Galloway Precision' Gallowglass Flat Faced Short Stroke Trigger for Kahr 9, 40 and 45

[gb6491]

Gallowglass Flat Faced Short Stroke Trigger for Kahr 9, 40 and 45 Pistols (https://gallowayprecision.com/gallowglass-flat-faced-short-stroke-trigger-for-kahr-9-40-and-45-pistols)

I have received Galloway Precision's flat face trigger for Kahr 9, 40 and 45 pistols that I ordered earlier this week.
They also call it a short stroke trigger, but that is a result of the over travel stop screw. Set correctly, that screw stops the trigger stroke right after the striker releases (the stock trigger has a bit of travel after the striker releases).

Upon initial inspection, I found a cosmetic flaw on the side of the trigger and machining marks on the front and rear surfaces. The machining marks were not too objectionable, but I didn't like the flaw on the side of the trigger. I briefly thought of returning the trigger and looked at Galloway's return policy. They state "*100% money back (less shipping) on all our products is offered by us against failure of our components or just displeasure our products did not meet your expectations or end needs within the first 30 days. Buy and don't like it we will refund your purchase price minus shipping upon return, within 30 days of purchase of the complete unmodified parts in question, with the exception of Closeout products which All Sales are Final." Not bad, but I didn't feel like shelling out for shipping and making a trip to the post office, so I fixed what I didn't like. Please note that I made no effort to contact Galloway in regards to this.
https://i.postimg.cc/zfgftQPM/t1blem.jpg (https://postimg.cc/wt9H3wzc)
https://i.postimg.cc/0jQR3MyQ/t2.jpg (https://postimg.cc/xJW4NdHD)
Filed, sanded, blasted, and beaded
https://i.postimg.cc/NFrb5BND/t3.jpg (https://postimg.cc/64tCPJx4)
Here are some comparison photos:
https://i.postimg.cc/1X3hTWKw/t4.jpg (https://postimg.cc/BLkVPBkn)
https://i.postimg.cc/g2TJKhmg/tcfront.jpg (https://postimg.cc/yD0s1kJR)
https://i.postimg.cc/C1ff8N8C/tcside.jpg (https://postimg.cc/34YR52nW)
To be continued...

[gb6491]

Galloway's installation video is quite good: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvmBBQCd8b0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvmBBQCd8b0)

I used a chopstick to lever the spring and spacer into place vice using a screwdriver as shown in the video. Position the leg of the spring that goes against the frame up high on the frame then push/lever the coil part down into place.

OEM trigger:
https://i.postimg.cc/yN3Fhs4S/p45ot800.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Gallowglass trigger:
https://i.postimg.cc/xC4DwvpZ/p45nt800.jpg (https://postimages.org/)


Thoughts:
I like the trigger. My finger doesn't feel cramped on it as it does with the OEM trigger. I think my finger naturally falls into a better position on the flat trigger.
https://i.postimg.cc/g2gxx5xL/p45ftf800.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Although finger placement is different, you still have Kahr's smooth long stroke trigger; pretty much unchanged if you decided to forego the overtravel screw (just back it out). I like the overtarvel stop myself, especially on my 45. However, it's not the best looking (IMO) and I don't know if I would use it on my PM9. I'd like to an option to buy one that doesn't have the hole with a slimmer profile....yep, just a plain flat face trigger, no short stroke talk needed
https://i.postimg.cc/ydR1VrqR/cwp45800.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/cJXYRC6h/cwp45edit800.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Regards,
Greg


https://i.postimg.cc/yYpdBGWf/Untitled-1-copy.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Bobshouse]

Great job of cleaning up that trigger! I'm not really sure about that set screw. Looks like after some use it would dig a pit into the polymer.

[gb6491]

Great job of cleaning up that trigger! I'm not really sure about that set screw. Looks like after some use it would dig a pit into the polymer.
Thanks:)
I've since rounded and polished the end of that set screw. There's no mark on the frame (I've done quite bit of dry firing), but I'll check after I fire it. The trigger on my CZ Phantom has both over travel and pre-travel screws, there is practically no wear where they contact the polymer ( it's been shot quite a bit).

Still, I'm on the fence about just screwing it in. The screw does not look as bad in hand as it does in photos, but my 45 releases the striker close to the end of the trigger's travel, so the over travel is pretty minimal even without the screw.

Regards,
Greg

[guido4198]

I put mine in yesterday. I REALLY dislike the amount of set screw that protrudes from the rear of the trigger. Might be a necessary evil..I don't know. On the plus side, I prefer the "feel" of the flat trigger right off the bat, in dry-firing. I'll get it to the range later this week and be back with a more complete report. At this point, there's very little reduction in the long trigger pull. Galloway only claims 10% reduction with the installation of the flat trigger and that's not much. They are claiming the significant reduction that some of us want (and some do not) will come with the installation of their new sear offering, after the first of the year.

[gb6491]

I put mine in yesterday. I REALLY dislike the amount of set screw that protrudes from the rear of the trigger. Might be a necessary evil..I don't know. On the plus side, I prefer the "feel" of the flat trigger right off the bat, in dry-firing. I'll get it to the range later this week and be back with a more complete report. At this point, there's very little reduction in the long trigger pull. Galloway only claims 10% reduction with the installation of the flat trigger and that's not much. They are claiming the significant reduction that some of us want (and some do not) will come with the installation of their new sear offering, after the first of the year.
I've decided to forgo the over travel stop. It's just too unsightly and the cool factor out weighs the little reduction in over travel it provides in my gun. It's my understanding that there will be significantly more over travel with their upcoming sear, so the screw will probably be a necessary evil. I'm happy with the flat trigger and probably will pass on the sear. Still, I have the screw in the trigger if I should change my mind. The little rounding/polishing of the set screw makes it just about flush on both sides of the trigger when screwed in/out enough,
https://i.postimg.cc/SNkkXstn/ft2-865.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/7P7SHBpx/ft3-865.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Just been thinking that my 45 has come a long way since it's birth as a CW45 over 9 years ago:)
https://i.postimg.cc/TYnj0RGM/ftcw45p-865-copya.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/ZRyjh6k0/ftcwp45-865-copy.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Regards,
Greg

[yqtszhj]

Just been thinking that my 45 has come a long way since it's birth as a CW45 over 9 years ago:)


If that is your replacement frame for the short frame rail issue, then between the new frame, P45 slide, and trigger, you’ve got yourself a whole new gun I’d say. That P45 slide sure is more appealing to the eye than a CW45 slide.

[gb6491]

If that is your replacement frame for the short frame rail issue, then between the new frame, P45 slide, and trigger, you’ve got yourself a whole new gun I’d say. That P45 slide sure is more appealing to the eye than a CW45 slide.
You know, that is the replacement frame.:smash: I kind of forgot about that.
I wasn't a big fan of the P45 slide when I bought my CW45, but I warmed up to the look over the years. The one on it now was part of a deal too good to pass up, plus I now have a nice stash of CW45 parts. I also like being able to use the sights Alphonse sells at Lakeline:
https://i.postimg.cc/bNTCSGXF/p45-8.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/J0qhW3yL/p45-9.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Regards,
Greg

[Bawanna]

I really like those rounded U notch rear sights and that front sight has a very XS look to it which I'm very partial to.

I might have to look him up for sights on my K9 and my PM 45 sights are getting weak but the beauty of the XS style is they work just fine with or without the night sight working.

Bout time I visited Al's sight again, haven't checked it out in quite a spell.

[gb6491]

I'm liking the flat trigger, but decided to reshape it a bit. I took some material off the backside while adjusting the profile ever so slightly. It doesn't look too much different in the photos below (actually kind of hard to see), but I'm really pleased with how it looks in person.
I was going to point out the before and after, but it's a pretty subtle change...so let me know if you can tell which is the modified trigger. Thanks!
https://i.postimg.cc/xdcjBNTQ/Untitled-1-copy1000.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Regards,
Greg

[yqtszhj]

I’m guessing the one on the right has the little hook on the bottom of the trigger made a little less pointy in the forward direction. Did I guess right?

[Bawanna]

I'm going with the one on the right also, one on the left has a little more material left in the lower area. Is the little rounding off on the right side part of the mod or a defect that's actually in a good place. Lower end of the trigger on the right side, just a little corner rounded off?

[gb6491]

I’m guessing the one on the right has the little hook on the bottom of the trigger made a little less pointy in the forward direction. Did I guess right?


I'm going with the one on the right also, one on the left has a little more material left in the lower area. Is the little rounding off on the right side part of the mod or a defect that's actually in a good place. Lower end of the trigger on the right side, just a little corner rounded off?
Darn, you both have good eyes!
I did knock the corners down on the forward bottom part of the trigger.
I also tapered the back side a bit which made it more rounded and thinner on the bottom.
https://i.postimg.cc/65cCRhtz/yri.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Regards,
Greg

[Bawanna]

Well I don't know about yqtszhj, but being deaf as a cedar stump I need to count on the eyes and they are getting questionable.
As usual I like what you did to it. I'm a bit skeered to try installing one of those but wouldn't mind trying one out.

[yqtszhj]

Looks better to me. I wasn’t to sure about that big pointy bottom at first but what you accomplished looks like a definite improvement.

[bugs]

has anyone ever tried drilling/tapping a stock CM9 trigger for a overtravel screw?

NRA LIFER

IDPA BELIEVER

[yqtszhj]

has anyone ever tried drilling/tapping a stock CM9 trigger for a overtravel screw?

NRA LIFER

IDPA BELIEVER

I haven’t but my CM9 breaks so far back I don’t think it would break if I did. Yours may be different though.

I do have a CZ clone I’ve been meaning to drill and tap the trigger on but haven’t done it yet. Bought the tap and bit so I need to make time to do it.

[guido4198]

Got my CM9 with new Galloway flat trigger to the range today. Flawless function. I like this trigger shape better than what the factory put in the gun. I believe it gives me better “ feel” when I’m taking deliberate aimed shots AND helps keep everything lined up better when I’m firing rapidly. I kept the overtravel screw and don’t believe it does much as the end of travel is already pretty much all the way back, but it does a little. I’ll take small improvements as I can get them, so long as performance and reliability aren’t degraded. At this point I’m not getting a significant reduction in re-set which is consistent with what Galloway told us to expect. As soon as they offer the new sear, I’ll most likely go for that as well.

[fsilber]

I think flat triggers are more traditionally used with guns shot in single-action.
That said, I find the Kahr trigger light enough for me to use the tip of the pad of the trigger finger instead of the joint, and I'm much more accurate that way (less likely to pull or push the gun to one side or the other).

I also find I shoot much better when over-travel is limited, though you have to be careful because there's a fine line between ideal and the gun doesn't reliably fire. I made a trigger-stop by putting a glob of expoxy paste behind the trigger and using sandpaper to reduce the depth until the trigger would break reliably.

[scattershot]

Got a pic of that? I’d like to see how much overtravel I can get rid of using that Fix.

[Old No7]

Well done by Greg on the trigger, and the superb write-up and photos to show it. Kudos' to you sir!

I just don't get it though...

I have never tried a straight trigger, I'll admit that...

But when i look at the shape of my trigger finger, it's not straight where it contacts the trigger. So...

I guess it's just not for me, as I do prefer smooth-faced rounded triggers (and have been known to grind/file the grooves out of them before, if they had 'em...).

Old No7

[Bawanna]

I'm kind of on board the same train you are 7. They make complete sense on a single action as mentioned earlier in this thread but not so much on these longer pulls.
But people here whose opinions I have strong faith in like them so I could be completely wrong.
I'm kind of skeered to install one myself but I'd sure like to play with one to get my own take on them.

[gb6491]

My apologies for the crappy photos that follow, but I hope they will suffice.
I like the flat trigger because I think (maybe delusional) that it allows me to use the lower part of the trigger for maximum leverage.
Even if there is no increase of leverage over the OEM trigger, this at least makes using it more comfortable.
Here's shot of the trigger with it's slack taken up. The trigger is almost vertical at the point and my finger easily positions low on it.
https://i.postimg.cc/W35sn4CJ/f1-865.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Here, I've started the firing stroke.
https://i.postimg.cc/tRfjC8jy/f2-865.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
This shot is slightly after the striker has released
https://i.postimg.cc/QdNG6DgQ/f3-865.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
Regards,
Greg

[Old No7]

Actually, those are pretty good photos and I think it shows what you mean by leverage. Glad it works well for you.

I've just realized I might be old-school and can't get past the look of a "straight" trigger face.

Thanks for adding those Greg. Nice job.

Old No7

[gb6491]

Actually, those are pretty good photos and I think it shows what you mean by leverage. Glad it works well for you.

I've just realized I might be old-school and can't get past the look of a "straight" trigger face.

Thanks for adding those Greg. Nice job.

Old No7
I hear ya. It took me a wile to warm up to triggers with a straight/flat face. Even now I only have them on certain guns. I like it on my P365, but didn't go with one on my P226 when I put in a trigger with over travel adjustment. I really like the one on my P45, I just seems right on it, but doubt I will put one on any of my other Kahr pistols. I don't like the look of them on 1911s and that's from a guy who has polymer 1911s. Of course, nothing is written in stone.

Thanks for your kind comments.
Regards,
Greg

[dao]

Greg am I recalling correctly that the trigger pin on the Kahrs can be a real pain to remove? Thanks!

[gb6491]

Greg am I recalling correctly that the trigger pin on the Kahrs can be a real pain to remove? Thanks!
On the metal frame guns it can be.

It's much easier on the poly frame guns. I use an arbor press, but I've also removed them with a punch and hammer.
The trigger axis pin on poly Kahrs is held in place by a cross pin. I like the press because I feel slowly pushing the axis pin past the cross pin is easier on the frame than the shock from driving it past with a punch. If I use a punch, I let the frame sit in the sun for a bit to warm up, then use a few light taps to move the axis pin past the cross pin. Once past the cross pin, the axis pin can be pushed out by hand. I'd say you might even be able to push the axis pin past the cross pin by hand, but I think that could lead to slipping off the pin and marring the frame. Galloway's video is quite good on removing then pin.
Regards,
Greg

[dao]

Thanks Greg. If I end up with a P or PM45 I'll take a look at the video. Kahr triggers have always been very good and I can't help but think the flat trigger face would make them even nicer.

[FreeMe]

All this is still currently academic, because the Galloway flat trigger is still out of stock.

[Scarywoody]

I was interested also but it's been "Out of Stock" all year.

[FreeMe]

Flat triggers are now in stock! (Unless I bought the last one ;) )

[jeepster09]

I have flat triggers in all my Sigs and like them a lot!

[Bawanna]

I just put a flat trigger in my 365. Mostly just to see if I liked it or not. So far without actually firing I like it pretty good. Put a spring kit in it while I was figuring it out and that helped a bit too.

[DavidR]

I just put a flat trigger in my 365. Mostly just to see if I liked it or not. So far without actually firing I like it pretty good. Put a spring kit in it while I was figuring it out and that helped a bit too.

Nice! What trigger and springs did you put in it?

I put the Sig flat face. Left the springs alone.

[Bawanna]

I went with the Sig Flat trigger but got it on Ebay for quite a bit less than the 49 bucks from Sig.

I put in the MCarbo spring kit as Greg did that one and was pleased with it. I'm also pleased, I think it was well worth it.

[FreeMe]

Flat trigger is installed on my P9. I need to get to the range yet to try it out.

Noting here that the site no longer has anything about milling slides for RDS. Hmmm....

[DavidR]

Flat trigger is installed on my P9. I need to get to the range yet to try it out.

Noting here that the site no longer has anything about milling slides for RDS. Hmmm....

Nice.

Unfortunately, Galloway never came through on their talk of a short stroke trigger.

[FreeMe]

Nice.

Unfortunately, Galloway never came through on their talk of a short stroke trigger.

I believe technically you are correct. My evaluation of the trigger I got is that it is arguably "short stroke" if you employ the ovevrtravel stop, which I dud not. Nothing is changed about the reset, as far as I can tell. They do appear to be doing the RDS side cuts again.

[guido4198]

I believe technically you are correct. My evaluation of the trigger I got is that it is arguably "short stroke" if you employ the ovevrtravel stop, which I dud not. Nothing is changed about the reset, as far as I can tell. They do appear to be doing the RDS side cuts again.
It's interesting to see this old thread resurrected with current comments. I'm disappointed that Galloway was unable to offer the short-stroke trigger kit. I spoke to them several times about it and was ready to place an order as soon as they were ready. Even volunteered to be a field tester if they had anything they wanted "wrung out" on the range. Ah well...good folks though, nonetheless. I'm using the long set screw trigger stop despite how bad it looks. I'm not terribly concerned with the "looks" of my EDC Kahr CM9 though. For my purposes...looks don't count for much in an everyday use tool. That's kinda like a carpenter wanting to have exhibition grade English Walnut on his hammer. :)

[Bawanna]

Where did you hear about my framing hammer? I'm of the school it has to work but it also has to look cool while it's working. Of course we all know that beauty is to the eye of the beholder which is why we all have different taste and sensibilities.

Also probably why I'm into weird old guns and knives that most wouldn't take a second glance at. Maybe I got bad taste........I'll have to ponder that.

[FreeMe]

It's interesting to see this old thread resurrected with current comments. I'm disappointed that Galloway was unable to offer the short-stroke trigger kit. I spoke to them several times about it and was ready to place an order as soon as they were ready. Even volunteered to be a field tester if they had anything they wanted "wrung out" on the range. Ah well...good folks though, nonetheless. I'm using the long set screw trigger stop despite how bad it looks. I'm not terribly concerned with the "looks" of my EDC Kahr CM9 though. For my purposes...looks don't count for much in an everyday use tool. That's kinda like a carpenter wanting to have exhibition grade English Walnut on his hammer. :)

I'm not that concerned about appearances, but I dislike overtravel adjustment screws on the trigger of my carry guns. Just seems like an invitation to (an admittedly unlikely) problem that I don't need to risk. I'm disappointed about that short stroke trigger kit too. I never have resolved the fact that my P9 does not have the sweet shorter stroke trigger of my Elite 03. It seems to me that something simple should be the answer. Might be as simple as sending the thing back to Kahr, but I'm resisting that.