Why I like Lowes

[JohnR]

I’ve been photographing as much Covid crap as I can since, like Ike said when they liberated the concentration camps, without photos people might not believe this really happened.

Anyway, I saw that they sell signs for your business saying concealed carry is permitted, but I didn’t see any “no guns” signs.

[wally1]

I like them too, but every time I go in the loudspeaker is telling me to cough into my elbow - I DON'T NEED TO COUGH!

[I_Like_Turtles]

The local Lowe's is quite gun owner friendly. I've open carried there, have seen several others open carry (for the unfamiliar, by "open carry" I mean "holstered sidearm") and have received nothing but compliments.

The last time there, open carry that day, I asked the checkout clerk how he felt about seeing an open carry customer. He replied "I like it....we need someone with a gun in here." Another clerk, another time, told me "we like guns here."

So for now, Lowe's is pro gun....let's hope it stays that way. No such "gun" signs at the local store though......but maybe I should give the sign area another look?

[dustnchips]

I like Lowes better than Home Depot and it has nothing to do with guns.

[JohnR]

At least it doesn’t say turn your head and cough into your elbow. :D

I took a video of one of those solar powered parking lot Daleks, that shouts to wear a mask and social distance. Those are creepy.

[dustnchips]

I'm Ina a small town and have never seen one of those.

[187911]

I guess it depends on where you live. I been to several Lowe's in my area and none of them have signs like that for sale.

[berettabone]

Been there............................................. .............

[Bawanna]

The local Lowe's is quite gun owner friendly. I've open carried there, have seen several others open carry (for the unfamiliar, by "open carry" I mean "holstered sidearm") and have received nothing but compliments.

The last time there, open carry that day, I asked the checkout clerk how he felt about seeing an open carry customer. He replied "I like it....we need someone with a gun in here." Another clerk, another time, told me "we like guns here."

So for now, Lowe's is pro gun....let's hope it stays that way. No such "gun" signs at the local store though......but maybe I should give the sign area another look?

If you were standing at the counter of a store where employees are not allowed to carry any kind of weapon and a guy with an open carry gun asked how you felt about it, what would be the safe response?

It's like asking a guy who just paid 50,000 for a new car that's a complete piece of junk. When asked how he likes it, you think he's gonna say, it's a complete piece of junk and look the fool.

[I_Like_Turtles]

If you were standing at the counter of a store where employees are not allowed to carry any kind of weapon and a guy with an open carry gun asked how you felt about it, what would be the safe response?

It's like asking a guy who just paid 50,000 for a new car that's a complete piece of junk. When asked how he likes it, you think he's gonna say, it's a complete piece of junk and look the fool.

Oh that makes such clear sense, because, in your experience, gun owners are such volatile people that when told something they don't like, they'd just kill the person wouldn't they? You know we tend to judge others by our own standards, so I assume, that's what you would do, right? Someone told you something you didn't like about gun ownership so you'd just shoot them? GIVE ME A BREAK.

You wouldn't do that nor do you honestly believe this clerk, and the 50 other clerks I've asked over the years at various stores, including times when I was concealed carrying or not carrying at all, and the subject of armed patrons came up believed they would be killed if they answered in the negative.

Geeze Louise. The hoplophobia about open carry is ludicrous. It is truly laughable.

Yep, scared that clerk so much, that he didn't stutter, hesitate, change his voice tone, display any timid body language or telling facial expression, but clearly he was scared for his life. So scared he lied, confidently, without hesitation. And his companions, on other days, so scared the store allows open carry. Yep, definitely scared. Clearly. Terrified. SMH.

But yes, local Lowe's pretty pro gun, so far.

[berettabone]

Everyone knows that reactions to open carry vary from state to state, city to city, town to town. Go in to a Lowes in my city open carrying and you'll be looking up at the stars after the swat team plants you on the floor. Do it up nort and you won't get a second look. Don't assume that open carry is viewed as a normal thing by everyone, and don't assume that everyone's reaction would be the same. There is still a portion of the John Q Public that freaks out at the sight of any firearm. Don't assume that all Lowes are the same. You know what happens when you assume............................................ .................................................. ..Personally, If I were to open carry, and I have, I would just open carry. I don't really give 2 hoots what the store or the clerks think. An opinion from a checkout person at Lowes is about as useful as money management advice from your garbage man........................

[Bawanna]

My point perhaps over complicated is the man with the gun is always right, the customer is always right or at least that's the way it used to be in the good ole days.

[I_Like_Turtles]

I don't know, I think I'm just a rather relaxed guy, seeing a man with a holstered firearm, as long as he's not touching it, isn't going to bother me. Doesn't bother me.

But Bawanna's comment the other day got me to thinking. Actually, I've been thinking about this for a few days, not related to this thread. I think I am going to do a survey....speak with various people in local society and ask their opinions on open carry. Try to get into not only what they think but why they think that way.

Been a while since I wrote a survey, had courses in it.

Personal motivations and reasons for those are of great interest to me. Being able to draw a broader, more general picture on subjects is something I seek.

No doubt, I should have majored in psychology. Is it too late to go to college a third time? LOL

No way would I want to be in college now. Too Marxist now, very dangerous for the outspoken individual.

I think my level of extroversion, tendency to speak my mind, if I was asked by an openly armed patron, the same question, I'd answer honestly without fear. In fact, I know I would. Now in my case, point is rather moot, since I am an open carry advocate, but if his position was against open carry, I would still reply, honestly, with full courtesy of course.

[Ken L]

The biggest issue here, Turtles, is that your mindset is getting in the way. I in no way am meaning to be a jerk here. Please take my words as "constructive criticism" and nothing more.

Your worldview is narrow. Your slice of the world (WVA? VA? I apologize if I don't recall correctly) although it is representative of where you live, is not representative of where the rest of us live. You project your worldview on the rest of us without walking a mile in our shoes. For instance, walk into my Lowes in Arvada, Colorado while open carrying. You'll be followed by store security. You won't know it, no matter how skilled you feel you are at spotting people watching you, because they are very good. Handoffs and such, team of 5 or 6. On a weekend when you're open carrying you will notice extra police in the store. Because of you. And that's if the leftists shopping in the garden center haven't called 911 about a man with a gun. Just facts. Be thankful that you're in Arvada and not Boulder. In Boulder you'll be beaten over the head with a Biden/Harris yard sign. Then arrested.

You also have a tendency to belittle people that don't share your opinion. Again, don't take offense, I am hoping that I can help you grow. One of the great things about America, at least Pre-Obama America, is that we were all allowed our option and people respected that there were different opinions. Those differences in opinion are what make America unique and stronger, as defined by our Founding Fathers. Separate yet equal, etc. In some of these discussions, you are not respecting the different opinions of the board members, you resort to telling folks that don't agree with you that they are wrong. That, combined with your forceful Internet personality and your propensity for "one up-manship" is a bit off putting and creates animus on the board. If it feels like the whole board is against you, maybe it is and maybe there is a reason.

Oh, and if you're going to quote Jeff Cooper, do it right. Hopolophobia is about fear of guns. None of us on this board fear guns. It is not fear of open carry. It is a term that is reserved for leftists, not fellow gun enthusiasts. Comes off as pretentious when used the way you did.

Bawana and Greg might very well hit me with the ban stick for provoking or singling you out. I do hope that I am allowed back at some point, because this Kahr community is a great one. My goal here is to help the community grow, and Turtles, since you've become a rather vocal part of the community my intent here is to build a bridge rather than a fence.

[getsome]

Thank you Ken L. Sometimes things just need to be said and you did it well and your views are appreciated by many here....

[JohnR]

Dogs are banned in the vast majority of retail establishments. Service animals are rare and allowed, but pets are not generally allowed. They can potentially make a mess and bother other shoppers so there's a fear factor there. But when I see a customer with their dog in the store I assume the store has an open-carry pet policy and I'm glad to see the dogs. I've never once seen a pet dog in a store that created a scene. People with poorly-trained or overly aggressive dogs seem to be aware that their pets are not welcome in stores so they leave them in the car or at home; I've never seen them in stores.

[I_Like_Turtles]

Dang...I had this all typed out but I guess the site deletes the proposed reply once the system auto logs out. Let's see if I can do it again.

That's a funny way of putting it, their "mindset is getting into the way." I guess that happens anytime someone continues to disagree. If they'd just make a fundamental change to how they think, all would be well, at least, with the person seeking agreement.

I am not sure how you arrived at such a conclusion. I am aware America is not a legal or cultural monolith. I've also lived in other states, including one very "blue" city of over a million people. I've also spent several weeks at a time in Asia, which is not exactly on board with the concept of self defense. That members' locales are hostile to self defense is a sad reality. I also understand that reality. A few weeks ago I met a friend in VA for lunch. I open carried while there, but the entire trip was through "sanctuary" counties. I would not have open carried in Richmond or Arlington, for example. I have open carried in rural PA. I would not open carry in Pittsburgh.

Please show the examples of when you felt I "belittled" other members. Please include which forum that occurred in, the thread title, and comment number for context, so we can discuss that further.

"One-upmanship?" I don't see it that way, although some may. I see discussion forums as "debate simulators" and I've definitely benefited from it. Since replies are possible, I tend to view comments made as "the author invites a reply." If they didn't want a reply they wouldn't have commented. I have never felt I have been "one-upped," but I have felt others were better in their choice of words.

You know, you've given me a good idea. Perhaps "hoplophobia" isn't the right word, although I do feel the aversion to open carry is a form of it. With Jeff Cooper denied us, what I can do is ask a friend in Greece what she thinks would be a good word to classify the fear of seeing openly armed self defenders. There certainly is a fear of it, you've described that to some extent in your reply, and many gun owners loath it. That part is most confusing to me, I would assume a self defender would applaud it, even if they themselves didn't like it. Personally, I don't like dedicated sports cars, but I support the right of anyone who wants to own and drive one. I don't feel threatened by the sight of a two-seat 1000 horsepower car with no trunk space. I would wonder about anyone that did.

While you are looking up those offensive comments, could you find another for me? I seem to recall making a blanket, preemptive apology at least once before. I could be wrong though, one's 40's are the twilight of youth and dawn of old age. I recall this apology along the lines of, "if anyone here ever feels I have insulted them, all they need do is message me or state it in the thread, and I'll immediately apologize however they wish (including publicly), and attempt to re-word whatever was offensive." Now I don't remember if that's how I put it, if I even stated it on this forum, but I meant it, and mean it now.

I don't think anyone is going to ban you, according to your post, they'll likely enjoy your mindset. Since you've mentioned Board members being unhappy, perhaps the site needs to change the rules concerning discussing open carry. That's the only area where I've been the main dissenter. I can only recall one other member supporting open carry, so far.

Despite your impression, I am open to changing my mind, but so far, I have not been exposed to an argument that convincing. I am open to change, have before, and I did "grow" as you put it. What I am not open to, is being pressured, online or otherwise, to make a change.

[Bawanna]

Kind of a long thorough post that indicates at least to me that Ken was spot on in every respect.

To clarify my personal hoplophobia my fear is not the gun, it's the gun in the control of anyone but myself and very few others. Certainly there are concealed guns all over and I watch for them constantly but I don't fear the gun.
I don't fear that the guy in the 1000 hp 2 seater is going to run over me with it even if it's only cause he don't want to mess up the paint job. Not a viable comparison.

A better comparison perhaps would be a big knife and the fear there is the same. I like knives but again I'm cautious around people I don't know wearing them.

[340pd]

Well said Ken and Bawanna.

The whole open carry thing is about common sense. If I open carry, it is while in my uniform and 99% of the time I am just getting gas and a snack where they know me. If I am entering a Walmart or Target for example I always pull out my uniform shirt and cover my firearm.

Open carry, be it gun or large knife, sets most people on edge. There are absolutely no positive reasons for such action especially in today's world.

Rather than strap my latest and greatest on my hip while wearing my tactical shorts and a 5.11 tee , I just cover up and wear a sign that says "I have a small *****" as it accomplishes the thing.

[I_Like_Turtles]

I have a feeling, even if it'd been a short and limited reply, your feelings would be the same.

I assume everyone is armed at all times, whether visible or not.

Given that each year, cars kill more people than guns, it seems one should fear the car more....or the driver of said car more.....if their fears were truly honest.

Ah, the "open carry is for cops only" argument. Well then, I assume you wish to change the law? Perhaps that's a better course instead of using the inadequate sexual reference tactic...often the use of such tactics is seen as projection. I see those as an attempt to gain an emotional response, when other debate tactics have failed.

[SlowBurn]

I've thought about open carry only because some folks I respect advocate it, and here's where I came out: I disagree with them.
Open carry is advertising (yes, it is.) For LEOs and similar that makes sense because you want everyone good and bad to know you're armed. Your job is to keep peace and protect everyone and this is one of the ways you let the public know you're prepared to do it. In a bad situation, people will rightly expect you to respond.
That's not my job, and its not why I carry. My gun is a personal tool to protect me and mine. In a given situation I'll use it or not depending on all the circumstances, but its strictly my decision to make at the time. I don't want to create any expectation or implicit obligation. In fact I can't think of anything positive that would come from drawing attention to the fact that I'm armed. It might make some people feel nervous and others feel safer, but neither of those is my goal.
Not all open carry people are exhibitionists. Advocates I respect are motivated by a desire to move society to a place where open carry is normal and unremarkable. I just don't see it happening and I'm not even sure it should happen. If you know me well enough, you'll know I'm armed, and its nobody else's business.

[dao]

About the only unarguable, proper time, and purpose I see for open carry is at a Rights Rally, to advocate the Right to do so. Never to intimidate, nor brandish, nor to warn, nor to show off, or for any valid reason that I can think of. Because when you get down to it, with the proper clothing, holster, and practice you can carry concealed just as comfortably while being just as prepared to defend yourself, as you could while open carrying.

Turtles you might want to think about the fact that some people carry openly in order to show others how cool they are, and to consciouly project an image of "toughness", in such a way and to such a degree that it amuses some, causes disdain, and in some cases fear. I don't believe you are one of those people but because you're doing the very same thing (open carrying), in the minds of some people that see you, you may be just another one of "those" guys. Who, at their worst can actually be potentially harmful to the 2A. And, whether you want to admit it or not (you haven't thus far), you give up any tactical advantage that you may have by letting your potential enemy know you, while hiding their own threat from you.

Open carry by civilians to remind politicians and gun control advocates that we have a Right to do so is needed, called for, and appropriate when done at the right time, in the right place, and in the right way. Aside from that it's mostly pointless and/or self-serving.

[Ken L]

Turtles, you're asking me to do what would end up being a very minimal amount of work to prove my points with your own words. I'm not going to go thru the exercise because you've done every one of those things in this very thread. So, why should I cut, paste, edit and put all these points in one post when they are already here? You're going to refute it all anyway.

One point I will make though. "Worldview" has nothing to do with physically where you have been in the world. It has everything to do with your mindset and how you perceive the world around you, and most importantly how you project that mindset. I suggest you google "narrow worldview".

Of course it doesn't apply to you and I'm wrong. <--this is me being sarcastic.

[Armybrat]

Mutt & Jeff here strutting into an Austin restaurant several years ago during the OC movement didn’t make a very good impression on the locals as far as projecting any positive images of responsible gun owners...

[Bawanna]

Just to be clear, I completely advocate open carry being legal even though I never do it and never will. It just helps if I have a wardrobe malfunction and my gun plays peek a boo. Open carry legality makes that fine and dandy.

Without open carry and with a narrow minded officer on a bad day, that's brandishing if the right little old lady makes the man or in my case derelict with a gun call.

[JohnR]

Mutt & Jeff here strutting into an Austin restaurant several years ago during the OC movement didn’t make a very good impression on the locals as far as projecting any positive images of responsible gun owners...

Those guys don't present themselves as positive and responsible people, even without guns.

Walking around with large amounts of cash sticking out of your pocket is perfectly legal, but not recommended for similar reasons why open carry is not recommended.

[berettabone]

Testosterone + IQ eq. 12 = Stupid. I was actually surprised that they got dressed up for the occasion.......................................... ............

[Planedude]

Just to be clear, I completely advocate open carry being legal even though I never do it and never will. It just helps if I have a wardrobe malfunction and my gun plays peek a boo. Open carry legality makes that fine and dandy.

Without open carry and with a narrow minded officer on a bad day, that's brandishing if the right little old lady makes the man or in my case derelict with a gun call.

Exactly!

That is the only reason I was in full support of open carry when it came to Texas.
Thanks for saying it first Bawanna.

[Armybrat]

Just to be clear, I completely advocate open carry being legal even though I never do it and never will. It just helps if I have a wardrobe malfunction and my gun plays peek a boo. Open carry legality makes that fine and dandy.

Without open carry and with a narrow minded officer on a bad day, that's brandishing if the right little old lady makes the man or in my case derelict with a gun call.
My same thoughts on OC.

[dao]

I guess this guy doesn't understand the concept of concealed carry. Or at least he didn't. I'd guess he's better informed now. And will learn even more as the charges develop. And the pain increases.

https://komonews.com/news/local/oregon-man-shoots-himself-in-groin-area-after-showing-off-gun-in-grocery-checkout

[Armybrat]

Guess he can no longer rock “balls to the wall”.

Darwin is giddy.

[getsome]

Saw the video of that one and it was pretty grisly, they said he shot himself in the groin but he actually hit the place you really don't want to be shot in....His main vein looked like a loaded cigar after it blew up and I'm willing to bet his new nick-name will be Snubby or perhaps even Deloris.....

[jeepster09]

Some people......

[Planedude]

Saw the video of that one and it was pretty grisly, they said he shot himself in the groin but he actually hit the place you really don't want to be shot in....His main vein looked like a loaded cigar after it blew up and I'm willing to bet his new nick-name will be Snubby or perhaps even Deloris.....

Soooooo... your saying he Glocked his cock??:confused:

That's going leave a mark.

OUCH!

[getsome]

Let's just say that appendix carry is fine until you get careless and then it's good bye Mr. Happy....

[dustnchips]

What the H*** is a guy doing pulling a gun out in a grocery story to show his buddy. What an idiot.

[dao]

Not sure, but I'd guess it's not that different from the guy that open carries for reasons other than pure, albeit misadvised self defense.