Federal 135gr hydra shok JHP in PM40

[garyb]

Just tried my first box of Fed 135gr low recoil hydra shok JHP personal defense ammo and compared it to my Winchester 165 target ammo through my PM40. The Federal had a very tiny increased recoil over the Win target ammo, but almost not noticable. Very pleasant to shoot both. I don't get it where folks complain about the PM40 recoil. It's a 40, so just man up. Both types of ammo shot identical at 7, 10 and 15 yards...all in a paper plate with no problem. (Time to move back to 20 yards). I am getting used to this trigger. They both feed well and the Fed defense ammo feels almost identical to my Win target ammo. Compared to some defense ammo, the Federal hydrashok does not break the bank either. I think I've found "my" perfect defense ammo for the PM40.

[olympicmotorcars]

I am with you on the "man up its a 40" recoil assessment. I don't get the big deal either.

I am partial to 165 grain Gold Dots.

[Bawanna]

On the days that I choose to "man up" which incidently are getting fewer and fewer I also like the 165gr Gold Dots. Worked good for me for years in my K40.

[koishoes]

I use the 135 Reduced Recoil Federal Hydras in my K9. Recoil feels the same as with my Federal 115 grain target rounds. Great quality too.

[jlottmc]

I'm partial to the 180gr Winchester Rangers in my 40's. FWIW, you'll never hear me complain about recoil on anything. Then again some folks around here call me a masochist, I still load magazines with my thumbs.

[joshh]

normally 165gr win pdx for my glock22. local shop has "bulk" deal on the 180gr pdx in plain white box for $25 so i'll prob grab a couple of them. i have never noticed a difference in "kick" from the 165 to 180. i couldnt imagine the point of the 135gr in a .40 tho, i shoot a 147gr 9mm in my pm9.

[garyb]

jlottmc, Still loading mags with your hands....I didn't know there was any other way to get it done...ha ha!!!! The mags load very easy and the 40 shoots sweet.

[O'Dell]

I'm partial to the 180gr Winchester Rangers in my 40's. FWIW, you'll never hear me complain about recoil on anything. Then again some folks around here call me a masochist, I still load magazines with my thumbs.

With your thumbs? How old school is that? :D I nearly always use my UpLula and in some cases, my XD c 45 comes to mind, it's almost impossible to load a full mag without it.

[jlottmc]

See they are them new fangled thingies called magazine loaders. Never had a use for one. I just man up and grow my thumbs stronger.

[Bawanna]

Well by gosh I'm the king of my castle (when my wife ain't home). I make my kids load em. I figure soon as I can pronounce uplula I might try me one. Let the kids use it.

[koishoes]

Hahaha Bawanna story of my life. I know those things make life easier (the loaders not the kids ;) ) but by god I always use my thumbs. My buddy and I went through about 1,500 rounds at the range yesterday and loaded every mag by hand. End of the day I just had black thumbs :D

[garyb]

I just read a good article posted by Deuce on Self Defense Ammo. I realize that everyone has their personal preference and pet peeves. Speaking for myself, some/many are unfounded....haha. This article Deuce posted is good and makes sense. www.chuckhawks/ammo_by_anonymous.com (http://www.chuckhawks/ammo_by_anonymous.com) . I hope this link works for you. If not, look for Deuce's thread on Self Defense Ammo. It pleasantly confirms my self defense ammo selection for my PM40, to use 135gr JHP Federal Hydrashock. (Winchester, Corbon, etc... all good.) Comparison made to the 180gr. Check it out for youself. :D

My link did not work...sorry. Go to Deuce's post to review this article. Sorry!

[earle8888]

I had commented previously, lighter, faster bullets maynot be your best choice! Likewise, hollow-point bullets, although hyped by the majority, don't seem to function the same in REAL world use as they due in Jell etc. sorry can't remember were mylast post was. Its great that wee have all the choices that we have, leets work to keep them!!!!!

[garyb]

Can you provide a more detailed explanation as to why lighter, faster hollow points may not be the best choice? I know the reasons why I selected them, but don't understand what info you have to the contrary. Not looking for a debate here, but rather am seeking more concrete info. Thanks.

[earle8888]

The use of heaviest bullet weight , historically has been the better performer in short barrels. Don't have any info on the NEW ammo loaded for short barrels, and having less blast.

[jocko]

I think it is MAG SAFE that makes alot of these ultra lightweight bullets to get the adverttised FPS stuff, but for all its add hype, no one uses that ammo. It has never been rated anythng other than add hype. I do not mean Mag tech ammo, it is ok ammo and two completely different companies.

I don't know of any of the major ammo makers that even mess in this ultra lite bullet weight crap either. I trust what Winchester, Federal and Remington and corbon people make for us shooters.

[garyb]

Yea, I agree with you Jocko. I personally spoke with CorBon and they told me the 140 DPX was designed with the Kahr in mind (short barrel and light gun). As an alternative they also recommended their 135gr JHP for the PM40. They were clear that these had less recoil (particularly the 140 DPX) than the heavier 180 gr loads. Makes sense to me and they are the ammo experts, not me. This (135- 140gr) is not an ultra lightweight bullet by any means, but the ballistics are similar to the Federal Hydrashock 135 JHP low recoil and the Win Ranger 135 or even 155 JHP. I personally feel these are all very good performers in my caliber. Not knocking the 180 gr, just fine tuning for myself and my gun. I also trust what Fed, Win, Corbon and Rem are making for us. These are all good ammos.

[jocko]

and the 140 grain 40 cal ammo is certainly not on the "light" bullet weight side that you will see "MAG SAFE" ADVERTISING.

[garyb]

It is clear that ammo manufacturers are designing optimized personal defense ammo specific for short barrel, light handguns like the PM40. Corbon explained this to me. In addition to the real world effects on humans as described in the article referred to above; comparing the Corbon 140DPX and Federal Hydrashock 135 JHP (each having an approx Vel of 1200 fps and energy of 448 ft/lb) to a 180gr (V of 1000 fps and E of 400 ft/lb); it might be questioned what is gained by the heavier bullet. Certainly velocity and energy are lost, mass weight is gained. Corbon told me that heavier bullets increase recoil in this type of gun (PM40) and the 135 or 140gr bullet is better optimized. (Obviously, I am NOT referring to the ultra lightweight that you referred to re Mag Safe.) There are other issues relating to optimum penetration that we have not discussed. In another reference it was noted that 135-140gr personal defense ammo is less prone to pass throughs, which is obviously not desireable. It seems prudent to consult with the ammo manufacturers to determine which new personal defense round is optimized for a specific firearm.

[TheTman]

I ran across a table at 40 S&W Stopping Power (http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp?Caliber=11&Weight=All) that for the most part shows the lighter faster bullets having better stopping power than the 180 gr bullets. It's kind of a neat table as you can plug in any of the major calibers and see how your choice in bullet ranks.
My question is, how much faith do you put in this type of information? I know there has been a lot of debate over the book these results were taken from. I've researched the .40 caliber quite a bit since I got my first .40 several years ago, and the information I've come across has kind of guided me away from the 180 gr. bullets towards the lighter faster loads. Also thanks to GaryB for sharing the information he obtained from Cor-Bon regarding their 140 and 135 gr. loads.

[garyb]

Yea, I agree with your conclusion too. It seems that the facts are obvious and the manufacturers are designing optimized ammo. But most guys will have their preference, regardless of the facts. I guess beyond performance, other additional and important issues remain, such as: which personal defense ammo can an individual shoot more accurately (shot placement) AND which has a better feel through his weapon, etc ....

[garyb]

After all the gobblygook I put in here about Fed hydrashock, I'll probably be changing to Corbon DPX with my next purchase. I like what I've been reading and seeing about this round, but I am still researching.

[rock]

Some info here by DocGKR, a very reputable source. Service Pistol Duty and Self-Defense Loads - M4Carbine.net Forums (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19887)

http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq319/DocGKR/Handgun_gel_comparison.jpg

[HadEmAll]

Just tried my first box of Fed 135gr low recoil hydra shok JHP personal defense ammo and compared it to my Winchester 165 target ammo through my PM40. The Federal had a very tiny increased recoil over the Win target ammo, but almost not noticable. Very pleasant to shoot both. I don't get it where folks complain about the PM40 recoil. It's a 40, so just man up. Both types of ammo shot identical at 7, 10 and 15 yards...all in a paper plate with no problem. (Time to move back to 20 yards). I am getting used to this trigger. They both feed well and the Fed defense ammo feels almost identical to my Win target ammo. Compared to some defense ammo, the Federal hydrashok does not break the bank either. I think I've found "my" perfect defense ammo for the PM40.

Pretty funny, the guy shooting mild, "low recoil" ammo lecturing those of us who shoot the real thing to "man up" and quit complaining about the PM40 recoil. :D.

I shoot 155 grain Winchester and Speer JHPs.

The blood blister on my trigger finger from those isn't just in my imagination.

But I "man up" and keep using it.

[aray]

Man up? See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-6ph7NWoBM

[slowpoke]

Well by gosh I'm the king of my castle (when my wife ain't home). I make my kids load em. I figure soon as I can pronounce uplula I might try me one. Let the kids use it.
Back before remotes got popular, the kids were good channel changers too. :D