to fame. That also was to cause better accuracy for their firearms as with the polygonal barrel was for every other firearm on earth....except now for Glock.

yeah I think they should have stuck with the inside rails too. I have a CZ 75 clone (Sar arms b6p compact) that I bought for around $250. It is fantastic and a real tack driver. maybe its all in my head but i attribute it to the inside rails lol

[yqtszhj]

I have to admit, I've become a CZ/CZ clone nut. Best guns I own. Traded/sold both my glocks for CZ's and have no regrets. I have one Sig P226 and like the DA pull on the CZ triggers better. I'm up to 4 now but still need to get me a CZ97 in .45.

[berettabone]

Glocks are made for carpenters.....after all nothing more than a block. Perhaps they would also be good to pound nails in with..:target: Shot a Gluck 20 and a 17 at the last shoot I was at up nort. Reminded me once again why I don't own one..................:p

[TheLastDaze]

i see the cz ban wagon has been rolling for quite a while😁 never shot one and kinda scared to look into them further....dont wanna take a trip..... I kinda like where I am now 😁

btw i think the only change to the barrel is the flaring or bell on muzzle... Course I havent watched but one review on the gun, and as ken said Glock has listened.... its apparent a lot of the camp dont like the grooves.... I dont mind them but how would it feel without?? hmmm, could it possibly be better for me?? options

[JethrosDad]

Come on LastDaze, you know you want to!

All the cool kids are doing it. :p

[mark7mod0]

yeah I think they should have stuck with the inside rails too. I have a CZ 75 clone (Sar arms b6p compact) that I bought for around $250. It is fantastic and a real tack driver. maybe its all in my head but i attribute it to the inside rails lol

Really like my P-07, but my favorite is still the 75 compact clone.....Tri Star chrome C100.

[yqtszhj]

Really like my P-07, but my favorite is still the 75 compact clone.....Tri Star chrome C100.

I have the same c100 in black. Very sweet pistol.

[jeepster09]

CZ's are nice!

[ltxi]

I've owned several Glocks, most went to cops who needed them more than me. I don't currently have any.

If the planets align I might one day get a 19 with the MOS set up for a dot sight. Probably even more so if they ever make that set up for a 45.

I think the 19 is about the best size of them all. Same with the 23 of course but I'm pretty much done with 40.

There will be no Gen 5 in my life, prefer a Gen 3 if I can find one when the time is right. I like the finger grooves.

Nice thing about the 23, and the 27 for that matter, is it can be drop in rebarreled to 9mm whenever feel like.

[Bawanna]

Nice thing about the 23, and the 27 for that matter, is it can be drop in rebarreled to 9mm whenever feel like.

That's interesting, hadn't thought of that. I do have quite a bit of 40 ammo to use up. The 23 handles 40 pretty nice, has enough size and grip to be manageable. I'll have to consider that.
Thanks for jogging my small mind.

[SlowBurn]

Well...I hate the finger grooves.
I have a Gen3 model 19, and it's not a bad gun, I shoot it okay, but my fingers don't fit the grooves. Had been looking for a Gen2, or maybe grinding off the finger bumps. A local gun reviewer, Sootch00, says the Gen 5 trigger is about a pound heaver, 6.5 vs 5.5, but that the new trigger is much improved, not so mushy, crisper, slight stacking.

Glock reports the old barrel was good for 4" groups at 25 yds, new barrel, 4" groups at 50 yards. Maybe it's not the rifling, but the manufacturing method that gives the improvements, local Glock dealer said the new barrel is "straighter", whatever that means.

-Ken

Maybe just hype. My 25 year old Glock 17 Gen 2 has no finger grooves and polygonal barrel both of which suit me.

I doubt there's much measurable velocity difference with the l&g barrel but what difference there is, the poly will be a slightly faster. My guess is they decided l&g rifled barrels cost less to make and the difference in performance didn't justify the added expense of the poly barrels, especially since they were competing on cost for the armed forces contract.

[340pd]

I really tried to like Glocks. I bought a Gen4 19, and like most I see at our range, it shot center right by an inch or two. Don't tell me to move the sight as I hate sights on a gun pounded way off to one side or another. I added a Grip Force Adapter (http://www.gripforceproducts.com/) and a nice set of Meprolite sights. The shots centered up but the gun still was not what I wanted so I sold it to a buddy and moved on.
I will stick with Sigs when I need a hi capacity 9mm.
https://s5.postimg.org/q1g9a7cnb/Sigs_zpstqqnhgft.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/xhfiw00cj/)

[Bawanna]

I love the look of Sigs, wanted a 220 SAS so badly. Had a 9 for awhile but like the glock for you it just didn't work for me. The decocker just was wrong for me. Hands too small or something.

They actually feel good in my hand but I just don't shoot them well at all. I must have a SIG curse or something.
Had basically the same thing when the HK's came out, thought I had to have one. Minute I picked one up, I put it right back down and knew it wasn't meant for me. I think it was an early USP. Controls about like the transmission in a Peterbilt tractor truck.
Those that carry them, our armed prison guards carry them and love them like nothing else. Just not for me I guess.

[berettabone]

Probably another reason why you like 1911's. Longer narrower grip. Having average hand size and long fingers, I still thought that Glock, Sig, and HK's were a bit large for me in the grip dept. The Sig 220 SAS that I owned was a great firearm, just too stocky in the grip. Same with USP's, great firearm, would love to own one, but again, too large in the grip. Can't reach controls very easily. Then I picked up an HK P2000SK. An HK that I can actually say fits like a glove. I am one of the unfortunate in my book, as far as hand size. Makes it more difficult for me to purchase firearms that I would like to own. If I had my druthers, I would probably own nothing but Sig or HK..................and my MK:p

[yqtszhj]

I love the looks of that Sig M11-A1. Wouldn't mind having one of those. To what Berettabone was saying about the Glock grip I have to agree, it just didnt fit so good.

The best pistol grip I think I have is the HK P30SK. Its way nicer than it should be. It has all those grip panels where you make it just like you want it. It has a 2 finger grip but so help me it fills the palm of the hand so that even with the pinky extention mag installed you dont even need your pinky. Thats the only HK I have ever owned or shot so I don't know how the others are.

[berettabone]

The P30SK does have a nice grip. When you use the flat, or extended mag plate, you can still fit some pinkie. I notice with my P2SK, with the pinkie base plate, I can get my whole hand on the grip, and unlike some other models(ahem) if you inadvertently press on the bottom of the magazine, it doesn't give you any feed issues. For me, the P30 felt pretty good, the wife said that it was one of the best for her. I think maybe a HK45 compact could fit my bill for grip. Been eyeing for a while. Just so much denaro..................................

[yqtszhj]

Oooooo..... HK45..... There is one relatively near by me on armslist ive been eyeballing recently. LNIB HK45 compact and the price isnt bad compared to new but still denaro as you mentioned.

Good thing he's not in town or I'd have a bigger hole i my wallet. Got to take the wife somewhere for anniversary next week so I'll be even less likely to have the money for it.

[Scarywoody]

I had the opportunity to shoot a Gen 5 G17. The trigger is much better than previous versions. The flared mag well was okay. I got caught up on the grip plug area. You will have to do all the things to Gen 5 that you did to Gen 3 and 4. Scrap the sights, undercut the trigger guard, front slide serrations, polish the internals, plus with Gen 5 file off the sharp edges of the flared mag well and get a grip plug. The front frame doesn't match the new slide taper. The new magazines were orange. I didn't ask if they were back ward compatible. As this Generation floods the market at least the Gen 3 prices will go down.

[ltxi]

I had no idea Glock was now doing Gen 5. Hadn't even quite head bothered with the fact there was a Gen 4 yet.

I have two Glocks...a Gen 2 G23 and an earliest G27. Both are good reliable and accurate. But have no interest at all in buying new(er)/more.

I find my G23 in particular a pleasure to shoot. Only double stack I've small hands ever felt really comfortable with.

Fact be, though, Glocks are essentially appliance guns. Any quality rifling/barrel is more than perfectly adequate. Add to that...most of these guns end up in the hands of professional amateurs and polygonal rifling leads like a b****.

And another thing....what's all this New And Improved nonsense really about anyway? Reminds me of laundry soap. Beyond Gen 2 Glocks didn't really need improving, and they hit evolutionary good as it needs to be/functionally really gonna get with the Gen 3.

But then...I'm also perfectly happy with my iPhone 6.

[JohnR]

I just read that the new M&P Compact 2.0 is G19-sized (i.e. larger and higher capacity than the 1.0). I prefer the M&P over Glock, but the full size is only a smidgeon bigger than the compact. Not sure I'd want it.

[johnh]

I think it was a good move for S&W. I read an article, not sure where, kind of pointing out that the G19 is a sweet spot in terms of size. Just big enough to get your whole hand on the grip, but not so large as to be hard to carry concealed or otherwise. S&W skipped that size and went straight to subcompact on their original M&P. Then came out with a Shield that was about the same size. Like a lot of us on the forum, many shooters drop to single stacked when they want a true subcompact sized gun. The 2.0 will likely do better than the subcompact M&P. Of course there are other G19 sized guns. The MRI MR9 is about the same size, as are some other Walther derived pistols. Not sure why S&W didn't do the same originally.