New PM4044N joins the family!

[RONDO]

Just finished running 200rds thru the new PM40.:D Incredible, just like its' P380, PM9, & PM45 siblings !:) I've never had any problems with any of these nifty little Kahr pistols ... they're the most accurate & reliable firearms I've ever owned.:yo:
A couple of observations:
* My PM9 is a 2007 model with the flat nose. My new PM40 is the newer tapered nose style. This works out great as I have no preference in style, yet the style variation allows me to readily differentiate them.;)
* The external length dimension of the "tapered" PM40 has increased barely 1/8"... negligible, in my opinion.
* I took the PM9 & PM45 along with the new Pm40 to the range for comparison. After running 150rds trouble free rounds thru the Pm40, I tried a couple of exercises using all three weapons in turn. First I shot 6 rds & 25' with the PM45, then 6rds with the PM40, followed by 6rds of PM9. I then used a target @ 15' and reversed the order of fire :33: Accuracy & reliability were outstanding with all three pistols, while felt recoil increased with caliber, just as one might expect.
*Federal "ball" ammo from Walmart was used for all three pistols 115gr, 180gr, & 230gr respectively ... great stuff with savings of $6-9 per 50rd box over gun store prices. ;)
All in all, it was a very enjoyable trip to the range.:typing: These are terrific little guns!!:D

[jocko]

rondo. I agree the 1/8" is negligible, so why did kahr even do it??? the PM40 and PM9 are ultra compact guns.

From photos it sure looks like more than 1/8" but I don't have them inf ront of me like you do, so I will take your word for it. right about one thing. They are terrific guns..

[RONDO]

Hey Jocko!
I was very interested in the "reason for change" thing as well as "what" was changed & how much, so I called Kahr tech support before the purchase. Not much luck.:mad: The guy I spoke to about the "bevel" didn't have dimensions available .. RATZ! That was my major pre-purchase concern.:confused: He did tell me about the internals i.e. lil' longer barrel, & springs, etc., as well as lil' longer slide, but NO Dimensions. Finally I spent a night on the computer comparing various pictures, crossed my fingers & bought it through Gunbroker. Worked out swell in the end, it's another precision piece from Kahr ... but quite an information vacuum.:eek: By the way the stated reason for the change was streamlining for holstering, concealing etc. Looks like the PM9, PM40, PM45 and their cousins are all goin' for the new look. Personally, it doesn't matter ... but I kinda' like the looks of my ol' wood burnin' model PM9.:rolleyes:

[jocko]

glocks seem to holster OK and they have the exact same blunt nose as the old style kahrs. oh well not big deal, but give me the old style any day. new buyers willnever know the difference..

[garyb]

Good report on the PM40 with the other PM calibers. I agree that it is a pleasant and great shooting piece. I also agree that the 1/8" of the new model, due to the taper on the slide is not a big deal. 1/8 difference is not worth talking about. You don't notice it or feel it. If anything it has 3 insignificant but all be it improvements: bevel for holstering easier; longer barrel; longer sight plane. Concealability factor change is also insignificant but 3 improvements and 1 compromise. 3:1 in favor of the improvement. I love the sweet shooting PM40...it's got Caliber and Size in it's favor.

[RONDO]

Hey GaryB! I agree the PM40 is a SWEEEET lil Pistol ! :D If I could only have one pistol out of the four that I posted about above ... it would probably be the PM40 ... healthy caliber/small package.;) As it is, I LOVE EM ALL!!

[Slynchee]

Rondo congratulations on the gun, I have the PM40 also and love it. Great gun and the recoil is not bad at all.

[2thhacker]

Rondo, I have read from others that the PM45 is pretty much equal to the PM40 or maybe even less "snappy." How would you rate the recoil of the 9, 40, 45 on a 1-10 scale (I know you said increases with caliber, just curious how much increase between them).

[Just One Shot]

Pics or it didn't happen.
:D

[RONDO]

Hey Guys! Correctamundo! A picture is worth a thousand words. Unfortunately, our camera got dropped :mad: and is being repaired, that said I'll post 'em ASAP ;), in the mean time, I hope the "word picture" helps :)

[RONDO]

Hey 2ththacker! Yea, I read similar reports. My experience runs counter to those articles, I'm happy to say.:D
I'll take a stab @ the 1-10 rating system for ya.:) If a .25 & .32 were assigned 1&2 respectively, and the P380 is a 3, then I'd say the PM9 was a 5.:cool: Continuing, I would say the PM40 was a 7, and the PM45 an 8. Leaving 9,10, 10+ for Dirty Harry.;)
I'd definitely rank them in that order, the 1-10 ratings are, of course, subjective.
I really dig the PM40, as well as the others!;)

[Bawanna]

Recoil as you say is subjective and different for each person. Personally I would reverse your 40 and 45 1-10 judgements. My PM 45 has less felt recoil to me than my K40 which has to be less than a PM40.
The 40 to me isn't so much recoil per se as flip or jolt. Even the 9 with virtually no recoil has an obnoxious crack or jolt.

I guess to me the 45 is more of a push rather than a jolt. I like em all anyhow, Dirty Harry rocks?

[Ognimalf]

Congrats on the new PM40!!! I was leaning towards the PM40 myself because I have a G27. The other half of me wanted the PM9 because I wanted a 9mm. Maybe in the near future I get one. Having a .4O that small is way cool!! Whats gonna be your carry load? Have you chosen a holster for it yet? Enjoy your little hand rocket.

[RONDO]

Sounds like the best thing for you to do "Ognimalf" is get 'em both!! The PM40 has been a real pleasant surprise. Accuracy and reliability are superb. Recoil about what you'd expect, as previously discussed.
And "Bawanna45" you bring up a good point ... while doing my comparison, I did rate the muzzel flip closer to the PM45 ... as second shot aiming was very similar.
Yeah! Dirty Harry rocks!

[RONDO]

Ooooops! Didn't quite answer the mail on that last one.:(
Holster research is ongoing!:biggrin1:
My carry loads for the P380, Pm9, PM40, & PM45 are Hornady Critical Defense. That company has IMHO done a fabulous job tayloring rounds specifically for short barrel, micro compact pistols.:) The also have a nifty solution for insuring hollowpoint expansion and the casings are stainless steel for corrosion control.
Hornady has calibrated projectile weight and powder pressure to get the most out of little guns like the Kahr Micros. They also have made efforts to reduce muzzle flash, saving that important njght vision. Finally I really dig the tapered design of the bullet ... the Kahrs eat 'em like candy!;)

[Ognimalf]

Sounds like the best thing for you to do "Ognimalf" is get 'em both!! The PM40 has been a real pleasant surprise. Accuracy and reliability are superb. Recoil about what you'd expect, as previously discussed.
And "Bawanna45" you bring up a good point ... while doing my comparison, I did rate the muzzel flip closer to the PM45 ... as second shot aiming was very similar.
Yeah! Dirty Harry rocks!

A two-tone PM40 with XS Standard Dots and 360 stipple sounds good!! Hey RONDO your gonna hear from my lawyer for trying to make me spend money.

[Ognimalf]

Ooooops! Didn't quite answer the mail on that last one.:(
Holster research is ongoing!:biggrin1:
My carry loads for the P380, Pm9, PM40, & PM45 are Hornady Critical Defense. That company has IMHO done a fabulous job tayloring rounds specifically for short barrel, micro compact pistols.:) The also have a nifty solution for insuring hollowpoint expansion and the casings are stainless steel for corrosion control.
Hornady has calibrated projectile weight and powder pressure to get the most out of little guns like the Kahr Micros. They also have made efforts to reduce muzzle flash, saving that important njght vision. Finally I really dig the tapered design of the bullet ... the Kahrs eat 'em like candy!;)

Good selection in carry ammo.

[garyb]

Interesting 1-10 ratings Rondo and I'd have to say it was what I'd expect from these micros. I have a good feeling that you're probably accurate, although I have not personally shot all these guns in these calibers. Good job. It seems that everyone's tolerance of recoil and/or flip is subjective...meaning to some the 7 rating of the 40 is less or more tolerable, depending on the individual. This is quite understandable. So, I don't believe there is any right or wrong answer on how someone feels about recoil. I also think Jocko is on to something by pushing the porting to reduce the muzzle flip. I believe magnaport that they will reduce muzzle flip by 30-40%, and this is substantial toward quick 2nd shot accuracy. However, I'm inclined to wait awhile to really get a good feel for the PM40 as it is...stock. Once I have a very good feel, the porting will be much more appreciated later...after the waranty is nearing expiration OR I get tired of waiting. I can't help to say again..."The PM40 is a sweet shooting, sexy, accurate micro in a substantial self defense caliber that can't be questioned". I can't wait to see what I am capable of doing with it on an IDPA range this year.

[wyntrout]

Just a tiny correction on the Critical Defense... the cases are nickel-plated for corrosion resistance. Stainless is more expensive than brass and really hard to machine, let alone swage or work with dies.

http://www.hornady.com/store/critical_defense

And recoil is related to chamber pressures and bullet mass... SAAMI tables... scroll down to pistol specifications. 9mm and .40 S&W (and .357 Magnum and a few others) have the same pressure spec's, while the .45 ACP is much lower... even the +P loads:

http://www.leverguns.com/articles/saami_pressures.htm

Wynn :)

[earle8888]

OK my2cents--Re: 40 S&W Flip/recoil== I have found that the 40 is similar in characteristics flash/crack/etc. as the 357mag. Both took, S&W 19RB, getting used to and get comfortable with. That said, the itsy bytse grip on the PM40 took me a while to get the correct hand hold/grip, once that was accomplished the recoil==what recoil. Not had any experience with muzzle breaks in pistols that impressed me, 19 Glock, and 29 S&W.

[RONDO]

Hey wyntrout! Absolutely correct! ... nickel it is! ;)

Also, the SAAMI Tables present pretty cool info .... if pressure difference is fairly constant between ball and Critical Defense, 9mm & .40 @ 35K while .45 is 21K, then bullet mass has a huge effect.

That appears to validate another impression; PM40 vs PM45 recoil deltas seem larger with ball ammo (180/230gr 22%diff) than with Critical Defense (165/185gr 11%diff)

All this is makin' me wanna hit the range again! :rain: It's rain'n so why not!

[RONDO]

earle8888
Agreed! None of this recoil we're talkin' about is unpleasant at all ...;)