New Magnum Research 429 Desert Eagle Cartridge

[gb6491]

I'm just the messenger :boink:
https://www.ballisticmag.com/2018/10/30/magnum-429-desert-eagle-cartridge/?mc_cid=a6300710d4&mc_eid=61c083856f
https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/blog/magnum-research-introduces-new-429-de-pistol-cartridge/?mc_cid=a6300710d4&mc_eid=61c083856f

[Bawanna]

Says it laughs at the 44 mag? No doubt only a matter of time before we see some revolvers for this too I reckon.

[yqtszhj]

Nice. Oooooh buddy, did you see the price on the rounds? Definitely have to reload those. Makes me feel better about the 10mm I’ve had a hankering for recently though. Always look at the good side. I can use that cost savings when explaining to the wife too.

[MrBlackCat]

I am just glad there is finally ANY pistol round between 50AE and 10mm Auto... Not that various gun manufacturers haven’t worked around this with revolver rounds, like Magnum Research, Coonan, AMT and others. I can’t wait to see IF another company chambers for this round second in an auto. With some knowledge of how the 440 CorBon round went, I am glad this is happening now under better conditions. I wonder if a BFR is likely for this round, other than as a custom build.


I will be ordering a barrel or barrels (6” & 10”) day one. Nothing on Magnum Research website yet though.


Can’t wait!


MrBlackCat

[CPTKILLER]

This is a niche cartridge just because you can.

[MrBlackCat]

This is a niche cartridge just because you can.

I suppose you are correct... even with the popularity of the 50AE, it is barely mainstream... I edited some of the "fan-boy-ness" out of my post.

I suppose it isn't the fact that 357 Mag and 44 Mag being revolver cartridges that deters gun makers from using them, because the companies that want to use rimmed cartridges, find a way that works reasonably. Even if niche cartridge, for myself, I am glad this is being done, and I will be buying the ammo for some time. And though I am not a re-loader quite yet, I keep all my big brass for when that time comes. When loading dies become available, I will get them for 429 also. Most likely, I will get a chamber reamer also if that becomes available.

So for me, this is a great opportunity to enjoy another caliber with the Desert Eagle. Look forward to performance and chrono-data soon after I get them. :)

MrBlackCat

[SkippyDP]

Yes cannot wait, please post here when the .429 barrels become available #MrBlackCat



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MrBlackCat]

I have ordered one... they have listed the 6" standard barrel in black. At least they aren't gouging us on the early run, like happens with some products.

Here is the page where I ordered...
https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/new-desert-eagle-429-de-6-barrel-black/

Now to get some ammo...



This is a niche cartridge just because you can.
This is very true when you think about it... and this is why it is a perfect match for a niche pistol which also was made just because they could. :)


MrBlackCat

Edit: Ammo is now listed on Magnum Research site...
https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/429-de-210-grain-jhp/
https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/429-de-240-grain-jsp/

[SkippyDP]

Fantastic Blackcat, now to work out how to get one imported. Good to see the reasonable price offering.
Thanks



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MrBlackCat]

FInally got this in hand...
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magnum%20Barrel_zpsbgk0guld.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magnum%20Barrel_zpsbgk0guld.jpg.html)

This isn’t a real/full review of the new .429DE Magnum caliber, so I won't make another thread. I will just put it here.
This is just some day one observations and experiences. No penetration tests. No accuracy over distance tests etc. This is just about function and a small chronograph sample.
The 429 compared... left to right, 9mm, 357Mag, 41Mag, 44Mag, 429DE Mag, and 50AE.
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Compare_zpsvfwviemy.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Compare_zpsvfwviemy.jpg.html)

I got just a barrel in this case... not buying another gun, currently only offered in stainless with an internal muzzle brake, which effectively shortens the barrel. A shorter barrel is not what I want in a magnum handgun round. I want to give every opportunity for as much powder burn as possible. On a side note, there isn’t a 10” barrel planned in the 429DE, as all 10” barrels have been discontinued at this time. Sad. I will re-chamber a 10” 44mag barrel for the 429 as soon as chamber reamers become available though.

If you are only interested in ballistic test stats, they are at the bottom. Just skip the next two sections down to “Ballistics”.

Note that all below is based on an “out of the box” barrel. I will polish the ramp and chamber as I do on some of my barrels. Oddly, this is a two part barrel, which to my knowledge is only made this way in Israel. I’ve not seen a two part US made barrel before so I doubt this is made in the US. It also shares a gas cylinder perfectly in spec with my other Israeli made barrels, unlike any of my US made barrels.

Sharing magazines…
First... the 429DE round is stated to be magazine compatible with the 50AE. There aren’t any custom magazines planned I am told, but I might modify some 50AE magazines and designate them as 429DE. Here is why. This is a necked down cartridge from a 50AE case to hold a 429 bullet. (.429 is a 44mag actual diameter, for those who don’t know) There is a slight tendency, when the magazine is full, to nose down just a tiny bit, keeping it from heading up the feed ramp. This only happened once, on a full magazine. No other feeding issues were experienced.
Second… it is substantially more difficult to load the rounds into the magazine than 50AE. I use a loader with 50AE only when loading up 10+ magazines. But I broke out the loader after the first magazine in this case. Big deal? Not at all, just wanted to mention it, as it is different than anything I have experienced with a Desert Eagle.
Here is a shot of 429DE compared to 50AE in magazines...
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magazine%20Compare%2050AE_zpswpwoysso.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magazine%20Compare%2050AE_zpswpwoysso.jpg. html)

Firing...
Try to avoid this scenario... if your gun is dirty from shooting a lot of cheap 50AE, target ammo... and you get exited because your new 429 barrel comes in... and you don’t even wipe the slide and springs, just so you can get some rounds across the chronograph... most of the cases MAY eject almost straight back over your head… or some of the time they will hit your glasses or head. Also, you might get some failures to return to battery... but just wiping off the slide and recoil springs and rods with two tiny sheets of Hoppes Lubricating Gun Oil Field Wipes, solves both of these issues, at least in my case. With that said, the 429 did not throw the best pattern of brass for sure. The 50AE, I can put a box to catch nearly all the brass when shooting from a rest. The 429 simply didn’t pile the brass as consistently... I expect this will change when I polish the chamber and inside of the locking lugs on this new barrel. It might be a break in issue, but I don’t wait for that with a Desert Eagle barrel. I don’t consider ejected brass pattern a problem, just something comparative that I noticed, and thought I would mention. Functionality was fine after I took 45 seconds to wipe the powder residue from the slide, frame, and recoil springs.
The 429DE is a rather “snappy” round for the Desert Eagle... I swear it has more “climb” than other calibers, but not sure how to quantify that. It felt like a 44 mag 10” barrel basically. It falls right in line between 44 and 50, as expected.

Ballistics...
I got some of the two loadings offered by Magnum Research under the name Glacier Ridge Ammunition – Magnum Research. One is a 210gr JHP, the other is a 240gr JSP.

Using a Caldwell chronograph... 14 rounds each.
The 240gr showed 1569fps average. (which puts it at 1312ft-lbs) deviation was 10.6
The 210gr showed 1697fps average. (which puts it at 1343ft-lbs) deviation was 10.4

For comparison...
Samson 50AE 300gr JHP showed 1429fps avg. (~1360ft-lbs) deviation was 22.3
American Quality 50AE 300gr JHP showed 1269fps avg. (~1072ft-lbs) deviation was 51fps
PPU 44Mag 240gr JHP showed 1362fps avg. (~ 988ft-lbs) deviation 22.1
Precision One 44Mag 240gr RNFP showed 1173fps avg. (~733ft-lbs) deviation 65.5

Just as the math would have shown, it has the energy of a 50AE in the diameter of 44 mag. The penetration must be crazy. I don’t do anything fancy like gel testing, but I do test with wood, paper, and other materials for comparison sometimes. This will be an interesting round to explore.
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magnum%20Ammo_zpsoxggksgr.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magnum%20Ammo_zpsoxggksgr.jpg.html)

That is all I got for now. :)

Happy Shootin’

MrBlackCat

[SkippyDP]

MrBlackCat

Thanks for your time and for putting the results of your.429 testing and evaluation up so quickly.

I have contacted my DE importer to get an eta on the new .429DE 6” barrel.

Unhappy to hear that the 10” barrels are being discontinued. Are the 44mag 10” barrels still available?

What kind of 50AE mags do you have to be a 10+ capacity?
Maybe it’s just a simple magazine base extension?
What mag loader do you use?

I see you have the same problems with rounds hitting your forehead/glasses and was surprised to hear a simple wipe of the springs and rails eliminated the problem.

Have a great weekend!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MrBlackCat]

MrBlackCat

Thanks for your time and for putting the results of your.429 testing and evaluation up so quickly.
You are welcome.



Unhappy to hear that the 10” barrels are being discontinued. Are the 44mag 10” barrels still available?
No... 10" barrels in all calibers are discontinued. If any are listed (I think they have already been pulled) they are a VERY small existing stock. Most internet sellers drop shipped Magnum Research barrels in my experience, so even if listed elsewhere it is unlikely they actually have them. I was told that no 10" barrels are being produced. I was told they had a few 10" left, but only with special finishes (chrome and nickle maybe) left a few days ago.



What kind of 50AE mags do you have to be a 10+ capacity?
Maybe it’s just a simple magazine base extension?
What mag loader do you use?Sorry if I wasn't clear. I meant loading ten or more magazines at a time, not like ten round magazines. I only have 7 round factory magazines, and loading ten of them in a row makes me appreciate a simple load assistant. I have come across a couple of those 10 round for 44 and 50, but they didn't function really at all... I could never get through a full magazine without a failure of some kind with them.
I don't know what brand this magazine loader is... I will see if it has a name on it, but I think it is 3D printed. It is just one of those simple push-down types. I got it with some things I bought a while back, used, so I don't remember a brand.
The loader I use... is hard to read, it was sold to me with in a lot I bought with other things, but this must be where it came from...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/RAE-Industries-IMI-Desert-Eagle-Mark-XIX-Speedloader-Magnum-Research-Desert/283193422846?hash=item41efa4b3fe:g:Yy8AAOSwKQFbtWn K
Here is mine...
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/DE%20Loader%2002_zpsyxzrjkdj.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/DE%20Loader%2002_zpsyxzrjkdj.jpg.html)https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/DE%20Loader%2001_zps2ihbgvnq.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/DE%20Loader%2001_zps2ihbgvnq.jpg.html)




I see you have the same problems with rounds hitting your forehead/glasses and was surprised to hear a simple wipe of the springs and rails eliminated the problem.



(Not specifically about the 429, but a general post I often repeat)
There are several things that can cause flat ejections (over the slide). Yes, sometimes it is because the gun is allowed to rotate too much effectively making the top of the gun face your face, so the guns up is not straight back... mostly that gets repeated on the internet by keyboard warriors though, just like limp-wristing causing "most issues", also mostly BS for another thread, but back to topic... the flat ejections I received, and the failures to return to battery were caused by the slide not being able to move freely. Drag on the slide causes more delay, and then too much of the gas impulse is absorbed getting the slide started. Then, in the later part of the slide acceleration, the slide movement in this case is kind of half hearted, even if it makes it far enough back to get another round from the magazine. Ideally, you want it to JUST barely bottom out, for a full run forward for the momentum to get that bolt rotated in hard. So called "limp wristing" is simply a multiplier for an issues like excess friction (from powder residue) and a couple more issues I was able to eliminate from my Desert Eagles.

One characteristic of this slightly necked cartridge is that it can wobble a bit more going up the ramp and may end up popping into the chamber ahead of the extractor claw, if the slide isn't very smooth. Then, the energy it takes to defeat the extractor claw spring, to pop it over the rim of the case is quite high. This is the most common issue I have found (in all calibers) that causes failure to return to battery. To test this, just ease your slide down on top of a chambered round and you can see this in action.
Further, imagine that the bolt lugs are trying to rotate into place behind the receiver lugs and the front of the extractor claw is hitting the shell. Not only does the claw need to rotate against the brass, it need to be forced outward over the rim of the cartridge during this rotation. Polishing the claw and a very tiny modification I do to mine eliminate this to the point of a really dirty slide and springs. All that grit of powder debris can really slow down a slide... and more lubricant just makes it gummier. I run all of mine with very little lubricants.

With all of this said, my 429 case ejections were not consistent as with all other calibers, but I also polish and de-burr most barrels. I will do a close inspection of the 429DE barrel today and see if I can improve this a bit. In my experience, ejection consistency should be correctable. This 429DE ammo must be hand loaded as it is the most consistent I have ever put across my chronograph... probably the most expensive also. :) The point being that if any ammo is able to pile its brass well, it should be this.

I will try to add pictures later. :)

MrBlackCat

[SkippyDP]

Thanks for your time and detailed answers to my questions. I appreciate the detailed replies especially as it really helps when trying to identify any problems.

The mag loader you pictured is definitely 3D printed. If it works, then all is good, I need a similar item as I know what you mean about loading a few mags at once. The other eBay one might be worth a try....

I will try honing the chamber and ramp, make your claw mod and see if the .357 runs better. The feed ramp is rough and FTF is not uncommon. The .44 is polished and runs fine with good hand loads.

Do you video in slow motion from the side and see how the slide reciprocates?

If the 10” & 14” barrel options are discontinued now, they will become default collector items. [emoji848]







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GarrettJ]

I think MRI is missing the boat on this one. Published velocities are around 1600 fps, which MrBlackCat was kind enough to validate. One goes to this type of cartridge to gain velocity. The .440 Corbon gave a published velocity on a 240 gr. bullet of closer to 1800 fps. That would be a good enough reason to go to the bother and expense of getting a different barrel/cartridge/etc.

The only problem here is that we can already get pretty darned close to 1600 fps. with a 240 gr. bullet in a Desert Eagle with a .44 Magnum. Offering the .429 in a ported barrel helps with recoil management, but also gives you effectively only a 5" barrel to work with.

In the past I have chronographed Federal 240 gr. JHP out of a 10" DE at 1550 fps. And I expect I can do as well with a standard 6" barrel (actually, mine is a 7.5" barrel. I had the 10" tube cut back and threaded for a silencer several years ago). I was trying to prove this today, using a book load of H110 with a 240 gr. XTP. Unfortunately, it was extremely overcast and a bit drizzly. I got out and tried shooting, but it was not light enough for my chronograph to get good readings. In 7 or 8 rounds, I only got one reading in the DE, which was 1465 fps. I also brought along a 10" T/C Contender, which I was able to get a single reading of 1621 fps.

I also have some other loads using Li'l Gun powder, which I'll try the next chance I get. I expect to get slightly higher velocities from that one.

So the question is whether the minimal gains provided by the .429DE are worth it as compared to the .44 Mag. Seems like going back to a 10" barrel would give the same results, with less effort.

Or maybe once this thing takes off, we will get some of the bullet & powder manufacturers running pressure test barrels and come up with some safe loads that produce velocities in the 1700-1800 fps. range.

I'm hopeful, anyway.

Of coures, just getting something because it's new or different is sometimes all the excuse we need.
:cool:

[MrBlackCat]

I think MRI is missing the boat on this one. Published velocities are around 1600 fps, which MrBlackCat was kind enough to validate. One goes to this type of cartridge to gain velocity. The .440 Corbon gave a published velocity on a 240 gr. bullet of closer to 1800 fps. That would be a good enough reason to go to the bother and expense of getting a different barrel/cartridge/etc.
I agree with this... this wasn't my reason for getting the new caliber however.
Just the numbers... you ever shoot Buffalo Bore ammo in any caliber? They generally lean toward heavy bullets for energy of course. While I have never tried their 44 Magnum, I have shot their 357 Magnum, and WOW does it do exactly what they say it will. It was obviously far and above anything else I have put through my Desert Eagle in 357 Magnum.
The point? Buffalo Bore has a jacketed 44 Mag round with a 270gr bullet making 1460fps/1,260 ft-lbs. So to me, we are not at the potential of this round with this case. Of course this is the first and only loadings right now... I don't see Buffalo Bore picking up an obscure ammo like this any time soon.


The only problem here is that we can already get pretty darned close to 1600 fps. with a 240 gr. bullet in a Desert Eagle with a .44 Magnum. Offering the .429 in a ported barrel helps with recoil management, but also gives you effectively only a 5" barrel to work with.
This is where it kind of breaks down for me... I don't reload of course, but help me understand this. How does a 50AE get a 300gr bullet out of the same length barrel at 1430? I don't have the chronograph records in my phone, but I am positive I have put some 50AE 300's out a good bit over 1500 from a 6" barrel. (Underwood maybe?) I DO have this one I just shot from a 10" DE... Samson 300gr JHP at 1641fps/1794.13ft-lbs.
The point? Shouldn't that super-light 240gr (comparatively!) easily make WAY over the 300gr 50AE's 1500+fps?


So the question is whether the minimal gains provided by the .429DE are worth it as compared to the .44 Mag. Seems like going back to a 10" barrel would give the same results, with less effort.
This is what I thought as well, when thinking in the context of extremely expensive rounds... if you are going to spend that much on ammunition (as a non-reloader) then just use something like Buffalo Bore and a 10" barrel.


Or maybe once this thing takes off, we will get some of the bullet & powder manufacturers running pressure test barrels and come up with some safe loads that produce velocities in the 1700-1800 fps. range.

I'm hopeful, anyway.On a virtual "wildcat" round like this, would this be expected? I don't know much about how that works. How much of this can be safely done with math vs real world? I have read some on the subject of load development, but that is the "How it should be world" vs the "How it is world".

I will remain hopeful someone comes up with some "serious" rounds for this caliber. While it isn't a slouch, a new caliber for a Desert Eagle is going to need to be more than "just because" as you stated above.

I am for developing a new line of Desert Eagles with new magnum rounds all spec'd to 60,000+ PSI... higher pressures is what makes the 454, 460 and 500 so powerful. :)
/BS On
Can you imagine the advertisement for that? "Got a Zombie Apocalypse, a Terminator from the future, or a Dinosaur from the past bearing down on you? Need a little more than your old Desert Eagle? WELL WE HAVE THE GUN FOR YOU! The all new Desert Eagle Ultra-Magnum Line! Forget the 50 Cal! Ultra-Magnums feature all new Ultra-Magnum (trademark) calibers that make the 50AE feel like a "9"! Pick up yours, with both hands, TODAY!"
/BS Off

Anyway, lets wait and see what comes out for this thing in the coming months. I will have a chamber reamer made for the .429 if I can't get one from Magnum Research in the next few months. Then I will see what we can get from a 10" barrel.

Thank you GarrettJ for your cents as a loader and a Desert Eagle guy... I always look forward to your posts.

Happy Shootin'
MrBlackCat

[CPTKILLER]

Please don't get me wrong. I like some non standard calibers. My grail caliber has been a 38 Super. Ammo is always a little hard to find but is available.

[MrBlackCat]

Please don't get me wrong. I like some non standard calibers. My grail caliber has been a 38 Super. Ammo is always a little hard to find but is available.

I have read a little about that chambering before... several changes and variants of the rim and headspace issues over the years. I am guessing all of that is more stable in modern times and the firearms that shoot it.

Kimber makes some precision stuff for sure... if anyone was going to make a non-standard caliber work reliably, it would be them.

MrBlackCat

[MrBlackCat]

Update:
Over the holidays I found a great price on 429DE Magnum ammo, and bought enough to matter finally.


One CON I forgot to mention before is the front sight is "wrong". Not sure what the deal is, but it shoots crazy low... like "I just shot my chronograph" low. The front blade sight that came on my 429DE barrel is 0.325" (8.26mm) high. The height of my other front sights across 13 barrels is around ranges from 0.240" (6.09mm) to 0.272" (6.91mm) depending on design. So at about 25 ft it shoots 3~4 inches low or so. Very uncharacteristic for a Desert Eagle. I did a few shots by "point shooting" and got the same result. To verify this, I pointed the gun several times, then looked down the sights and the front blade was about .100" higher than the rear site every time. Not sure what is going on with that.https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue_zpsaj9zrnmb.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue_zpsaj9zrnmb.jpg.htm l)

One PRO... this bore has about the highest polish I have seen in a Desert Eagle Barrel. I have polished my barrels bores before, and get this result over time, but this barrel was like this new.

One issue I noted my first time shooting the 429DE, was irregular ejections. Mostly low, and it will throw them left or right, sometimes center. Not very good or consistent, but working. So I did a standard polish of the chamber and ramp between then and now to see if that changed anything. No improvement of consistency, but ejection strength/distance did increase. I did polish the chamber a bit for easier extraction, which seems to have worked.


So I ran another set through the chronograph I shot a while back, then through the new chronograph and got almost identical results... (guess the old one will be ok after all!)
DE429 6"
210gr JHP 1697.69mv
240gr JSP 1568.45mv
Pretty fun to shoot and less punishing than 50EA.


Then I just shot some things with it... like lumber, firewood, targets, and some water jugs. Shooting gallon water jugs with the 429DE in 210's is closer to shooting them with 454 Casull than with 50AE. Just noting that, but not a huge difference in any of these magnum calibers vs water jugs.


I will swap the front sight out for a more standard height one, but the height that came with this 429DE barrel is really crazy tall. Still puzzled about that one. When the second 429DE Barrel gets here in a few days, I will come back here and post if the sight is the same height or not.


I will leave you with a picture... this is a bag of happiness for those who enjoy the conversion of gunpowder and lead into smiles. :)


Happy Shootin'!


MrBlackCat
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magnum%20-%20Bag%20of%20Smiles_zpsc5lo8oex.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Magnum%20-%20Bag%20of%20Smiles_zpsc5lo8oex.jpg.html)

[gb6491]

Nice photos MrBlackCat!

On the front sight thing, it kind of reminds me of my Ruger Vaqueros in .45Colt. They had tall front sights, but that allowed me to file them down for a load I liked at a particular distance. I've often wondered if Ruger does that on purpose:confused:
http://i50.tinypic.com/xaweoy.jpg
Regards,
Greg

[MrBlackCat]

Ok... so I got a second 429DE Magnum barrel, and it has the same tall sight on it... and also shoots very low.
Hmm... wonder what happened with that?

Does anyone else have a 429DE with the same sights and P.O.I. results that I am getting?

Here is an image of the 429's next to two 50AE barrels with equal height sights. As I stated before, all of my 6" barrels sights vary by about 30 thousandths of an inch... and these are 50 to 80 thousandths of an inch taller than all other sights.
I can't help but wonder if these sights were intended for adjustable rear sights.


https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue%20x2_zps8vpe5pee.jp g (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue%20x2_zps8vpe5pee.jp g.html)

EDIT: Look at the barrels listed here on the Magnum Research site...
https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Barrels%20ALL_zpswi3lfuja.jpg (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Barrels%20ALL_zpswi3lfuja.jpg.html)
(source: https://www.magnumresearch.com/429-desert-eagle/# )
All of the sights are the "normal" type (height) except the one with the internal muzzle brake. The ones on my two 429DE barrels look like the internal muzzle brake versions in height/profile. If you look at the linked source page, at the top photo, the stainless gun with muzzle brake barrel and the two part black barrel next to the gun have the tall sights like mine.

MrBlackCat

[TonyRumore]

I bought a complete 429DE gun. It has the same tall front sight as yours. I haven't fired it yet, but I put a laser in the bore it looks like it's going to hit 12-14" low at 50 feet.
It doesn't surprise me a bit. My first DE was a 44 Magnum I bought when they first came out around 1987. That POS had all sorts of problems and hit about 12" high at 50 feet. Even at 100 yards, it was WAY over the target.
I ended up machining the rear sight down to the point the notch was nearly gone and then had to recut the notch nearly down into the base. I also bought a complete 440 Corbon gun when those came out in 1997 or so. It didn't have any sight problems but ejection was rather wild to say the least.

Back in 1999-2001 we made about a dozen AR-15 uppers in 440 Corbon and I still have the chamber reamer and head space gauges. Just for the hell of it, I dropped the 440 Go-Gauge into the 429DE barrel and the bolt won't close on it, nor will it chamber 440 Corbon ammo. It appears though, that a 429DE round would chamber in a 440 Corbon barrel, but of course you would most likely have excessive head space.

Notice the big gouge under the "Made in USA." It's like that on both sides of the frame. I'm not sure what's going on there. Edited to add - I guess they are all like that.

Tony Rumore
Tromix

https://i.imgur.com/460pjnh.jpg

[MrBlackCat]

I bought a complete 429DE gun. It has the same tall front sight as yours. I haven't fired it yet, but I put a laser in the bore it looks like it's going to hit 12-14" low at 50 feet.
It doesn't surprise me a bit. My first DE was a 44 Magnum I bought when they first came out around 1987. That POS had all sorts of problems and hit about 12" high at 50 feet. Even at 100 yards, it was WAY over the target.
I ended up machining the rear sight down to the point the notch was nearly gone and then had to recut the notch nearly down into the base. I also bought a complete 440 Corbon gun when those came out in 1997 or so. It didn't have any sight problems but ejection was rather wild to say the least.

Back in 1999-2001 we made about a dozen AR-15 uppers in 440 Corbon and I still have the chamber reamer and head space gauges. I dropped the 440 Go-Gauge into the 429DE barrel and the bolt won't close on it, nor will it chamber 440 Corbon ammo. I appears though, that a 429DE round would chamber in a 440 Corbon barrel, but of course you would most likely have excessive head space.

Tony Rumore
Tromix
[image removed - MBC]

Interesting... thank you for sharing your sight height.
Persons as yourself reporting these odd hit barrels has me curious now. I realize you have not tested this in practice, but a bore gauge is a close indicator of Point of Impact. My bore gauge isn't terribly accurate (if I spin it around) but still shows almost exactly what I experienced in firing at the same distances. If it ever stops raining here I am going to bench all of my barrels and see what I really get at 100 yards.
I have yet to even swap my 429 front sights... they seem to need the "standard" front sights to shoot at the correct elevation. Your stainless barrel seems to be one piece and mine are two part... which I have always considered to be US made and Israeli made, respectively, although nothing is certain. So this is really interesting they both shoot "the same", possibly being made in separate facilities. Strange to me, but I am not a barrel maker and don't know what exactly causes this. Simple physics says that they are simply bored inaccurately. I am a machinist, but not a gunsmith.

Very interesting you mention the wild ejections... that is what I get with both barrels on any frame with any slide with any bolt. Maybe its a "feature" of the case shape, as the ammo seems really consistent. I have been wanting to buy a high speed camera of my own to look at these things with. I notice no difference between the two different 429DE loadings ejections either... even more reason to suspect the case shape. I definitely notice change in ejection with various loadings in other calibers in a Desert Eagle, but throwing brass to the left I have not experienced before the 429DE.

Maybe we can get some 429 reamers and loading dies before too long. :)

Thank you for your post...

MrBlackCat

[TonyRumore]

My 440 Corbon gun would throw the brass to the left as well....even with a death grip on it. I think the slide velocity might be kinda slow in the DE, which may be causing the ejector tension to partially unload when the case shoulder clears the chamber mouth, but the neck is still supported by the back end of the barrel. The case may start to eject, rotating outward and off the bolt face, but then stops as the neck is dragged across the last part of the barrel entrance. Then when the neck finally clears the back of the barrel, the ejector either doesn't have enough umph to throw it clear, or it simply looses tension and falls off the extractor causing the case to drop free, uncontrolled, and then is hit in mid air by the recoiling gun.

Edited to add: I pulled out an old Tromix 440 CorBon AR-15 and found that 429 DE cartridges will chamber just fine....however there may be excessive head space. I need to make a 440 gauge to confirm exactly how far out the head space is between the two.
A 440 Corbon cartridge will not chamber in my 429 DE pistol.

Tony

[TonyRumore]

I made a 440 Corbon case gauge and set it up with the Go-Gauge flush with the top of the 440CB cartridge gauge. I then dropped in a factory HSM 429DE round and measured it with a depth micrometer. The 429DE round dropped .013" below the top of the 440CB gauge. So, if your 440CB barrel was cut to the very tightest (shortest) possible in-spec chamber, you would have .013" head space when firing an HSM 429DE round in your 440CB gun (at least with this lot of ammo). However, there are probably no 440CB chambers cut that tight and most are probably about .003" off the Go-Gauge, so the most likely amount of head space would be more like .016". That's quite a bit.

[GarrettJ]

I just emailed RCBS, Hornady, and Lee as well as MRI, asking if any of them had plans to produce reloading dies for the .429DE. I'll report back if I hear anything.

[GarrettJ]

Response from Lee:
Yes, we do have a die set coming out soon: https://leeprecision.com/3-die-set-429- ... eagle.html (https://leeprecision.com/3-die-set-429-desert-eagle.html)

Response from Hornady:
Thank you for the email. At this time we are not. I will pass on a suggestion and see what we can do.

Response from MRI:
We expect to have the dies here and ready for sale in aprox. 6-8 weeks.

The next step will be to get some of the bullet, powder, or loading equipment manufacturers (or even MRI - hint, hint) to start working up data. Something developed with actual pressure equipment is going to be better than us home reloaders just watching for primer flattening. Having viable support for reloaders is paramount to making this semi-wildcat round a success.

But I expect we should be able to safely get above the velocities listed for the current .429 factory ammo. I can get over 1500 fps with a 240 gr .44 Mag now, using published book loads.

[TonyRumore]

FWIW, back in 1999 Corbon was using 30.6gr of H110 behind a 240gr XTP in the 440 Corbon Mag, and 25.0gr behind the 300gr Solid.

Tony

[ottoman]

My Lee die set showed up Saturday

[Sova]

I like the idea. I've fired the .440 cor bon desert eagle and seen that it was a great idea poorly executed. I personally have been wanting to do a similar cartridge for years but lacked the resources to do so (which should change next year. But mine is a .308 shortened and bottlenecked down to a 9mm or .357. The idea is a handgun that competes in accuracy and power with rifles st up to 300 yards so you are not naked when reduced to sidearm. I plan to start making a few different handguns next winter and may start in it too. Meanwhile, i am very much open to getting a Desert Eagle barrel in this caliber.

[foxcurry]

Do we have any loading data for the 429 DE yet?

[The Glockodile]

https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue%20x2_zps8vpe5pee.jp g (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue%20x2_zps8vpe5pee.jp g.html)

I noticed that the sights on your regular barrels are serrated.

None of mine come like that from the factory...

Are they aftermarket options?

[MrBlackCat]

I noticed that the sights on your regular barrels are serrated.

None of mine come like that from the factory...

Are they aftermarket options?
They are all original as far as I know... and I don't know why they change. It is more common on the older barrels I have, both US and Israeli made. Probably just a cost cutting measure for modern times, but that is only speculation.

MrBlackCat

[The Glockodile]

https://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz121/TheMrBlackCat/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue%20x2_zps8vpe5pee.jp g (https://s820.photobucket.com/user/TheMrBlackCat/media/Tool%20Forums/429DE%20Magnum/429DE%20Sight%20Height%20Issue%20x2_zps8vpe5pee.jp g.html)

For some reason, I can't add attachments - but the non - serrated front sight on this relatively new .50AE 6" barrel I got does sit considerably higher than the one on my older DE50MC. At least a full millimeter higher, eyeballing it.

[The Glockodile]

How many posts before I can add Attachments, by the way?

[Bawanna]

30. You can add them now if you use like postimage or one of the other providers.

[The Glockodile]

30. You can add them now if you use like postimage or one of the other providers.

Ugh.

I'm only half way...

[The Glockodile]

One thing - MRI just informed me that the lower, flush (for lack of a better term) sights aren't part of their inventory any more.

[MrBlackCat]

One thing - MRI just informed me that the lower, flush (for lack of a better term) sights aren't part of their inventory any more.
Lower sights? Which ones are we talking about exactly?

MrBlackCat

[The Glockodile]

Lower sights? Which ones are we talking about exactly?

MrBlackCat

I'll post a picture once I can...