View Full Version : Help me determine the age and value of these 3 guns (lots of pics)
JustinN
01-08-2011, 08:05 AM
I have a couple of old "family" guns I am wanting to find out a little more about, as well as my first pistol (technically my dad bought it since I was way too young). Anyway, on to the guns...
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/6410/bothz.jpg
These are the two hereditary guns, a hammered 12 gauge double barrel and a 44-40 Marlin lever gun.
http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/5629/both2.jpg
Here they are a bit closer
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/6220/marlinr.jpg
Marlin Barrel
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1269/marlin2.jpg
Model 1894
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7484/marlinserial.jpg
Marlin Serial Number
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/3097/americangunco.jpg
The shotgun is "American Gun Company, New York". My Grandfather bought it when he was a kid (born in 1918) but it was used. He is the one that cut the barrel short.
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/3679/shotbarrel.jpg
Shotgun Barrel
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/6342/shotserial.jpg
Shotgun Serial Number
JustinN
01-08-2011, 08:07 AM
http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/1567/smitha.jpg
My first pistol, a Smith and Wesson K frame (I think) .22 revolver.
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/3493/smith2r.jpg
Other side.
http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/3078/smithserial.jpg
Serial Number.
I am just curious as to when each of these were made, and what their approximate value would be. I don't plan on selling any of them anytime soon, especially the shotgun and rifle, but I just want to know.
Thanks!
Serial Number
Damascus barreled, exposed hammer shotguns were a short-lived phenomenon, circa late 1870's-1890's. There was an article in print on them a couple of years back in the DGW blackpowder annual. Nice gun, we have a similar one from my wifes great-great grandfather, bought new in the late 19th century.
jocko
01-08-2011, 12:24 PM
That smith looks like ther K-22 Masterpeace. Oh what a gun that was back then. I had one with Buehler scope base on it and a Weaver K4 scope on it, It was really accurate at 50 yards. Killed many squirrels with it.
Bawanna
01-08-2011, 12:26 PM
Those are sweet! Looks like you used your pistol to hang wanted posters but other than that it's beautiful.
Cherish those things, keep em oiled and in a place of honor.
I have some books, I don't got time right now but I'll try to look for them this afternoon and let ya know what I can find. Some of them old shotguns can be darn tough to get information on. The Marlin shouldn't be too difficult to narrow down, not quite as easy as the winchesters but should be doable.
Put that shotgun back together very carefully, that wood and everything is very delicate. You break anything and I'm coming down there with a switch. Your holding history in your hands and I'm JEALOUS!
mr surveyor
01-08-2011, 02:33 PM
from a quick search at oldguns.net and my 2008 printing of The Blue Book of Gun Values, I come up with the following on the Marlin:
Mfg Date (from oldguns.net) = 1895
Value per Blue Book (my guess of "condition") 60% condition = $875 70% condition=$1250 80% condition =$1650
And, if it is a .44-40 WCF you can add an additional 10% to rated value according to the Blue Book.
Since the Marlin appears to be original (hard to tell from photos), it should be easy to establish a value to a buyer... as an owner though, I would have a difficult time deciding if I really wanted to be a seller.
The shotgun has obviously lost most of it's collectable value having been altered by cutting down the barrels. I would guess, in my non-expert opinion, that it would have much more value as a family heirloom than a collectable (although there are thousands of big city yuppie types that would pay unbelievable prices for "things" to hang on the walls of their "study").
Now, since I've been distracted from my preparations in advance of the impending ice storm, I'll do my redneck evlauation of the S&W....
Hope this is helpful
surv
JustinN
01-08-2011, 05:14 PM
Thanks for the input! That helps a bunch on the Marlin. Really none of them are for sale, or ever will be. I'm just wanting to know more about them (and value is always fun). The Marlin is all original, and still shoots really well....
No fear Bawanna, the shotgun is a lot more solid than you would think. It was actually really gummy a while back and I tore the thing apart completely, cleaned and oiled, and have it functioning flawlessly. While I am careful with it, since it is actually older than Bawanna, it still isn't too flimsy....
As far as the wanted poster hanging....you gotta do what you gotta do....now if someone was to ever make some fancy grips for it......
robmcd
01-09-2011, 05:25 PM
Open the cylinder on the S&W and check the number stamped near the yoke.
Bawanna
01-09-2011, 06:50 PM
I looked up the shotgun and it was what they called a trade gun around the turn of the century. It was distributed by H&D Folsum as American Gun along with their own house brand. It later became Crescent which was the original manufacture and then became Stevens. They made several SxS's both damascus and steel.
They also made some 32 break top revolvers.
The book describes them as good quality inexpensive single and double barrel shotguns made in the Norwich works about 1892.
They went from American gun to Crescent in 1922. J. Stevens bought them about 1930 and was called Crescent-Davis ARMS Corp. They remained in the Steven's catalog until 1941. Actually 1937 since they only sold boxlock Stevens/Davis frames after 37.
More than you ever wanted to know huh? History in your hands.
JustinN
01-09-2011, 10:03 PM
Open the cylinder on the S&W and check the number stamped near the yoke.
It has a 22487
100percent
01-09-2011, 10:25 PM
Don't go putting a load in your shot gun. I saw one recently that the owner put in a std 12 ga load and saw the Damascus steel come apart in ribbons of steel.
robmcd
01-11-2011, 06:50 PM
It has a 22487
Your S&W K22 was manufactured in 1957. Assuming that it's in proper working order, and given it's condition per your photos, it's probably worth in the $ 400.00 range.
Don't go putting a load in your shot gun. I saw one recently that the owner put in a std 12 ga load and saw the Damascus steel come apart in ribbons of steel.
They were made for blackpowder loads, and many of them still can be shot with handloaded blackpowder loads. They were never rated for the chamber pressures generated by smokeless.
Always check with a gunsmith familiar with blackpowder weaponry before ever considering firing a 100+ year old firearm.
JustinN
01-12-2011, 04:03 PM
Yeah, never gonna shoot the shotty. It's just an heirloom of my grandad's that I like to look at.
Thanks for the info Robmcd. The revolver works great and really the only problems (besides a bit of blue wore on the cylinder and barrel) are the grips....not terrible, just a bit beat up.
robmcd
01-12-2011, 05:43 PM
Yeah, never gonna shoot the shotty. It's just an heirloom of my grandad's that I like to look at.
Thanks for the info Robmcd. The revolver works great and really the only problems (besides a bit of blue wore on the cylinder and barrel) are the grips....not terrible, just a bit beat up.
As long as the cylinder timing and gap at the forcing cone are OK, you should be good to go. A business card should not fit into the gap.
You can still buy that type of K-frame diamond grips from S&W on their site. If you replace them, don't get rid of them - they likely have a matching serial number on the inner surface.
Ford's Gun Refinishing does a great polished blue job on classic revolvers.
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