From Leader to Trailer

[dao]

I would have said Follower but I'm not convinced that Justin even cares to compete enough to play the wonder nine game of ever-increasing capacity.
Below are pictures of my PM9 and P365X. Don't get me wrong I'm still greatly fond of my Kahrs, even moreso than my size-comparable Sigs. But these pictures give a pretty good illustration of what Kahr is up against, or would be if Justin decides to get back in the game.
My PM9 with the Lakeline extension is a 6+1 gun. The P365 with a flush fit mag is 12+1 and with the extended mag is 15+1 with only about 3/4" added to the grip length in the latter case. The Sig is the same in slide width, not as tall with the 12rd mag vs. Kahr with the extended mag, and just a bit longer in slide length (3/8"). It's less than 3ozs. heavier than the Kahr with an empty mag in each. Not a lot to add to the pocket or holster in order to get either 6 or 9 add'tl rounds.
I have no doubt Justin could again make the Kahr a leader in its class if he cared to. The big questions are, does he want to? And will he?
Even if Kahr never gives us a K45 it would be great to see a PM9D that is double stack no bigger than the P365X and able to match the capacity, but with the buttery smooth DA trigger it already has. My wallet would suffer but my admiration would be even higher.

[DavidR]

I just sold my CM9. It was a great and reliable gun but since I bought my first P365 in October 2019 I have not carried the CM9. Given a choice, I will choose the 365 every time. For me it’s a few reasons:

1) I shoot the 365 better

2) The 365 has higher capacity

3) No difference in ease of carry


DAO: with your Lakeline extension I think your PM9 is 7+1.

[dao]

Yeah, you're right David, that mag is 7+1 with the extension.

I keep a spreadsheet with miscellaneous details for my modest collection (including the date on which they all sank on the boat), but if I don't reference it I do sometimes remember the details wrong.

I haven't shot my P365X yet, but I think I'm really going to like it. I've heard they're relatively soft shooting, you gotta love the capacity, and they're easy to carry. But I still like my Kahr's better for the trigger, the looks, and the feel in hand.

[OMCHamlin]

Well, I sold my PM9 several months after picking up a P365ms as well. It's hard to argue the more size efficient platform, unless you simply result to raw emotion...

For right now, my Kahr CW45 stays put, as I know of no better platform for that round and my needs. (Plus, I took a heat gun and re-purposed a Glock 43X holster to the CW, and it is perfection for holstering the Kahr.)

[yqtszhj]

I think about the only thing the cm9 still has going for it is weight by a very, very, very slim margin. That said I haven’t carried my cm9 in so long I can’t remember when. I’ve recently been carrying a g43 with a magguts for 8 plus 1 because it pockets better, or a g48 with 15 round shield arms mags.

Kahr has slipped behind I’d say.

[JohnR]

I like the Kahr trigger better, my CM9 is staying.

Otherwise, I posted years ago that Kahr could fit a staggered 9mm mag in a grip the width of the PM45. All the other gun makers listened to me.

[King Rat]

The Kahr is one classy gun. I mean, it just has a cool look and feel. Just something about them. Either you are a fan or you are not. And plenty of fans out there. My CM9's are definitely not going anywhere. And 7 or 8 rounds is more than enough for any practical EDC.

[jeepster09]

I recently acquired a Sig P938 [Baby 1911] it holds 8 rounds super light and slim. I really like it.

[dao]

You can use the Kimber 8rd mags in that with no problem at all Jeep, giving you 9rds of baby 1911 sweetness. It adds about 3/8" to the bottom of the grip past where your current 7rd mags are.

[Armybrat]

I like the Kahr trigger better, my CM9 is staying.

Otherwise, I posted years ago that Kahr could fit a staggered 9mm mag in a grip the width of the PM45. All the other gun makers listened to me.

That’s what I’ve been hoping for, but am through waiting. Am looking at the Sig P365, the Ruger Max 9, and the S&W CSX.

Justin Moon has apparently decided to concentrate on the Auto Ordnance & Magnum Research branches of his firearms group at the expense of Kahr.
Disappointing, to say the least.

[JohnR]

I’m a fan of the Shield Plus. The Hellcat and 365 seem nice, but I can’t get excited about them for some reason.

[DavidR]

I really like my Shield 1.0. It’s a little bigger than the 365 and Hellcat but still easy to carry at 1:00 because it’s so thin. The grip on the Shield Plus may be a bit larger than I like.

[JohnR]

The Plus grip isn’t really plus size, the difference between it and the old Shield is barely noticeable.

[DavidR]

I hope to fondle one soon.

[dao]

Had one (Shield Plus). And sold it. I could not get the slide to cycle with all 13 rounds in the larger magazine. Either by hand or after firing. Once the top round was gone it did fine. I only shot about 50 rounds through it so it might have broken in past that but I traded it for something I wanted more. It shot well, felt good and as with most Smiths it appeared to be of good build quality. Pocketable too.
I've seen vids on youtube of some experiencing bulging mags with the new CSX when filled to capacity. To the point where they have to be manually yarded out of the magwell. Methinks Smith might be rushing things to market a bit too fast these days.

[JohnR]

My Plus has been flawless since day one. I bought two additional 13 round mags, when I was able to find them. One appears to have had the spring from the smaller mag put in it, as the follower doesn't reach the top when empty. No matter, I intend to install MagGuts kits when they come out, so I'll have a 15+1 Shield. One of the other mags takes extra effort to get the 13th round in, but it does go in.

[guido4198]

If anyone has been following my thread in the "Other firearms" section you'll notice that my interest in the Sig P365 wasn't driven by a desire for more rounds. I put the MagGuts +1 in the 6rd Kahr magazines for my CM9. 7+1 in my EDC gun has been fine. I recently acquired the Sig P365X and now carry 12+1. Frankly, the extra 5 rounds isn't a "make or break" for me. For domestic EDC, and especially since I got out of the 1% Biker world...I was fine with 8 in the gun. I've been in places overseas where my EDC was a Browning Hi-Power and (at least) 2 spare magazines. What DID make a difference was the opportunity to get into a quality carry gun with a red dot. My eyes aren't great and having a red dot sight that works real well with my everyday "street" glasses was the reason for getting the Sig. If we're talking about ideas we wish Kahr Arms had produced or would produce...I wish they offered a slide for my CM9 with a red dot installed at an attractive price point. I'd have grabbed that and not the Sig.

[DavidR]

The Plus grip isn’t really plus size, the difference between it and the old Shield is barely noticeable.

My LGS has a Plus with night sights for $469. I quickly walked away from the counter. [emoji15]

Maybe next week I’ll bring in my 1.0 and see about an upgrade. I need to find out if it will fit my Vedder Light Tuck.

[pk1313]

I've been a competitive shooter for most of my life. I haven't competed with my black front target sights and black rear sights in a few years, last time I went to the range - I had a very hard time picking them up. I don't have red dot mini reflex on any of my carry guns - but I think I'm headed that way. I can send some of my Kahr slides to get milled or just start over and look at other brands or maybe Kahr can offer a slide cut option for existing owners on their website or offer a RMR cut out option on their new slides / pistols.

My brain started clicking when a saw the optics ready PSA Dagger for $349 and almost anywhere you can find SIG ROMEO ZERO's for $150 - $500 gets you a 15 rnd red dot optics topped pistol - brand spankin new

[SlowBurn]

Consider a CT laser grip? Mine work great and don’t change the guns profiles.

[Bawanna]

I still am really fond of all my Kahrs, my T9 and my PM45 probably leading the Kahr pack.

[dao]

+1 on the PM45. I decided not to bid on the last T9 I saw. Still regretting it.

[JohnR]

I still am really fond of all my Kahrs, my T9 and my PM45 probably leading the Kahr pack.
Didn’t you get a Sig P210? How would you compare the 210 to the T9? Or was that someone else?

[Bawanna]

Didn’t you get a Sig P210? How would you compare the 210 to the T9? Or was that someone else?

I did get a P210 Sig and it's absolutely delightful. If I had to choose between the two the Sig would win hands down but thankfully I don't have to choose so I get to keep both. The T fits just about everyone that has held one like it was made for them. Especially me. That being said, the T is more practical for a carry piece. The 210 especially the Target model like I got is really not with the big comfy grip etc. There is a 210 Carry now with a more normal grip that might make a fine carry piece.

[O'Dell]

Personally, I'm quite happy with my four Kahrs, PM9, MK40, CM45, and CW45 just as they are. I don't care for staggered Mags as the extra rounds just add weight and widen the grip. Of my fourteen Pistols, only one holds more than eight rounds, and it's too large to carry. The HK USP 40 does make a good HD weapon though with excellent night sights and thirteen round mags.

[MMyers1970]

You are absolutely correct. I can't imagine Kahr sells very many pistols anymore. The CW380 probably sold ok for a while because it was the smallest, nicest .380. But Ruger has the LCP II and the LCP Max for about the same money, with much higher name recognition and market penetration.

I don't think many people are going to spend what Kahr wants for a PM9 when they can get a Hellcat or P365 or Shield Plus for less money.

[King Rat]

You are absolutely correct. I can't imagine Kahr sells very many pistols anymore. The CW380 probably sold ok for a while because it was the smallest, nicest .380. But Ruger has the LCP II and the LCP Max for about the same money, with much higher name recognition and market penetration.

I don't think many people are going to spend what Kahr wants for a PM9 when they can get a Hellcat or P365 or Shield Plus for less money.


Ill take the Kahr 380 any day over any LCP. I have owned many LCP's own two Kahr CW380 and p380. For one thing they will run the Rugers to to the ground in quality and longevitiy, Trust me, I know this for a fact. . And if someone wants a Micro 9 they CAN get a Kahr CM9. And by the way I do have a Sig 365. The Kahr's are not going anywhere. In fact the Kahr CM'9s are going for around $422.00 which is heck of a deal. Where can I get a Sig for that price? Or Hellcat?

[berettabone]

We paid $240 for the wife's LCP II. You get what you pay for. Minimal everything. If you get 1200 rds. through it, be happy. It's not supposed to be quality. It's a throwaway gun. It shoots well for what it is. If you're someone who doesn't practice or shoot a lot, it's a pretty good buy. IMHO, a going to the mailbox gun. A bit overpriced currently.

[Armybrat]

I paid $170 new for the last regular LCP about 3 years ago. Paid $300 for my first one in 2008.
Paid $380 for an LCP Max in February, but I seriously doubt it will drop $100+ in price any time soon.

[DavidR]

The Plus grip isn’t really plus size, the difference between it and the old Shield is barely noticeable.

You’re absolutely correct. Rented one today. Barely noticeable but for me a definite improvement. The grip, being a little thicker, feels better proportioned. I will soon have one. [emoji16]

[JohnR]

Hogue customer service recommends the Shield 45 beavertail grip if you want one for the Plus 9mm.

[DavidR]

It felt really good stock. Maybe a Talon grip or maybe not. Time will tell.

[DavidR]

Yep, Shield Plus is a winner.

Fed, fired and ejected all 125 rounds. Three different types of range ammo and 20 rounds of Federal Punch.

The stock grip, including the texturing, is perfect for me. Grip size, grip texture and trigger are a huge improvement over the original Shield.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220505/6913d5e64c60b5ab06f0e9cf7e3cce42.jpg

[dao]

I liked my Shield Plus, but not enough to keep me from trading it in toward a Colt 1911 :D

Nice little shooter though.