Wife's hands

[jg rider]

Well it's the time in our lives when our hands have grown weaker. Wife now has arthritic hands so she now has a hard time cycling her K9 or her PM9. She's had surgery done and is now going for therapy. She's tried different other pistols like a Glock 43, Ruger LC9 and some others. They all have a stiffer recoil spring then her K9. I think that's because she may have a Lady Kahr recoil spring, no longer sold by Kahr in her K9. She's carried hers since 1998. I've ordered a lighter spring from Wolf but it wont be here for about 30 days (pandemic)
I don't think this will do the trick but we'll try.
Has anyone here suffer from the same hand issues and have come up with a solution. Cutting coils, another after market brand etc.

Thanks for reading this, John

[BirdsThaWord]

My friend is going through the same thing. Hard to get him to the range anymore as it is not a fun experience for him anymore. He has now gone to a snubby and a poly judge to avoid racking a slide. Best wishes to your wife on her recovery/therapy.

[finpro]

A recoil spring with much less strength is likely to transmit a lot more recoil to the shooter's hand, especially in a light, short grip PM9. Have you considered a LakeLine charging handle? (https://lakelinellc.com/shop/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) Kahr sells similar units. (https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) I have never seen one, but it is vaguely similar to charging ears that come on HK VP9s. I have one and I think this would help someone whose problem is gripping the thin slide, but who has the basic strength to retract the slide for loading. If you try this, let us know how it works for you.

[Bawanna]

I've wondered about those Beretta's with the tip up barrel. A little different program but saves the slide racking. I don't recall now the caliber options, if a 9 is available or not.

[getsome]

Another option might be a S&W Shield EZ…..Picked up one recently and it really is very easy to rack and the magazine has that thumb thing like a .22 to make mag loading much easier…..Never shot one and have no idea how the light spring effects recoil but shouldn’t be too bad with 9mm…….

[Bawanna]

I've been hankering to fondle one of them Shield EZ's myself. My wife can't rack a slide on hardly anything. Not sure I want an auto in her purse anyhow, her little 638 snubbie should be plenty.

[jg rider]

A recoil spring with much less strength is likely to transmit a lot more recoil to the shooter's hand, especially in a light, short grip PM9. Have you considered a LakeLine charging handle? (https://lakelinellc.com/shop/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) Kahr sells similar units. (https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) I have never seen one, but it is vaguely similar to charging ears that come on HK VP9s. I have one and I think this would help someone whose problem is gripping the thin slide, but who has the basic strength to retract the slide for loading. If you try this, let us know how it works for you.
I didn't know there was such a thing for Kahrs. My question is since wife carries iwb appendix carry, will the wing dig in to her skin. On the the S&W Shield, I haven't been able to locate one to look at. I think it may be bigger then a standard Shield because of the EZ internal hammer and spring vs. the shield striker system

[finpro]

I didn't know there was such a thing for Kahrs. My question is since wife carries iwb appendix carry, will the wing dig in to her skin. On the the S&W Shield, I haven't been able to locate one to look at. I think it may be bigger then a standard Shield because of the EZ internal hammer and spring vs. the shield striker system

If the inside of the charging handle is a problem for her, there are holsters that have a layer of material between the rear of the slide and the body. It would also be possible to diminish and smooth the body side edge of the charging handle. On a VP9 the wings are separate units and I removed the body side wing, leaving the outside wing, because I thought it would be better for carrying. When I decided that a VP9 was too big for carrying compared to a smaller double stack, I replaced the inside wing and it now serves as a house gun. At about $40 for the Kahr charging handle, if this works for her, it is the cheap way to go. I think I may be talking myself into getting one for my MP9.

[jg rider]

There's a company out there called Tandem Kross that makes a cocker for Ruger. 22s and Browning .22s. It fits around the slides and has a loop in the back to insert a finger to cock the slide. I wonder if someone makes something like that for a Kahr. Doesn't Glocks have something like that ?

It's gonna be hard to pull the wife away from her kahrs. K9 for winter carry and PM9 for summers

https://youtu.be/qMsNjn82BmI

https://youtu.be/aTqtx3d-pfk

https://youtu.be/5vvwq8miWww

[wyntrout]

My wife isn't arthritic, but she's 65 now and never could rack the Kahrs. I bought her a P9, a P380, and then a G-19 gen. 3, and then a gen. 4 to no avail. After the G-43 came out I tried one of those and then bought a Blue Label one for her. Fortunately Glock had improved the connector by then and gotten the 5.5 pound or so trigger pull correct. She could cock the Glocks but they were too big. The G-43 was kind of like the Goldilocks "just right".

She hasn't shot it since the first range trip after I bought it, but it is ready at the head of her side of the bed. I haven't been to the range much in the last two years, but she's not interested in going with me. She's retired USAF and not unused to guns, but doesn't want to practice much.

There are replacement "toggles" for the rear back plate of the Kahrs. I favor teaching to use the support hand and placing the fingers over the slide with the thumb along the slide and simultaneous racking by holding the gun close to the chest and pushing the gun away while pulling the slide to the rear with the support hand. Avoid getting the fingers in the way of the ejection support and pull the support hand clear quickly to allow the slide to cleanly go forward... no "riding" the slide as that could lead to incomplete chambering, especially with Kahrs.

Another biggie is gripping the Kahr firmly. A loose or weak grip causes loss of momentum to the slide and incomplete chamberings... something you don't want in a possible fight to the death!

[Bawanna]

There's a company out there called Tandem Kross that makes a cocker for Ruger. 22s and Browning .22s. It fits around the slides and has a loop in the back to insert a finger to cock the slide. I wonder if someone makes something like that for a Kahr. Doesn't Glocks have something like that ?

It's gonna be hard to pull the wife away from her kahrs. K9 for winter carry and PM9 for summers

https://youtu.be/qMsNjn82BmI

https://youtu.be/aTqtx3d-pfk

https://youtu.be/5vvwq8miWww

With your talent I can't imagine you couldn't come up with something similar to the loop. That's actually not a bad idea.

[jg rider]

My wife isn't arthritic, but she's 65 now and never could rack the Kahrs. I bought her a P9, a P380, and then a G-19 gen. 3, and then a gen. 4 to no avail. After the G-43 came out I tried one of those and then bought a Blue Label one for her. Fortunately Glock had improved the connector by then and gotten the 5.5 pound or so trigger pull correct. She could cock the Glocks but they were too big. The G-43 was kind of like the Goldilocks "just right".

She hasn't shot it since the first range trip after I bought it, but it is ready at the head of her side of the bed. I haven't been to the range much in the last two years, but she's not interested in going with me. She's retired USAF and not unused to guns, but doesn't want to practice much.

There are replacement "toggles" for the rear back plate of the Kahrs. I favor teaching to use the support hand and placing the fingers over the slide with the thumb along the slide and simultaneous racking by holding the gun close to the chest and pushing the gun away while pulling the slide to the rear with the support hand. Avoid getting the fingers in the way of the ejection support and pull the support hand clear quickly to allow the slide to cleanly go forward... no "riding" the slide as that could lead to incomplete chambering, especially with Kahrs.

Another biggie is gripping the Kahr firmly. A loose or weak grip causes loss of momentum to the slide and incomplete chamberings... something you don't want in a possible fight to the death!
My wife is now turning 75 and the problem is her strong hand. Her pain is in the web. She pulls with the left and used to push with the right. Now any pressure she puts in the web of her right hand causes pain. Doc and therapist say things should get better in about a year. They both want to know why would she want to shoot.

[jg rider]

With your talent I can't imagine you couldn't come up with something similar to the loop. That's actually not a bad idea.
Hi Bawanna,
It's been a while. This is what Tandemkross has to offer.


https://youtu.be/MsFCBQTS5nQ

[getsome]

jg give a look at a S&W Shield EZ….I was surprised at how little effort it took to rack the slide on that pistol and it might just work for her without adding any gizmos that might get in the way of a clean draw…...If the web of her shooting hand is the problem they make the EZ pistol in .380 ACP (sorry Bawanna) but it might be a choice so she can keep in the shooting game……..Sometimes you just have to do what you can to stay armed……

[finpro]

For those with slide retraction issues, something worth trying is to position their trigger finger in the trigger guard BEHIND the trigger which allows a better grip and slightly more leverage. I think this is actually a better and safer way to load pistols with difficult slides. With the trigger finger tightly against the frame behind the trigger, there is no danger of a trigger finger slipping off the frame into the front of the trigger. This only works for pistols, like Kahrs, whose triggers don't move rearward when retracting the slide. And, there is no cost.
Something else to teach such shooters is that Kahr rear steel sights and dovetails are strong enough to catch against something hard and push to retract the slide. Knowing this is useful in case there is a need to load a chamber with one hand in an emergency.

[jg rider]

jg give a look at a S&W Shield EZ….I was surprised at how little effort it took to rack the slide on that pistol and it might just work for her without adding any gizmos that might get in the way of a clean draw…...If the web of her shooting hand is the problem they make the EZ pistol in .380 ACP (sorry Bawanna) but it might be a choice so she can keep in the shooting game……..Sometimes you just have to do what you can to stay armed……
Hi,
I would look at one if I could find one. It still would be a hard sell to the wife. Her theory is that she only has to rack the slide twice. Once to chamber a round and once to clear the chambered round. Both scenarios almost don't apply to her since her Kahrs are always loaded for bear. I said almost because when using practice ammo I do the clearing of her edc ammo and loading of the practice ammo.
Her Kahrs were bought in 1998 and 2001 and have never missed a beat, no misfires, ftf, fte, nothing , nada. But! I tell her it could happen and what are you going to do then ? Crickets !

[jg rider]

A recoil spring with much less strength is likely to transmit a lot more recoil to the shooter's hand, especially in a light, short grip PM9. Have you considered a LakeLine charging handle? (https://lakelinellc.com/shop/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) Kahr sells similar units. (https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) I have never seen one, but it is vaguely similar to charging ears that come on HK VP9s. I have one and I think this would help someone whose problem is gripping the thin slide, but who has the basic strength to retract the slide for loading. If you try this, let us know how it works for you.

Thanks finpro,
I bought one of those Lakeline units. But it won't work for us. It's too small to grip, has sharp corners that hurt her fingers when pulling back the slide and digs jnto her skin when holstered.
181341813318135
Found this item on Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/Handi-Racker-Safest-Pistols-Green-Compact/dp/B01BFMD9U4

On that same Amazon page it shows some slide rackers for Glocks that look if they could be redesigned for Kahrs

I also found 3 Lady Kahr recoil springs from days gone by in my stock pile. FYI I also ordered a reduced spring from Wolf that's rated at 18#. The lady Kahr springs are lighter
(https://www.amazon.com/Handi-Racker-Safest-Pistols-Green-Compact/dp/B01BFMD9U4)

[Bawanna]

My wife is now turning 75 and the problem is her strong hand. Her pain is in the web. She pulls with the left and used to push with the right. Now any pressure she puts in the web of her right hand causes pain. Doc and therapist say things should get better in about a year. They both want to know why would she want to shoot.

My doctor asked if I knew where to get any 9 ammo. He lives in town and I did the background checks on guns, saw his name come up so I asked about it next visit. Took him a couple boxes next trip. This was before the ammo pandemic we have now of course. Now I'd trade 6 rounds for an office call.

[jg rider]

Well I contacted Lakeline ( Al ) and he is kind enough to take the part back. Haven't followed up on what this company has to offer but I will. Good customer relations !

[Bawanna]

Well I contacted Lakeline ( Al ) and he is kind enough to take the part back. Haven't followed up on what this company has to offer but I will. Good customer relations !

Al's a good guy, lives on the good side of my state. Met him once, been trying to meet up again for years, maybe it'll happen one of these days.

[FreeMe]

I didn't know there was such a thing for Kahrs. My question is since wife carries iwb appendix carry, will the wing dig in to her skin. On the the S&W Shield, I haven't been able to locate one to look at. I think it may be bigger then a standard Shield because of the EZ internal hammer and spring vs. the shield striker system

The EZ is indeed bigger than the Shield. In fact, the EZ has very little in common with the standard Shield, other than both being plastic modified Browning style handguns produced by S&W. Most of the size difference is the 1/2" longer barrel and 1/8" wider slide.

It may be though that S&W has found the best solution so far for arthritic hands. Besides the easier slide manipulation, it's also much easier to disassemble and clean. As much as I like my Kahrs, you gotta hand it to S&W for innovation.

[atp]

For an easy-to-rack pistol (click to see Lightfighter discussion) (https://www.lightfighter.net/topic/ccw-gun-when-you-can-t-carry-gun?reply=122359012719304280#122359012719304280), I concur with those recommending the S&W Shield EZ line, in either .380 or 9mm. The EZ .380 is super-friendly both to rack and to fire. Downside is that it's rather large, which might be a problem for carry. But try them, as if their slides are still too heavy, probably EVERYTHING will be, and you'll know you need to look into more exotic solutions (like maybe Beretta tip-up barrels).

I recall racking the Glock 43 slide to be very similar to the Sig P365. So if the Glock 43 recoil spring is too heavy for her hands, my guess is the Sig P365 and most other compact 9mm pistols will be too. If a bigger pistol is an option, perhaps try a full-size 9mm like the Sig P320. The heavier full-length slide may allow setting it up with extra-light springs. I believe some competition shooters do that, so after-market recoil springs in various weights are available (but only for the full-length slide, not the compact).

Compared to the usual modified-Browning tilting-barrel system, rotary barrel pistols like the Beretta PX4 Storm and Grand Power K100 are said to have lower recoil and allow much lighter recoil springs. But I've never used any of those myself, so I'm not sure.

In smaller .380 pistols, the Sig P238 is very friendly to shoot, only modestly larger than a Kahr P380, and it's slide is MUCH easier to rack than the P380, although still heavier than the S&W EZ .380. If you like 1911-style SAO pistols, the Sig P238 is very nice. Downside is it is stupidly expensive, often $650+, and really only available in that one size format, no choice about slide or grip length.

The new Ruger LCP Max double-stack .380 is worth a look. Slide spring weight is moderate, definitely much less than Kahr P380. Good sights, good grip; but I haven't shot one yet. Trigger is mediocre, but probably ok; to me it feels sort of like a weirdly long Glock trigger. Length of trigger pull seems similar to Kahr, perhaps slightly shorter, although IMO the Kahr trigger pull is smoother and better.

Rumor is that Sig is working on a new .380 pistol based on the their P365. I love the P365 (and XL), so that's interesting to me. But I have no idea if this new .380 is supposed to just be a P365 chambered in .380, making it large for a .380, sort of like the S&W EZ but double-stack. Or if it will be something smaller, like the Ruger LCP Max. Or whether it will ever actually come to market at all, of course!

[atp]

Have you considered a LakeLine charging handle? (https://lakelinellc.com/shop/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/) Kahr sells similar units. (https://shopkahrfirearmsgroup.com/kahr-9mm-charging-handle/)
That sounds worth trying. If the problem is not enough grip strength causing her hand to slip off the slide too early when racking, that extra bit sticking out the side might be enough for her to hold on. I guess the arthritis is only in her fingers and not her wrist, if she SHOOTS the PM9 just fine!

[BirdsThaWord]

I did not read through all the posts, but my $0.02 ... I just picked up a LCP ii EZ 22 LR. It racks ridiculously EZ. If she gets a chance to try one out at a gun store. 11 rounds of high velocity 22 LR with little recoil.

[atp]

Sig announced the P365 .380 ACP (https://americanhandgunner.com/handguns/popular-sig-sauer-p365-now-available-in-380-acp/). Turns out, it really is just a P365 in .380, exact same frame size as the 9mm.

[atp]

I just picked up a LCP ii EZ 22 LR. It racks ridiculously EZ.
That's a good suggestion. I just wish the LCP II .22 LR had the superior sights of the LCP Max.

[laserfish]

My wife has the same arthritis problem in her thumbs. The EZ was really easy for her to rack, but she liked the Springfield Hellcat feel better and she could rack it easily. Bought it with the Hex red dot installed and she is deadly accurate with it. Has zero problems racking the Hellcat and cannot even move my K9. I love it too! Can I put a red dot on my T-9? I think that would be ultimate.

[FreeMe]

... Can I put a red dot on my T-9? I think that would be ultimate.

Galloway Precision can mill your Kahr slide for a dot.

The only Kahr I've seen with a dot sight mounted was the T9 that Justin Moon was shooting in one of the videos on the Kahr website a couple years ago. That video has apparently been removed since then.