New member surprised with all the tech issues I'm seeing

[Grizzly]

Hi everyone,
With Illinois poised to pass restrictive gun legislation I'm looking for a single stack for ccw. My 1911 is too heavy for that, snubs are fine, but I also want a med small auto. The Kahr is drawing me strongly since I'm accustomed to dao in revolvers and also my Sig P250 w/nice 3 dot sights, which Illinois will probably ban due to a high magazine capacity.

So I started reading here and right away I'm seeing things like front sights falling off of CW-9s, ejection issues with folks dremeling the barrel shroud and its is really causing me to wonder if the Kahrs are the way to go. I was originally interested in the 45 but think I may stick with 9mm since I'm 75 with arthritis. Any complaints from old timers about racking slides? I'm also considering the carbon fiber grip since some say it is more comfortable and somewhat cushioned.

So, are my initial fears justified? Just how problematic are these CWs and do I need to start with a premium?

[yqtszhj]

If you get a CW9 I think you’ll be happy. I’ve had 3 Kahr 9mm’s (cw9 cm9, and ct9) and my experience with them has been good. The CW9 is nice to shoot and the CT9 is a dream and super smooth, just a little bigger. The CM9 is a little harder to rack the slide but still not too bad.

[BirdsThaWord]

Welcome Grizzly. The tech issues you see would be duplicated on any forum specific to any gun, I do believe. This is just a good place to get those questions answered or ideas on upgrades when something isn’t working or a desire to upgrade is present. I concur with yqtszhj in that the chances of getting a good one is quite high. Now as far as the racking part, Kahrs are known to have strong recoil springs. You may want to find one you can test out before spending the dough. I’m saying that only because you mentioned the arthritis. That point alone may make it not right for you. I have 3 Kahrs (two 45’s and a 9mm), and am fine to rack them all. But, other guns I own do rack much easier. I’d hate to see you spend the bucks only to have to sell it.

[O'Dell]

I have had eight Kahrs in the last 12 - 15 years and currently have four. You're right about a Kahr being an excellent carry gun. Although I have fifteen pistols to choose from, all semis, I nearly always have a CM45 or a MK40N in my holster or a PM9 in my pocket.

Of these eight Kahrs, I have never had a problem or sent a gun back to Kahr for repairs. Unfortunately, I can't say the same for my SIG's, HK's or SA's.

[kenemoore]

I currently own a MK-9, a K-9, a T-9, a PM-9, a PM45 and a CW380. The CW380 is the only one I had any issues with. The K9 is my favorite. About the weight of an officer's 1911, all metal, great shooter. Remember, lots of people ***** about problem guns, but almost nobody praises good ones.

[sorcerer]

I currently have 3 Kahr’s. They were all used when purchased. The first was a CW9, the second was K9, lastly MK9. All have been flawless as long as I do my part. The K9 is the only one I have had an issue with and that was my doing. I had been carrying it for an extended amount of time and decided to shoot in at a IDPA match. First string of fire it wasn’t returning to battery and I was having to “tap” the rear of the slide after each shot. The only person I beat that night was the person who was DQed. After a quick check at the safety table I found that the gun needed to be lubed. Out to my car and a spritzer of lube to the rails it ran flawlessly the rest of the night.

[tokuno]

K9, P9, CW9, MK9, PM9, all shoot great, nothing has fallen off. My first thought was similar to BirdsThaWord's: People with problems on a particular make of anything beat a path to the appropriate forums for resolution. I appreciate the solid support here for those who do report issues.
My knobby knuckles and bent joints portend future issues, but I haven't noticed grip strength loss (yet, knock on wood); I'm a poor measure for your question about racking Kahrs. However, all of my kids could rack them with no issues when they were younger. They were taught the overhand, bent-elbow grip with a push-away with strong arm.

[Grizzly]

Good replies, thank you all. This seems like a nice forum as judged by how many of you have already responded to a new guy here. Thanks again. I suppose I'd see the same thing on any forum. It's probably just that I'm new to Kahrs and more aware of all the problem questions being addressed. There is a CT45 I may look at today and a CT9 in all black that I found nearby online that interests me at a good price under 300 that I'm hoping I could pick up in person. I've never liked all stainless since shooting a revolver with stainless sights years ago. I have had other stainless revolvers with black sights and have not had any problems at all with the glare of inability to find or see the sights since. I guess it's just one of those things that sticks in your brain whether it's still a problem or not.

It looks like Illinois may have to go to single stacks if this legislation passes. Since I'm replacing a compact Sig P250 (looks identical to the P320, only dao) I'm trying to decide between a 4" Kahr and a 4" Shield. I already have light carry guns and I'm leaning more towards the low 20 ish ounce weight and accuracy potential. The Kahr would be the lightest in this now dwindling class of autos. Any thoughts?

[Bawanna]

My theory on state legislation is if they are thinking about banning something buy as many of those as you can possibly afford as quickly as you can. Bans are a great booster for gun sales.

Welcome Grizzly, glad you found us. We're a pretty small group these days and some new folks to liven the place up is a wonderful thing.

[yqtszhj]

Good replies, thank you all. This seems like a nice forum as judged by how many of you have already responded to a new guy here. Thanks again. I suppose I'd see the same thing on any forum. It's probably just that I'm new to Kahrs and more aware of all the problem questions being addressed. There is a CT45 I may look at today and a CT9 in all black that I found nearby online that interests me at a good price under 300 that I'm hoping I could pick up in person. I've never liked all stainless since shooting a revolver with stainless sights years ago. I have had other stainless revolvers with black sights and have not had any problems at all with the glare of inability to find or see the sights since. I guess it's just one of those things that sticks in your brain whether it's still a problem or not.

It looks like Illinois may have to go to single stacks if this legislation passes. Since I'm replacing a compact Sig P250 (looks identical to the P320, only dao) I'm trying to decide between a 4" Kahr and a 4" Shield. I already have light carry guns and I'm leaning more towards the low 20 ish ounce weight and accuracy potential. The Kahr would be the lightest in this now dwindling class of autos. Any thoughts?

A ct9 in all black under 3 I’d have to get. I also wish Sig would have kept making the P250. I love those DAO semi auto’s. My son has the compact also and I told him don’t sell it because I’ll buy it from him.

[Scarpia]

Griz...welcome to Kahr world. Kahr uses 20lb springs to manage recoil. I find that 20lb is way over engineered for recoil management. I replaced three of my four Kahrs (PM9, MK9, K9) recoil springs with 18.5lb versions available from Wolff. The reduced spring force does not make the racking easy but does reduce the effort and has no effect on the function of the slide. I also changed the striker spring from factory 6lbs to 5lbs also available from Wolff. For the record, I'm 78 zeroing in on 79. I rack the slide "once" and leave the gun with a round chambered in my gun locker. When I choose a Kahr for carrying, I stuff it in a holster and off I go. These are not range guns where you might be struggling to chamber a round frequently. I don't suggest a spring force less than 18lbs. At say 16lbs, you are tampering with the gun's timing.

As far as parts coming loose goes, I have not experienced any issues with my Kahrs, but I have had parts fly off my Ruger's, cracked frames in a S&W Shield and a G3C Taurus, grip screws loosening is not uncommon in any gun. I have since decided to carry only metal framed guns in high the pressure 9mm and 40S&W calibers. In the lower pressure 45ACP, I do carry polymer framed guns, namely the CW45, Shield 45 and Springfield XD-Mod 2 Subcompact. I'm close to adding a Glock 30 in 45ACP to the collection. There are other guns on the market with easy to rack slides. Check out Ruger and S&W for their hammer fired guns.

By the way and unrelated to your posting, I often wonder what would be said about Colt, Smith and Wesson, Winchester, etc. if the web existed 100+ years ago? I'm sure someone would claim Colt guns were junk, S&W's were cheap, the Winchester 73 was a useless rifle.

[Bawanna]

That would be interesting if the web existed back then. Course by today's standards they all were cheap back then. Be nice to jump in the time machine and go back an buy a sack full of each, especially the 73's, ok and the Colts and S&W's too. Oh, and maybe several Schoefield's too long as we're dreaming.

[kenemoore]

Colone, you could make a small fortune with Single Action Colt revolvers.

[Scott321]

Hi everyone,
...I'm accustomed to dao in revolvers and also my Sig P250...

So I started reading here and right away I'm seeing things like front sights falling off of CW-9s, ejection issues with folks dremeling the barrel shroud and its is really causing me to wonder if the Kahrs are the way to go. I was originally interested in the 45 but think I may stick with 9mm since I'm 75 with arthritis. Any complaints from old timers about racking slides? I'm also considering the carbon fiber grip since some say it is more comfortable and somewhat cushioned...

IMO...

1. My father is 80. He's familiar with firearms. He still wrist curls 80+ lbs for reps (probably what gave him arthritis in the first place). He can't reciprocate the slide on my K9 nor my CW45. The hand position and pressure to rack the slide cause severe pain... IMO from a pinched nerve for placing pressure on the slide in that way. I might suggest you try to rack the slide in the shop. If your technique and particular arthritis ailments aren't an issue, then it looks like a green light.

2. I have a CW45 (and a PM45 and TP45). I usually shoot and carry WWB JHP with no issues (although I use Corbon Short barrel for my PM45 when carrying and that kicks more). The kick on the CW45 with WWB JHP loads is very manageable. I can only compare to my CM9 and K9. The K9 has noticeably less recoil with a high grip, but IMO the CM9 with +P's is not any more controllable than the CW45 with WWB JHP (IIRC Fed HST 45 is loaded similarly). Your mileage may vary. Additionally, I did spend about 60 seconds with some sandpaper on the 45's at the top of the back straps to get a mm or two higher hold... but that's not something I've seen anyone else do, and I don't have a lot of meat between my thumb and forefinger.,

3. Every manufacturer has an occasional lemon. Of the eight I own, one is still on the "questionable" pile, even after it was sent back to Kahr and the problem was 'reduced.'

[tokuno]

As far as parts coming loose goes, I have not experienced any issues with my Kahrs, but I have had parts fly off my Ruger's . . .

Never experienced a Kahr problem, but I did experience the sight sliding slideways in the dovetail of either the Ruger or Buckmark - can't remember which one it was . . . *ahem* rca indicated that some anonymous knucklehead forgot to tighten a screw . . . .:rolleyes:
I think the same wingnut maybe sheepishly remembers rotating his brother's tires back in high school and forgetting to snug the left front lugnuts . . . might've been the same half-wit who wasted an afternoon pulling apart the garage to retrieve a 1911 recoil spring . . . I need to start hanging out with a higher quality persona.

[Grizzly]

I made it to the shop to look at the CT45. The coarse texture of the grip was really surprising. Why did they make it so rough front and back? I may have to take a second look, but the first impression was, no way. I can't seem to find one of the carbon fiber coated frames for sale. Watching a few reviews, I got the impression that they had some kind of softer give to them. Probably an older offering? I'm sure some judicious sanding would mellow the grip out. Are there any Hogue type slip on covers for them? I have one on my LCP Custom which works fine at thickening the thin grip frame and adds a nice gripping surface also.

I can't even remember what my reaction was to racking the slide. I know it was doable, but I can't remember how much effort it took. I may have to take a second look. The market has really gone whole hog high capacity. Single stacks or 10 round capacity pistols are certainly in the minority right now. The courts may in time reel back some of this restrictive gun legislation, but that may still take years. Illinois finally elected enough dems to get their way and are not slowing down and plan on passing this high capacity ban along with their list of rifles and shotguns and pistols they plan on banning the sale and future ownership of along with registration. I'm sure the lawyers are waiting to start challenging it in court.

Here is a question for everyone. How well do you shoot your Kahrs compared to your compact 4" autos the size of Glock 19s, M&Ps and other pistols with barrels shorter than duty models at ranges of 15 to 25 yard? I'm thinking they are easier to more precise with than the 4" Kahrs.

[HSparrow]

3"-4" groups at 15 yards with my K40 no different than my WWII Colt 1911. I am not a tupperware (composite) fan of any lowers on any pistol. I was looking for another Kahr a K9mm in black. I stopped by my dealer wo sells Kahrs and Kimbers. He said he had no luck in finding one for me except for used no thanks. A bud and I were at a range a couple weeks ago I bought my K40, and he brought his Kimber Micro in 9MM. We swapped guns and put many rounds with each other gun. The only comment was the gun was really snappy and it took him a few rounds to get use to it. I have been shooting the K40 for 10 years now never an issue. I was impressed with his Kimber micro. I stopped at my favorite dealer and asked if he had any luck in locating me a K9mm. No, he had talked to Kahr, and they are not in production but will be in the future. He had lots of tupperware ones but no dice. After shooting my buds Kimber I looked at the Kimbers. He has a dozen or so with no tupperware lowers. I ended up buying a Kimber micro 9 rapide scorpius. Don't get me wrong I love my K40 and will still carry it most of the time. If he had a K9 in black it would have been gone.

[yqtszhj]

The micro 9 platform is nice. I have a Sig 938 and have been looking at the micro 9 to add to the collection.

[DJK11]

Grizzly I didn’t read that you have fired a Kahr. Like many purchases, try before you buy if possible. I’m a 45 guy and regard Kahr’s 45 offerings to be the finest single stacks made. They don’t get the credit they deserve. PM45 is my favorite with the TP45 a close second. The dual recoil springers are tighter than the single spring. I don’t get the complaints about “difficult to rack”. How many times does one hand cycle the slide? Maybe if your watching a war movie and racking your Kahr to get in the mood. Don’t give the so called problems a second thought. Many of us have zero issues and some have had issues, me included. While many can cut the bull from the target, Kahrs are not bullseye guns.