New list of CA decertifications

[340pd]

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/de-certified-handguns

[DavidR]

Quite a long list. Should make it easier for the drug cartels and gangs to control the state.

#DefundCalifornia

[DavidR]

If only we had a constitutional amendment that guaranteed the right to keep and bear arms.

[Armybrat]

That link just goes to their home page. I couldn’t find the actual list.

[gb6491]

That link just goes to their home page. I couldn’t find the actual list.
It will work now.
Regards,
Greg

[dao]

In other places and at other times CA's decertification of guns, depending on their reasons for doing so could very well be characterized as extortion. Why would a gun and/or its manufacturer suddenly lose its certification? If it was "worthy" of being certified at one time and has not changed since what exactly has changed in order for it to no longer be "worthy"? I'm sure it's not arbitrary and almost as certain it has something to do with money. Which smacks of extortion, at least to me.

[Armybrat]

It will work now.
Regards,
Greg
Thank you.
It appears the gun manufacturers have given up on California. I think they should follow through and boycott selling any of their products including ammo to all California law enforcement agencies. Let them see how they like them apples.

[Bawanna]

I'd say don't sell any products or ammo to California (except) Law Enforcement. Remember despite what the current regime thinks, they are the good guys.
Our police here in Washington are even struggling to get ammo like everybody else. Just not right.

[dao]

I don't think a manufacturer could refuse to sell to any organization, municipality, or individual unless it was within the law, such as minors. If they tried I believe they'd be sued pretty quickly.

[Armybrat]

I'd say don't sell any products or ammo to California (except) Law Enforcement. Remember despite what the current regime thinks, they are the good guys.
Our police here in Washington are even struggling to get ammo like everybody else. Just not right.

I understand what you are saying, but I’m thinking of what Barrett did.

[DavidR]

I don't think a manufacturer could refuse to sell to any organization, municipality, or individual unless it was within the law, such as minors. If they tried I believe they'd be sued pretty quickly.

I don’t think a manufacturer incorporated in one state can be forced to sell to customers in another state.

I fully support refusing to sell to Californians and California law enforcement.

[dao]

Looks like you're probably right and I'm wrong David. From the FTC site:

In general, a seller has the right to choose its business partners. A firm's refusal to deal with any other person or company is lawful so long as the refusal is not the product of an anticompetitive agreement with other firms or part of a predatory or exclusionary strategy to acquire or maintain a monopoly. This principle was laid out by the Supreme Court more than 85 years ago:

The purpose of the Sherman Act is to... preserve the right of freedom of trade. In the absence of any purpose to create or maintain a monopoly, the act does not restrict the long recognized right of a trader or manufacturer engaged in an entirely private business, freely to exercise his own independent discretion as to parties with whom he will deal.


This remains a fundamental rule of federal antitrust law and draws a line between legal independent decision-making on the one hand and illegal joint or monopolistic activity on the other.

Oh, and FTR I do think that while it would be unfortunate to put CA police at a disadvantage by making it harder for them to be sufficiently armed, restricting sales to the entire State of CA would be warranted in order to make the State understand the true and potential consequences of their unwise and unfair decisions.

[Bawanna]

Why make Law Enforcement suffer because of foolish citizenry? They don't make the rules, they just try to interpret them and enforce them. Has to be a difficult job in California. I'm sure even there the police don't seek out gun violations to awful hard. Enough stuff going on otherwise.

[dao]

Well Colonel while it's unlikely the criminals are going to complain or lobby the State to be more fair in their decisions on gun control, the law abiding and police-supporting public, as well as the police themselves likely would make their voices heard if those decisions prevent police from being able to sufficiently protect themselves. CA seemingly makes very few decisions based on truth and logic. And this should stop if the good people and LE are going to be able to protect themselves and others. It is no doubt sad though that a company taking the stance we're talking about would, in the process of doing so make LE even more dangerous than it already is.
Maybe this recall of their governor will help, especially if the Pub that is gearing up to run against him in that event is able to take his office.

[DavidR]

Why make Law Enforcement suffer because of foolish citizenry? They don't make the rules, they just try to interpret them and enforce them. Has to be a difficult job in California. I'm sure even there the police don't seek out gun violations to awful hard. Enough stuff going on otherwise.

I’m sure the Chinese will be happy to sell to them since the state is essentially a Chinese province.

[BassCliff]

Hi,


https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/de-certified-handguns

To be fair, there is a list of Recently Added Handgun Models: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/certified-handguns/recently-added

(Sarcasm!) :rolleyes:


Quite a long list. Should make it easier for the drug cartels and gangs to control the state.

#DefundCalifornia

Looks to be about 38 pistols that have been de-certified. I guess someone decided they were too scary, or they weren't getting enough kick-backs.


If only we had a constitutional amendment that guaranteed the right to keep and bear arms.

The Attorney General of CA is an idiot, just like the governor. I'm mailing in my recall petition tomorrow. Cross your fingers.


Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

[dustnchips]

The decertification was not about the guns. It was all about fees charged by the state. The manufactures refused to pay the state to be on the good boy list so the state will not let then sell their guns there. If an indivegual did it it would be unlawful.

[dao]

As I thought, legalized extortion. By the State.

[BassCliff]

Hi,


The decertification was not about the guns. It was all about fees charged by the state. The manufactures refused to pay the state to be on the good boy list so the state will not let then sell their guns there. If an indivegual did it it would be unlawful.

That makes sense. Where can I find this extortion paperwork? There must be some record of the "fees" charged for a firearm manufacturer to do business in CA. It's always a money-grab here. This state is a fiscal black hole.


Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

[340pd]

I disagree with the extortion argument. I think that only is part of the issue.
From my understanding CA in an effort to curb the number of guns available refused to allow any guns on the list that had ANY modifications or improvements made by the manufacturer. Further, due to their demand that there be some form of microstamping (an impossible demand) be mandatory on any new firearms add to the list.

[dao]

All due respect, I don't think that holds water. Simply because there should be no reason why guns once approved should be removed from the list, barring any mods or improvements that you cited. But even at that, why remove guns that have been improved if the changes have not made the gun less safe, or lethal?

[Bawanna]

Safe and lethal have nothing to do with anything in California. They would much rather just not allow anything that goes bang, might cause cancer or something.

It's their sneaky way of bringing in gun control. The people making the policy don't have a clue about firearms.

[340pd]

You are correct Bawanna. Their requirements for Microstamping (a technology that does not exist) drives manufacturers to stop selling in CA and that is what the AG in CA wants. The requirement that any modifications or improvements made requires a new re-certification and unless microstamping is included in those changes, they are not ever added to the approved list. All this BS has nothing to do with safety and everything to do with constantly shrinking the number of guns available for sale in that state.
If I lived in that CA I would just drive around and randomly throw handfuls of spent brass into the street just to keep those idiots on point.

[Bawanna]

I'm sure there's still no shortage of guns available from friends across state lines.