Why no 10rd mags for TP, ST, CT series?

[thinman]

Just ordered a new TP9 pistol to go with my PM9. I'm curious if anyone knows anything about why Kahr doesn't offer a 10rd magazine for their 4" barreled pistols.
Both IDPA and USPSA Production Division limit competitors to 10 rounds in a magazine. The 4" Kahr pistols have enough sight radius and overall weight to be at least moderately successful in competition but not having 10rd magazines is a pretty big disadvantage.
Kahr shows a 10rd magazine for the P9, CW9, ST9 series size pistols. Looks like all Kahr would have to do is adjust the length of the plastic grip extension to make the P9 10rd magazine work in the bigger TP9 pistol. Has anyone tried trimming a grip extension to make the P9 mag work in their TP9?

[rms2324]

Just ordered a new TP9 pistol to go with my PM9. I'm curious if anyone knows anything about why Kahr doesn't offer a 10rd magazine for their 4" barreled pistols.
Both IDPA and USPSA Production Division limit competitors to 10 rounds in a magazine. The 4" Kahr pistols have enough sight radius and overall weight to be at least moderately successful in competition but not having 10rd magazines is a pretty big disadvantage.
Kahr shows a 10rd magazine for the P9, CW9, ST9 series size pistols. Looks like all Kahr would have to do is adjust the length of the plastic grip extension to make the P9 10rd magazine work in the bigger TP9 pistol. Has anyone tried trimming a grip extension to make the P9 mag work in their TP9?


Because Kahr hasn’t innovated since they released their polymer pistols

[JohnR]

The ST has a rail :)

[DavidR]

Because Kahr hasn’t innovated since they released their polymer pistols

Bingo!

[thinman]

Thank you for mentioning the ST's rail. S model also has a rail. Both the ST and S also have front slide serrations. Those does appear to be the latest innovations. Google says the S series came out in 2017, so it has been a while. Kahr website shows the ST is discontinued. Innovations department doesn't seem to be burning the midnight oil dreaming up new stuff. Too bad. Kahr isn't providing a lot of reasons for satisfied, existing owners to go out and buy something new.

[King Rat]

One gun I truly hope Kahr does not try and "f" things up with "Innovation" is the Pm 9 or CM9. Especially by trying to add more ammo in a gun that is Spectacular in Size, and weight for every day Carry. Not any guns I know of that fit the bill. Adding more weight is Not Innovation for many. Adding length or height is not innovation. It is a step backward. One of the smallest 9mm in class and shoots so mild. And of course one of the Best DAO triggers produced. Yes, the other models they should make one with 10 rds and a 17 rd extension.
The only innovation I think Kahr could do with the 380 and the PM/CM is to make it a modular design. Get rid of the bulky Slide stop. If Kahr could add more rounds and keep the same size and weight, that would be Innovation. No more than the 15. 9 oz it now has and still shoot as mild as it now does.

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[Bawanna]

Sometimes when you finally get it right, any innovation is not necessarily a good thing. Look at the 1911? Other than ginger bread or cosmetic stuff it's been perfect for over a 100 years.

Kahr has Magnum Research and Auto Ordnance under their umbrella. Perhaps those branches should pursue some of these "Innovations"?

Personally I think we got a might off course when we steered away from Flintlocks, but I'm told I was born a 100 years too late, maybe longer than that.

[DavidR]

There’s absolutely no reason to quit making the current single stack 9s. However, if Kahr wants to make small 9mm pistols that people will actually buy, ...

[MMyers1970]

Unfortunately for Kahr, the market is leaving them behind. Those of us who already have the single stack pistols love them, but if someone is looking for their first carry pistol, buying anything but a P365/Hellcat/Shield Plus/Max 9 makes no sense.

11 is more than 7.

[rms2324]

Unfortunately for Kahr, the market is leaving them behind. Those of us who already have the single stack pistols love them, but if someone is looking for their first carry pistol, buying anything but a P365/Hellcat/Shield Plus/Max 9 makes no sense.

11 is more than 7.
Exactly. After this stupid loose slide-to-frame fit on my “premium” $800 K9, I’m done with buying Kahrs. Their guns are overpriced and give you much less than other, cheaper pistols. There’s 0 reason to buy a Kahr nowadays when there’s so many better options on the market.This doesn’t include the CM/PM9 as it’s in a class of its own. I’ve put about 1200 rounds through my PM9 and it’s in my pocket most days.

Aside from that, I’m finished with Kahr. My Glock’s are $3-400 less than any of my Kahrs and there isn’t an IOTA of movement in the slide-to-frame fit and waddya know, they always run even without a BS “break-in period” (it’s 2021, any decent gun should be able to run out of the box with some lube). Sig P365 XL, HK P30SK, Walther PPQ, hell even my Canik which I picked up for $250 is super tight and reliable. Kahr’s gotten complacent and it will be there downfall in the near-future. Why my slide shoots forward when I dry fire and why my $800 “premium” gun rattles like a baby toy, I won’t know. According to Kahr, it’s within spec (lol). Not to mention the ball of metal on my slide left over from CNC, the absolutely damaged and dented backplate, the different colorations on my slide/frame, how any mag with the pinky extension won’t seat in my gun, and my slide serrations are all dented. Quality is not their concern nowadays

90% of new-ish shooters have never even heard of Kahr and there’s a reason for that

[Canine Dave]

Sometimes when you finally get it right, any innovation is not necessarily a good thing. Look at the 1911? Other than ginger bread or cosmetic stuff it's been perfect for over a 100 years.



+1

These are extra characters for appeasement only.

[King Rat]

Exactly. After this stupid loose slide-to-frame fit on my “premium” $800 K9, I’m done with buying Kahrs. Their guns are overpriced and give you much less than other, cheaper pistols. There’s 0 reason to buy a Kahr nowadays when there’s so many better options on the market.This doesn’t include the CM/PM9 as it’s in a class of its own. I’ve put about 1200 rounds through my PM9 and it’s in my pocket most days.

Aside from that, I’m finished with Kahr. My Glock’s are $3-400 less than any of my Kahrs and there isn’t an IOTA of movement in the slide-to-frame fit and waddya know, they always run even without a BS “break-in period” (it’s 2021, any decent gun should be able to run out of the box with some lube). Sig P365 XL, HK P30SK, Walther PPQ, hell even my Canik which I picked up for $250 is super tight and reliable. Kahr’s gotten complacent and it will be there downfall in the near-future. Why my slide shoots forward when I dry fire and why my $800 “premium” gun rattles like a baby toy, I won’t know. According to Kahr, it’s within spec (lol). Not to mention the ball of metal on my slide left over from CNC, the absolutely damaged and dented backplate, the different colorations on my slide/frame, how any mag with the pinky extension won’t seat in my gun, and my slide serrations are all dented. Quality is not their concern nowadays

90% of new-ish shooters have never even heard of Kahr and there’s a reason for that

Lol, New shooters have never heard of Kahr? Of course not. that was true years ago when experienced owners of Kahr found a top Carry gun. New shooters? That is how you define a good gun, from what they know? You need to go over the Glock forum where all owners have never once had a issue, the guns are all perfect right out the box and where they never ever at any point needed a new part. By the way, I must have a crooked finger, because every Glock does this to my finger. And for sure I am not the only one. My God, even video's on how to dremel the damn trigger guard down. Of course CNN will tell you it is the fingers fault and not the guns.
New shooter's? Lol, you might learn that New Shooter's have not heard of a lot of guns? Why? There is a reason for this. And if you believe it is because if they had not, is because of the guns they never heard of is because of Bad performance, then all I can say is, What ever. But God how I love the internet. You did get one thing right the CM9 is in a class by itself. And a top shelf gun it is.

https://i.imgur.com/skcFhfw.jpg?2 https://i.imgur.com/i72BwdW.jpg

[rms2324]

Lol, New shooters have never heard of Kahr? Of course not. that was true years ago when experienced owners of Kahr found a top Carry gun. New shooters? That is how you define a good gun, from what they know? You need to go over the Glock forum where all owners have never once had a issue, the guns are all perfect right out the box and where they never ever at any point needed a new part. By the way, I must have a crooked finger, because every Glock does this to my finger. And for sure I am not the only one. My God, even video's on how to dremel the damn trigger guard down. Of course CNN will tell you it is the fingers fault and not the guns.
New shooter's? Lol, you might learn that New Shooter's have not heard of a lot of guns? Why? There is a reason for this. And if you believe it is because if they had not, is because of the guns they never heard of is because of Bad performance, then all I can say is, What ever. But God how I love the internet. You did get one thing right the CM9 is in a class by itself. And a top shelf gun it is.

https://i.imgur.com/skcFhfw.jpg?2 https://i.imgur.com/i72BwdW.jpg
This was from a place of emotion as I’ve had my new K9 back to Kahr twice, 4.5 months without it and they still did nothing to fix the issues even though I’ve specifically described them multiple times. I have scars from slide bite and Glock knuckle, I never said Glocks were perfect but as a tool, their durability and reliability are unmatched. I’m saying Kahr’s more-than-normal quality control issues, guns having to be sent back multiple times and still not being fixed and their complete lack of innovation is why they are not a force in the market anymore. You really think Glock, Sig, Ruger, and S&W are worried about competition with Kahr? They’re not even a thought in their mind

I’m not saying they’re bad guns whatsoever, I’m saying if you’re in the market for a carry gun, why would you go Kahr with a break in period, low capacity, historical reliability/QC issues (magazines especially) and very expensive relative to what’s on the market?

[FreeMe]

https://i.imgur.com/skcFhfw.jpg?2 https://i.imgur.com/i72BwdW.jpg

LOL. I'm wondering why in 2021 some pistol manufacturers are still sticking with hooked trigger guards. And it's just Kahr that isn't moving forward?

I have to agree though. How hard would it be to supply ten round mags for the T series? FTM, given the economy of plastic frames, how hard would it be to make a P9 grip slightly wider and go with a Shield style "stack & a half" mag? I sure ain't giving up mine, but without that innovation or something just as significant (hint...RDS-ready slide), I certainly have no reason to buy another Kahr product.

[Scott321]

Interesting... the 10 round magazine pictured on Kahr's website has 9-8 stamped on the side. Looks like they put a +2 extension on it and wanted some extra support above the baseplate wings. I guess they don't think there's a significant market for a 10 rounder that will fit in the T9 or TP9.

17667

I wonder if a TP9 slide would go on a P9 or CW9 frame. My TP45 fits on my CW45 frame and the dustcover is the same length.

[thinman]

S Series pistols have front slide serrations and have pic rail for flashlights and such. How hard would it be to add a red dot sight cut? Next, make the 4" TP9 slide available as an option on the S (same as P) Series receiver. Then we would have a 4" slide on a S Series size frame that already has available 10 round magazines. If one uses the Lothar barrel from the P Series might as well add the step cut chamber that the Walther Lothar uses. That would give us 10 round capability with front slide serrations, pic rail for accessories, absolute tack driver barrel and the only thing Kahr has to do is mix and match what is already on the shelf and do the little dab of engineering to program a CNC machine for the red dot sight cut and mounting screw holes in the slide. I want one.

[O'Dell]

Personally I glad Kahr hasn't jumped on the double stack bandwagon. I might quit buying them if they did. Currently I have fifteen pistols from Kahrs to SIG's , HK's, S&W, and 1911's. Only one holds over eight rounds in the mag, and that's my HK USP 40. I use it as my HD weapon because it's too large and heavy with 13 rounds to carry. I don't even bother to put in in my safe.

[hardluk1]

I don't visit this site often any more after several hand surgery's . I spent to last almost 7 years with heavier , wider , lighter trigger . I ended up giving 3 of my 4 kahrs two a son-in-law and daughter and I told a 10 year old grandson when he could fluidly rack a cm9 until the snap caps in the mag were gone it would be his and his momma's of course . Heck I can't do that any more , lost to much hand strength do to the surgery's . I can shot my ct45 again but the le commander I carry is easier faster and smoother to shot .

Ok back on subject . I still have the CT45 and I made a small notch in the edge bottom of the grip about 3/8ths wide and 3/16ths deep my flat bottom wilson combat 8 round mags run reliably and the 10 rounders run for back up needs . Got to watch some 1911 mags . MY stock colt mag and a old CMC needed some metal in front of the feed lips - lowered and or rounded . Kimber 8 round pro-mag runs fine too . Bottom line is I gain capacity and can buy mags at a lower price for many and have lower cost 10 round mags for back up .

I do wish kahr had made a 1" wide pistol years ago and offered a 38super in the 45 frame pistols . S&W with the model 59 had the small 1.5 wide double stack mag design back in '71 .WE have a P365xl and my gen 2 s&w 669 mags slides right on in but the tapper at the top is different so not useable . My s&w mags measure .80 wide and 1.250 deep . So a 1" wide grip was possible for kahr too .

I do wonder if a springfield EMP mag will work if any of the 9mm or 40 models kahrs .